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I first saw this list in chapter 11 of "The Book of Lists," vol. 1. (There are four volumes.)
I'm amazed by those who argue that if high school teachers aren't including certain classics on the mandatory reading list anymore, it must be because they're women teachers, and thus must be anti-male. Can't people imagine that even teen boys don't WANT to read certain "boys" books that are one, two, or three centuries old - and maybe their GRANDFATHERS never wanted to read them either?
Hint: the following list was collected in 1950, from a Columbia University Press poll of "hundreds of editors, writers, booksellers, librarians, literary critics, and general readers."
Hillary states that Trump has committed treason, gets pushback:
There has never been a whit of evidence that ISIS, or al Qaeda, relied upon the statement of Western leaders to actually recruit or that a single ISIS jihadi walked away from his Paris taxi thinking, "I hate Donald Trump so much that I want to blow myself up." ISIS's call is not to defend Islam from the West, as Clinton has falsely stated, but to impose Islam upon the West. The people that flock to the ISIS banner don't do so because they see Islam as threatened. They do it because they see Islam as resurgent and victorious and they want to be part of a new Moorish conquest of Europe.
It involves Cartman, so it's rude, crude and socially unacceptable. Also many references to vajayjays.
I R A Darth Aggie
at September 20, 2016 10:21 AM
From Lenona's first linkie:
1. it's not a list of "boy" books. It's a list for literature majors.
2. I've read one of those books, by a woman who happens to have two titles on the list. I therefore declare that list to be misogynist and utterly without merit.
3. many of those books have leaked into popular culture, if not having been made into movies.
Here's an example: He tasks me! He tasks me, and I shall have him. I'll chase him round the Moons of Nibia and round the Antares Maelstrom and round Perdition's flames before I give him up!
She doesn’t dislike you. She is not irritated with you. She does not merely prefer the company of others, though she certainly does prefer the company of those who will either pay her or suck up to her.
She hates you.
You’re deplorable. You’re irredeemable. With a wave of her limp, clammy hand, this sick old woman dismisses you from the company of those whose opinions have value, whose interests matter, who have any moral claim to participation in self-governance. You are less than nothing. You are vermin to be, at best, driven from society.
America’s public pension funds, which manage trillions of dollars in retirement assets for millions of civil servants, are systematically deceiving taxpayers, politicians, and municipal bond investors with elaborate accounting sleight-of-hand. The “official” numbers show that public pension funds are struggling; the accurate ones show that the looming fiscal time bomb is so explosive that it may be impossible to defuse.
1. it's not a list of "boy" books. It's a list for literature majors.
________________________________________
Why do you think I used quotation marks? Take a hint. Jeez.
(I realize you're kidding around, but how much, I wonder?)
Some of it wasn't even fiction, as you may have noticed. It was simply a mix of "boring" but very different classics.
Anyone should know that when it comes to pre-20th century novels, women weren't really encouraged to become writers, so of course the most highly critically acclaimed novels by men heavily outnumbered those by women - and would have been written to appeal to men. (Another hint - even after the novel lost its reputation as being an inherently decadent form of writing, women were still discouraged from READING novels for decades, never mind writing them, as it was "common wisdom" that too much reading and learning in women would lead to insanity and sterility.) So when people complain about alleged shortages of books that supposedly appeal to boys, they often point to the shortage of classics on the reading list.
Another reason I used quotation marks is that adolescence wasn't really supposed to exist until sometime in the twentieth century (and prepubescent childhood barely existed as a concept until the late 19th century). Hence, the shortage of books for small children. Hence also, the fact that teens were expected to tackle novels for adults in high school - or even earlier, and that was not necessarily asking too much of them. (Another hint - Louisa May Alcott and her sisters read "Pilgrim's Progress" BEFORE they reached their teens - maybe not even for school. It's all about parental expectation.) The fact that so many parents and teachers have given up trying to get teens to read any really old novels that aren't at least funny - such as those by Twain or Swift - is simply part of the dumbing down of society. Kids are being allowed to think: "If there's no instant gratification, it can't be worth learning."
______________________________________
3. many of those books have leaked into popular culture, if not having been made into movies.
_______________________________________
Which is precisely why so many young people balk at reading anything. As in "well, if it's so good, how come it never became a movie? No, I won't read it." Or: "Well, if it's already a movie, only an idiot or a goody-goody would waste several days reading the book - I can always Google any plot discrepancies. Only stupid teachers think that anything matters besides the plot."
Same goes for watching stage musicals such as "Man of La Mancha" instead of reading the original book. (Though, in all fairness, I've heard that even modern Spaniards, who should love Cervantes more than any other people, have a pretty difficult time getting through "Don Quixote." "Easier said than done," as one journalist said.)
And even if you're a teen who hasn't seen the musical, you may think that all you really need to know, to be culturally literate, is the story of the windmills, and that any teacher who says otherwise is being petty and stupid.
And how many kids actually READ "Dr. Jekyll & Mr. Hyde" without being ordered to do so? Yes, they miss something if they don't. (I even once met some preteens from a well-off family who didn't know anything about the story; had I been able to do so, I would have read them the book aloud and hoped they didn't find out the "secret" from anyone else, while I was reading.)
lenona
at September 20, 2016 4:19 PM
"Why do you think I used quotation marks? Take a hint. Jeez.
(I realize you're kidding around, but how much, I wonder?)"
Sorry Lenona, but you were too non sequitur for me as well. I guess that is a hint only Matlock could follow.
Ben
at September 20, 2016 4:39 PM
only an idiot or a goody-goody would waste several days reading the book
I never understood this argument, today alone I read two 300+ page novels, wrote a small news advert and read half of a THIRD book.
All of it in between running two special needs clients to 5 doctors appointments and a lunch out at a resutrant
It is a culture thing Lujlp. It doesn't need to make sense.
Having the same hair style or clothing style isn't a matter of logic. But showing participation in the group is part of being a member of the group. The symbol itself is irrelevant. Sharing the symbol is what is important. Rejection of education is a similar cultural symbol.
Ben
at September 21, 2016 6:03 AM
I never understood this argument,
______________________________________
It's the child's and teenager's argument. Few adults, even those who sympathize (or empathize), would say anything like that out loud. (Of course, kids typically have other school subjects for which there are no "shortcuts" - such as math. Plus all the housework, sports, and other activities that take up their time - which is why it typically takes days for them to read one novel.)
Two inconvenient truths about reading books are:
1. It's something that's typically done while sitting down, meaning that one has do to even more hated physical exercise as a result - or give up video games (NEVER!)
2. It's not a social activity in the way that Facebook is, and the more time one spends on solitary activities, the more one risks being seen as anti-social. (One can play video games with friends, after all.)
It's too easy to imagine the following scenario:
MOTHER: "Sorry, darling, but no, I will not let you have more than 15 hours a week of screen time."
TEEN: "Why NOT?!"
MOTHER: "For starters, you need more exercise, and -"
TEEN: "So? I'll just stop reading books! THAT'LL give me more time to exercise! I was only reading to make you happy anyway and I'm sick of it. My FRIENDS don't read, and every hour you take away from my video games and Facebook is ruining my social life! Why can't you see that?"
(Notice that the mother hasn't even mentioned the need for reading yet and probably was cautious enough not to do so for fear of a possible backfire, but backfire was what happened anyway.)
Bushman for Shrillary!
http://www.politico.com/story/2016/09/exclusive-george-hw-bush-to-vote-for-hillary-228395
Fucker
Stinky the Clown at September 20, 2016 7:09 AM
Good job, guys:
http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/296622-audit-more-than-800-immigrants-mistakenly-granted-citizenship
I R A Darth Aggie at September 20, 2016 7:34 AM
Stinky: that just shows that the upper echelons of both parties have more in common with each other than with the les deplorables.
Which, among other reasons, why the Republicans can't really seem to do much against Obama, and before that Brother Bill.
I R A Darth Aggie at September 20, 2016 7:37 AM
A candidate paper for the New Real Peer Review twiter account
http://arstechnica.com/science/2016/09/teenagers-will-eat-veggies-if-you-tell-them-theyre-sticking-it-to-the-man/
Sixclaws at September 20, 2016 9:26 AM
I first saw this list in chapter 11 of "The Book of Lists," vol. 1. (There are four volumes.)
I'm amazed by those who argue that if high school teachers aren't including certain classics on the mandatory reading list anymore, it must be because they're women teachers, and thus must be anti-male. Can't people imagine that even teen boys don't WANT to read certain "boys" books that are one, two, or three centuries old - and maybe their GRANDFATHERS never wanted to read them either?
Hint: the following list was collected in 1950, from a Columbia University Press poll of "hundreds of editors, writers, booksellers, librarians, literary critics, and general readers."
http://blog.chron.com/bookish/2010/07/the-15-most-boring-books-send-your-own-picks/?view_comments=1
There are more than 100 comments.
lenona at September 20, 2016 10:11 AM
Another post, with comments (same but shorter book list):
http://www.weirduniverse.net/blog/comments/the_most_boring_books_ever
lenona at September 20, 2016 10:12 AM
Hillary states that Trump has committed treason, gets pushback:
http://www.redstate.com/streiff/2016/09/19/unreal.-sick-desperate-hillary-clinton-accuses-donald-trump-treason-video/
I R A Darth Aggie at September 20, 2016 10:16 AM
Eric Cartman for Prezzie!
http://freebeacon.com/blog/south-park-amy-schumer-help-prove-parody-impossible/
It involves Cartman, so it's rude, crude and socially unacceptable. Also many references to vajayjays.
I R A Darth Aggie at September 20, 2016 10:21 AM
From Lenona's first linkie:
1. it's not a list of "boy" books. It's a list for literature majors.
2. I've read one of those books, by a woman who happens to have two titles on the list. I therefore declare that list to be misogynist and utterly without merit.
3. many of those books have leaked into popular culture, if not having been made into movies.
Here's an example: He tasks me! He tasks me, and I shall have him. I'll chase him round the Moons of Nibia and round the Antares Maelstrom and round Perdition's flames before I give him up!
I R A Darth Aggie at September 20, 2016 10:35 AM
Oh, boy:
http://www.the-american-interest.com/2016/09/19/watchdog-warns-of-a-coming-china-banking-crisis/
I R A Darth Aggie at September 20, 2016 10:47 AM
http://townhall.com/columnists/kurtschlichter/2016/09/19/hillary-hates-you-n2220280
I R A Darth Aggie at September 20, 2016 2:04 PM
Will they be "too big to fail"??
http://www.the-american-interest.com/2016/09/19/blockbuster-nyt-report-exposes-public-pension-charade/
I R A Darth Aggie at September 20, 2016 2:25 PM
I slipped up a bit - here's the 15-title list. (But chances are anyone who opened my first link found it already.)
http://blog.chron.com/bookish/2010/07/the-15-most-boring-books-send-your-own-picks/
_________________________________________
1. it's not a list of "boy" books. It's a list for literature majors.
________________________________________
Why do you think I used quotation marks? Take a hint. Jeez.
(I realize you're kidding around, but how much, I wonder?)
Some of it wasn't even fiction, as you may have noticed. It was simply a mix of "boring" but very different classics.
Anyone should know that when it comes to pre-20th century novels, women weren't really encouraged to become writers, so of course the most highly critically acclaimed novels by men heavily outnumbered those by women - and would have been written to appeal to men. (Another hint - even after the novel lost its reputation as being an inherently decadent form of writing, women were still discouraged from READING novels for decades, never mind writing them, as it was "common wisdom" that too much reading and learning in women would lead to insanity and sterility.) So when people complain about alleged shortages of books that supposedly appeal to boys, they often point to the shortage of classics on the reading list.
Another reason I used quotation marks is that adolescence wasn't really supposed to exist until sometime in the twentieth century (and prepubescent childhood barely existed as a concept until the late 19th century). Hence, the shortage of books for small children. Hence also, the fact that teens were expected to tackle novels for adults in high school - or even earlier, and that was not necessarily asking too much of them. (Another hint - Louisa May Alcott and her sisters read "Pilgrim's Progress" BEFORE they reached their teens - maybe not even for school. It's all about parental expectation.) The fact that so many parents and teachers have given up trying to get teens to read any really old novels that aren't at least funny - such as those by Twain or Swift - is simply part of the dumbing down of society. Kids are being allowed to think: "If there's no instant gratification, it can't be worth learning."
______________________________________
3. many of those books have leaked into popular culture, if not having been made into movies.
_______________________________________
Which is precisely why so many young people balk at reading anything. As in "well, if it's so good, how come it never became a movie? No, I won't read it." Or: "Well, if it's already a movie, only an idiot or a goody-goody would waste several days reading the book - I can always Google any plot discrepancies. Only stupid teachers think that anything matters besides the plot."
Same goes for watching stage musicals such as "Man of La Mancha" instead of reading the original book. (Though, in all fairness, I've heard that even modern Spaniards, who should love Cervantes more than any other people, have a pretty difficult time getting through "Don Quixote." "Easier said than done," as one journalist said.)
And even if you're a teen who hasn't seen the musical, you may think that all you really need to know, to be culturally literate, is the story of the windmills, and that any teacher who says otherwise is being petty and stupid.
And how many kids actually READ "Dr. Jekyll & Mr. Hyde" without being ordered to do so? Yes, they miss something if they don't. (I even once met some preteens from a well-off family who didn't know anything about the story; had I been able to do so, I would have read them the book aloud and hoped they didn't find out the "secret" from anyone else, while I was reading.)
lenona at September 20, 2016 4:19 PM
"Why do you think I used quotation marks? Take a hint. Jeez.
(I realize you're kidding around, but how much, I wonder?)"
Sorry Lenona, but you were too non sequitur for me as well. I guess that is a hint only Matlock could follow.
Ben at September 20, 2016 4:39 PM
only an idiot or a goody-goody would waste several days reading the book
I never understood this argument, today alone I read two 300+ page novels, wrote a small news advert and read half of a THIRD book.
All of it in between running two special needs clients to 5 doctors appointments and a lunch out at a resutrant
lujlp at September 20, 2016 11:36 PM
It is a culture thing Lujlp. It doesn't need to make sense.
Having the same hair style or clothing style isn't a matter of logic. But showing participation in the group is part of being a member of the group. The symbol itself is irrelevant. Sharing the symbol is what is important. Rejection of education is a similar cultural symbol.
Ben at September 21, 2016 6:03 AM
I never understood this argument,
______________________________________
It's the child's and teenager's argument. Few adults, even those who sympathize (or empathize), would say anything like that out loud. (Of course, kids typically have other school subjects for which there are no "shortcuts" - such as math. Plus all the housework, sports, and other activities that take up their time - which is why it typically takes days for them to read one novel.)
Two inconvenient truths about reading books are:
1. It's something that's typically done while sitting down, meaning that one has do to even more hated physical exercise as a result - or give up video games (NEVER!)
2. It's not a social activity in the way that Facebook is, and the more time one spends on solitary activities, the more one risks being seen as anti-social. (One can play video games with friends, after all.)
It's too easy to imagine the following scenario:
MOTHER: "Sorry, darling, but no, I will not let you have more than 15 hours a week of screen time."
TEEN: "Why NOT?!"
MOTHER: "For starters, you need more exercise, and -"
TEEN: "So? I'll just stop reading books! THAT'LL give me more time to exercise! I was only reading to make you happy anyway and I'm sick of it. My FRIENDS don't read, and every hour you take away from my video games and Facebook is ruining my social life! Why can't you see that?"
(Notice that the mother hasn't even mentioned the need for reading yet and probably was cautious enough not to do so for fear of a possible backfire, but backfire was what happened anyway.)
lenona at September 22, 2016 11:36 AM
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