"I'm In My 40s, Child-Free And Happy. Why Won't Anyone Believe Me?"
I'm reminded of the people who scold me that "nobody on their deathbed wishes they'd worked more."
Um, you're not me. I've worked hard to hack my physical and psychological systems so I can have as much energy as possible to write late into the day. My work means the world to me and I do the life stuff in between. That -- not having kids and living in ways other people find fulfilling -- is what makes me happy, is what gives my life meaning.
Glynnis MacNicol writes in The New York Times about the belief many have that if you are a woman without a partner and children, you'll feel miserable and unfulfilled:
On an otherwise perfect spring evening in Manhattan, I again faced a dilemma I'd been struggling with since turning 40: how to counter other people's disbelief that I, single and child-free, could possibly be enjoying my own life....A year earlier I'd mentioned to an acquaintance that I found it amusing that my married friends often expressed envy over my large new apartment -- and that I live in it alone -- and was gently told, "they were just being nice," to make me feel better (I assume about the fact that I was alone). There was my best friend's wedding, a few days after I turned 40, when, happily surrounded by my oldest, closest friends, I was assured I shouldn't worry because "there's still time." (This from a guest to whom I'd just been introduced.)
Once, after telling a group at a party that I'd spent a month living in Paris, I was told that it was "nice that you can still enjoy yourself." As if the fact that I was enjoying myself -- by myself! With a baguette! In Paris! -- was somehow heroic.
For a long time I did brush these remarks off. Yet another unexpected gift of my 40s: just how little concern I have for others' opinions about me. But it's wearing thin. And increasingly I find myself frustrated by the belief that I, a reasonably successful person by most measures, do not know my own mind.
Not long ago, a friend described my book to a group of women in their 50s and 60s. They started laughing, she told me. She asked what was so funny. "It's just that your friend will change her mind about kids at about age 48," they said. "And then there will be a scramble, and a sperm bank, and a tank will arrive in her living room. She'll change her mind, that's so clear."
So clear! As if I didn't understand the consequences of my decision making. I suppose this should not surprise. As a culture, we seem to thrive on judging other women, whether it's their appearance (see every best-dressed list, ever) or what they should be allowed to do with their bodies (cast a glance at the headlines regarding the precarious future of Roe v. Wade). We are deeply uncomfortable with the idea of women on their own, navigating their own lives, let alone liking it.
Loving the fuck out of it.
I could use more money and frequent trips to Paris, but otherwise I'm good.
Two things in life I will never regret: 1) not reproducing and 2) not cohabitating.
I couldn't imagine having young people in my life who, even after they've grown up, still don't go away. Being a parent is not a role you can assume and then discard when you're tired of it and want to do something else. Once you're a parent, you always will be.
As for cohabitating, I like coming home and knowing no one's there. Just me and my cats. My home is my little safe haven from human interaction. The last thing I want is another person occupying my safe haven and asking, "How was your day?"
Patrick at July 7, 2018 3:08 AM
Perhaps off-topic, but when people say things like "As a culture, we seem to thrive on judging other women," I always have to wonder: What about *other* cultures? Has the speaker conducted a cross-cultural analysis and concluded that women judge other women in, say, Germany or Russia or China or Mexico than they do in the US? Doubt it...there just seems to be this instinctive desire on the part of many to take a shot at their own.
David Foster at July 7, 2018 6:07 AM
> when people say things like "As a
> culture, we seem to thrive on judging
> other women"
Not the kind of threesomes that first come to mind, but on point in this context.
Crid at July 7, 2018 6:31 AM
I don't think the parent friends are lying. All lifestyles come with plusses and minuses, and when you've got little kids, what you don't have is a lot of free time for yourself. So you can be happy with your life but still envy aspects of other peoples' without being a liar.
NicoleK at July 7, 2018 6:44 AM
'cause there are never any men on those "Best Dressed" lists?
Do you mean the alarmist panic-inducing headlines of the news media which specialize not in informing the public but in terrifying it?
And when did Roe v. Wade become the sole standard by which we judge the attitudes toward women of every politician or judge?
Is abortion to be the only yardstick against which women's lives and wellbeing are measured?
Conan the Grammarian at July 7, 2018 6:45 AM
"I'm In My 40s, Child-Free And Happy. Why Won't Anyone Believe Me?"
Because pain and despair are the default human conditions. Embrace death puny mortal!
More seriously, because it is a relatively rare situation. I don't have any hard statistics but a rough guess would be 70% of the women in their 40s without children are not happy with that decision. On top of that over 80% of women in their 40s have had children (down from 90% a few decades ago). So I would guestimate the number of happy older childfree women is around 6%. Then you tack on the fact that many women are happy being childless until their fertility starts to run out and then go baby crazy incredibly fast. The number of people who flip their emotions is several times the number who stay pat.
So "the belief many have that if you are a woman without a partner and children, you'll feel miserable and unfulfilled" is accurate. Statistically the one population is significantly larger than the other.
Ben at July 7, 2018 6:56 AM
The world is full of people who are rude. Perhaps they were never taught to be considerate and to put themselves in other's shoes. Logically, if someone is single, for instance, they are either happy about that or are unhappy about that. If they are happy, why say something that denigrates their choice? If they are unhappy, why say something that calls attention to their plight?
Having said that, I believe that most people are ultimately going to be glad they have kids, if they do. It's a tough call because nothing gives you the actual experience of being a parent except actually doing it. That doesn't mean that any given person doesn't know their own mind on this issue and it sure as hell doesn't give me permission to judge them.
RigelDog at July 7, 2018 7:03 AM
“I'm In My 40s, Child-Free And Happy. Why Won't Anyone Believe Me?"
Why do you care if they believe you or not?
Plenty of time to have regrets later, when you are 88, out of your mind, and your second cousin on your mothers side, loots your assets, and sticks you in a nursing home in Poland.
I have dinner with my adult children once a week. We all have holiday dinners with their 93 year old remaining grandparent on holidays and birthdays.
And yes, she lives at home, and we all take care of her.
If you have a dysfunctional family, I understand distancing yourself and going it alone, but if you have a functional family, it is ten times better than alone, especially after sixty when you might find yourself unable to do some of the stuff that needs to be done to have a happy comfortable life.
Ive got a good friend, who lives with his x wife, whom he really dislikes.
He is healthier and happier there than he is alone. They have a daughter, and do family dinners and vacations together. Im happy for him.
Isab at July 7, 2018 7:49 AM
"nobody on their deathbed wishes they'd worked more."
Actually not true. If you are old and broke you may be quite distressed and maybe a burden to your kids. It could be really scary.
My kids are grown and are delightful. I talk to one or the other of them almost every day and see them almost every week. I also had a blast when they were young. It was fun--tiring but fun. Your experience may vary.
cc at July 7, 2018 9:00 AM
Don't let the ankle-biters get you down.
iowaan at July 7, 2018 9:02 AM
> Why Won't Anyone Believe Me?
The lady doth protest too much, methinks. No matter what you do, someone is going to dislike you, and the choices that you have made - often for the most ridiculous reasons. It really won't make any sense, nor will it be accurate. You won't be able to do anything to change their mind. Just carry on...
Snoopy at July 7, 2018 9:02 AM
"Two things in life I will never regret:..."
I'm not going to pretend I know your past, but given the zeal and coherence you present here, usually, I'm not disagreeing with your choices at all.
There might be a better late-life outcome when family is present, vs. an agency of some kind, but teh gap might be narrowing as extended, caring families become rarer...
May you find your way as pleasant.
Radwaste at July 7, 2018 9:51 AM
What Ben said, I've seen lots of happy childless ladies contract baby rabies
Kudos to this chick if she is happy, but its a bit like the person who thru some random fluke always hits 21 at the black jack table feigning ignorance as to why everyone else complains about losing money
We all know the stats, we all know humans by and large are lax thinkers, we all know most women regret not having kids
Why get upset when people who dont know you and you will never see again make a reasonable assumption
Its not like they are arguing the earth is flat or vaccinations are a government conspiracy to geo-tag all people for death camps
lujlp at July 7, 2018 10:49 AM
I am in my 40's and childfree, and I can't understand why CF people seem to spend so much time thinking about something they don't want. There are forums dedicated to discussing something that they don't want. They also seem to spend a lot of time bitching about supposedly endless people questioning / bitching or commenting on their CF-ness. They seem to feel the need to justify their choice by always inserting the caveat of "I love my fiends kids, I am a great Aunt, I love animals!!!!" Like its is not ok to just not like kids. In all my years I think I have only been asked maybe twice, why I don't have kids. It is not something I think about much, nor does it seem to be something other think about me.CF seems to be yet another "Identity" people are labelling themselves with so that they can then turn around and claim persecution and victim status.
Stormy at July 7, 2018 1:03 PM
"your second cousin on your mothers side, loots your assets, and sticks you in a nursing home in Poland."
And then knocks you down in the mud and kicks you. In the head. With an iron boot!
Gog_Magog_Carpet_Reclaimers at July 7, 2018 3:00 PM
She just hasn't found the right person to have kids with yet -
https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/notorious-serial-killer-fathers-baby-12871661
Snoopy at July 7, 2018 4:15 PM
I think it's far more accepted for men to not want children, not to have them, and not want to be in the company of children.
As far as Isab's observation:
Plenty of time to have regrets later, when you are 88, out of your mind, and your second cousin on your mothers side, loots your assets, and sticks you in a nursing home in Poland.
That's certainly possible, but I think it's more likely your own children would do such a thing rather than your second cousin.
Kevin at July 7, 2018 8:29 PM
I dunno, the single men in their 50s I know mention feeling the pressure.
NicoleK at July 8, 2018 4:55 AM
If they are in their 50s then it is kinda too late. After 35 most (not all) women's fertility drops tremendously. But what is not as well known is men have the same effect just later. Around 45-50 most (once again not all) men's fertility drops and being able to make kids becomes pretty much impossible.
Also, I thought you were somewhere in Europe NicoleK. Is this more of a European thing? Here in the south US mothers (and mother in laws) are the ones to pester you about kids. Men don't really get involved.
Ben at July 8, 2018 5:54 AM
That's certainly possible, but I think it's more likely your own children would do such a thing rather than your second cousin.
Kevin at July 7, 2018 8:29 PM
With rare exceptions, children who are treated well, treat their aging parents well.
Isab at July 8, 2018 7:13 AM
I am in Europe but the guys in question are mostly in the US. (I get back regularly and spent the first 33 years of my life there)
I think guys assume they have plenty of time but when they hit 50 they suddenly realise there are not a whole lot of 35 and under women looking to date a 50 year old and they may have missed the boat.
NicoleK at July 8, 2018 11:37 AM
I can see that Nicole. And yes they've missed the boat.
Far as my experiences it may be age as well. I'm in my late 30s. I don't have a lot of childless friends in their 50s.
Ben at July 8, 2018 2:13 PM
Beautifully said, Rigeldog.
____________________________________
I don't have any hard statistics but a rough guess would be 70% of the women in their 40s without children are not happy with that decision.
______________________________________
Dunno, they seem happy enough about not adopting. That's telling.
Here's what I said in 2015:
http://www.advicegoddess.com/archives/2015/03/06/baby_fever_--_e.html
I haven't known anyone who said one thing to ME, but did the opposite later. Most of the people I know are discreet enough not to blab about anything they might change their minds about.
Maybe it happens to those under 40, but if you're older than that and get "broody," as Sylvia Lucas pointed out, that's likely just a case of wanting the fun without the work. Like wanting grandchildren to play with - and then send home. I.e., it's not real regret.
lenona at July 8, 2018 4:59 PM
"He Says He Wants Kids – But Does He Mean, “I want YOU to have kids”?"
https://sylviadlucas.wordpress.com/2012/01/12/he-says-he-wants-kids/#more-604
lenona at July 8, 2018 5:01 PM
http://www.advicegoddess.com/archives/2017/08/linkmonger.html
Part of what I said:
I think there are only three reasons to call yourself childLESS as opposed to childFREE:
1. You have a fertility problem and you don't want to adopt even a healthy baby. Many would say this doesn't really count - at the least, it doesn't count as an excuse to be miserable. Get over it and get a life.
2. You're too poor. This includes the inability to move away from a bad neighborhood where you wouldn't want to marry anyone - and you don't believe in single parenthood. Fair enough.
3. You're too unpopular. Both in the dating scene AND with the foster care agencies.
lenona at August 10, 2017 3:06 PM
lenona at July 8, 2018 5:03 PM
"Dunno, they seem happy enough about not adopting. That's telling."
No it isn't. There is a significant difference between how men and women interact with kids. Women are vastly more concerned with genetic relationships. This is most telling in adoptive and foster kids. Just about the only reason male kids seek out their biological parents is because they have some disease and heredity may play a factor. Quite frankly the very vast majority of male kids have zero interest in their biological parents and never look for them. Female children are very different. Almost all adopted kids that look for their biological parents are female.
So if you were talking about men then you would have a point. But men for the most part don't 'get broody'. In this case we are talking about women. And for a lot of them adoption doesn't fill the need. Hence a failure to adopt doesn't indicate anything.
Ben at July 8, 2018 7:14 PM
"That's certainly possible, but I think it's more likely your own children would do such a thing rather than your second cousin."
I had a childless great-aunt whose estate wound up in a Bleak House scenario due to warring cousins. But do you know why that happened? She didn't leave a will. There's a lesson here.
Cousin Dave at July 9, 2018 7:02 AM
In this case we are talking about women. And for a lot of them adoption doesn't fill the need. Hence a failure to adopt doesn't indicate anything.
____________________________________________
You could still call it selfish. Many adoptive mothers would agree.
Granted, the late Helen Doss (mother of 12 mostly mixed race children and author of "The Family Nobody Wanted") admitted it took her a little while to get used to the idea of adoption. But when she did...whoa!
And if men don't care about genetics so much, why are those who openly WANT children generally not that enthusiastic about adopting? "Carrying on the line" USED to be a source of macho pride, at least.
And I knew I forgot something earlier:
https://sylviadlucas.wordpress.com/2013/05/13/childfree-regret/#more-1970
"Will the childfree regret their choice later?"
Most of it, by Sylvia D. Lucas:
...I always think the “regret” question (or, sometimes, curse – “You’ll regret it!”) is a little weird, because it creates – as I see it, anyway – a paradox.
If someone who genuinely doesn’t want kids at 20, 25, and then 30 doesn’t have kids, s/he’s behaving in a manner consistent with her/his desires for his/her life. “I don’t want to have or raise children” = “I won’t have or raise children.”
If at 55 or 60 the same person has retired and says, “Gee, I wish I would have had kids,” that isn’t – or shouldn’t be called – regret. If anything, someone who genuinely didn’t want children when younger but decides when they’re older that they “shoulda had them” is experiencing a simple desire for something they don’t currently have. They want a child or children right NOW…that is, to suddenly have them around for this moment now that they’ve changed their mind/become lonely/had a crisis. But they certainly didn’t want them before, didn’t want to spend the rest of their lives raising them, or they would have tried to have them.
How can there be regret for something that was never, until now, a desire?
“Aren’t you afraid you’ll regret not having kids later?” (something many people ask) also implies that at some point everyone wants, or will want to have had, kids. And that simply isn’t the case. It also implies that you should aim your life in a direction that MIGHT eliminate regret felt on a porch swing at 90 years old, that to be on the safe side, maybe you should give birth and overhaul your life even if you really don’t want to on the off-chance that you’ll have second thoughts in the future.
A good predictor of future regret – whether it’s over eating a donut, marrying the wrong person, or calling in sick for the third time that week – is thinking I’m going to hate myself for this later.
A person who desperately wants children, marries someone who doesn’t want children, and agrees to stay married without children even as s/he continues to want them will very likely likely have that thought. This person is creating a perfect regret scenario.
But people who truly don’t want children usually aren’t thinking, “I’m going to hate myself for this later.” See video below (60 seconds) for an explanation.
(end)
From Jerry Steinberg, Founding Non-Father Emeritus of NO KIDDING!, the international social club for childless and childfree couples and singles:
I was reading an article in the paper on making career choices, and I thought the following advice pertained, as well, to people making the decision whether to have kids: “Assume that whichever choice you make will turn out to be the wrong one, then choose the one which would be easier to live with.”
From Bad Puppy!
I never understand this question when people ask it. I just reply that life is about choices and every door you open closes others. I mean what if I get older and wish I’d climbed a mountain? People seem to think you are “really missing out” on something if you don’t have kids, but that’s by THEIR barometer of preferences in life. Not yours. I know myself well enough to know what I want and don’t want out of life and what would absolutely be a dealbreaker for my happiness. Feeling as strongly as I do about not having kids, I know I won’t ever regret it, but if I did, dude, we can’t make every choice and live every reality. That’s just not possible. At least not in the context of one lifetime without invoking multiple universes...
...Of course… when someone says: “What if you regret it?” You can always say: “What if YOU regret having kids?” I’ve actually had several parents confide in me that though they love their children they regret becoming parents. I’ve never met a child free person that regretted not having kids later. I guess theoretically such a person could exist, but it would be like searching for a unicorn.
(end)
lenona at July 9, 2018 11:26 AM
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/07/05/upshot/americans-are-having-fewer-babies-they-told-us-why.html
"Americans Are Having Fewer Babies. They Told Us Why.
"Women have more options, for one. But a new poll also shows that financial insecurity is altering a generation’s choices."
By Claire Cain Miller
_________________________________________
One response letter, today, said in effect that you're NEVER going to have enough money or leisure time, with or without kids, so why not have them?
Seems to me that everyone needs SOME leisure time every week...why sacrifice that little amount?
Btw, Rush Limbaugh certainly has enough money. I suspect he never wanted kids and chose his wives accordingly (aside from his stepkid), or his first three wives, at least, may have changed their minds once they married him.
lenona at July 9, 2018 1:11 PM
I'm 49 and childless, yet these conversations never come up for me. It's probably because I don't go around telling people I'm 49 and childless.
If I went around saying to people, "I'm 49 and I've never been to New York City. But I'm happy with that choice! Living in Indianapolis is awesome, and Chicago is only three hours away. Louisville and Cincinnati are even closer! I am totally. Freakin. Happy. Here."
If I went around saying that, I'd expect people to say, "You know, you might regret it if you never went to New York."
Lori Miller at July 9, 2018 2:45 PM
I'm 49 and childless, yet these conversations never come up for me. It's probably because I don't go around telling people I'm 49 and childless.
______________________________________________
Same here, pretty much.
However, I get the impression that the more vocal CF types don't have the luck to live where people mind their own business and don't ask nosy questions - or don't accuse them of going against God's will.
lenona at July 9, 2018 5:47 PM
I tell people it's just me and the dog, and they seem satisfied with that.
And another thing--the author is annoyed that people don't believe she's happy, but some dude offering her his leftover steak out of pity is OK?
Lori Miller at July 9, 2018 6:08 PM
When I was 21, I was invited by a young lady to have some sushi.
I had never had it. It looked slimy. And the idea of eating raw flesh was anathema. So my already decided biases made me not enjoy the experience at all.
Then I went out with a different girl. At this point I was 25. I was wiser and perhaps a bit more flexible. And I tried what I thought I did not like.
I started to enjoy sushi, quite a bit in fact. I would eat it twice a week if I could.
So these 40 something women who say they 'could never be mothers' well...they never tried. All they see is baby vomit, and diapers and the fact that they are not able to do whatever they want whenever they want.
I wonder, if one did a poll, how many mothers said the exact same thing but once they had a kid, said that they were fools before.
I am guessing a lot larger cohort than those who stand by their guns and define their entire identity as 'acerbically childless PITA'.
But I get that this is a one way road: once they pop out that kid, there is no 'backsies'.
So I won't say these ladies are not being honest as far as they can be.
But I will take their criticism of motherhood with the same regard as I would someone who has not eaten sushi critiquing that meal.
FIDO at July 10, 2018 3:53 AM
They seem to feel the need to justify their choice by always inserting the caveat of "I love my fiends kids, I am a great Aunt, I love animals!!!!"
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The more militant CF types refuse to do this and say so - online.
On another point:
http://asylums.insanejournal.com/childfree/424.html?mode=reply
Excerpt:
Belief: "So Childfree people don't want kids - we get that, but it's not necessary to be so 'activist' about it."
Truth: "It is, actually. We network, we share information on doctors who don't make us jump through hoops and undergo psychological testing and still stay 'sorry, won't do it', no matter what. We share information on birth control, we share frustration with others who understand and have been there - at being told we'll 'change our minds', or nagging in-laws, or getting told by a spouse after five years of marriage that they want children and that's that. We vent about not being allowed time off of work to care for infirm parents or roommates, when coworkers can frequently take off as much as they want to run their kids to soccer practice, and dump the rest of the workload on us. We vent about taxes, about lack of social services and help available for those without children, and at how baby-centric society has become - and it has. Haven't you ever personally experienced the relief and pleasure of being able to congregate and converse with people of like minds? If your whole family and most of your friends followed one political party that did not match your views, how would you feel if you met a group of people who do share your outlook on things, and you can talk to without getting yelled at or told you're crazy? It's no different here."
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And Fido, since you can't change your mind about being a parent once you have them - assuming adoption doesn't feel like an option - it's hardly comparable with a temporary choice like EATING one bite of something you've never had. One CHOOSES to develop a taste for it. Btw, I've had coffee more than once, but it's been years since I drank it; I never learned to like it.
Someone compared those childed "friends" who pressure CF people to have kids to those who try to pressure you into doing drugs or joining their religion. I.e., misery loves company, or they wouldn't be so pushy about it.
lenona at July 10, 2018 10:14 AM
Is abortion to be the only yardstick against which women's lives and wellbeing are measured?
_____________________________________
No, but it's still damn important. There are reasons why MOST women now agree that adoption is more traumatic than abortion. It just didn't used to be acceptable to say so. Most single adults who give birth without planning to get pregnant, do not choose adoption these days, as a rule. Also, no woman enjoys having an abortion, but even an IUD can fail.
I saw Mona Charen (born in 1957) on PBS recently (it's the first half of the video and runs for about 14 minutes) -
https://www.pbs.org/video/amanpour-mona-charen-and-alexander-betts-6mozdj/
- and while what she said is somewhat remarkable, I suspect it's an act. That is, soon after the 11-minute mark, she "applauds" the fact that women are no longer stigmatized for wanting careers and/or for not wanting children, so that implies that she's all in favor of ACCESS to birth control, at least, but earlier, she makes it clear she's still blatantly anti-abortion. Does she not care that the 20 states that are ready and waiting to outlaw abortion (these get briefly mentioned in the interview) are hardly likely to do the logical thing and make it EASIER for poor women to get effective contraception? If anything, those states are going to make it harder. So just how sincere is she when she "applauds" women who want birth control?
(By contrast, in Midge Decter's 2001 book "An Old Wife's Tale: My Seven Decades in Love and War," Decter (born in 1927) acts perplexed at the idea that ANY couple would try to control if and when they would have children, compared to couples of her generation, who treated having children as natural and inevitable "as the rainfall." She's Jewish, so I don't know whether she considers birth control sinful or not. So is Charen, btw.)
lenona at July 10, 2018 10:20 AM
Thread on MacNicol's article:
http://www.refugees.bratfree.com/read.php?2,424700
From mumofsixbirds:
"...Even outside my own family bubble, I can see the misery painted on the faces of Duhs, as they lug around their multiple, shrieking kids and morbidly obese wife who looks like she has let herself go pretty badly since her first loaf. It's a simple observation, yet so many people believe it will be different for them, or they will find some sort of existential happiness out of the whole thing. Thanks to TV commercials, the media, and Internet, the image of the happy famblee is kept alive, despite obvious signs that it isn't reality for a lot of people.
"In the end, what does this all really bring them? Poverty? A broken marriage? Serious mental and physical health problems? How do these things equate happiness? I just don't know..."
lenona at July 11, 2018 11:43 AM
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