Must Love Vaginas (Must Also Have One)
There's notion that gynecologists should be female. In fact, Soumya Karlamangla writes in the LA Times that male doctors are disappearing from gynecology:
Now 82% of residents training to be OB-GYNs are women. The proportion of female gynecologists in practice nationwide is expected to hit two-thirds by 2025. Gynecologists in TV and movies were once exclusively white men, but now the most well-known is arguably the Indian American character Dr. Mindy Lahiri of "The Mindy Project" on TV.Carol Weisman, a Penn State public health and OB-GYN professor, lauded women's success in the field and balked at efforts to recruit men. She pointed out that OB-GYN remains one of the hardest specialties to break into each year.
"It seems to me that there's some residual sexism in that view, that we need men to be sure that we're training the best possible people for our specialty. I find that very odd," she said.
Of course, if there were another specialty or career, it would be A-OK to recruit women (and probably overtly or covertly encouraged).
I've never cared what sex my doctors are. Both of my gynecologists have been male. Then again, unlike a woman in the piece, I don't find the insertion of an IUD a traumatizing thing. Having a male gynecologist look up your hoohoo (with a nurse present) is about as sexy as having a dentist drill a filling.
By the way, one of the top gynecologists (a doctor-researcher) at the big Kaiser facility is a male. You'd be lucky to see him. And you'd be an idiot to swap him out for a lesser-rated and perhaps less good doctor who happens to be a woman.
Okay, yes, female doctors have periods and parts like their female patients.
As female ob in the piece points out, she hasn't had a baby and can still care for pregnant women.
Do you require your cancer doc to have had cancer?
And really, imagine the hue and cry if the tables were turned and women were informed they really aren't welcome in a urology practice that sees mostly males?
By the way: Your greatest worry should be not whether your doctor has the same down there parts as you but that your doctor practices evidence-based medicine,
Pro tip: Most don't.
A 1992 study found that doctors would need to read 17 studies a day to keep current on advances in medicine. My gynecologist works at an HMO. They send him patients one after the next, like widgets on an assembly line, then he goes home. When is he going to do all that reading?
(Even *I* don't usually read 17 studies a day, and I read studies for a living -- and turn them into applied science -- as you'll see in my new science-based book, Unf*ckology: A Field Guide to Living with Guts and Confidence.)
I wouldn't go to a male gynecologist.
a) I did once and it was very uncomfortable, he kept calling me "love" and asking me if I was a virgin (I was tense) and it was just weird.
b) I don't need my cancer doctor to have had cancer, but I do want my doctor to have the same body parts as me. They should know what a speculum in a vagina feels like.
c) This is sexist but I wonder why a guy would decide to become a professional vagina examiner. Don't tell me "Maybe they love babies". Doctors who love babies become pediatricians.
I can also tell you that medical help is great, it was also good to talk to some who had actually given birth. While many midwives and OB-gyns haven't, and are still great, I think it is important to also talk to medical practitioners and laypeople who have gone through the experience.
NicoleK at March 8, 2018 1:15 AM
I will say I did go to a male fertility specialist and he was fine. I did prefer my female fertility specialist the next time around.
OK to say I would "never" go to a male gyno is a strong statement. I have a decided preference for female.
And I perfectly understand a male who would prefer a male urologist. It makes sense to me.
NicoleK at March 8, 2018 1:20 AM
Interesting. My wife prefers a female ob-gyn for the simple reason that her hands are smaller. Her ob-gyn is of Filipino descent, and is tiny in all respects, including her hands. It's a comfort thing. My wife also states that a female ob-gyn is better with discussing intangibles, such as mood swings. She simply feels that there is a profound chasm between men and women in terms of understanding moods, sexuality and other issues connected to being female. A male doctor can have the knowledge, and the know-how, but he can' truly empathize, as he's never had a period and never had a baby and never had a mood swing and never had menopause. Of course, your mileage may vary.
Interestingly, my GP is female, and she does my prostate exam once a year. I've never had any qualms about having a woman do that sort of exam, as she's basically just checking an organ for swelling or other oddities.
roadgeek at March 8, 2018 4:48 AM
I recently developed an inguinal hernia. Getting it diagnosed and treated has necessitated my exposing my junk to four different medical professionals over the last two weeks.
As chance would have it, all four of them turned out to be female. I didn't care. I just want the damn thing fixed, ASAP and the genders of the professionals involved in the fixing are irrelevant to me.
I could have specified male medics only, but that would have delayed my referral by two weeks, my consultation by four and the surgery by - I don't know. It would have been futile, in any case as the surgeon, while male, has a female nurse practitioner, who assists in the surgery.
This is just me, of course. I can understand that other men, or some women, may feel differently.
the other rob at March 8, 2018 4:50 AM
Theoretically, it shouldn’t matter but in my experience male gynecologists are just insensitive (jerks actually.) females aren’t much better. I think in part this may be because females are part of the new frontier and they are building on knowledge imparted by males.
I remember getting stitches after the birth of my first child. I asked for a local anesthetic. I was told,”there are no nerves down there. You can’t feel anything.” A woman would know that is a laughable notion.
A women is more likely to be open to a change in protocol when you point out that performing a procedure that causes bleeding without asking the patient to bring a pad or providing a pad is pretty cruel. Yet that is standard protocol.
Another male thought nothing of sneaking oophorectomy on the chart when we had discussed keeping my ovaries. With the wave of a hand he said that I could just use a spray. PS. It didn’t work. He said, Yes, sometimes it is not absorbed. No big deal. Hm. A women would know that hormones are a big deal.
Jen at March 8, 2018 5:07 AM
It's going to be the collision of women's choices:
- women demand female OB-GYNs, therefore, they turn the specialty into a pink ghetto
- women retire early or go part time to have their own kids, and demonstrably work fewer hours than men in the medical profession
This same newspaper will have an article within five years about the crisi... OH, wait. What's this news from 7/20/17? Nearly half of all US counties lack any OB-GYN? There's a shortage of 8,800 OB-GYNs?
Discrimination has a cost.
I'm sure they'll expect some man, somewhere to fix it when the average woman can't get an appointment.
I want a doctor who will treat me when I need to be treated; I understand that everything above that is gravy.
El Verde Loco at March 8, 2018 5:30 AM
El Verde Loco makes great points.
And I forgot to put this in the piece -- maybe I'll add it. Your greatest worry should be that your doctor practices evidence-based medicine.
Guess what: Most don't.
PS I'm writing a medical expose now -- an op-ed that turned into a book.
Amy Alkon at March 8, 2018 5:32 AM
Your greatest worry should be that your doctor practices evidence-based medicine.
Is that even possible? remember, a sizable portion of the peer-reviewed scientific literature can not be replicated. And not just in medicine.
I guess it's better than a shaman rattling bones at us, but not by a lot. And the bone rattler might make us feel better mentally and emotionally. Faith is a funny thing.
I R A Darth Aggie at March 8, 2018 6:38 AM
A conversation that my wife and I had with one of her friends recently rather stunned me. She and my wife were talking about the topic of male vs. female doctors. (I wasn't participating; I was just listening.) Her friend stated that she would never allow her teenage daughter to be seen by a male doctor under any circumstances. At this point, I had to butt in:
Me: "So your GP is female?"
Her: "Yes."
Me: "And I presume her GYN is female?"
Her: "Absolutely."
Me: "So if she breaks her leg and needs to see an orthopedic surgeon..."
Her: "The surgeon had better be female, or my daughter's not going."
I stopped there. No point in continuing the conversation. This was someone that, up until then, I had always regarded as a fairly reasonable person. Now I know better. And oh yeah, she has a son too.
Cousin Dave at March 8, 2018 6:39 AM
Also: A lot of women don't realize that there really isn't any such thing as a medical specialty that focuses specifically on the male sex organs or male hormonal systems. Yes, it's a part of urology, but urology also includes a lot of things having to do with the kidneys, bladder, and endocrine glands that aren't sex specific. Nearly all urologists see both male and female patients. I think this is one of the reasons that so little progress has been made on the detection and treatment of prostate and testicular cancer.
Cousin Dave at March 8, 2018 6:43 AM
I want to hear more about this "pink ghetto."
These doctors, specialists, are being certified to the same levels of excellence as any other, and with greater technology and research available than to any generation heretofore.
What exactly are the deprivations do you imagine to be at hand?
Cooter, but with practical & personal insight; what's not to love?
Crid at March 8, 2018 6:57 AM
"I want to hear more about this 'pink ghetto.'
These doctors, specialists, are being certified to the same levels of excellence as any other, and with greater technology and research available than to any generation heretofore."
I don't know; you could say the same thing about public school teaching, and look at what's happened there. But as Loco points out above, the main hazard is that locking out a large pool of potential practitioners will result in a shortage, which the government will inevitably "fix" with rationing.
Cousin Dave at March 8, 2018 7:18 AM
Also, from the LAT article that Amy quotes: "It seems to me that there's some residual sexism in that view, that we need men to be sure that we're training the best possible people for our specialty. I find that very odd."
In other words, diversity is a core principle of American values. Except for when exclusion benefits a politically preferred class. Then, diversity doesn't matter.
Cousin Dave at March 8, 2018 7:20 AM
On an anecdotal note, the two women doctors I have seen, and the one I know personally are thin skinned bossy *know it alls*. Maybe fine qualities to get you in and through medical school but not to be a practicing physician.
As I have pointed out before, the problem with evidence based medicine, has to do with your ability to look at the metadata in a study and determine if the study is valid at all.
Most doctors are practitioners. They dont have time to read questionable studies, and probably shouldnt. Even a valid study is only going to give you some shakey statistics, and isnt going to tell you how well your particular patient is going to fare with any specific procedure or drug regimen. .
Isab at March 8, 2018 7:34 AM
"I've never cared what sex my doctors are."
The stuff my guy has had to hear is not for some goody-two-shoes magna cum laude Blossom fan. My failing manhood, the whory-ness, the half-hearted efforts at harm reduction. It had better be a pretty comfortable relationship if you're going to expose the deepest and most vulnerable part of your ego.
Judgement Day. I can't fault anyone for having gender, racial, religious, or other preferences for the person who is going to take the confessional that a sex doc requires. Then again, maybe you really don't have anything to confess.
smurfy at March 8, 2018 8:34 AM
> locking out a large pool of
> potential practitioners will
> result in a shortage
[1.] Nobody's being "locked out" of anything. Any guy who thinks his practice can deliver recognizably good care to patients can hang a shingle wherever he likes, and good luck to him. Those quick to feel a pinching "lock" are probably wise to pick another specialty anyway, no?
[2.] Even if not (and-probably-so-but-nonetheless), wouldn't you expect a corresponding drop in prices from other specialties, podiatry/radiology/ENT etc., now suddenly more competitive for the arrival of this recently-freed male 'talent'?
If standards aren't dropping and prices aren't synthetically bolstered, I see *everything* to admire about this.
Crid at March 8, 2018 8:37 AM
I once dated a woman who rejected women gynecologists. She said she understood why a man would want to spend his days doing this, but the thought of a women rummaging around in her business gave her the willies.
So, any guy trying to be an OB/GYN will have some patients, if for no other reason than patients with the willies - as opposed to having patients with willies.
Conan the Grammarian at March 8, 2018 8:49 AM
My regular ob/gyn is female; my perinatal was male (but I only saw him a couple of times, and mostly worked with his female NP and sonographers.) I had a negative (not pervy) experience with a male OB when my regular doc was on vacation during one of my pregnancies.
For a gynecologist, I prefer female doctors. And I have good insurance, and am willing to pay cash if needed, so I’ll continue to see doctors that I have confidence in and have pleasant bedside manner. I don’t really care about gender for other specialties. But if women prefer female ob/gyns, and because of that preference most ob/gyns are female, that seems like basic economic cause and effect. I don’t think that there should be any institutional discouragement of either gender going into any specialty, but as long as healthcare markets are relatively free choice, patients are going to see who they like.
ahw at March 8, 2018 9:23 AM
Crid, it's well known that when lots of women enter a field, salaries go down... see medicine in Russia.
That said, seems like the free market would fix it... women ask for female OBgyns. There are less men. If there are not enough OBgyns, the salaries will go up and more people will want to be OBgyns, and women will take what they can get.
NicoleK at March 8, 2018 9:57 AM
Meh...I don't have strong preference one way or the other. My daughters were all delivered by male doctors, and I had great care from all of them, and one of them had exceptional bedside manner, he was kind, caring and extremely compassionate during a miscarriage. Even after I moved from the area, I continued to go back to him for a couple of years, but it was such a pain. My current OB is female, and she's pretty good...I don't think she has much personality, but she does a great job otherwise.
Now let's talk about the ridiculous number of female weather reporters in LA right now. I don't know what it is, but every single one of them bugs the shit out of me! I prefer my weather from an older male. I don't know why, but I do! My boyfriend thinks I'm crazy.
sara at March 8, 2018 10:21 AM
Charlotte (NC) has both. The initial forecast is by a blonde in the requisite figure-hugging dress and the later in-depth report is by an older guy with caterpillar eyebrows. Of course, the fact that the weather report takes up almost 75% of the newscast gives both of them significant airtime.
Conan the Grammarian at March 8, 2018 10:37 AM
"If standards aren't dropping and prices aren't synthetically bolstered, I see *everything* to admire about this."
Admire? Why? I see it mainly as a moral neutral. Customers are expressing their preference, which they have every right to do. If a large percentage of the customer base makes their choice on less-than-rational grounds, that doesn't seem like a good thing, but it happens in markets all the time, so c'est la vie. But I can't help but think that if a large percentage of white persons suffering from melanoma expressed a strong preference for a white dermatologist, there would be widespread moral outrage. What's the diff?
And remember, to a considerable extent, medicine is not a free market. If customer choice winds up causing a problem in a non-free market, government will gladly take that as an excuse to step in and take the customer's choice away.
Cousin Dave at March 8, 2018 10:55 AM
"Caterpillar eyebrows" Thank you for that visual!
I've had both male and female gynies. They were all good. I do have to echo earlier sentiments that being a woman helps a gynecologist understand the nuances of the sensations a woman experiences with various medical conditions.
just me at March 8, 2018 11:02 AM
When I was pregnant I felt the female doctors were very blasé and dismissive of what I was physically/emotionally feeling and going through; they'd all been there, done that. The men were much more empathetic and interested in how I was doing and what questions did I have.
As to NicoleK's question as to why god forbid a man would want to "become a professional vagina examiner," I had a male friend in college who was pre-med and wanted to become an OB/GYN because he was fascinated by how the female human body worked. I would guess that probably a lot of the men (and women) who want to become OB/GYNs feel the same way.
Fink-Nottle at March 8, 2018 12:07 PM
Yeah, see, that feels creepy.
It's my hang-up, I know. My problem, not theirs. Lucky for me I have options.
NicoleK at March 8, 2018 12:21 PM
> see medicine in Russia.
Women's be wanted to have time to raise their babies. Seriously, is Russia where you want to find your economic model?
Crid at March 8, 2018 2:50 PM
Me: "So if she breaks her leg and needs to see an orthopedic surgeon..."
Her: "The surgeon had better be female, or my daughter's not going."
I stopped there. No point in continuing the conversation.
I disagree, I would have continued it long enough to request she leave my home and hire a chaperone/videographer should she or her daughter ever with to step foot in you home again
lujlp at March 8, 2018 4:23 PM
The men were much more empathetic and interested in how I was doing and what questions did I have.
That's exactly the opposite of my experience (not with respect to GYN but in general).
I had an accident and injured my knee and the first doctor (middle aged guy) I showed it to just said it's a sprain, walk it off. So after some days it wasn't getting any better and went for a second opinion; this time the doc was female, she was very caring, let's take a look, does this hurt, what do you feel and so on. Then she sent me to an MRI and found out I had torn a ligament.
Stinky the Clown at March 8, 2018 6:26 PM
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