A lot of health care you would expect to be 'free' isn't. In Alberta, it's nice to have a job with benefits to pay for things like dental, prescriptions, eye exams, etc.

I worked for an oil and gas company a few years back. The security guard who worked in the building was having troubling headaches. He didn't have the money to pay for the MRI needed. The president and the vice-president of the company pitched in the $750.00 to pay for it. Thankfully, he was ok.

It just baffles me that so many are so fed up with our current bad system that they'll buy into government running healthcare. Things need fixing but government controlling it all is not the answer.

How well does the US Postal Service run things? The IRS? The Pentagon is always on budget right? The VA is a paragon of excellence in healthcare for our veterans of course.

I wish people would stop using the word "free" to describe our health care system. It isn't free. We pay for it through our taxes and get an inferior system. And since we cap our prices for medication, we actually free ride off Americans who pay inflated prices to phama companies to compensate for inferior profits here.

A few years ago, my family doctor retired. I was not able to find a new one within the public system and now have to pay a private doctor. I actually sent an e-mail to our Prime Minister asking for a tax refund since I paid for a service and did not receive it. Funny but I'm still waiting for the refund ...

I live in the US, and I can't claim my experience has been nearly as bad, but it's still not what I'd hope for from health care I'm paying for. I experienced sudden and severe hearing loss in my right ear over Christmas, with no clear cause.

A little Web research revealed it could be anything from an earwax blockage to a brain tumor (with the blockage being much more likely). I couldn't even get an appointment with my primary. Spent two hours being routed through her automated phone system. Finally got an appointment with another doctor -- for May 14th. The second doctor I tried was incorrectly listed as a general practice doctor when, in fact, he was an oncologist, but it was another 30 minutes on his automated system before I found that out.

I decided to hit the walk-in clinic, where they diagnosed it as a simple blockage, and I have an appointment with an ENT at the same clinic for next week. I'm just lucky I live in one of the biggest cities in the world, where I can keep trying until I get something. But at least I COULD get an appointment if I didn't give up.

Not to say that our system is perfect but I was treated for Hodgkins lymphoma immediately. I went to the hospital thinking I had bronchitis and they found a large "mass" in my chest. Within a week I was in surgery and had my first chemo within 2. I was closely followed after all of my treatments for 10 years. The system isn't complete garbage but it has it's shortcomings. I am quite sure the US also has it's share of horror stories.

The system can't change - I am 100% uninsurable now!!

I live in Ontario, and the only thing that I have to add to the discussion, is that you have to fight to get the better quality treatments. I rarely use the system because I take very good care of my own health, so when I do, I want to get my money's worth since I'm paying alot for it through my taxes. The doctors try to push you to take the crappy tests and settle for the minimum, but I push until I get what I want. I'm lucky I live in Toronto, which is the biggest city with the most hospitals (probably), but we still have a shortage of GP (general practitioners, generic physicians, etc.)

My favorite Canadian Healthcare story is the guy from 1 of the Maritime provinces who committed an armed robbery in Toronto and then turned himself in. He needed treatment for something that was too long a wait where he was, while the prisoners in Toronto had no waiting.

Another socialized medicine story:
I had a German GF who lived with me in Boston for a few years. She was having dental problems and ended up paying a big discount to have a dental student replace the caps on her front teeth at a dental school. Her teeth looked perfect to me and I asked her one day why she needed to have all her teeth capped in the first place. She said she was seeing her Dentist when she was a teenager in Germany and he suggested getting all her teeth done. His reasoning was that she might as well get them done since it was free.
If that's not socialized medecine in a nutshell I don't know what is.

Drudge is linking a story on the "screwulus" bill. It has provision in it that Daschle wanted. Rationed healthcare is on it's way here.

Sio, what's your beef with the USPS? I've spent lots of time in Canada, Britain and France and our postal system here in the US puts them all to shame. Certainly there are plenty of anecdotes about lost mail, discourteous clerks etc., but I marvel at how, on the whole, efficient it is.

Yeah, I'd be a lot more likely to compare it to the Department of Motor Vehicles.

The USPS has never done me wrong. I can get a letter from one side of the country to the other in under a week for 42 cents.

However, going to get my motorcycle license had me waiting in line for over an hour to get to the computer to take the test (there was nobody in front of me, but they don't multitask), and then another hour or so to get my picture taken for the new license.

Oh, and because I pay cash for my medical care, I never wait if I need an appointment.

I have been speaking with my dentist quite a bit lately, and I asked him about dental care up here in Idaho. It really is not affordable for most, not some, families any more. I mentioned here my little accident was $7,700, less $1,500 (maximum per year) paid by my insurance. How many families have that kind of money laying around?

When I was growing up, solidly blue collar middle class, dental care was pretty universal amongst the working, albeit less sophisticated than today.

While I appreciate the years my dentist has served in school, and the excellent work he is performing, my total time in the chair will be about 6 hours, and figure on another hour or two for the tech to build the porcelain bridge. How does that come out to $7,700?

PS- I shopped around, everyone was about the same price.

Eric -

Consider this:

He has to pay licensing fees. He has to pay for that office, and its staff. He has large amounts of highly specialized (read: very expensive) equipment. And he has to pay gobs of money for malpractice insurance in case you don't like the way your face looks when you come out.

If there's any anesthesia involved, that goes a long way toward explaining the price as well, as anesthesiologists are the most expensive part of any operation. And the least willing to deal.

Most of your cost is tied up in their risk mitigation, however. I would not be the least bit surprised if they keep the prices high to scare off customers that might be looking for a payday.

Oh, and remember what I said I thought the end-game of nationalized healthcare was? I said it was "to decide who lives, who dies, and who gets born".

I never thought they'd have the balls to use it as their opening move.

Sweet JESUS, Brian!! We are so fucked. I've got to go write my senator now.

Eh, I like the USPS overall but they're not exactly known for overall fiscal efficiency. They have gotten quite good on service overall in the last decade but stamp prices keep going up and up and now they want to drop service down to 5days/week. The DMV is probably a better example, I'll grant you.

Rojak--where do you live? I live in downtown LA, and we don't get mail on Mondays, Saturdays, days after a holiday, days where the regular carrier is on vacation or is sick, and most of the time, the mail's mis-delivered, messed up, opened, or worse. Our carrier is barely literate in English and his supervisor is (no lie) legally blind. My dog could do a better job.

The US Postal service has consistently given me better service than UPS or DHL or FedEx, all of which I've had hassles with in the past year.

I'll point to one other thing the government does well -- in many southern states, government controls liquor stores. Booze is a whole lot cheaper at those fine ABC Stores, and the supplies are more diverse.

OMG, you let the government control your booze? I had no idea that happened in the US. The Ontario government controls our booze (and beer). It's actually not that bad.

Chrissy -

There are still "dry" towns and counties in some southern states.

The town where the Jack Daniel's distillery is located is dry. They can't taste the product on the premises.

> albeit less sophisticated
> than today.

I'd bet that's the magic passage.

Last year, after 48 years, I had to stand down one of my original Soldiers in White for a synthetic replacement... And the new thing thing is fucking fantastic. The surgery was intrusive as hell but essentially painless. There were about a hundred fabulous chemicals involved, and all sorts of machinery and infrared and and ultraviolet and all this other stuff. Now the smile's as good as ever, undetectably improved and maintenance-free for the rest of a lifetime. The doctor/surgeon/whatchallit was a fucking genius, his assistant was a gorgeous brown-eyed ninja (all I could see behind her blue mask, a beauty that sustained me in grim moments), and even his receptionist was a fearsomely courteous and efficient business professional. The three of them could have launched a space shuttle... They were that good.

Let me put it another way: If all the poor people in our communities wanted to back off to the 1950's standard of dental care to pay the 1950's kind of prices, we wouldn't let them. Dentures like your granddad wore are immoral.