Twitter discussion on this topic:

https://twitter.com/amyalkon/status/940831531714732037

It seems to me that the appeal of these supplements is the same as for those weight loss formulas you hear about. You don't have to actually change how you live. All you have to do is take a pill, and you'll be back to what you were years ago.

I believe that there are instances where testosterone, administered under the care of a doctor, can be truly beneficial. Some years ago, I had my T checked by my GP. It was 0. He was shocked. Said it was the lowest T reading he'd ever seen. Started me on T, which made all the difference. Having more energy was the immediate benefit. Emotional benefits were profound, including a sense of confidence I hadn't had in years. Improved sexual function, with increased desire and better orgasms. (Not all o's are created equal. Never had a bad one, but the difference was like night and day). Further research and testing found a pituitary prolactinoma (tumor on my pituitary gland), which is inoperable. I'm now under the care of an endocrinologist, and the tumor is shrinking. Unfortunately, my body has stopped making T, probably permanently. I take an injection of T every two weeks, however, and it keeps my T levels in the normal range, and gives me so much in terms of quality of life.

Yes, I suspect there are lots of men out there taking supplements in the search to stop or reverse normal aging processes, but there are many men, such as myself, who have a medical need for supplemental testosterone. I'm not prepared to be a eunuch at the age of 55, nor am I prepared to throw the baby out with the bath water by saying that all testosterone is pointless, or no better than a placebo. T has certainly made all the difference in my life.

Re RK's comment, I recently heard a Joe Rogan podcast that went like that... He's aging in good health, but boosts it to the highest level of a typical man's life and no further, and is happy with the results.

A family member who used hormones developed early dementia, so I'll tread carefully, but am not against it in principle. Pinsky says that there's no reason for a woman to menstruate nowadays, because it can be safely medicated away... So perhaps treatments that seem radical aren't always dangerous.

Sully wrote an article. See also.

Compelling mantra:

We live in animal form; Nobody knows anything.

RoadGeek's, comment, not RK's.

As with anything else, I suspect the dose makes the poison.

I dont much believe these studies since they rarely control for all the other factors in the population studied.

Double blind experiments people, can’t stress that concept enough.

As someone with no thyroid gland, I can’t tell you how much better I feel under the care of a doctor who actually treats my symptoms and was willing to agressively balance T3 and T4 as opposed to just being satisfied with a test result that met the minimum medical guidelines for blood levels of these two hormones.

If I had gone to him twenty years ago, I could have spared myself two surgeries.

Quite frankly all three endocrinologists I saw were blithering idiots.

Whoever wrote that silly abstract should have read the article first. Or maybe she just hates people with testosterone - as most of the people who work at universities like the several listed at the top of the article do. I highly recommend that everyone completely ignore that asinine abstract and read the article itself and follow some of the links to the studies it reviews.

What the majority of the studies reviewed in that so-called "Research Article" showed is that supplemental testosterone will not cure diseases nor relieve symptoms of diseases and conditions that are not caused by lack of testosterone.

Well, that's not entirely correct. Though a few of the studies reviewed showed negative effects in old men with serious diseases like CHF, COPD, cirrhosis, HIV, angina; and some showed no benefit; many of the studies showed benefits and improvements that ranged from negligible to quite substantial.

Very few of the studies evaluated the effects of supplemental testosterone when it's taken for the purpose that the vast majority of the men who take it are taking it for: to raise testosterone levels into the physiological normal range and relieve the adverse symptoms of low testosterone. Testosterone taken to relieve the negative effects of low testosterone is very effective. Duh.

Before I started Testosterone therapy a year ago, my testosterone was as low as a eunuch-like 204. My endocrinologist is careful, however. Before she started me on therapy, however, she had me change my OCD medication, since the one I was taking could have contributed to that condition. The level did rise to 245, but then slid back to 215. That's when she started me on testosterone therapy.

Initially, I was using one ml every two weeks. In a few months, I was at 500. However, a few months later, I was at 785, which she deemed too high. Since I didn't want my prostate to swell to the size of a watermelon, I was all too happy to go along with reducing the dose to 0.5ml every two weeks to lower it to the ideal 400-600 range. I will be getting tested again in about 3 weeks.

If I had my way, I would try to get it to 1000 (the high end of normal). But I doubt that either God or my endocrinologist would be fine with that. And the prostate troubles would undoubtedly be mighty.

The results, so far, are bearing out what that abstract asserts. While I have a little increase in sexual function, it's not spectacular. My energy levels are not much different. My strength and muscle mass have increased a little bit, if my guns are any indication; however, I will still have to work out for truly significant strength gains. However, I would still prefer to be a normal man vs. a potential eunuch.

> And the prostate troubles would undoubtedly be mighty.

Testosterone may be protective against high-grade prostate cancer -

http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/13685538.2017.1298584

"...Quite frankly all three endocrinologists I saw were blithering idiots...."

I'm on my third, having fired my first two. Most people are too timid to question a medical professional, but I'm not. And when they aren't doing the job, they're gone.

I've also found that most specialists tend to wear blinders; they over-focus on one aspect of treatment at the expense of other facets of the problem. My first endocrinologist was focused on my weight, but had no curiosity as to why I was obese, or why my T was so low. My second endocrinologist was competent, but again lacked curiosity, and had no solutions for the weight gain; she was also furious that I went, behind her back, to Houston to see about having that tumor removed. I was questioning her authority, you see. My third endocrinologist suggested I had sleep apnea during our first visit, and has worked to balance my hormones to facilitate weight loss, and it's working. She listens, and asks questions, and solicits input on my case from other doctors in her clinic.

In the end, the patient has to push and question and advocate for what they want/need, and can't be afraid of offending a medical professional.

In the end, the patient has to push and question and advocate for what they want/need, and can't be afraid of offending a medical professional.

roadgeek at January 19, 2018 6:05 PM

Being intimidate by Medical Professionals and all the studies they don't bother to read carefully, is like being intimidated by the saleman down at your local Ford dealer, who desperately wants to sell you that new pickup truck.

One of the worst things about third party payer. Doctors often forget who the customer is.

In my town there has seldom been more than one endocrinologist. For a period of time there was none. Five years ago, in desperation, I called a Sports Medicine doctor. Never been happier. Feel better in many ways at 62 than I did when I was 45. He helped my shooting too.