Commenting On A Person's Looks Is Terrible! Oh, It's A Man? Never Mind! Have At It!
First, here's a link, thanks to @BretWeinstein, of James Damore's original document, complete with charts and links. Bret: "That James Damore was fired is lunacy. That it was Google that fired him makes this truly alarming." (Though not surprising.)
An excerpt from the supposedly horrible document:
Note, I'm not saying that all men differ from all women in the following ways or that these differences are "just." I'm simply stating that the distribution of preferences and abilities of men and women differ in part due to biological causes and that these differences may explain why we don't see equal representation of women in tech and leadership. Many of these differences are small and there's significant overlap between men and women, so you can't say anything about an individual given these population level distributions.
About the looks thing, Diana Fleischman smacks down the hypocrites:
To people making fun of #GoogleMemo dude's appearance. You don't have to date articulate men with PhDs who work for Google. More for me.
— Diana S. Fleischman (@sentientist) August 7, 2017
Via @CHSommers, Bloomberg's Mark Bergen and Ellen Huet write:
James Damore, the Google engineer who wrote the note, confirmed his dismissal in an email, saying that he had been fired for "perpetuating gender stereotypes."
This is more the sort of ugly stuff he was talking about -- treating people "as individuals."
This is the conclusion of the so-called "anti-diversity" memo that got James Damore fired from Google. pic.twitter.com/AWUIneJCYX
— Ian Miles Cheong (@stillgray) August 8, 2017
I read the memo, and as somebody who spends every day reading social science research, what I can tell you is that it reflects the findings from across that literature.
Yes, Google calls that "advancing harmful gender stereotypes in our workplace" -- aka biological sex differences supported by a great deal of evidence. To name just one example -- from my post from the other day -- there's Simon Baron-Cohen's research on how men tend to be "systematizers," while women tend to be "empathizers."
My science-based advice column references a cavalcade of research on sex differences.
There's too often this idea that announcing what the data say means being bigoted -- irrational, ridiculous thinking. The woman speaking in the Bloomberg video is essentially a social justice parrot, using terms like "microaggressions," as the social justice religion requires.
Meanwhile, psychologist and methodology vetter Scott Lilienfield has shown that clams about harms from "microaggressions" are not supported by evidence.
What especially worries me is how victim feminism seems to be running our culture, how there's become a culture of apologizing for being male and even for apologizing for putting out data that don't confirm social justice religious beliefs.
His appearance, of course, is irrelevant, though I think he's kind of cute.
— Diana S. Fleischman (@sentientist) August 7, 2017
Oh, and because he's so smart, articulate, and thinking, if I were hiring, I'd hire him, and if I didn't have a boyfriend and were closer to his age, I'd go out with him, too.
UPDATE: Adam Grant is wrong.
"Gender differences in ability and motivation are mostly small or zero." -Grant. Um, no they're not https://t.co/rl1I8lEnpT @slatestarcodex pic.twitter.com/LLtA7y7aop
— Amy Alkon (@amyalkon) August 8, 2017
Guy: everyones too afraid of the echo chamber to talk about facts
Google: we encourage debate. FYI you are fired for crimethink
lujlp at August 7, 2017 11:30 PM
I think Google need to put its money where its mouth is.
Publish the salaries of their top five female employees and top five male employees, as well as the total paid all their female employees and the total paid all their male employees
Should be fun watching them justify their wage gap
lujlp at August 7, 2017 11:51 PM
Google managers, google insiders, reporters are all saying that employees stayed home on Monday because the memo made them feel unsafe at work.
What a huge bunch of babies. Some guy in my company of 72,000 has bad think, I am so scared, I need to stay home.
What more do employers need to consider when deciding why not to hire that female? Well, if I hire her and someone writes an email, she may stay home and say she is afraid.
And talk about 1% problems. Most people go to work when the are deeply worried about personal matters or work matters because they are afraid of losing their jobs.
People go to work when the work is physically dangerous to life and limb because they need the money.
But now, team women stays home because bad emails give them the cramps.
jerry at August 8, 2017 1:25 AM
These SJW clowns are going to follow him, including to his next employer and make his life a misery.
I like the Goddess' column, but there's an implication that the SJW fascists can be reasoned with, including appeals to charity, compassion, honor and fairness and reality
.
Richard Aubrey at August 8, 2017 3:49 AM
Ask.com is my new default search engine.
Jeff Guinn at August 8, 2017 4:26 AM
Listen, and understand! That social justice parrot is out there! It can't be bargained with. It can't be reasoned with. It doesn't feel pity, or remorse, or fear. And it absolutely will not stop... ever, until you are re-educated!
The only way to get to these people is to make them abide by their own rules, and when they break them, to hector them as they have.
But even that has limits, as they'll just ball up in a corner and weep bitterly about microagressions and mansplain'.
I R A Darth Aggie at August 8, 2017 5:57 AM
As a feminist, as someone who believes in free speech, come on folks. We can't go on witch hunts when people state an opinion or give facts. Most of the information was factual. It was even clarified that the notions weren't all-encompassing.
It is unfortunate when decisions are made to be PC.
To the women out there that stayed home - put on your big girl panties and get to work. You are making us women look like wimps.
From a women in a traditionally female field who has gone back to work when a student threw a desk at her, has stepped in the middle of fights with teens that outweighed her by 100 lbs., and has even overcome the humiliation of bat-wing jokes.
Jen at August 8, 2017 6:01 AM
Oh, Jen, it's far worse than that.
https://pjmedia.com/trending/2017/08/07/diversity-is-conformity-at-google/
Read. Weep. This will not end well. Also, not to put too fine a point on it, I suspect more than a few of these people did the whole #ILoveScience thing not too long ago.
Should have been #ILoveScienceThatAgreesWithMyViewPoint
I R A Darth Aggie at August 8, 2017 6:26 AM
To put a not too fine point on things, this guy needs to leave California. It will be very hard for him to find a new job in that state and I would worry a little about his safety.
As for this outcome, it was entirely predictable. I can sympathize with what he is going through. But this is little different from juggling live hand grenades and having one of them go off. I applaud him for being willing to take this hit. I just hope he knew what he was doing. But having seen a picture of him and how young he appears I doubt he understood just what he was setting off by noticing the blatant sexism and racism at Google.
Ben at August 8, 2017 6:39 AM
Shoot, I went to work last week with a sprained toe, in a job where I'm on my feet all day. Just wrapped it, popped one ibuprofen, and off I go.
spqr2008 at August 8, 2017 6:45 AM
"Well, if I hire her and someone writes an email, she may stay home and say she is afraid."
This is best understood as a labor action -- a strike. The message to the employer is, "Make the workplace conform to our political views, or we'll put you out of business." Of course Google management is already sympathetic to that POV, but this reinforces the training.
"I like the Goddess' column, but there's an implication that the SJW fascists can be reasoned with."
The Goddess does not need me to defend her, but I daresay she knows better. We've discussed here many times about how leftism is basically the cluster B personality disorders rendered in the form of politics. You can't reason with a narcissist.
"But even that has limits, as they'll just ball up in a corner and weep bitterly about microagressions and mansplain'."
Or they bareface it, using the narcissist's favorite explanation: "It's different when I do it! I'm trying to make you a better human being."
"I suspect more than a few of these people did the whole #ILoveScience thing not too long ago."
No doubt. Remember what Iowahawk says about leftist tactics: "Identify a widely respected institution. Kill it and gut it. Then wear its carcass as a skin suit, while demanding respect." I expect that two decades from now, the percentage of the population that actually understands the scientific method (or even knows what it is) will be less than 1%.
Cousin Dave at August 8, 2017 6:53 AM
This. The Baby Boom will be dead or dying. Gen-X won't have enough size or political pull (thanks for nothing, Boomers) to reverse the trend and the under-educated but over-politicized Millennials will be in charge.
Conan the Grammarian at August 8, 2017 7:35 AM
I worked for years while on dialysis, forgive me if I find the inability to go to work because of some guy's opinion hilarious.
Anonymous Guy at August 8, 2017 7:39 AM
I suspect that Dr. Damore will land on his feet somewhere, and that it will be an overall improvement from his current situation.
"I expect that two decades from now, the percentage of the population that actually understands the scientific method (or even knows what it is) will be less than 1%."
Likely true, but I expect to remain in that 1%. And if I can tolerate the universal bullshit and work with the H1-B hordes, I am hopeful of plentiful opportunities for gain due to the ignorance of the 99%.
bkmale at August 8, 2017 7:52 AM
This makes me wonder that the reason for Silicon Valley tech companies value H-1B Visas so much is that it's the only way to get work done.
They probably hire foreigners with an actual objective point of view and milk them as much as they can before the Social Justice rot consumes the poor suckers.
Sixclaws at August 8, 2017 8:10 AM
Also, he'd better get ready for a life of struggle like what Bora Zivkovic is going through. Or do what Tim Hunt did and find a new life in Japan.
Sixclaws at August 8, 2017 8:22 AM
It is a religion. Victimology is a way of showing morality in an a-religious culture. It is also a way of getting attention and power, so it has a double benefit to people. Victim/oppressor also structures reality for the weak-minded.
cc at August 8, 2017 11:36 AM
Yeah, looks like he will land on his feet, and quite possibly with a big pile of cash.
https://twitter.com/ClarkHat/status/894925657112805376
I R A Darth Aggie at August 8, 2017 11:37 AM
Additionally, he may have found four expert witnesses should it come to that.
https://archive.is/VlNfl
The Quillette site seems to be down at the moment, thus the Internet Archive link.
I R A Darth Aggie at August 8, 2017 11:49 AM
"Commenting On A Person's Looks Is Terrible! Oh, It's A Man? Never Mind! Have At It!"
Except it isn't about him being a man. It is about him being a heretic. If he was black they would be using all kinds of racist terms for him. If he was a girl there would be all kinds of sexist terms. This is a classic double standard of you can't do x but I can.
God bless double standards. Without them many people would have no standards at all.
Ben at August 8, 2017 12:44 PM
https://pjmedia.com/instapundit/272297/
I R A Darth Aggie at August 8, 2017 1:19 PM
Google is not interested in how someone scores on a math test. None of the science demonstrates a sex difference on what matters to Google, which is how well does a person do at software engineering.
If you think that just takes math, you would not do well in the field. It takes a mix of skills and interests, and good teams have a mix of people with different strengths. I think Google is quite right to evaluate based on effectiveness in the job - after all, that's what most of us want for our own evaluations.
Steve Gerrard at August 10, 2017 12:04 AM
Steve,
I thought the whole point was that Google doesn't do that. Instead they have one standard for women and another for men. One standard for this group and another for a different group. And also while it is acceptable to look different thinking different is absolutely not tolerated.
Wasn't evaluating people based on their fitness for the job instead of their outwards appearance what Damore called for?
Ben at August 10, 2017 12:21 PM
Leave a comment