Without You, I'd Really Be Lacking In Problems
You guys have been so super giving me your "What Do You Do When...?" manners questions to help me get the chapter outline done so I can sell my next book (and figure out what to put in it!).
For the uninitiated, this is a comprehensive book on manners for the 20 to 40 audience, covering all the areas regular people go in their daily lives (none of this business on how to address a wedding invite to a divorcée or what to do with a fingerbowl).
Today's topics I need questions on are: Children (The Underparented Child and general manners questions about your own children or others').
And then there's Communication (the spoken and written word).
And, finally, Family Gatherings. Examples of questions include:
•How to set boundaries with those relatives who shout across the table to you and your significant other to ask when you're getting married or having that baby.
•How to keep holiday dinners from degenerating into political shouting matches.
•How to keep the family drunk from ruining yet another dinner.
•What to do when your boyfriend, girlfriend, or spouse has too many family gatherings they expect you to attend.
Please feel free to post questions that aren't in these categories. Also, I could use some interesting questions (on love, sex, dating, and relationships) for my column now, so if you're wondering about something, please e-mail me your question at adviceamy at A O L dot com.







My question is, what do you do when your MIL insists that every Christmas be spent with their side, and cries hysterically when you explain you're alternating their side, your house, your parents'.
NicoleK at September 27, 2010 6:45 AM
My in-laws hijack all the holidays, too, sometimes just calling us on the phone to let us know when they'll be arriving, with no invitation issued and no inquiry into whether or not we have plans. This has been a point of contention for years, since my husband refuses to "turn away family" on a holiday. I think their assumption is horribly rude, and it's ruined more than one of my plans in the past. Add to that the fact that they have money and my parents don't, which results in the in-laws being free to travel at the drop of a hat as much as they like, while we generally have to be the ones to visit with my parents...so if we any afford to travel for the holidays, it essentially guarantees we end up staying hone and hosting my in-laws because "we aren't doing anything anyway."
Also, my best friend has in-laws who insist on everyone exchanging Christmas gifts that precisely equal each other in monetary value. If anyone differs from this for any reason, financial or otherwise, all he'll breaks loose. She rightly feels that any assumption of a certain "class" of gift is rude and ridiculous, but there isn't a whole lot of room for discussion on that side of the family. Any ideas?
mse at September 27, 2010 7:29 AM
Here's a touchy question for you. How much leeway do/should you give for a misbehaving child with special needs? I mean, you paid your money, and it's not quite fair for your night to be ruined by a screaming kid, but how much does the situation change if it's an autistic kid having an over stimulation meltdown as opposed to just a brat who wants dessert first?
We've got a special needs kid who we go to great lengths to teach manners and self-control. She does pretty well, and we're not afraid to get her to calm down or be quiet. So when we see another kid who clearly has issues in a restaurant or store having a meltdown, our heart goes out to them. However, there's a point where a person should really accept that the situation is potentially upsetting to others, and should consider taking it outside, proverbially speaking.
It's an absolute balancing act. It's far more challenging to deal with a special-needs kid, and harder still to get them to behave in every situation. But as any parent will tell you, there gets to a point where you want to go out, and none of the babysitters you trust are available, so you just cross your fingers.
Most people will be more understanding if it's clear the child has an issue, but should there be a reasonable limit before the parent(s) should accept that you're becoming a big enough distraction to leave or otherwise diffuse the situation?
Also, in today's litigious society, it becomes a very touchy subject to go over and offer advice just as an individual, let alone if an employee of the business tries. I gotta tell you, if you think having a non-issued kid makes people into entitled yahoos, you should meet some of the parents we've met. They think everything their child does must be forgiven without reservation. They forget that the goal is to get them to participate in society, and manners is a big part of that.
Of course, it's just as annoying when some self-important person comes over and starts offering parenting advice, unaware (or uncaring) of the extra parameters that special needs add to everything. I have to admit, in the back of my head I fantasize about a boorish clod storming over and hissing "What is WRONG with your kid?" and watching him deflate ashamed when I calmly reply "Aspergers Syndrome. She's quite high-functioning, but she still has moments where she needs to get up and shake off some energy. we're working on it, and she's made great progress."
Vinnie Bartilucci at September 27, 2010 7:37 AM
Amy Alkon
https://www.advicegoddess.com/archives/2010/09/without-you-id.html#comment-1759039">comment from Vinnie BartilucciThanks, Vinnie, for that. I'm actually putting that in the book -- my friend Sergeant Heather has a kid with autism, and she's great on this. She tells people around her that there may be an outburst, and if there is, she's sorry, and they'll go outside the room. I think parents of special needs kids need to act the same way parents of non-special needs kids do: If my neighbor's kids start throwing a tantrum at the grocery store, she leaves the grocery store and takes them out to the car and goes home if they don't quiet down. If people can see that your kid has some issues, they're going to feel differently than if they don't (and probably feel for you and the kid), but I think the same rules of consideration apply. I also think it helps if the parent makes some gesture of "Sorry!" to the others, and show you mean to do something (take the kid outside, etc.). Life happens, but if you show that you care about others' being disturbed, and aren't just all "Hey, suck it up!" I think people cut you some (or a lot of) slack.
Amy Alkon
at September 27, 2010 7:46 AM
Ugh. I had a classic one last night.
http://martinisforbreakfast.wordpress.com/2010/09/26/the-dumb-daddy-brigage-was-out-in-force-tonight/
I quite honestly think I'm either going to have to start taking pictures of this stupidity and getting them on the 7 o'clock news or just stop leaving the house. It's getting ridiculous around here.
What made it especially bad is that it was clear the waitstaff was NOT happy about it (one waitress went over to the kids SEVERAL times to take things away from them, like the salt & pepper shakers from another table) and the fathers HAD to have seen this and did NOTHING. Not to mention the running and rolling on the floor game the kids were doing all around the bar, complete with screaming.
I've decided they're a lost cause and it's time to start shaming the business owners who allow this. It's not fair to their staff, or to their well-behaved customers.
Ann at September 27, 2010 9:20 AM
Re: the drunk family member who ruins holidays.
This might sound a bit extreme for some people, but I have a sibling who's been known to get obnoxious with a few under his belt. We're not a big family, so for the last few Christmases, we've had a no-alcohol Christmas dinner. It was usually held at my mom's house and since it was her house, it was her right to set the rules.
This sibling of mine can only go for about three hours without getting restless, so when he and his wife say they have to leave, which is usually right after dessert, we don't argue or try to convince them to stay. However, we have been known to treat ourselves to a nicely spiked eggnog as soon as we hear their car pulling out of the driveway.
The thing is, as much as alcohol functions well as a social lubricant, it is actually easier to have a good dinner time conversation with people who aren't drinking. And, of course, all of us in the know know the spiked eggnog is coming anyway.
ie at September 27, 2010 9:49 AM
I forgot to add that my sibling, of course, figured out what was going on, so he would usually tank up before he arrived. However, he had to spend the next few hours getting through Christmas dinner while detoxing, which isn't pleasant and which pretty much guaranteed that he was gonna be out the door right after dessert. It was better than the alternative, trust me.
ie at September 27, 2010 9:55 AM
I'm glad Vinnie addressed the question of how to guide special-needs kids to behave in public, like our high-functioning Aspie/ADHD daughter, and I felt that your response was spot-on. No two kids with special needs are alike anymore than any two kids without special needs are alike, but their parents still have to recognize that these kids have to live in this world and adapt as much as they realistically can, even if it requires OT or other kinds of therapy.
On a related note, a few years ago, when my dear mom was still alive and well, she and our daughter and I went to a lovely pool/beach club in Vero Beach, FL. Keep in mind that in addition to my daughter's issues, Mom was still sensitive about my having been diagnosed as autistic at the age of 3, having shown all the classic textbook autism symptoms. (Kudos to The Cornerstone School and Center for Preventive Psychiatry for helping me get over these issues...but I digress.) Furthermore, in our area, they're very Aspie/autism-savvy and unafraid to openly discuss it with folks who are sympathetic and understanding, with resources like Good Shepherd to help out such families. So when we were at this pool club, a lady noticed our daughter having one of her brief "walkabout" moments where she flapped her arms and walked up and down briefly to get rid of her pent-up energy before jumping merrily back into the pool. Mind you, she wasn't being disruptive; she had even found a quiet, shady, out-of-the-way spot for her walking, and I had my eye on her the whole time. (She's an excellent swimmer, BTW.) This lady took me aside and asked me, in a very kind, friendly way, if our daughter had Asperger's, because her nephew had shown similar symptoms. I said yes, and we had a perfectly nice talk in which I recommended various options for therapy and such. When the lady thanked me and left, my mom was livid: "What nerve! How dare she pry like that! I bet she doesn't even have a nephew. She's probably just a nosy bitch!" Vinnie and I are so used to this sort of thing where we live that I had never stopped to think that the wound was still so raw with Mom that even this quiet conversation got her so upset. Maybe when folks are as used to these situations as Vinnie and I are, we unwittingly forget that not everyone has the same viewpoint -- not that this excuses the boors out there whose social skills need work!
DorianTB at September 27, 2010 10:07 AM
Amy Alkon
https://www.advicegoddess.com/archives/2010/09/without-you-id.html#comment-1759147">comment from DorianTBI'm glad Vinnie addressed the question of how to guide special-needs kids to behave in public, like our high-functioning Aspie/ADHD daughter, and I felt that your response was spot-on.
PHEW! Hard enough to be a parent of a special-needs kid without even the advice columnists coming off as jerks.
Amy Alkon
at September 27, 2010 10:27 AM
Here's how I've handled the "when will you have kids" bit, depending on how pissed I was:
"Gee, I don't know what's wrong. We've been having wild sex every single day and just don't know why we aren't pregnant. We've tried missionary, doggie style, me on top, nothing. What worked for you and your wife?"
"Well, it's one of two things. Either I don't want any kids, and it's none of your business, or I want kids and am having trouble getting pregnant. Which is also none of your business, but thanks for making me feel bad."
Lesley at September 27, 2010 10:27 AM
Some advice columnists may come off as jerks, but I'm happy to say that you're not one of them! :-)
DorianTB at September 27, 2010 10:29 AM
Amy Alkon
https://www.advicegoddess.com/archives/2010/09/without-you-id.html#comment-1759179">comment from DorianTBSome advice columnists may come off as jerks, but I'm happy to say that you're not one of them! :-)
Thanks, Dorian...I am a jerk because I'm human, but I try to identify when and where I'm a jerk and do my best to be less of one.
Amy Alkon
at September 27, 2010 10:56 AM
"Why haven't you had kids yet?"
"I've had four. CPS keeps taking them away."
MonicaP at September 27, 2010 11:16 AM
Before my spouse and I had the kiddos, and people asked us when we were going to reproduce, I'd smile sweetly and say "I'll tell you all about my sex life just as soon as you tell me all about yours."
That usually shut 'em up.
My question regarding parenting:
When kids are behaving poorly in public, do you address them, or address their parents? Personally, I believe in speaking - politely and non aggresivley - directly to the child. But I've had parents come unglued when I've addressed the child. (Ummmmkay. Your kid is six and acting like a howler monkey on meth. All I said was "Please keep your hands to yourself.")
And, if you do say something, what do you say back to the parent who says to you "Don't you DARE talk to my kid!"
UW Girl at September 27, 2010 11:40 AM
>>>And, if you do say something, what do you say back to the parent who says to you "Don't you DARE talk to my kid!"
I say, "Are you the parent? Then start acting like it?"
lsomber at September 27, 2010 12:28 PM
Okay, here's a question. What do you do when you're in the grocery store (at ten p.m., which is when the children in our house house are asleep, hubby is home and I can shop without a horde) and you come across a mother toting four small children and a cell phone, the mother ambles around chatting, following the same general path as you, and her brats yell, throw boxes, pull stuff out of your cart and practically beg for a smack?
After the kids started pulling stuff out of the cart I walked up to the mother and tapped her on the shoulder, when she turned around I said, "Excuse me ma'am, it looks like your children are having trouble controlling themselves. Maybe you want to take them home, like now?" She thought I was just the biggest witch in the world and said so, very loudly.
Alice at September 27, 2010 4:05 PM
Yes the dreaded Children or Marriage question. True I have been with my gf for about 9 years but being asked "Oh, you been together a long time, why are you not married? OR "You guys should get married". I usually brush off or give a slightly true excuse. Then the children one which is a little touchy as the GF can not have children. I mean some of these people are my friends but I still can not tell them "Oh by the way my GF can not have kids" as that is a touch to personal plus not really my place to say.
How to interact with strange children. I mean in this day and age of STRANGER DANGER how do you say hi to that cute kid or play with that little boy who runs up to you with a toy. I mean I have it so lucky here in Korea (which is slowwwly getting the stay away from kids vibe) but that day when I head back to the west. I mean the safe bet would be to look at the parent or ask for permission but include the rejections or the looks of pervert!
John Paulson at September 27, 2010 4:55 PM
This advice won't work for some? most? autistic/ Aspergers kids, but applies to other special needs kids. Our pediatric neurologist in Detroit (Harry Chugani- awesome doc, well worth the 370 mile drive, shameless plug) told us to not treat our daughter any differently than any other child when it came to discipline. He also said don't let her tell us "I can't". For the record, she has cerebral palsy and epilepsy. She doesn't have cognitive impairments, but she HAS had two strokes, and we think her inhibitory center took a bit of a hit with one of them. This can lead to some interesting moments, but she knows full well what does and doesn't fly in public. We don't cut her any slack, she's held to the same standard as her sisters and her classmates.
Juliana at September 27, 2010 5:27 PM
Oh, and Monica P's reply at 11:16 for the win.
Juliana at September 27, 2010 5:28 PM
When people come unglued always stay calm, and make all your statments sound like questions, drives them fucking nuts.
The people who tell you not to talk to their children, suggest that perhaps they should raise their children in such a manner that strangers wont be required to adjust their bad parenting techniques.
As for questions on marrige and children, mention you've been sacrificing as many animals on your alter to Marduk as you can in your quest for fulfillment, then ask about their pets
lujlp at September 27, 2010 5:47 PM
For John Paulson: my boyfriend and I have been together for ten years, with absolutely no plans to cohabitate or marry. He came up with the best comeback ever to the "when are you getting married" question:
"Ann and I have decide that if one of us goes down on one knee it's to be beheaded."
Shuts them right up. Seriously, their brains short circuit. And they stop asking personal questions.
Ann at September 27, 2010 7:48 PM
We do cohabitate. I do sort of want to get married but their are problems with the marriage question - money, family, religion, distance, immigration, she lost dead mother's wedding ring,and so on.
I think I have people think either it is been so long so do it or LOVE (tm) will conquer all problems. At that point I really want to smack somebody or roll my eyes.
Also as to the children question. Even if I do spill the beans about her nability to have children then you start getting advice that you do not really want. Oh have you considered adoption, or are you sure, etc! Really I do not want to talk about this with YOU heck I have trouble talking to my GF about it.
John Paulson at September 28, 2010 2:10 AM
Actually the one thing that I am been wondering about COMMUNICATION for the last few years is the lack of it. I mean we live in the age of instant email, skype, cheap long distance phone calls, and so on. Yet, people still do not communicate! Including me!
Another one is nobody will call each other - I mean my girlfriend gets sad once in a while as no one is calling or talking to her. Me as a guy give the logical advice of hey why don't you call _______. Yet she doesn't and then complains that they don't call her. Thus going into a strange cycle or a phone call game of chicken that the other half does not know they are playing. Why for some people are they so reluctant to be the one to intiate? Does it seem desperate?
Hmm
John Paulson at September 28, 2010 3:02 AM
Juliana, I agree with your pediatric neurologist! My late mom learned a sobering lessons when my sister was diagnosed with various behavioral, neurological, and psychological problems back in the late 1950s (before I was born, for the record). Back then, they assumed every problem a kid had must be the fault of evil, unloving parents. Moreover, the "experts" of that era strongly cautioned parents of kids with these issues not to try disciplining them, as discipline would crush the poor waifs emotionally. The result: instead of being a kid with developmental issues, my sister became a monstrous spoiled brat with developmental issues, and remains one to this day, having wreaked havoc on our lives in myriad ways, resulting in restraining orders (she has a habit of stalking people when they won't let her dominate their every waking moment) verbal and physical violence often intense enough to land her in jail. My well-meaning mom inevitably bailed her out, which I'm afraid only confirmed my sister's belief that her actions had no consequences, therefore she should feel free to cause as much trouble as her whims would allow. OY!
DorianTB at September 28, 2010 6:56 AM
What do you say when your date reveals that his last relationship ended because he had an affair.
Then says it was 2 years ago, it was the first time and he learned a valuable lesson and won't ever do it again. HMMMMMMM! To trust or not to trust???
Sallie at September 28, 2010 8:28 AM
What do you do when a friend tells you she is becoming close plutonic friends with her boss at a job where she only works a couple hrs a wk, but loves. She says he's a potential life long partner.
I said quit if he's what she wants.
Jay at September 28, 2010 8:35 AM
What do you do when you're in the grocery store (at ten p.m., ... following the same general path as you, and her brats yell, throw boxes, pull stuff out of your cart and practically beg for a smack?
... Change isles.
Start with bread & work your way back to fruit. Get off the same general path as them.
Megan at September 28, 2010 8:51 AM
Question for family gatherings: What's the best way to deal with malicious gossip when it's about you?
I have a couple of family members who like to spread lies and hurtful conjecture about me and my husband, mainly for the drama value. Sometimes these things get back to me. For the most part, I ignore it. I don't want to waste that kind of time correcting things that never happened anyway. But I feel especially compelled to say something when it's about my husband. The usual response to me calling them on it is, "Oh, I never said that. She/he must have misunderstood."
This kind of gossip has already ruined a relationship with a family friend that spanned 28 years.
MonicaP at September 28, 2010 2:22 PM
What do you do about the family member that shares other people's personal info on facebook or other social networking sites?
My cousin had a health issue and her mum spread it out in the ether to her "friends".
One of my own relations tagged me in FB pictures with my full name and very small town real life location. It has happened more than once with different people.
LauraGr at September 29, 2010 10:48 AM
What do you do about the family member that shares other people's personal info on facebook or other social networking sites?
Pretty much what you do about anyone who spills private info they shouldn't: Don't tell them anything you're not OK with the whole world knowing.
One of my own relations tagged me in FB pictures with my full name and very small town real life location. It has happened more than once with different people.
You can ask that they remove it and not do it again. People shouldn't get mad if you ask nicely. One of the good things here is that you will know when people tag you.
MonicaP at September 29, 2010 2:43 PM
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