How Are The Man Boobs Coming, Soy Eaters?
From the 2012 Ancestral Health Symposium, a tweet:
@chriskresser
You would have to eat 1,421 lbs of conventional meat to get the same amount of estrogen as found in 3 oz of soybean oil! #ahs12

How Are The Man Boobs Coming, Soy Eaters?
From the 2012 Ancestral Health Symposium, a tweet:
@chriskresser
You would have to eat 1,421 lbs of conventional meat to get the same amount of estrogen as found in 3 oz of soybean oil! #ahs12
It's a well-known scientific fact that men who consume higher levels of estrogen in processed bean curd are more athletic, focused, and attentive to partners.
Seriously, is estrogen even digestible? One wouldn't think so. It's difficult to worry about this.
One of the best Ted videos.
A Tedlike micro-lecture. (For the sisters.)
Crid [CridComment at gmail] at August 11, 2012 7:29 AM
BTW, Ryan is crazy-super pro-life. I'm going to vote for him anyway... IJS, it could be a screechy autumn.
Crid [CridComment at gmail] at August 11, 2012 7:36 AM
Amy Alkon
https://www.advicegoddess.com/archives/2012/08/how-are-the-man.html#comment-3300129">comment from Crid [CridComment at gmail]It's a well-known scientific fact that men who consume higher levels of estrogen in processed bean curd are more athletic, focused, and attentive to partners.
For anyone new here, Crid is joking and most likely knows nothing of the research on soy. We'll talk a bit about wheat and its man-boob-causing effects on my radio show this weekend with my guest, cardiologist Dr. William Davis, author of Wheat Belly.
Amy Alkon
at August 11, 2012 7:39 AM
Meanwhile, Be afraid of your food, because science.
Crid [CridComment at gmail] at August 11, 2012 7:52 AM
"You would have to eat 1,421 lbs of conventional meat..."
I going to take that a a challenge, starting with a 16oz Ribeye tonight!
Steamer at August 11, 2012 8:01 AM
Amy Alkon
https://www.advicegoddess.com/archives/2012/08/how-are-the-man.html#comment-3300158">comment from Crid [CridComment at gmail]Meanwhile, Be afraid of your food, because science.
No, just discern what is and isn't supported by evidence because it's idiotic to eat wheat, and it's wise to eat meat, green beans, kale, organ meats, for example, per solid evidence.
For evidence-based dietary medicine, listen to my show with dietary researcher Dr. Jeff Volek:
http://www.blogtalkradio.com/amyalkon/2012/07/02/advice-goddess-radio-amy-alkon
And my show with Dr. Michael Eades and Dr. Mary Dan Eades:
http://www.blogtalkradio.com/amyalkon/2012/01/16/advice-goddess-radio-amy-alkon
Or listen to Crid, who's saying...well...absolutely nothing.
As I've posted here numerous times before, per Gary Taubes' "Why We Get Fat," it is carbohydrates -- sugar, flour, starchy vegetables like potatoes, apple juice -- that cause the insulin secretion that puts on fat.
Amy Alkon
at August 11, 2012 8:16 AM
I think it's very interesting Amy. If as a society we are ingesting all this estrogen, you would expect society to become increasing feminized, wouldn't you? It seems to me this is occurring. On the other hand, women seem to be getting more and more aggresive toward each other.
PS- The "doggie parkour" was great.
Eric at August 11, 2012 8:43 AM
> just discern what is and isn't supported
> by evidence
Also, develop a nose for fear mongering. Because moobs! Soy.
I like soy sauce with sushi... It complements and challenges the briny fats of the fish flesh in a delicious stalwart way.
And as a bonus, it's made my areolae shiny and vital, with just a hint of youthful, athletic elevation over the surrounding man-province. Chicks dig it; men dig it.
This effect might conceivably be a consequence of the edamame, but I've chosen not to stress.
Crid [CridComment at gmail] at August 11, 2012 9:21 AM
Amy Alkon
https://www.advicegoddess.com/archives/2012/08/how-are-the-man.html#comment-3300208">comment from EricEnough with the dietary mythology: At my fave cafe. Just heard talk about "steel cut oats" like that means something. Wanna be healthy? Eat steel-cut bacon.
Amy Alkon
at August 11, 2012 9:21 AM
Bagel boobs - Bill Davis's latest blogpost.
I look forward to the radio show.@Eric, have you noticed how so many more men are bald these days (or at least have large, visible bald spots)? It used to be a rare occurrence, but now it's commonplace.
gharkness at August 11, 2012 11:00 AM
>> Have you noticed...
Only when I brush my teeth.
Eric at August 11, 2012 12:14 PM
This is very weird to me. Yesterday, the women:
> The article describes GMO corn that includes
> a human gene causing immune infertility
Today, the men:
> How Are The Man Boobs Coming, Soy Eaters?
So we're having trouble growing into the kind of people we'd hoped to become. How can we fix ourselves, and fix the behavior of others? Ag policy!... Yeah, that's the ticket!
It must been something I ate...
It musta b
Crid [CridComment at gmail] at August 11, 2012 1:20 PM
Soy protein and soy lecithin contain the phytoestrogens genistein and daidzein. Both interact with estrogen receptors in humans, including male humans, and produce effects similar to the effects of estrogen. About 30% to 50% of people have intestinal bacteria that will convert daidzein into S-equol, which has an even stronger estrogenic effect. Phytoestrogens can also cause increased production of estrogen and decreased production of testosterone in men.
This is why subjects in clinical studies of drugs that are hormones, that have an effect on hormone levels, or that can change the effects of hormones are not allowed to consume soy or anything containing soy beginning at least a couple of weeks before the study starts until the end of the study.
Americans eat more soy than anyone else. Check the ingredients labels on packaged foods, especially snacks. It's in almost everything.
Ken R at August 11, 2012 2:51 PM
Crid: "Seriously, is estrogen even digestible?"
Unlike testosterone, it absorbs from the intestines into the blood stream - as evidenced by the effects of widely used estrogen-containing drugs like birth control pills and Premarin, and the widely known effects of foods containing estrogenic substances like soy.
A very small percentage - like 1%-4% - of ingested testosterone will absorb, but the amount is inconsistent from one person to another, and from one dose to another in the same person. Methylated testosterone will absorb pretty consistently, but it's bad for the liver. So testosterone is usually used topically or by injection.
Ken R at August 11, 2012 3:02 PM
A few years ago a company I worked for conducted several clinical drug studies for which we needed healthy male subjects between 18 and 40 years old with normal testosterone levels. We defined "normal" as 300-800 ng/dL.
We were surprised to find out that 30% of the healthy young men we screened were not qualified for our studies because their testosterone level was below 300. I don't know if that applies to the general population or was just an anomaly in the 600 or so men we screened. We wondered if it had anything to do with the high consumption of soy and other foods containing estrogenic substances.
Some men begin to have symptoms when their testosterone level goes below 500. Many lose their sex drive, become impotent, lose energy and motivation, gain weight, grow boobs, become physically weaker, and have many other physical and mental health and social problems when their level goes below 300.
So, women, if your man is acting like a bitch, get his testosterone level checked. And don't let him eat soy.
Ken R at August 11, 2012 3:25 PM
> it absorbs from the intestines into the blood
> stream - as evidenced by the effects of widely
> used estrogen-containing drugs
Well, yes, I guess that would follow. Them girl-pills in circle-y blister packs, mood-swingin' sweethearts, and all that stuff.
So...
TITS!!#^!!#%!!!
(Sorry.)
It's just not in my heart to worry. I remember hearing about the scourge of Burger King's menarche-inducing Whoppers when I was in college, which was a very long time ago. The years wore on, and then the decades, but nobody from the lab seemed to be building a career with bulletproof epidemiology of this hormonal-beef scenario. It became much more appropriate to account for the explosion teenage pregnancies by the observation that these girls were, quite literally in all respects, fucking idiots.
Crid [CridComment at gmail] at August 11, 2012 3:54 PM
I've been hearing alot about 'natural steel cut oats'
What exactly is natural about mining iron oxide, heating beyond anything natural short of a volcano or forest fire, mixing in carbon and a few other various elements to stablize the atomic lattice on a molecular level. Pour the liquid metal concoction into die cast molds and use the resulting product to cut up mother fucking oats grown en masse with chemical fertilizer and harvest by automobile?
Chirst, the stupidity of health nuts pisses me off
lujlp at August 11, 2012 4:43 PM
"Just heard talk about "steel cut oats" like that means something."
Steel cut oats is a texture thing. They've got more body than rolled oats. So it's less like wallpaper paste and more like horse food.
Elle at August 11, 2012 4:53 PM
Amy Alkon
https://www.advicegoddess.com/archives/2012/08/how-are-the-man.html#comment-3300595">comment from ElleSo it's less like wallpaper paste and more like horse food.
Thanks for explaining that. (He was talking about it like it meant health bennies.)
Amy Alkon
at August 11, 2012 5:21 PM
Amy Alkon
https://www.advicegoddess.com/archives/2012/08/how-are-the-man.html#comment-3300596">comment from Crid [CridComment at gmail]The problem with those blister packs isn't "TITS!!#^!!#%!!! (Sorry.)"
It's this:
http://www.advicegoddess.com/ag-column-archives/2011/11/whiff-the-wrong.html
Amy Alkon
at August 11, 2012 5:22 PM
The tits under discussion were mine, Amy. And there's just not time enough in life to worry that their pucker and perk can be meaningfully modulated by trace estrogen in a modern diet.
That tweet looks awfully like bullshit without a cite attached. Before being impressed, I'd want to know exactly what compounds he meant by "estrogen," who did the measurement, whether he's trying to measure plant hormones in the animal kingdom, etc. Also how he makes his living.
You're wonderfully "rigorous" and all, but I don't think you know much about soy either. A few years ago my friend with the degree in nutrition said tofu's protein isn't worth the toil required of the gut to extract it.
Well, OK then... I'm receptive to rhetoric that tofu sucks. Fads in many parts of life blow through for a few decades, and are then shed with what-were-we-thinking disgust (pagers; the Democratic party; pantyhose, etc.).
But the tweet looks like shameless fear-mongering, for which sexual themes are always very effective... For as we all know, the more thriving the Inuit, the more pendulous his moobs.
Crid [CridComment at gmail] at August 11, 2012 6:50 PM
While investigating ways to tease you about this, I found a lovely taxonomy graphic. You can locate your family members, housepets and parasites with this browser.
Crid [CridComment at gmail] at August 11, 2012 6:57 PM
Dear crid:
Just because I don't think Olympic medals should be ripped from the necks of sixteen year olds doesn't mean I don't think the olympics are insane.
For you.
http://www.nationalreview.com/blogs/print/313553
Feebie at August 11, 2012 7:29 PM
The author makes some good points, but I'm betting never truly cometed in any type of sports.
Pushing your body to extremes fucks with your emotional control, so I'm willing to ook past a few taers from winners and losers, provided its a real sport and not something like badmiton or speed walking like you've just dropped a duece in your shorts.
Hell, I love water polo and played it in high school and college and I and most of my former team mates think it should not be an olympic event
lujlp at August 11, 2012 8:35 PM
"I'm receptive to rhetoric that tofu sucks."
You people will have to pry the delicious Sundubu jjigae tofu off my hands. I love korean stew tofu, in fact I love Tofu period.
You do have to keep in mind most modern food was created as "filler" food. Or as to get rid of junk parts of the animal. Sushi, southern cooking', lobster. All poor mans food originally. Bread was used to fill yourself up because darn meat was just too hard to come by.
Purplepen at August 12, 2012 3:07 AM
No, just discern what is and isn't supported by evidence because it's idiotic to eat wheat...
It's not all that smart to drink alcohol either but you can pry my home-baked rustic bread and red wine from my cold dead hands. And for all the searching for the miracle diet, The Onion has had it right all along:
World Death Rate Holding Steady at 100%
Astra at August 12, 2012 7:34 AM
Amy Alkon
https://www.advicegoddess.com/archives/2012/08/how-are-the-man.html#comment-3300865">comment from AstraActually, wine doesn't have the terrible effects of wheat and I drink dry white wine, which has very low carbs, about daily.
Amy Alkon
at August 12, 2012 7:51 AM
Amy Alkon
https://www.advicegoddess.com/archives/2012/08/how-are-the-man.html#comment-3300870">comment from Amy AlkonI likewise eat dessert about once every week or two, but I eat ice cream, which has no flour in it, because cream and sugar aren't as damaging to your health as something with flour.
Amy Alkon
at August 12, 2012 7:53 AM
> Actually, wine doesn't have the terrible effects
> of wheat and I drink dry white wine, which has
> very low carbs, about daily.
You blaspheme.
Might as well explore the delicate flavors of a bottle of cheap teenager's perfume.
Also, sincere thanks to Ken R for his technical thoughts above, but the questions will be even-more detailed.
Crid [CridComment at gmail] at August 12, 2012 1:10 PM
Also, "Ancestral Health"?
Is that like....
Nevermind.
Crid [CridComment at gmail] at August 12, 2012 1:11 PM
Amy Alkon
https://www.advicegoddess.com/archives/2012/08/how-are-the-man.html#comment-3300957">comment from Crid [CridComment at gmail]Studies have shown that a glass of wine per day helps with weight loss, but if you can’t stop with just one – and I’m one of those who has difficulty in doing so – cold turkey may be the better strategy. -- Dr. Michael Eades on the comments on his blog.
http://www.proteinpower.com/drmike/weight-loss/changing-perceptions-of-obesity/comment-page-3/#comments
Amy Alkon
at August 12, 2012 1:16 PM
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