For Whom The Wind Chimes Toll
This girl I'm dating is truly great -- except for how she is into astrology, buys me crystals to improve my "energy," and keeps sitting me down for tarot card readings. As we get more serious, I feel like telling her I don't believe in any of this. But I think she actually believes in this stuff and would be hurt if I came clean.
--Rationally Based
Somehow, people who find it perfectly reasonable to ask a deck of cards whether they should invest in a 401(k) will sneer at you for asking a mailbox for directions to the movie theater. The question is, as a guy who tries to live rationally, can you respect a woman who probably reads books like "The Healing Power of Pebbles" and "How to Ask the Universe for a Pony"? (Without respect, you have contempt, which researcher John Gottman finds is the number one killer of relationships.)
Figure out whether you can compartmentalize -- focus on what you love and shrug off her planning her day based around whether she sees a sign in her toast. If you stay together, gently explain that you appreciate how sweet she is in wanting to help you but that you really don't believe in all this stuff. Over time, if you let her see your thought process but don't hammer her with it, she may come around to the merits of evidence-based beliefs. In the meantime, do your best to be polite when she introduces you to her relatives -- all her relatives, ever. (Are you free for a seance Friday night?)
"...gently explain that you appreciate how sweet she is in wanting to help you but that you really don't believe in all this stuff." - Amy
"What? You don't believe? Well, I have to try harder to convince you it's all real!"
Fayd at October 14, 2014 4:25 PM
"Rationally based" must be young, or newly in love to call this woman great. Anyone who believes in astrology and crystals and tarot cards can't have a real thought process, or critical thinking skills. This may not seem important when hormones run high, but for the everyday interactions and the pleasure - or pain- that relationships bring, intelligence and critical thinking is key.
I would look at this just like I, as a woman, would look at a guy who believed in conspiracy theories. It's not cute; it's stupid. It won't wear well. Good luck.
pbjammin at October 14, 2014 4:28 PM
"The Healing Power of Pebbles" and "How to Ask the Universe for a Pony"
Hahahahahaaaaaa. Amy, that's good stuff. :)
I-dated-a-whore at October 14, 2014 4:30 PM
Amy Alkon
https://www.advicegoddess.com/ag-column-archives/2014/10/for-whom-the-wi.html#comment-5245431">comment from I-dated-a-whoreThanks so much, I-dated!
Amy Alkon at October 14, 2014 4:44 PM
Run the other way, man... you ARE looking at her thought processes, ones which you cannot accept.
This is kinda fundamental. You can't change people, any more than they can change you... which is what BOTH of you are trying to do. Respect what she believes in enough to let her go.
I can tell horror stories about how it goes in the end if you stay. In particular, YOU are likely to be the one blamed when something doesn't work, as you aren't "believing hard enough"
Would you go out with a faith-healing, serpent handling Pentecostal? New age religion can be similar, depending on how much the practitioner wishes to believe it.
You must leave her, brother.
SwissArmyD at October 14, 2014 7:59 PM
Would you go out with a faith-healing, serpent handling Pentecostal?
Depends, how often will she be handling my serpent and drinking its 'venom'?
lujlp at October 14, 2014 8:48 PM
Amy hit the nail on the head here. The letter writer might as well have asked, "I'm enjoying putting my penis into a woman that I can't possibly respect. Can this turn into a lasting relationship?"
No, it can't.
whistleDick at October 14, 2014 9:38 PM
How do these women ever end up married? What type of guy sticks around?
Ppen at October 14, 2014 11:37 PM
How does she use the tarot cards? Does she believe spirits are speaking through them, or does she use them as a set of psychological symbols that help her answer questions she already knows the answer to?
Do the crystals look nice?
NicoleK at October 15, 2014 4:09 AM
A solid relationship is based on truth. Maybe not the WHOLE truth, bald-faced, all the time (no those pants don't make you look fat), but a fundamental honesty.
It actually IS possible for humanists and persons of faith to have successful relationships, but, as has already been mentioned, you have to compartmentalize.
You have to negotiate boundaries. (It's okay for you to pray for me if you want, but stop proselytizing. I won't tell you there's no God if you will quit sprinkling me with holy water.)
But you can't have those negotiations without understanding first.
Lamont Cranston at October 15, 2014 6:16 AM
"sneer at you for asking a mailbox for directions to the movie theater. "
It's not my main account but I use gmail way more than I use snail mail, and since Google is where I'd ask for the address I effectively ask my mailbox for directions weekly.
Joe J at October 15, 2014 7:15 AM
I lived in Santa Fe, NM for a while so I have some perspective on the crystal people ... they can in fact be great and it's comforting to believe in something when religion is not your thing for whatever reason. If it helps her focus, meditate, and be a centered person in touch with her feelings then where's the harm? They can also be total kooksticks so keep that in mind.
chickia at October 15, 2014 8:03 AM
my husband believes in aliens, and i don't. we accept this about one another and don't try to convert each other; no problem. but if i thought i had to pretend to believe what he does, or vice versa, the way LW seems to feel, that could breed contempt. at least give the girl the opportunity to accept or reject YOUR OPINION. if she does reject it/if it's some kind of deal-breaker, aren't you glad you found out before it went on too long?
Rachel Flax at October 15, 2014 11:29 AM
Rachel, aliens are a verifiable fact. Microbial life beyond earth has been conclusively proven.
lujlp at October 15, 2014 11:43 AM
I travel to one particular locale for work with a high percentage of people like this girl. (I very definitely would consider it a religion.) Some are quite pretty, and I occasionally wonder if I could "put my penis in one". The answer is no.
Alas though lujlp, microbial life beyond Earth has not been conclusively proven. Organic compounds that do not require life have been found, and I think pretty much all scientists assume there is life out there somewhere, but we have not conclusively found any, yet.
SlowMindThinking at October 15, 2014 12:44 PM
"...microbial life beyond Earth has not been conclusively proven." - SlowMindThinking
As I once noted on my old Christian-themed vlog, this is something that got me ticked off about some atheists. Many of them say they refuse to believe in God because there's no evidence, but yet some believe in intelligent life forms on other planets, even though there is no solid proof.
Fayd at October 15, 2014 2:03 PM
Word of the day: "Kookstick"
Thank you to Chickia. :)
I-dated-a-whore at October 15, 2014 3:36 PM
@Ppen,
How do these women ever end up married? What type of guy sticks around?
Are there crystal guys? I've never met one.
Pirate Jo at October 15, 2014 4:58 PM
California probably has crystal guys. California has everything!
I-dated-a-whore at October 15, 2014 5:09 PM
There are Crystal gazing, long-haired drum circle man-children too. They can be some of the sweetest, nicest people ever, and they don't shove their beliefs down your throat. They also make awesome neighbors, because they are usually very thoughtful.
Kat at October 15, 2014 8:29 PM
My advice to anyone with a partner who seems unusually into something very weird: Watch "The Extreme Guide to Parenting" (it's a series on Bravo or TLC or one of those reality-heavy cable networks. It shows couples that drag their kids into their own personal brand of nonsense, often with only the mother being into it (though occasionally the dad is on board). Look for the appropriate episode about your partner's quirk, and ask yourself if you could really stay with someone like that for the long term.
For this reader, there was a particular mom who believed in "auras" and that her son--an undisciplined brat who made his older sister's life miserable--was an "indigo child" who was special and needed to be unconstrained. I don't know whether I felt more sorry for the older sister or the husband.
Brian at October 16, 2014 12:02 PM
To LW:
Why do you care about her "real thought process"?
If that is more important for you than her being a woman, find yourself an intelligent man --- like Agathon found Socrates.
Mere Mortal at October 17, 2014 9:18 AM
The question is, as a guy who tries to live rationally, can you respect a woman who probably reads books like "The Healing Power of Pebbles" and "How to Ask the Universe for a Pony"?
There are many things people believe in that haven't been proven: God, miracles, aliens (the non-illegal kind), ghosts, being able to communicate with the those who have passed away, astrology, etc.
I could respect a woman who believes in some of those things, but a belief in astrology is one thing I couldn't (and don't respect.) I find the idea to be utterly absurd. I've met women on dates who asked me for my sign, stating that it was important because they could never get along with a man who was this-sign or that-sign.
JD at October 17, 2014 11:03 AM
Yeah. I dated one of these. Her beliefs and behavior went from benign to insane at lightspeed. I could tell you stories that would curdle your beer.
Run like the wind.
Gog_Magog_Carpet_Reclaimers at October 17, 2014 11:10 AM
Common, you gotta share one at least```
lujlp at October 19, 2014 9:01 AM
"Believe in" is a term relating to emotional commitment, not an assessment of a relationship between what is thought and what can be demonstrated.
That is why an imaginary god can be cited as real.
Radwaste at October 19, 2014 1:18 PM
Yes, Gog, don't leave us hanging like that :-D
crella at November 11, 2014 12:33 AM
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