I believe in strong borders in part so we can provide a strong safety net to actual citizens, and also to keep wages from being arbitraged down. A big part of that is taking away the incentive to move here illegally with your children.

That said, if you've been here some extended period of time and we haven't tossed you out, and you have earned a degree or been in the armed forces, and are below a certain age, then I am okay with making it easier for you to stay here.

Your parents shouldn't have come here, and we should've sent them back sooner, but I'm not going to take all of that out on you.

Saying children of illegals should stay because they did nothing wrong is like saying children of embezzlers should keep their stolen money.

Trivially spouting and tweeting that children of illegals should be kicked out because their parents did something wrong is like saying children of embezzlers should go to jail with their parents.

I am more concerned with H1-B visa (and H1-B visa fraud), and the policies of public universities that favor foreign (fully paid) students over citizens that end up making our public universities taxpater subsidized schools for foreign kids.

Jerry, in order to fix that we're gonna have to get our own kids up to par. The foreign kids who are fully paid are often the ones who are brilliant geniuses that we're trying to lure here.

It might not be bad to have a requirement that they have to work X number of years in the US or serve the country in some way afterwards, though.

If the law ordered children of embezzlers to go to jail with their parents, then it is the parents that placed their child in danger, not the law.

I'm a little tired of people who think they create human shields by having children. "Oh, you can't deport me! I have a child! Think of my child!"

YOU should have thought of your child. Your child can go with you.

Unfortunately, where the child is born makes a difference. If two illegals have a child here, that child is a natural born U.S. citizen.

If they bring the child here, then the child is an illegal alien.

Has anyone noticed that judicial discretion that Obama ordered applies to those from 16 to 30? Why is the cutoff at 30? Probably because they figure that anyone over 30 has enough sense to not vote for Obama a second time?

Besides, Obama knows he doesn't have the power to do this on his own. There is no executive order issued for this.

I don't blame the kid that was 7 when his parents came across the border and he was raised here and is now 21. But how do know that the 21 year old standing in front of the judge is Jose Habanero that has been here for 14 years and not Juan Jalapeno who came across the border a year ago?

There is a reason part of the description that is occasionally used is un-documented.

I am against it. Legal young adults are having problems finding jobs. Why intentionally enlarge the pool of seekers. Plus, not being able to profit from a crime is good law. They might not have been the ones who committed the crime when they came, but when they stay after age 18 they are, and should have to face the consequences accordingly.

I have mixed feelings about it. I do think it is wrong to deport young people to Mexico when they don't even speak Spanish. That just can't be right.

I know a girl who was brought here when she was 2. Her parents paid "coyotes" to get them in. She is now 24 and only knows of America, not Mexico. It isn't her fault. She earned a high school diploma but now because of her illegal status, she cannot get any kind of meaningful job because she has no social and no working papers. She works very hard but all menial jobs that many of the "hardworking" Americans are too good for. Her life is in limbo and that's a shame.

Does anyone really believe that we should deport her to a country that is not her home and was only her home for 2 years of her life? I moved within my own town 3 times in 5 years and was practically required to sign in blood and show proof of residency to get my kids in the school district and keep them in. Don't blame the kids of illegals because the school districts and local agencies did not catch these parents who snuck in illegally. If you catch them when the kids are young and send them home, that's one thing. But 22 years later?!

So here's the thing. The legal immigration system is really, really screwed up. It needs major reform. No secret there. However, the Democratic Party has no cred on discussing the issue -- all of their previous "reform" proposals have been thinly-disguised amnesty programs, that would reward lots of illegals while not actually doing anything to fix the legal immigration system. Further, the Democrats have fought tooth and nail against measures to secure the border, and they have sought to poison the political well with the Fast and Furious gun-running program.

So some people in Congress, moderate Democrats and Republicans, have been quietly knocking around ideas. One idea would be a path to citizenship for people like Kristen mentioned. Specifically, Marco Rubio had a proposal that would allow them to apply for work permits for a given period of time, which would allow them to remain in the country legally and work while they work their way through the legal immigration maze.

Obama sought to co-opt the issue in order to pander (or so he thinks) to Hispanics. So he took Rubio's idea and turned it into an amnesty program. Politically, it was clever; he will gain favor with certain Hispanic groups, and he has effectively neutralized Rubio, who might be in line for the GOP Presidential ticket.

Problem is, he's also neutralized everyone, including people in his own party, who were working towards a compromise on the issue. Not only did Obama corrupt the idea, but he's also implementing it without legal authority. Further, he's made it clear that he will do nothing to secure the border. The effect is that everyone in Congress who doesn't represent a far-left district is now forced into a close-the-borders-no-compromises stance. Reform of the immigration system is just as badly needed today as it was last week, but Obama probably set that back ten years.

My own stance on the issue is:

1. Secure the borders first.
2. No amnesty for anyone who entered the country illegally as adults or teenagers. Deport their asses.
3. The rest is negotiable.

I'm torn. It seems so horrible to deport people who had no way at all of refusing to come here, and no practical means to leave at 18. Tell an 18-year-old who has no memory of Mexico, El Salvador, wherever, no skills in that country's language, no *really* anti-American sentiments to just pick up and head out? Ooof, can't do it.

Besides, at this point, we the taxpayers have educated them and probably paid for quite a bit of their food and medical care; it seems like a bad idea to send that investment away with ill will---it will probably come back to us, just not the way we'd like. We'd be essentially handing back millions of dollars and saying "here are some nice healthy, literate, law-abiding young people who now have a bone to pick with us. Enjoy!"

I like the idea of requiring these young adults who were smuggled in as children to fulfill some military service requirements or some such, show up and somehow be accounted for and pay some sort of obligation, financial or through service. Deport the ones who are criminals, who don't come forward and make some arrangements to more-or-less thank the country for taking them in, so the other countries get the ingrates, layabouts and criminals and we keep the good ones in whom we've already invested. I'd also be happy to roll the "smuggled in" age back to 10 0r 12. It seems a little unfair, but you can be more certain that a 10yo is actually smuggled, not part of coming over, vs. a 16yo, who could've come over on his/her own.

In my school district, we(meaning teachers and admin) are not allowed to determine status of citizenship...so the discussion of the schools "finding illegals" is a moot point. The schools have to funnel large amounts of money and specialized staff to meet the needs of these students. They come in at odd times of the year, with totally inadequate educations;many(for all practical purposes)are illiterate. Homework gets completed rarely. Their parents line up for the free food bags/clothes that are donated weekly by parents and volunteer groups. Every form must go out bi-lingual. Sometimes, these students just don't return to school, never returning hundreds of dollars of schoolbooks. I work in a "good" school district. I wonder what others are like?
I don't think about it when I'm teaching them. Kids are kids for the most part. but its frustrating to see those state test scores at the end of the year. I work really hard everyday to have my job put in jeopardy by things that I have zero control over. I don't blame illegals for coming here, but wow, does it make my job tougher than it already is....

Cousin Dave has the right idea. First we need to secure our borders.

"I have mixed feelings about it. I do think it is wrong to deport young people to Mexico when they don't even speak Spanish. That just can't be right."

How many do you think are really in that boat? I know many hispanic people who all came here legally (or their parents did) and they ALL speak primarily Spanish at home. Even those who's families came here when they were 3 or 4 years old. They all eventually went through the process to become citizens and they ALL teach their kids both english and spanish.

I realy don't think there are more then a few rare cases where people that knowingly are here illgegally aren't teaching their kids Spanish. Heck, the fact that many of them can't speak any english is a big driver for issues at a lot of public schools in places like LA.

About the chatter of H1Bs above... yes there probably is some abuse by people and companies but the vast majority are being brought here because there is a gaping hole of need being filled by them. I support IC design engineers and we hire more and more from India and China and such because they simply can't find people here that can do it. They'd rather not because the whole H1B process is a pain for the people and the company and there are always worries about IP issues, but they need people to do the work and don't have a lot of choice.

We've expaned in India itself a lot too, but there're actually issues there too. Many smart people but a lot seem to lack the drive to strive on their own, but follow directions really well.

As I see it, there are two major issues up. First, what to do going FORWARD with the law. The second, what to do with the mess we have NOW.

To go forward without just making things worse, we do need to make legal immigration make sense. I'm not all that familiar with it, but I've heard enough to think that 1.) we make it hard for really great people to come over (physicists, chemists, engineers, etc). 2.) we make it difficult for anyone in general 3.) Policies are kinda arbitrary.

So, that needs to be fixed WHILE fixing the border.

For the mess we have...

First we need to secure the border (hey, that overlaps the previous point). Then we need to get rid of all the illegal inmates in our jails - starting with violent offenders, repeat offenders, etc. I'm not talking about Mr. 2 speeding tickets here.

As we find other serious criminals in here illegally, we need to get rid of them (gangs, drug trafficking).

Once all THAT is well done or at least well underway in a serious way, I think most Americans will be quite willing to have serious and thoughtful discussion about what to do with undocumented people who have been here a long time, who came as children, who have school records going back years, etc.

I guess I just don't see the point in having that discussion now, because we aren't deporting people with repeated violent criminal records, and we aren't admitting people with serious smarts and skills. In other words, right now our polices are bass ackwards.

I am the child of immigrants; my father from Cuba, my mother from Italy. Mom's family had to have sponsorship, vaccinations, etc. Dad's family was exiled during the revolution and had actually been sent to a "camp" after submitting an application to leave the island. He came here with only the clothes he was wearing and remained a Political Refugee for several years. Both became citizens.
Growing up in So. Cal. I was exposed to illegal immigrants from Mexico and central America and was always struck by the difference in attitudes between my immigrant family and my immigrant neighbors. My family worked hard, bought homes and opened businesses that provided jobs for others while contributing to the tax base. My illegal neighbors were not "pro American" like my family. They refused to immerse themselves into American culture and instead of becoming Americanized as a group and enjoying the standard of living that we often take for granted here, they reduced the standards of the areas in which they lived to an amalgamation of low rent American and the third World nations they came from.
I am also embittered by the treatment of Cuban nationals that to this very day have to fight extradition if they are caught in the water, but can apply for amnesty if they make it to shore. Even that does not insure that they stay (remember Elian Gonzales removed at gunpoint?) while here in CA illegals live with impunity, attending rallies while waving the flags of their nations of origin. Every big box hardware store has 40 illegals standing out front soliciting work and the schools of the South West are FULL of the children of illegals while music programs, industrial arts disappear and the quality of education suffers for all.
Secure our borders and send them all home to get in line. Admit only those that meet our standards and adhere to our laws. Meanwhile, those LUCKY enough to have been educated here courtesy of the U.S. taxpayer, should use that education to better their homeland and make it a place that fewer seek to flee. No need for angst or guilt, just do the right thing by AMERICANS.

Absolutely not. There is always the risk of these former illegals occupying job slots that could go to native-born Americans or naturalized citizens and legal residents who did things the right way.

"In my school district, we(meaning teachers and admin) are not allowed to determine status of citizenship..."

Laura,
I'm not putting it on the teachers. I'm talking about the registration process to get the kids into class. In many districts, at least here in NY, we have to show many different forms of proof of residency, birth certificates, leases, utility bills, mortgage statements, etc. The girl I know was enrolled in 2nd grade. What kind of papers did they show to enroll her? She's is the age of my son and I know enrolling him was a nightmare.

How can we blame her? She doesn't know Mexico. It isn't her country, at least not the country she knows. I don't think there's an easy solution, but deporting someone like her is unfair.

How can we blame her? She doesn't know Mexico. It isn't her country, at least not the country she knows. I don't think there's an easy solution, but deporting someone like her is unfair.

Just as importantly, in case the compassion angle doesn't strike a chord with people, if we're going to pour resources into her upbringing and education, we should reap those dividends. She should be part of our economy.

I don't buy the argument that illegals are taking jobs Americans would love to have. Alabama and Arizona found out otherwise after passing their immigration laws designed to drive away illegal immigrants. It turns out even unemployed Americans don't want to do the backbreaking, low-paying farm work these immigrants do. And the ones who try generally quit after a few days.

Life isn't fair.

Best lesson I've ever learned (and re-learned and re-learned again).

Kristen points out that it would be unfair to deport somebody who only knows our country and came as a young child.

I don't disagree.

Savant Idiot points out that allowing people to come illegally and don't want/try to become American is being unfair to those who follow the process and make America their homeland.

I don't disagree.

This is where I tend to fall on the conservative side of things. Life isn't fair, that's why we have rules - to make it more fair. If you cut in line, you should expect somebody might catch you and send you to the back. That said, there's no point in doing that right now because the border isn't secure.

Ok, why not just allow anyone at anytime to enter the country and totally bankrupt us. Didn't Amy have a video up from Youtube that shows the consequences of mass immigration?

A microcosm of this issue would actually be the family. I own a home and have a family. This would represent my "country" and its "citizens". Anyone who invades or enters my "country" is breaking the law. It is against the law to break in, illegally enter a dwelling or "country". This compares to an illegal (a burglar and his family) entering my home and not leaving using my familiy's resources (taxes)(my paycheck)and now the mayor (Obama)of my town is ordering me not to kick the intruder's kids out and not only that but making me pay for these illegal's kids' (food, shelter, healthcare and education) taking away from my own children's needs. So, now I am stuck paying for a criminal's kids "because it is the right thing to do (for the illegals)and "America". HOW IN THE HELL IS THAT RIGHT FOR "AMERICA" (my house)? How is that helping me and my family taking resources from my family and giving it to criminals? I don't give a flying fuck if the kids were brought here not having a choice, too bad, just like I wont feel guilty providing for a burglar's children left in my home. They are illegal, CRIMINALS and should be JAILED/DEPORTED just like a criminal and their kids that come along for the ride should be jailed.