Hope you didn't get all sweaty wrestling the pig.

Wow.
How does someone take a one-paragraph response to an email and read so much into it?
'I googled you and you seem to be into astrology' is apparently filthy and demeaning now.
Should we alert Miss Manners? Or an attorney?

Good for you, Amy. This guy is a total asshat, and there is NOTHING spiritual about him.

People who have been through the toughest shit life can throw at them and still come out the other side smiling, are what I would call spiritual. I read a quote a long time ago, have no idea who said it, but I think it's true: "Religion is for people who are afraid of going to hell; spirituality is for people who have already been there."

People like this guy are mean and petty, and have no idea what spirituality even means. You don't owe him a thing; you didn't even owe him the kindness you tried to show him.

In my experience... Anyone who says "I am a spiritual teacher" usually has a bridge in Brooklyn to sell.
My usual response is something like, "Wow, your ego really seems to need to identify with being a spiritual teacher. Why do you need to be special?"

Or I say something like... "The Tao says Those who know, do not speak. Those who speak, do not know."

As a book review editor, as soon as I see transpersonal psychology, it goes in the trash. And nothing offends my astronomer/physicist friends like having someone confuse astrology with science. :-)

He wanted free publicity from being on your show. He didn't get it, so he was a big whiny bitch. he'd get along great with my students these days.

Not only don't you believe in astrology, you don't "believe" in anything. Why? Because you are open to no-thing.

Kudos to you for actually being professional and polite enough to respond in the first place. I don't even have the energy to deal with people like this guy anymore.

My friend Tom is a Christian and I am an atheist

My first gf is a quite devout Christian. and I've evolved from agnostic to atheist since then. We still are very fond of each other and I'm going to visit her and her husband and kids weekend after next.

If you think it's bad when people like this contact you online Amy, you want to try them in person, I'm sure you know what I mean. I was staying interstate for work, which over the weekend mostly meant a book and packet of smokes in the bar, when a guy came and sat at my table.
Another group had told him to fuck off. He proceeded to explain to me how "Google Earth has made us all one" (my protests that nothing changes just because you take a photo of it went unheard) and also how he did "real" astrology, not that shit you read in the papers. Being an engineer (and in the mood for some fun) I asked how it worked, how he made predictions, etc. Technical details, like I would ask about any product. He didn't like that, expected me to just accept his mystical ability without question. He got more and more frustrated with me then fell asleep on the table.

Probably should have mentioned he was matching me drink for drink. He learnt a lesson about trying to out-drink mild mannered pretty boys (who just happened to be a habitual drunk with a *very* high tolerance). I left him there then a had a few more glasses of wine over dinner.

My sister was telling me about a new-agey-woo type she met some time ago; a serious believer in reincarnation. The gal said she loved everyone but refused to feel sorry or empathetic for anyone in a bad situation. Because when you reincarnate, you choose the life you want to be born into (presumably to learn some kind of spiritual lesson I guess). So there's no reason to feel sympathy for anyone because that's what they chose. Yup, even the kids in Africa who are raped because someone thinks it's a cure for AIDS - that's the life they chose. And bless them for being strong enough to choose the life that provided them with the lessons they needed.

How convenient for her that she chose a life in Park Slope to be reincarnated to.

"Go away wishes" -- I love that.

We really do need some new endings for letters besides, "sincerely," "yours truly" and "love."

Most of my letters are responses to lawyers behaving badly. Maybe something like "angrily," "apparently not quite as gullible as you hoped," "disbelievingly"....

In my opinion any use of "I Am...." creates flawed thinking. The concept of being has no meaning in physics. There is only doing. "I AM" a monotheist, polytheist, atheist all create a mental limitations. This poison is usually stronger in Theists. I believe in the XYZ deity and my pack animal brain wants validation from others so I have better status. In general Atheists seem to just want to be left alone.

I choose to believe that XYZ is God/dess and I accept the Joe or Jane Schmo prophet. I also choose to accept The Schmo's rules for living. That seems less stressful that "I AM" a XYZian and my identity is wrapped up in it.

I don't believe in a deity until I see proof seems less stressful than saying 'I AM" an Atheist.

The problem as I see it has to do with language and social contracts. Our pack animal brain want to label everyone and put them in boxes. Maybe it comes from our history when visit from a neighboring tribe could mean death.

I've found people who believe in spiritual things along psychic and medium lines come in two packages. There are those who are deeply spiritual and consider it a personal thing thereby not trying to convert anyone and letting people come to their own conclusions and beliefs.

Then there are those who wear it like a badge and think they not only have to convert everyone but also have to reduce those who don't believe as suffering from having too much ego. By doing this they miss whatever lessons they supposedly learned because judgment does not go hand in hand with spiritual thinking.

Sorry, you got number two.

To expand on what Kristen said: Some narcissists grab onto religion or spirituality, as a way of elevating themselves above others -- literally holier than thou. They will pick and choose precepts and rules so as to construct something that validates their image of themselves as superior beings. The underlying philosophy doesn't matter -- the whole purpose of the religion that they construct is to reinforce their ego.

Thirdly, I am all about science: Your pre-programmed "non-science" filter makes you appear to me as if you are a robot, and nothing more.

Yeah. But you ought to see the ass on that bot.

I like to play with that reincarnation concept sometimes. Like, maybe in my last life I had way too much adventure, so I decided to take a vacation and come back as a shy, nearsighted, overweight bookworm. Just to see what it was like, get some rest, y'know?

Otherwise I'm not very spiritual, and I never saw the word egoic before. Ego-ick? Egoyk? It seems like a vanity word made up by someone for whom inserting the syllable -tist- was too much trouble.

I think I'll go with ego-ick.

"Amy Alkon, Opinionated Bitch"

Opinionated bitch - now that's a title *I* would be proud to have; but as a guy I just have to settle for opinionated asshole. (sigh)

What he seems to have overlooked is the fact that it is YOUR radio show that he would like to be booked on, and not HIS. Apparently he may be unaware that alienating the host may not be the best strategy.

Wow, too.

Ignoring the spiritual "stuff"

The surprising thing is peoples inability to understand basic human nature and operating structures of society. Why, do so many people not understand these things. How to ask for help, get people to do things, talk. Some people does not get the simple idea of being kind, polite, and smiling - it works. Why get aggressive or mean to people, who you barely know or who you need. I digress...

This guy creates a list of all his credentials and then he proceeds to fail at everyone of them. I love when people make these lists of how special they are. Really people if you are going to do this. Stop at three things. Two is better, just keep it relevant.

published author - I am published author, too. OK, not famous or well published, but I am published. Heck in this day and age anybody can be a published "author".

spiritual teacher - OK, may he can broaden my spiritual side. yet what does this guy teach me, when another person politely refuses him, he then proceeds to be a bitchy little queen and start slapping the other persons cheek! A true spiritual person to me, would not act this way. Thanks, from your response to another person, shows your spirituality is dark and flawed. Please, do not teach me that.

motivational speaker - if after one rejection, a polite one at that. The email writer, proceeds to get defensive and then defensive. Wow, that would motivate me, not. Just imagine the guy giving a speech about this incident. If this guy can not turn around a basic denial of request to something positive. Add in his response to it. Shows his form of motivation is crappy, well sure as heck no Tony Robbins. "Yes people, when life gives you lemons, through a snit and whole bunch of five dollar words, will solve the problem.

life and wellness coach - if this guy can not figure out he asked the wrong person to interview him, shows this guy could not coach a person to run around a baseball diamond, either way. Plus if this guy can not even get his life organized that he not find the right places to sell himself and deal with life. Sure as heck think he could not help with mine, very much. I want someone better then me to be a coach. A life coach to me would be someone whose life I would want to be like.

authority on alternative medicine - once again.... OK. what kind of alternative medicine. How are you an authority? Degree, certificate, family tradition, what? Did you go learn Oriental medicine at some University (really). Did your Native American grandfather teach your Shamanic practices. Probably not, This guess this guy bought a couple of books, skimmed, did not read most of them. He probably hits up the herb section at the local food co-op.

transpersonal psychology - ahhh, I love that five dollar word. OK, transpersonal to me means the ability of two people being able to connect and understand each other. Psychology would mean the study and deep understanding of that. In a couple of letters/emails this guy fails horribly. Even if, he understood just the basics of psychology, he would know that his current response would be counter productive. Wow, he really got transpersonal with Amy. I can so see the connection.

Thus I leave you fellow Amy readers. I, the second language teacher/coach , cigar aficionado, Koreanaphile, television program critic, computer and sexual authority.

Is this the jerk you mentioned last night? The reason for your crappy day? This person is a schmuck,like many others I've encountered in that arena. They refuse to be reasoned with, and once you dig beneath that thin mask of good-will and "spirituality" you find their character is at least as ugly as they proclaim the rest of ours to be.

Some narcissists grab onto religion or spirituality, as a way of elevating themselves above others

My sister says there are a lot of narcissistic and hostile people in that "spiritual" community. She got bitten a few times before she started realizing this.

And no, Meloni, this isn't the jerk who gave me a crappy day. This was no big deal, this interchange with the guy. I just find hypocrisy interesting.

This guy creates a list of all his credentials and then he proceeds to fail at everyone of them.

Exactly, John Paulson. I, on the other hand, am writing my chapter on communicating for my next book, and I think I'm going to open it with a story on how I failed to communicate. I'm a fuckup, like all people. I just try to recognize when I act like a jerk so I can try to be less of a jerk in the future.

A guy who I respect who IS a "spiritual teacher" is psychiatrist Dr. Mark Goulston, who wrote a book on listening (among others). Here he is on my radio show, talking about that book:
http://www.blogtalkradio.com/amyalkon/2012/05/28/advice-goddess-radio-amy-alkon

I don't really know what "spiritual" means -- but I find Goulston humble and open about his own errors in life, and somebody who has some wisdom and is using it to try to help people.

Some narcissists grab onto religion or spirituality, as a way of elevating themselves above others

Along this line, I've always wondered why the people who post all those "inspirational" messages on Facebook are always the biggest douchebags.

People are loathsome.

Except the fun ones.

This is the Hawaiian estate of the guy who developed Sildenafil. Care for a dip?

Just a point of correction ... you were at no point in this transaction a bitch.

You initiated the conversation politely and the mutt immediately came on like (well, there is that "B" word we could use).

And in response, you defended yourself. Appropriately.

None of us out here with a head on our shoulders call that being a bitch.

Love that swingset clip, Crid.

And thanks, Paul.

I just noticed something funny in scrolling down -- this bit from him:

pain-body (conventional psychology doesn't even acknowledge this) is addicted to pain, and suffering.

I'm one of the world's bigger weenies when it comes to pain. In fact, I can't even abide cold feet and most of the year, wear down booties while sitting at my desk to write. I wore them part of the day yesterday, when it was 70 or so here. (It's chilly under my desk! Brrr!)

On a side note, Miss Alkon, could I send a rant/a bug up my ass about communication. How so many people fail at it. Not by silly reasons, by breaking basic fundamentals.

It really bother's me. Just a simple summary. I am a member on some forums. On these groups people come to ask for help and advice. Yet, time and again, many of these people do not properly communicate what they want or need. Jut understand some basics on communication and human nature, people would get amazing results.

As I said it is a basic summary, and if you say, No. I will take it like an Adult and move on with my life (not before, I grumble and pout to myself for a little while).

Being "open to no-thing" is very Zen.

Yes, my "egoic mind." (Who talks this way?!)

People like that*, I find. There's something about belief in that kind of woo that leads to talking like that; might just be a remnant of 70s-era psychobabble? Not sure, and don't care to investigate enough to form a better hypothesis.

(* Who oddly, as in this case, always seem to have plenty of ego themselves.)

I find it to match the heuristic just like complaints about being "open minded" - the latter is merely a demand for agreement.

(I expect, however, that the chapter on theoretical physics in his Free Book would be hilariously face-palm-y for people with any actual physics background.

Just a guess, based on the heuristics I've acquired and the cues in his statements, but I'd put money on it.

I'd look up his stuff myself, except naturally your redaction [for his own good] makes that impossible..

Likewise I also have no idea what "spiritual" really means, other than "religion without the modicum of rigor that religions impose" or the like. Which doesn't improve religion...)

The mystery man came over And he said "I'm outta sight!"

He said for a nominal service charge I could reach nirvana tonight

If I was ready, willing and able To pay him his regular fee

He would drop all the rest of His pressing affairs and devote His attention to me

But I said "Look here brother who you jiving with that cosmik debris?"

(Is that a real poncho or is that a Sears poncho?)

Hmmmmmmmmmmm...no foolin'?

BTW...

She said she was the Magic Mama

And she could throw a mean tarot

And carried on without a comma

That she was someone I should know.

(She had a snake for a pet, and an amulet)

The Crystal Healing Intuitive Astrologer (unacknowledged by ignorant Western scientists) may actually be seeking a different type of radio-venue -- this one, for example.

http://www.liahhoward.com/index.html

Try not to LOL. I dare you.

"some of these 'new age' people who profess to be 'spiritual,' etc., are some of the biggest, most hostile buttholes out there."

There's a reason for that. At some level, they know they're hostile and angry and defensive and that those characteristics drive people away, so they're often drawn to practices that they think will help them become less so. Many can't manage it - whether it's their temperament or their upbringing or something else getting in the way, I don't know - but they continue to value those qualities they simply don't have and talk as if they've gotten to where they want to be.

It's no different, in my opinion, from persons of a certain political stripe who talk about peace and love and rail against the awfulness of war and the politicians who start them in the angriest and most contemptuous way imaginable. Those advocates of peace and love have the same mindset that causes wars. (My favorite cases in point: the late wife-beaters John Lennon and Carl Sagan). If you want peace, you have to start by being peaceful yourself, and that means, at a minimum, learning to disagree with others civilly.

One last comment on "spiritual" folks: two of the worst flame wars I have ever witnessed occurred among Buddhists and Quakers. Seriously.

"pain-body (conventional psychology doesn't even acknowledge this) is addicted to pain, and suffering."

See, and here I am just addicted to rib eye steaks and orgasms

Gog_Magog - I LOVE a good Frank Zappa reference, even though it's pretty obscure these days - and btw, isn't your user name also a Firesign Theatre reference? LOVELOVELOVE Firesign - the more education you get, the more jokes you get!

Amy - why aren't you publishing the links for maximum impact, so the rest of us can ridicule this guy?

And it's your clear-eyed recognition of this responsibility — as well as your stoic, businesslike acceptance of the duty — that brings us all back to this blog month after month, year after year.

(PS- For the record, it's hasn't worked yet for one longtime commenter.)

(But who doesn't love a blog where people quote FZ lyrics?)

By the way, I think we all agree that "egoic" is a meme that needs to die immediately. We don't have time for torture to extract information: Kill.

Oh, they're spanky little bastards!!

I yoosta gota these parties in Orange County where...

...Never mind.

If you're a Twitter user, consider following this account.

Y'know, the Chicago Fuckball could lose this thing.

Big Bird, Big Bird...

...And Big Bird.

Finding this guys site is not hard. Cut and paste some of his first letter and you will find it. Nice design of site, I do like. Handsome man too. The content, well I think the guy is trying to play some sort of a google bingo, this guys hits upon almost every buzzword from Mayan prophecy to Jung.

He has a new book out and he is probably doing a shotgun approach to getting the word out about it. Lets' contact any radio or web cast place and see if they will interview me.

To be fair, people can use symbolic systems such as astrology as psychological tools for relaxation and meditation rather and still be into science.

Yeah, found him in seconds.

Douchebag alert.

I'd wager good money if you drilled down, the root of his philosophy of why everybody was always against him, is that it was because he was to awesome and their ego couldn't take it.

If my eyes could roll more, they'd be on the floor getting away from me.

"Know this: you are in a dying field."

How egoic of him. If it's a dying field, why is he so eager to use it to peddle his gibberish book?

BTW, what is the right wine to accompany steak and orgasms?

> To be fair, people can use symbolic systems
> such as astrology as psychological tools for
> relaxation and meditation rather and still be
> into science.

Maybe, but it's hard to trust them.

You comment calls to mind this guy. Our present mentality about such things would not regard his most personal interests as irrelevant, even though his work was an indisputable (and perhaps essential) benefit to the American miracle.

In today's culture, it could never have happened, and in many regions of the world that ought to emulate us, it probably never will.

Crid - I, too, love that swing set as it looks like so much fun. And the swimming pool on that guy's estate is, hmm, most appropriate, no?

BTW, what is the right wine to accompany steak and orgasms?

I don't know about anyone else, but I prefer a nice Argentina malbec or perhaps a merlot. A good shiraz will do in a pinch.

BTW, what is the right wine to accompany steak and orgasms?

Merl....ooooh!

> And the swimming pool on that guy's estate is,
> hmm, most appropriate, no?

Well, some people might be OK with it, but I think having the water slide draining to that end of the unit makes a vast difference.

" . . . having the water slide draining to that end of the unit . . "

Ouch, I didn't notice that!