Zero Tolerance...Of Kitchen Spices?
Just when you thought zero tolerance policies couldn't get any stupider, there's this: A kid getting suspended from seventh grade for...get this...possession of a bag of oregano. Temporary possession, at that. Elisabeth Hulette writes in the Virginian-Pilot about Adam Grass' suspension:
The school called it an "imitation controlled substance," which is prohibited under division policy. Even though Adam didn't bring it to school, and was just passing it from one student to another, he was suspended for 10 days and recommended for expulsion, Grass said....It all started, Grass said, when the older brother of a boy at Hickory Middle said it would be "really funny" if he brought a bag of oregano to school, Grass said. The younger brother did and showed off the herb in the lunchroom.
Adam walked away, but later ran into a boy who asked him to return the oregano to its owner.
Adam took it, then realized the owner wasn't in his next class. He passed it to another student.
"So he was in possession of it for maybe 30 seconds," Grass said.
When school officials found out, they suspended four boys, including Adam, he said.
John Whitehead, founder and president of The Rutherford Institute, called the case an example of when schools overreact with zero-tolerance policies.
The institute has handled hundreds of such cases, which seem to be growing in number and severity nationwide, he said.
Worse, such incidents land on students' permanent records, which can keep them from getting into colleges such as service academies. That's what could happen to Adam, a candidate for the National Junior Honor Society, Whitehead said.
via ifeminists







Maybe they thought too hard about his last name and got confused?
Seriously, though, this is insane. I get the concept (though don't necessarily support it) of banning imitation weapons (though schools have taken that waaaaaay too far), because they can be used to scare or intimidate other kids, but what is the perceived harm of a bag of oregano? Unless he's selling it to other kids, which is a whole different offense. It was a stupid thing to do, deliberately provoking the administrators, but punish the kids for that, not for showing up to school well-supplied for a nice marinara.
NumberSix at March 18, 2011 12:20 AM
Didn't we see this in "A Few Good Men"? Yes, we did.
Kaffee: Dave you seem distraught.
Lieutenant Dave Spradling: We were supposed to meet in your office 15 minutes ago to talk about the McDermont case. You're stalling on this one. We get this done right now, or I mean it, Kaffee, I'm going to hang your boy from a fuckin' yardarm!
Kaffee: Yardarm? Sherby, does the Navy still hang people from Yardarms?
Lt. Sherby: I don't think so.
Kaffee: Dave, Sherby doesn't think the Navy hangs people yardarms anymore.
Lieutenant Dave Spradling: I'm going to charge him with possession and being under the influence while on duty. You plead guilty I recommend 30 days in the brig with loss of rank and pay.
Kaffee: It was oregano, Dave. It was 10 dollars worth of oregano.
Lieutenant Dave Spradling: Yeah, but your client thought it was marijuana.
Kaffee: My client's a moron that's not against the law.
Lieutenant Dave Spradling: Kaffee, I have people to answer to just like you do. I'm going to charge him.
Kaffee: With what? Possession of a condiment?
Lieutenant Dave Spradling: Kaffee...
Kaffee: Look, Dave, I tried to help you out of this but if you ask for jail time I'm going to file a motion to dismiss.
Kaffee: You won't get it.
Kaffee: I will get it. And if the MTD is denied I'll file a motion in limine seeking an evidentary ruling in advance and then I'm going to file against pretrial confinement and you're going to spend the next three months going blind on paperwork because a Signalman Second Class bought and smoked a dime bag of oregano.
Lieutenant Dave Spradling: B misdemeanor 20 days in the brig.
Kaffee: C misdemeanor 15 days restricted duty.
Patrick at March 18, 2011 3:14 AM
Patrick that was awesome!
Sabrina at March 18, 2011 4:30 AM
So...going to school is like joining the military, except you don't have a Uniform Code of Military Justice to go by?
I R A Darth Aggie at March 18, 2011 6:46 AM
Hers the problem, y'all are jumping to conclusions about the schools and the administration, with out all of the information. Check the state laws, here is Nevada's
NRS 453.321 Offer, attempt or commission of unauthorized act relating to controlled or counterfeit substance unlawful; penalties; prohibition against probation or suspension of sentence for certain repeat offenders.
1. Except as authorized by the provisions of NRS 453.011 to 453.552, inclusive, it is unlawful for a person to:
(a) Import, transport, sell, exchange, barter, supply, prescribe, dispense, give away or administer a controlled or counterfeit substance;
(b) Manufacture or compound a counterfeit substance; or
(c) Offer or attempt to do any act set forth in paragraph (a) or (b).
As you can see counterfeit substances offered or possessed are treated as the real thing, ie "Dude look what I have, is a crime. You can search the NRS, I thought it was about fake Viagra and other "legit" drugs, but it covers ALL controlled substances and administrators, have to pass it on to the cops and impose school consequences,
Piper at March 18, 2011 7:26 AM
If these folks are so stupid, why do they want MORE control:
http://www.moonbattery.com/archives/2011/03/do-your-part-to.html
Ben David at March 18, 2011 7:38 AM
BTW, not saying it is right, just might be a matter of law. Personally, It would have made my job easier to not call LE on fake drugs
Piper at March 18, 2011 8:02 AM
Piper --
You DO realize that the school laundry has boxes and boxes of imitation cocaine, right?
Soap powder.
What idiots. And they must shout their idiocy to the heavens!
Radwaste at March 18, 2011 8:17 AM
Patrick beat me to it! DAMN!
Feebie at March 18, 2011 8:30 AM
I think that it's fair to assume that the unstated policy of these schools is simply to kick out anyone who gives them any pretext. It's not really a disciplinary policy. It's attrition. The teachers and administrators don't want the responsibility of having to manage kids, so they're finding excuses to kick them out whenever they can. Why else would you even think of expelling a kid for something as stupid as this.
morgan at March 18, 2011 9:34 AM
Piper, that law would only be applicabe if they boys were trying to pass it off as a controlled substance.
As they were passing it back and forth with out the intent of giving it to an unknowing third party any hack job night school lawyer will get this kicked.
lujlp at March 18, 2011 9:55 AM
"As you can see counterfeit substances offered or possessed are treated as the real thing"
I'm fairly certain those laws only apply to counterfeits of branded drugs. If the kid had a bottle of fake Valium pills made to resemble the real thing, there'd be no question. But given that the law fails to define under what circumstances oregano is to be considered a counterfeit substance, I'm pretty sure a decent lawyer could get this thrown out. Otherwise, a strict reading of the law would make illegal the possession of a whole lot of ordinary foodstuffs, including oregano, parsley, cilantro, powdered sugar, and Coca-Cola syrup.
I think the whole thing with the oregano is ridiculous anyway. Anyone who has ever been around both can smell the difference between oregano and marijuana right off. When I was in high school, I knew of a few guys who tried the oregano trick. None of the teachers was ever fooled for a minute.
Cousin Dave at March 18, 2011 10:27 AM
I did originally assume the laws were to apply to things like fake Valium and other branded pills but the same section also deals with illegal drugs and the courts have held that if a student presents oregano to another as pot it is covered.
Like I said, not something I would do, but when I was administrating, I had to operate under that law.
If I had my way and the law did not exist, I would give the kid who brought it a couple of days in school suspension, for disturbance of school,and bring all parents in to explain why it is not a good idea to bring even fake drugs to school:
1. Other students have been known to beat up kids for smoke, drugs, booze, any contraband they bring to school. After having to work to steal the drugs, finding it to be fake would earn the kid another beating
2. sometimes gangs have staked out the school as their territory and they can take exception to anybody dealing on their turf.
Piper at March 18, 2011 11:55 AM
Oregano is a gateway drug. It leads to spaghetti and then to lasagna; and fettucini, linguini, and even pizza.
Let them have oregano and next thing you know, carb-crazed kids are running wild in our schools.
====================
This poor kid may have to change his name ... to 'snotgrass.
Conan the Grammarian at March 18, 2011 11:56 AM
Amy Alkon
https://www.advicegoddess.com/archives/2011/03/zero-toleranceo.html#comment-1936832">comment from Conan the GrammarianHilarious, Conan.
Amy Alkon
at March 18, 2011 12:11 PM
Amy Alkon
https://www.advicegoddess.com/archives/2011/03/zero-toleranceo.html#comment-1936835">comment from Amy AlkonAnd before you know it, you'll be doing thyme.
Amy Alkon
at March 18, 2011 12:12 PM
The kids got in trouble for the wrong reason, but they should have gotten in trouble. Kids are kids and do stupid things. They all go through a degree of rebellion. I'm pretty relaxed as a parent but I do draw the line with disrespect to teachers and school personnel. These kids were laughing at the rules and finding a way to flaunt them and make fools of the teachers. Ten days is extreme and nobody deserves expulsion, but they do need to know that joke's over and by the way, enjoy detention. How funny is that?
Kristen at March 18, 2011 12:37 PM
"And before you know it, you'll be doing thyme."
Go to your room.
Steve Daniels at March 18, 2011 1:05 PM
"And before you know it, you'll be doing thyme."
-Amy
Go to your room.
-Steve Daniels
So, now we're punishing punners?
lujlp at March 18, 2011 1:12 PM
They just seem like dillweeds to me...
Red at March 18, 2011 1:12 PM
Amy Alkon
https://www.advicegoddess.com/archives/2011/03/zero-toleranceo.html#comment-1937210">comment from lujlpSo, now we're punishing punners?
Basilically.
Amy Alkon
at March 18, 2011 1:33 PM
Luj, stop trying to curry favor.
MonicaP at March 18, 2011 1:54 PM
I think what they really need is some very sage advice....
Red at March 18, 2011 1:55 PM
Well this being my first allspice pun, it is my beyleaf that you all find it a bit more savory. After the chilie reception I recived over my first pun defending the ginger, I hope I didnt get carawyed and go a little overboard.
So lets all be cherivl, or should I be maced?
lujlp at March 18, 2011 2:17 PM
Well, I know when I was in high school, if you sold someone an aspirin and called it X, they punished you like it was X. But, the guy that held it exactly 30 seconds should not have been punished in any way.
momof4 at March 18, 2011 3:30 PM
What happened to the good old days of a head slap, a stern talking too and some grueling work!
Then a second go around by mom and dad!
Then another round by other family members!
Plus maybe some extra damnation and punishment from your local priest/pastor.
Usually by the end the kid has shaped up a bit or it is a damn long time before the kid does something stupid again.
John Paulson at March 18, 2011 8:43 PM
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