The Kind Of Firefighters I Want: More Qualified, Not "More Women!"
There's sense in the letters to the editor section of the LA Times:
Los Angeles Mayor Eric Garcetti wants more of the city's firefighters to be women, a difficult goal made clear by the fact that the four women in this year's training class have been eliminated. ("Second straight LAFD recruit class is all male after women exit," April 29)If a female trainee can't meet the physical requirements, which exist for safety reasons, too bad. In fact, The Times might want to look at the rate at which women leave the active roster of the Los Angeles Fire Department for early disability or are given cushy desk jobs.
Firefighters need to be in the field for 20 or 30 years to be cost effective. Slanting the playing field doesn't create equality, but it is unfair to those who easily meet the physical requirements.
I would love to be a supermodel, but alas, I don't meet the physical standard. Oh well. If a female can meet the LAFD standard, excellent. If not, too bad, but it isn't discrimination.
Trudi Reynolds, Malibu
From the Ben Welsh LA Times story linked above:
Despite repeated calls from City Hall for reform, the percentage of female LAFD firefighters remains at slightly less than 3% -- the same as in 1995. Numbers are just as low across the country."It's heartbreaking," said Capt. Tamara Chick, president of a group representing female firefighters at the LAFD. "Every time one of these women gets hurt or gets fired or quits, it breaks your heart."
Why is it "heartbreaking"? Why should I care whether there are firefighters with vaginas?
If there's a fire in my house, I just want firefighters who are strong enough to haul my ass out. If they can do that, I don't care whether they're men, women, or creatures from space with one big purple eye.
More sense -- from the LAT comments section (though it seems autocorrect was out drinking at the bar):
retiredengineer23
i retired after 31 years as a firefighter, i proctored scores of exams, at the absolute height of a woman's ability they barley can pass the agility exam,most fail with men scoring 40%higher.What will these gals be like in their 40s when they barley passed in the 20;s
Its time to stop this pathetic politically correct fashion show, they have altered the 35 foot ladders so gals can use them, however now it takes twice as long to extend one.Unlike the LA Marathon no fire scene gives women a 10 minute headstart on the men
Unlike the LA Marathon no fire scene gives women a 10 minute headstart on the men
We have a winner.
DrCos at May 6, 2015 4:00 AM
Its as if they never heard of comparative advantage
tmitsss at May 6, 2015 6:32 AM
"Why should I care whether there are firefighters with vaginas?"
Maybe that's the solution. Women firefighters without vaginas. I'm sure Jenner at the height of his powers had the physical prowess.
drP at May 6, 2015 6:36 AM
Can we settle for male fire-fighters who IDENTIFY as women (for administrative purposes. . . )
Because, if you say otherwise, you're "misgendering" and thus guilty of "badthink". . .
(evil grin)
Keith Glass at May 6, 2015 6:42 AM
So...if I self-identify as a woman who just happens to be a lesbian but born a man I can check off several boxes?
What if I also claim to have been born a poor black child?
Whoa! what a rush. I was about to tell the boss where to go because as a transgendered lesbian of color you can't fire me. But then reality set back in.
Le sigh.
I R A Darth Aggie at May 6, 2015 6:49 AM
You are not a poor black child IRA. You are a disadvantage African American youth (humanity did start in Africa, we all have our advantages and our disadvantages, and youth seems to apply to anyone under 50).
Ben at May 6, 2015 7:51 AM
"...as a transgendered lesbian of color you can't fire me."
If you add an Hispanic surname you'd be practically bullet-proof.
bkmale at May 6, 2015 7:53 AM
I'm all for women serving in traditionally male jobs if they can do them. As long as they meet the same requirements as the men do. That means for some jobs, women will be very, very rare. But if that very, very rare woman wants to do the job she should be able to.
NicoleK at May 6, 2015 8:01 AM
"But if that very, very rare woman wants to do the job she should be able to."
Certainly. But you don't meet quotas that way.
Cousin Dave at May 6, 2015 8:44 AM
In the first story I saw, about a woman being passed despite not achieving physical tasks, it was noted that four other women HAD satisfactorily done the assigned work. Wgat else was involved here?
John A at May 6, 2015 8:52 AM
I'll wager that men who aren't in excellent shape (that is to say, the majority of men out there) would have a very hard time meeting the physical standard for firefighters. And out of the pool of men who can meet the standard, only a certain percentage would have the desire & dedication to be a firefighter. The pool of women who can meet the physical standard must be much smaller, and since only a small percentage of those women have the desire & dedication to go with it, then in a sensible world no one should be surprised that women firefighters are as rare as hen's teeth.
Martin at May 6, 2015 8:54 AM
huh... equality of opportunity is different from equality of outcome.
who knew?
SwissArmyD at May 6, 2015 9:29 AM
Woman to become NY firefighter despite failing crucial fitness test:
http://nypost.com/2015/05/03/woman-to-become-ny-firefighter-despite-failing-crucial-fitness-test/
Snoopy at May 6, 2015 9:32 AM
I'm not a runner or marathoner, but fuck. If I was, there's no WAY I'd take a headstart on the men! How damn insulting!!!
Snoopy I'd be so ashamed if I were that woman. No way I'd take the job if I failed.
momof4 at May 6, 2015 9:52 AM
Its as if they never heard of comparative advantage - tmitsss
So, just to be clear you assert that women are not equal and need to be given special advantages to make up for their inherent failures just for existing?
lujlp at May 6, 2015 1:04 PM
And they say feminism never killed anyone? Female street cops, combat soldiers and firefighters are a danger to themselves, their comrades, and the public at large.
Jay R at May 6, 2015 1:53 PM
This will cheer you up. Some women are Army strong - but then you knew that. It also washed my eyes out real good. Today this lady is my hero.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g6x2guhVu_w
Dave B at May 6, 2015 4:31 PM
It's heartbreaking!"
No, what's heartbreaking is that for every person unqualified, except for attributes unrelated to the job such as race or gender, someone who might have been a better candidate was passed over.
THAT'S heartbreaking.
And in the case of police, firefighting, or other public safety job - the losers aren't just qualified but passed over candidates - the public loses out too.
Now, THAT'S heartbreaking.
And, Dave B., I've seen that video and found it to be amazing. I go for a hike in the woods with just a light backpack (water and lunch) and it takes me 5 hours or so. She did that with a heavy pack, rifle, fully geared up and completed it in under 3 hours. Holy crap! I wish I could do that.
I also loved the fact that, at least by what the voices sound like, it is mainly men cheering her on. I can even hear the one guy yell: "you got it ma'am." A clear show of respect for a fellow soldier. That is EARNED respect.
charles at May 6, 2015 6:05 PM
I want to know who my family gets to sue if I wind up a s'more because some chick was hired to meet a quota.
Feebie at May 10, 2015 1:00 AM
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