Poor, Persecuted Christians
Oops, sorry! Like Mano Singham, did I forget to start a war on Christmas?
My, how time flies. What with one thing and another, I realized that it is already past mid-December and my fellow atheists and I have forgotten all about starting our annual war on Christmas. I really do apologize. I have had a lot of things on my mind lately but I'll get on it right away.You know what war I mean. All of us for many years have been plotting secretly in our underground cells with just one goal in mind: to destroy Christianity by undermining the very foundation of that religion: the Christmas holiday. The way we do that is by sending greeting cards or wishing people well with religiously neutral phrases like "Happy Holidays" or "Compliments of the Season" or simply wishing for peace on Earth and goodwill to all, without invoking Jesus or Biblical verses. By using such language our goal was to try and create a time of year when the whole world might be united around the secular ideas of peace and goodwill, anchored by a celebration that originated in a pagan celebration of the winter solstice.
We also try to destroy Christianity by encouraging people to not take part in the traditional orgy of spending vast amounts of money and resources on 'gifts' that have ceased to become gifts in the sense of genuine and spontaneous gestures of affection or response to needs, and have now become the obligatory filling of almost extortion-like expectations which often leads to disappointment and anger and resentment because the gift wasn't good enough or not what was expected or because someone else was given something better.
Another part of the atheist plan to destroy Christmas was to discourage people from gluttonous eating and drinking and to simply spend time socializing with friends and family.
The plan was going along well until it was discovered a few years ago. Bill O'Reilly and John Gibson of Fox News, clever people that they are, saw through our plan. They realized that once people start thinking beyond their own religious tribe and in terms of our common humanity, that was the first dangerous step on the slippery road that led inevitably to humanism, agnosticism, and atheism.
Being manly warriors for god, never braver than when they are facing down imaginary enemies, they started a counter-offensive, wreaking vengeance on those stores and shop clerks who do not use the short list of approved language such as "Merry Christmas" and do not festoon every display and image with the nativity scene and Biblical phrases, such shibboleths being necessary parts of proving that they share warrior Bill's fervor for the Christian god and Jesus.
But is it me or have others also noted that O'Reilly and others seem to have run out of steam on this issue? This year I do not hear the same level of hysteria on their part as in previous years. Are they tired from their strenuous efforts of previous years and handed the baton on to others? Have they declared victory and moved on to other issues that promise better ratings?
Lucky for us, Congress, which only had time to patch, not actually fix the AMT (Alternative Minimum Tax) issue, found plenty of time to stand up for the persecuted majority. Sally Quinn writes for the WaPo:
On Dec. 11, H.R. 847 was passed in the House of Representatives. Just listen to what our lawmakers have resolved:"Whereas Christmas, a holiday of great significance to Americans," it begins, "is celebrated annually by Christians throughout the United States. . . ." It goes on to state, among other things, that "Christianity [is] the religion of over three-fourths of the American population," that "American Christians observe Christmas, the holiday celebrating the birth of their savior, Jesus Christ," and that "Christmas is celebrated as a recognition of God's redemption, mercy, and Grace."
ad_icon"Now, therefore be it Resolved, that the House of Representatives . . . expresses continued support for Christians in the United States . . . acknowledges and supports the role played by Christians and Christianity in the founding of the United States . . . rejects bigotry and persecution directed against Christians, both in the United States and worldwide; and expresses its deepest respect to American Christians."
For brevity, I have omitted the resolution's references to Christianity around the world.
This resolution passed with 195 Democratic yea votes, 177 Republican yeas and nine Democratic nays. No Republicans voted against it. Ten House members voted "present." Forty were not there, including the bill's sponsor, Rep. Steve King of Iowa.
Among those voting for the resolution was a Jewish member of Congress who has asked me not to print his name. He was outraged and appalled by the bill, he told me. But he was also afraid. He thought it would hurt him with his mostly Christian constituency if he voted against it. He told some of his colleagues about his anguish. They advised him not to be stupid. It would be better for him politically if he voted for it.
It's possible that the 10 who voted "present" also had problems with the bill but decided it was safer not to vote against it. One could also assume that some of those who were absent were not there so as not to have to deal with the problem.
Earlier this year the House also passed resolutions honoring Islamic and Indian holidays but nothing that so equated a single faith with America and Americans.
How could this happen, in what will soon be 2008, in a pluralistic, multicultural, multireligious society, a society based on the concepts of religious freedom and separation of church and state? What were they thinking?
This resolution was as anti-American as anything Congress has ever passed. It disenfranchised and marginalized millions and millions of men and women, reducing them to second-class citizens.
Oh, please. Now she's getting all hysterical, too. Can we just have the people in government attempt to actually govern, and leave the sending of Christmas cards (and/or Reason's Greetings cards, and/or lumps of coal) to the people?
For the record, I will wish you a Merry Christmas. Or a fabulicious Kwaanza, or a joyful Whatever The Fuck I Think You Celebrate. Reasonable atheist broad that I am.
Get your Reason's Greetings cards here, at the Freedom From Religion Foundation.
Well, I'd just like to wish everyone a Cool Yule!
Here's a link to my favorite Xmas video so far this year:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2007/12/21/ashton-kutchers-christma_n_77889.html
Flynne at December 23, 2007 8:22 AM
The whole Christmas holiday has been relegated to a now 10 week long shopping orgy. Ben Stein eloquently spoke about this on CBS News Sunday Morning last week:
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/12/16/sunday/main3623554.shtml?source=search_story
What put me over the top was this year some of the kids in our neighborhood REGISTERED online for what gifts they wanted! We got emails from them about what they wanted! AAuugghh!!
This year, instead of sending my clients a bunch of crap, we put that money towards fixing a third world child's cleft lip via operation smile.org. It's really the only thing about the holiday this year that has made me feel good.
PS- Last night the local fire department came through the neighborhood with the fire truck all lit up and Santa throwing candy canes to the kids. It was a wonderful use of the taxpayers money, and something my 4 year is still talking about this morning.
eric at December 23, 2007 9:26 AM
Fucking congress cant even get the religon right
Easter the observance of the ressurection is "celebrated as a recognition of God's redemption, mercy, and Grace"
Chistmas is the celebration of Jesus birth
Why is it really that belivers are nore pissed off at the admited non belivers and not the asshats who obviously dont belive, wont admit it and constantly get every point of doctrine and dogma wrong?
Would any of the faithful like to explain that to me?
lujlp at December 23, 2007 9:31 AM
This year, instead of sending my clients a bunch of crap, we put that money towards fixing a third world child's cleft lip via operation smile.org. It's really the only thing about the holiday this year that has made me feel good.
Eric, you never cease to impress.
And yes, Christmas is a pagan holiday turned into the celebration of the birth of malls. "Merry Christmas" actually translates to "Best of luck at Macy's."
Amy Alkon at December 23, 2007 11:35 AM
Don't you think it's odd that when Congress looks at the 1st Amendment, they insist that "the establishment of religion" means the aiding, abetting or endorsement of same - yet they had no problem identifying "the establishment" as a noun before they gained office?
Radwaste at December 23, 2007 11:59 AM
I did some googling and it's operationsmile.com, and they seem to have a terrific mission. Thanks for pointing them out.
jerry at December 23, 2007 1:07 PM
TO: Amy Alkon, Mano Singham, et al.
RE: Merry Christmas!
God bless you, everyone.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
P.S. And may He give you a very happy New Year.
Chuck Pelto at December 23, 2007 3:11 PM
Quite frankly, I'd love to see an end to the whole Christmas tradition, which is nothing more than an orgy of consumerism.
It's invaded the workplace, with the "Secret Santa" nonsense. What I hate most is the fact that I have to spend the entire day at my mother's house, with people I barely know. I feel a little like a prisoner. I realize that the less introverted types who often throw "icebreakers" my way are making an effort to make me feel included...but, even if I don't want to be?
I'd just as soon spend the entire day alone, instead of the forced exchange of gifts that I'm being pressed into joining. What if I don't feel like giving a person a gift? Or what if I don't know what they like/need/want?
I enjoyed Christmas when I was little. Now it's a tiresome chore. I could spend the morning opening presents, and the afternoon making use of that new sled. Now, as an adult, I'm a prisoner in the house, getting things I don't need, and returning the favor to those who gave to me.
Patrick at December 23, 2007 3:48 PM
TO: lujlp
RE: Perhaps....
"Why is it really that belivers are nore pissed off at the admited non belivers and not the asshats who obviously dont belive, wont admit it and constantly get every point of doctrine and dogma wrong?
Would any of the faithful like to explain that to me?" -- lujlp
...it's not at all what you think.
In the first place, being one of the 'faithful', I, nor any of the other 'faithful' men I hang with are 'pissed off' at non-believers. [Note: And we're all the very 'worst' sort of 'faithful'. We're all born-again'rs.]
Seriously. Do you get PO'd at someone who is ignorant? Even if they're proud of their ignorance? If so, I'd suggest you have some issues regarding anger management. Maybe Dr. [InstaWife] Helen could help.
As for the people who are non-believers, we consider them to be 'ignorant'. And, in many cases 'proud of it'.
Given the opportunity, we'll talk to them to explain our understanding of 'reality'. Whether they accept it or not is not our problem.
As for the people who claim to be christians but are ignorant, we'll talk with them too. Again, it's not our job to 'convert' them to our understanding, but I find it quite interesting to watch their eyes as I explain something to them.
Case in point....
Denver in the late 90s.
Going to the Promise Keepers event at the new Pepsi Center. Waiting at the light-rail station in the pre-dawn light and enjoying a fine cigar.
A couple of younger guys are standing up wind of me giving me the 'eye'. They've got Bibles with them, so I figure they're enroute to the same destination as I. So I strike up a conversation with them.
Turns out their of the Southern Baptist persuasion. And the mention my cigar. Evidently, the Southern Baptists think smoking is akin to drinking alcohol.
Having touched on the topic of 'sin', I commented that he how hates sin hates mankind.
Furthermore, I point out to them that God loves fermentation. And that he uses the same part of His Creation to accomplish it to make bread as wells wine.
It was fun to watch the gears in their heads go into overdrive as they grasped that concept.
So, ignorant christians are treated just the same as non-believers, at least as far as REAL christians are concerned.
Hope that helps.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
P.S. See what I mean about dealing with non-believers?
Chuck Pelto at December 23, 2007 3:50 PM
I'd just as soon spend the entire day alone, instead of the forced exchange of gifts that I'm being pressed into joining. What if I don't feel like giving a person a gift? Or what if I don't know what they like/need/want?
I know what you mean, Patrick. I got my assistant, my editor, and my bookkeeper presents, and I'll get liquor for the guys at my mail place, and tip the guy who does the garden, and the ladies who clean my house, but that's it.
I love giving people presents, but I prefer to do it when I see something I think a friend will like, not because it's December 25.
Amy Alkon at December 23, 2007 3:53 PM
TO: Patrick
RE: How VERY Sad
"Now, as an adult, I'm a prisoner in the house, getting things I don't need, and returning the favor to those who gave to me." -- Patrick
It's not the gifts that are important. Rather it is the chance to be with family and/or friends.
In Denver, we used to throw the doors open to all the holiday orphans of the local chapter of Mensa; those with no family in the area. We'd have about 10-30 people come through; eat, drink, talk, and watch movies.
Where we're at now, we have family and there aren't that many Ms in the area....as far as we can tell.
But we still enjoy having family and friends over. Maybe it's that I enjoy cooking good food and sharing it with others.
This years feast is a roast of beef. It is currently marinading in a mixture of herbs, spices, oils and dry white wine. Tomorrow the Mistress of Baking will prepare a mincemeat pie.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
P.S. But look on the bright side. Obviously, if you're getting things you don't need, you must be the proverbial man who has everything.
In a way, I guess that's kind of nice....
Chuck Pelto at December 23, 2007 3:58 PM
TO: Amy Alkon
RE: Timing Is Important
"I love giving people presents, but I prefer to do it when I see something I think a friend will like, not because it's December 25." -- Amy Alkon
We visit estate sales on weekends.
During the course of the year, we'll pick up things that we think others will appreciate. We then give it to them on significant dates; B'days, other holidays or celebrations. Christmas acts as a great catch all for those who we couldn't find a good date to give them something on.
Case in point...
A great guy who has done yeoman's labor for the sake of all the neighborhoods in this community is going to get a t-shirt we found.
He's a practicing Zen Buddhist, who has the personality of Winnie the Pooh with a Ph.D.
The shirt shows Winnie the Pooh and says, in Chinese and English "Pooh Just Is".
We'll drop it on his doorstep tomorrow night, on our way to a party. A note attached from Santa will look as if hand-written with a quill pen that has seen a lot of work over the last few days.
Signed Santa.
Ring the doorbell and RUN!
Ya gotta have some fun with it all. Eh?
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[There is more fun in giving than receiving. Especially when you do it like this.]
Chuck Pelto at December 23, 2007 4:05 PM
Apparently the Christians are good for something. They managed to do the country a favor when they used up the governments time passing some stupid feel good thing. Much better that they do that then use the time like they have been all the rest of the year, (aka, bending the American public over the barrel.) Now if only we could come up with more ways to waste their time America might actually have a chance of recovering from being governed.
Tomre Utsu Zo at December 23, 2007 6:35 PM
Uh, perhaps you've heard of the Alternative Minimum Tax?
http://www.reuters.com/article/politicsNews/idUSWBT00810020071219
There's plenty that's positive for government to do.
Amy Alkon at December 23, 2007 7:12 PM
"and expresses its deepest respect to American Christians."
And it's deepest disrespect to the rest of us.
Donna at December 24, 2007 9:33 AM
TO: Donna
RE: Hmmmm....
"And it's deepest disrespect to the rest of us." -- Donna
Sounds like covetousness to me.
However, what's preventing you from having Congress pass a similar resolution about Judaism, Buddhism, Taoism, Shintoism, Islam, etc., etc., etc....
Not to forget Atheism and Satanism?
Write your Congressional delegation TODAY!
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[As soon as the man is at one with God, he will not beg. He will then see prayer in all action. -- Ralph Waldo Emerson]
Chuck Pelto at December 24, 2007 10:18 AM
Hey chuck, given the amount of money they pay themselves and the amount of debt the counry is in is it really to amazing to imagine they should be doing their jobs instead of wasting our time?
You want a real world example, AZ is closing it school district for homless and extremely at risk children cause they cant afford 3 million or so a year, but they have the money to afford hunndereds of man hours to put up and take down decorations, and the hundreds of thousands of kilowatt hours to power the decorations.
Keep in mind the school district there closing covers the Pheonix valley which comprises nearly 30 cites, but all thirty cites have the cash to waste on decorations
lujlp at December 24, 2007 1:00 PM
So tell me all ye faithful what whould jesus do?
Spend millions of dollars on a celebration of his birthday(which ironically is at the wrong time of year)
or help the needly and homelss and sick
lujlp at December 24, 2007 1:09 PM
TO: lujlp
RE: This Discussion....
"Hey chuck, given the amount of money they pay themselves and the amount of debt the counry is in is it really to amazing to imagine they should be doing their jobs instead of wasting our time?" -- lujlp
...is one door down the hall and to the Left.
Repost this item there and I'll respond.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
P.S. There's a lot to be said about this. As well as your follow-on comment. But this is the venue about homosexual/unmarried 'rights'.
Chuck Pelto at December 24, 2007 3:46 PM
TO: All
RE: Oops
My mistake. THIS is the thread about that.
I thought I was in the NEXT thread.
TO: lujlp
RE: Money Matters
"Hey chuck, given the amount of money they pay themselves and the amount of debt the counry is in is it really to amazing to imagine they should be doing their jobs instead of wasting our time?" -- lujlp
Congressmen get what....six figures a year?
CEOs get a lot more than that.
As for wasting time and resources....as well as endangering the well-being of others?
I agree.
What's your point?
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Nobody's life, liberty or property is safe while the legislature is in session.]
Chuck Pelto at December 24, 2007 3:49 PM
TO: lujlp
RE: WWJD?
"So tell me all ye faithful what whould jesus do?" -- lujlp
I suspect He'd do exactly what He did to the Sandhedrin of His day....
...rebuke them for the 'whitewashed sephulcurs' that they werer. Embarrassing them in the public eye until the only think they could do is kill Him.
On the other hand, there's the report about how some woman poured EXTREMELY expensive perfume over Him shortly before His murder.
When Judas protested that the perfume could have been sold for one man's wages for a year, He said, "Let her be. She's doing me an honor that will be remembered through the ages," or words to that affect.
On the third hand, many christians do a LOT of good deeds for those who are less well-off during this time of year.
Indeed, reports are that christians give more than any other 'belief system' in supporting the needy.
Hope that helps.
Merry Christmas, ALL!
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[If you have your priorities in their proper order, everything else seems to fall into its proper place automatically.]
Chuck Pelto at December 24, 2007 3:56 PM
Missed the point chuck, my comment wasnt about people, but the government cutting services to the needly to spend money wastfully
try again
lujlp at December 24, 2007 4:38 PM
TO: lujlp
RE: Perhap....
"Missed the point chuck, my comment wasnt about people, but the government cutting services to the needly to spend money wastfully" -- lujlp
....perhaps not.
Perhaps I was thinking YOU were missing the point that should be addressed.
After all....
....Congress is made up of 'people'.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[The World is changed one person at a time; one neighbor, one student, one teacher, one city council member, one Congressman...one blogger.]
Chuck Pelto at December 25, 2007 8:33 AM
P.S. Additionally....
....what are you doing to pick-up the 'slack'?
Or, what were you doing when you abdicated your personal responsibility to the people in the government?
Is there any difference? If so....why?
Merry Christmas....
Chuck Pelto at December 25, 2007 8:38 AM
P.P.S. Even more....
What lead you to think that the government would be the most efficient means of helping the poor?
By and large, I do believe, it is proven that government is among the more wasteful organizations. Especially when it comes to providing support to people in need.
I've not seen any specific figures on this yet. But I know I'm VERY judicious in giving money through 'charitable' organizations.
Case in point....
Last year some such outfit approached me for a donation.
I asked them about their successful pass-through of funding to their target group.
The caller said 80%.
I went to a site operated by the California Secretary of State, which reports their findings on 'pass-through'.
The caller either misunderstood my question or was lying through their smiling teeth, as the CASecState reported they only pass on 20% of their collected funds to their targeted population of needy.
I'd REALLY like to see such a study done on what a fine job the government does of passing along supporting services to the needy, vis-a-vis other NGO charities.
I doubt if the government does any better. And I suspect they do MUCH worse.
I'll have to ask this question of some of my associates in the community neighborhood network. Some of them are deeply into it from the NGO perspective.
Last Friday, one of them was grossing about what a miserable job the local government was doing with respect to human rights. Seems they've got a client who is paralized due to the 'treatement' he received at the hands of the local constabulary, according to his report. They're working the case now.....
Chuck Pelto at December 25, 2007 9:06 AM
TO: All
RE: So Many Posts
Actually, I'm in the kitchen preparing the day's feast; roast beast [it's been marinading for the last 36 hours in oils, wine, herbs and spices], garlic smashed potatoes, green beans, fresh homebaked bread, shriaz. For 'openers', the family tradition of pineapple fritters and champagne. Dessert is a drunken mincemeat pie; bourbon, brandy and Myers rum.
I'm in-between preparing dishes while commenting here.
Hope you're all having a wonderful day.
Merry Christmas,
Chuck(le)
Chuck Pelto at December 25, 2007 9:11 AM
Chuck, you want a website of your own, try typepad.com. Contribute to the discussion, fine. Take it over...not fine. I'm sure you're having a lovely Christmas dinner, but this is not a discussion about Christmas dinner.
Amy Alkon at December 25, 2007 9:35 AM
TO: Amy Alkon
RE: A Site of My Own
Actually...
I've got three.
They're driven with Expression Engine.
Merry Christmas,
Chuck(le)
Chuck Pelto at December 25, 2007 9:40 AM
TO: Amy Alkon
RE: Back On-Topic
Speaking of having a Wonderful Life during this seasons of 'Reason'....
Is there something of a problem demonstrating to the atheists here what living as a Christian is like during this time of the year? Sharing the Joy?
I'm reminded of the refrain in the Newsboys hit Shine.
Shine!
Make em wonder what you got.
Make em wish that they were not;
On the outside looking bored.
Shine!
Let it shine before all men.
Let em see good works and then;
Let em glorify the Lord.
Merry Christmas, Amy,
Chuck(le)
Chuck Pelto at December 25, 2007 9:49 AM
Is there something of a problem demonstrating to the atheists here what living as a Christian is like during this time of the year? Sharing the Joy?
Chuck, my joy is in staying home alone all day, and enjoying the quiet. And in avoiding the consumerism that is Christmas by staying out of the malls and stores. And later, I'll have dinner at my neighbors'.
Post once, okay? This isn't a contest to imitate mouse droppings.
Amy Alkon at December 25, 2007 10:04 AM
TO: Amy Alkon, et al.
RE: Merry Christmas? Bah! Humbug! In Retail??!?!??!
Take a moment to look at this....those of you who are in corporate America and despise the idea of Christmas....
http://www.breitbart.tv/?p=15034
Merry Christmas,
Chuck(le)
Chuck Pelto at December 25, 2007 11:58 AM
TO: Amy Alkon
RE: Holidaze
"...my joy is in staying home alone all day, and enjoying the quiet. And in avoiding the consumerism that is Christmas by staying out of the malls and stores. And later, I'll have dinner at my neighbors'." -- Amy Alkon
Everybody should have 'joy'. Whether at their home and/or in quiet. Or amongst friends, neighbors and/or associates.
As for 'consumerism'....well...I've never been a big fan of that.
I believe that the Guy we Christians celebrate the birth of this day, had something to say about the sort of rabid 'consumerism' you touch upon.
I believe He drove such merchants out of the Temple with a whip, made of knotted ropes on one occasion. He later on commented about how people, as individuals, can serve one of two gods; righteousness or money. The implication was that it was up to each of us to decide for themselves what was 'right' in Life.
But, once again, we come back to the discussion of 'wherein' are the 'rules' we'll judge by?
Merry Christmas,
Chuck(le)
[A man is determined by what he does.]
Chuck Pelto at December 25, 2007 12:05 PM
P.S. I spent only 30 minutes 'shopping' this 'season'.
And none of it was spent in a 'mall'. Rather, I went to a specialty store and picked out what I perceived the distaff needed and wanted.
She seems to have agreed.
NOW...of to the feast....
Merry Christmas!!!!
Chuck(le)
Chuck Pelto at December 25, 2007 12:07 PM
Chuck, post once. I've asked you nicely. Now you're being rude. If you continue along these lines, you'll be rude and banned.
Amy Alkon at December 25, 2007 12:11 PM
Chuch I help run a distribution site for St Marys Food Bank
And while I dont think the govt is the best apparatus for helping the poor, I'd rather children get an education then a 2 week long light display instead of said education
But thats just me
How bout you?
lujlp at December 26, 2007 1:38 AM
As for the Breitbart link, although I'm an atheist, and say Merry Christmas to anybody I don't think is Jewish, I had to laugh at the caption, "To tell Christians that they cannot say 'Merry Christmas' to welcome the birth of their savior is insane dictatorship."
How many people are actually celebrating anything but the international holiday of shopping?
Amy Alkon at December 26, 2007 2:32 AM
TO: Amy Alkon
RE: Any Excuse In a Storm, Eh?
"Chuck, post once. I've asked you nicely. Now you're being rude. If you continue along these lines, you'll be rude and banned." -- Amy Alkon
Go ahead. It's your blog. You can do whatever you like.
Not that I haven't expected this sort of behavior, in due time. It was, as I initially perceived—despite your 'free speech' claim—just a matter of touching on the right button.
Apparently, I've found it.
I bless you—with a better understanding of Christianity during this time—and you want to kill me.
How niiiiice.....
Merry Christmas, Amy....
Chuck(le)
[The Truth will out.]
Chuck Pelto at December 26, 2007 5:24 PM
P.S. In your 'free speech' mentality....
...how many others have you put this sort of gies—only one post—in the last two years, if ever?
Why?
By the by....
....just so you understand.
Did Christ sit in a corner of the Temple and expect the chosen to come to him?
I do believe He was a tad more pro-active than that. Going to the houses of sinners and engaging them on their home-turf, so to say.
Think about it, in this Season that some of us cherish.
"Reason Greetings"?
Back at ya, babe.....
Chuck Pelto at December 26, 2007 5:29 PM
Oh, I don't know, Chuckle, (well said you are laughable), common human decency and a deep abiding appreciation of separation of church and state that has me wanting the government to not endorse my view. Just a pity they felt they had to treat me and 20% or more of its other citizens by endorsing one held by the majority in a country where minority rights are supposed to be protected. I hope you have the lovely delight of how it feels to be alienated in your own land one fine day so you can feel the joy of walking in my shoes.
Donna at December 27, 2007 8:11 AM
“Oh, I don't know, Chuckle, (well said you are laughable)” -- Donna
I’ve sort of taken a liking to Will Rogers’ approach. Get them laughing and you might get them thinking. Albeit, I admit I’m not nearly as clever as Will is.
[Note: Don’t worry about ‘offending’ me. I’ve been abused by the best, one each Colonel ‘No Slack’ Stack.]
“....common human decency and a deep abiding appreciation of separation of church and state that has me wanting the government to not endorse my view. Just a pity they felt they had to treat me and 20% or more of its other citizens by endorsing one held by the majority in a country where minority rights are supposed to be protected.” -- Donna
Oh. I’m pretty sure they’re doing a good job of looking after that 20% interest. If they aren’t, I counsel to throw your particular ‘bum’ out.
“I hope you have the lovely delight of how it feels to be alienated in your own land one fine day so you can feel the joy of walking in my shoes.” -- Donna
You have NO IDEA of how many times I’ve been ‘alienated’ in the land that I and every other man and woman who has served their country and countrymen/women in uniform has been alienated. That includes being spat upon for the clothing I was wearing; something in a deep, rich green, with some bits of ribbon and metal here and there.
How many times have you been—physically—spat on? Or accused of being a ‘baby killer’? Or legally raped in court because the judge during the divorce hearings had ‘something’ against men in the Army?
I think the high points in my list of ‘alienations’ were two....
[1] Accosted by a member of my church choir during practice.
I was in battle-dress, having just come off-duty to the rehearsal.
A man next to me turned and asked, “Why is it you joined an organization that kills people?”
I replied, “I did it just so you could stand there and, with impunity, insult me to my face; without fear of retaliation.” [Note: For the ‘slow’, it has something to do with upholding and defending the Constitution, along with the Bill of Rights.]
He was non-plussed. After a few seconds he said, “A good reply.”
A week or two later he left the choir. And a bit after that, I no longer saw his face in the congregation.
[2] At a Denver Mensa Halloween Party, a Methodist minister, after discovering my profession, asked me a similar question.
To his question I asked him another question, “What was the profession of the first Gentile converted to Christ?”
He paused. He thought. Then he turned and walked away.
[Note: To the ignorant, Cornelius was the first Gentile who was converted to Christ. He was an officer in the Roman army of occupation. See the Book of Acts, chapter 10.]
You asked me to appreciate walking a mile in your shoes.
I got a pair of combat boots you might want to consider....
Merry Christmas,
Chuck(le)
[You haven’t lived until you’ve almost died.]
Chuck Pelto at December 27, 2007 2:44 PM
P.S. Donna....
....it comes with 27 years of 'service' to you and everyone else here, in the infantry. Starting in August 1970.
Hope that helps put thinks into perspective.
Love Ya....and may we all have a Happy and educational New Year.
Chuck Pelto at December 27, 2007 2:49 PM
TO: Amy Alkon
RE: Good Question
"How many people are actually celebrating anything but the international holiday of shopping?" -- Amy Alkon
I'd say that the majority are doing what you suppose. And that only a few are doing what is the REAL 'reason for the season'.
But then again, He said,
Your point is well recognized.
As I said, somewhere here, one can only serve one of two 'gods'; righteousness or money.
Your comment corroborates this statement. And you are right to stand back in your indignation about their misbehavior. I do so myself. But then, over the years, I've come to understand that I can't do very much about it.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[All you can do, is all you can do.]
P.S. And the most you, as I see it, can do is save yourself by being better than yourself.
Chuck Pelto at December 27, 2007 3:16 PM
TO: lujlp
RE: Good Things to Do
"And while I dont think the govt is the best apparatus for helping the poor, I'd rather children get an education then a 2 week long light display instead of said education" -- lujlp
There's a time and place for bright lights; Independence Day, Christmas, New Years, etc.
I doubt if the entire educations process is focused on such. Or do you have statistical proof otherwise?
In not, why is it you remind me of Mr. Scrooge?
"But thats just me" -- lujlp
Maybe I've struck on some commonality here? Eh?
"How bout you?" -- lujlp
Well...
...I have to admit I don't travel quite as much as I used to. Otherwise, I might be taking some illegal to a Roman Catholic church, from where I picked him up on the side of the interstate along the Front Range, in mid-Winter.
This year, my focus has been on improving the quality of life in all the neighborhoods of this community. Something to do with being appointed to the (1) Planning and Zoning Commission, (2) Zoning Board of Appeals and (3) Chair of the association of neighborhood associations for this county.
It seems, we have only so much time in a given day.
But this doesn't stop me from emptying my pockets when I pass a Salvation Army bell-ringer. And I've passed quite of few of them this Season; Sam's Club, Wal-Mart, Safeway, King Soupers. Nothing at Target, as I've sworn off buying ANYTHING at their place until they allow such bell-ringers back.
Then again, there are these discussions with these 'unbelievers'.
Would you believe it, that it takes up so much time????!?!
But, fortunately, right now, I'm in another kitchen experiment. So I've got some time between 'processings' and 'cookings' to indulge in such.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Anyone can cook. -- Gasteau, Ratatoiulle]
Chuck Pelto at December 27, 2007 3:33 PM
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