What a bargain! It cost nearly three times as much to kill Hitler. A few weeks ago the President was in France celebrating the anniversary of D-day. Fifty years from now we'll be celebrating the capture of Saddam in a free and democratic Iraq and saying it was all worth the price.

Hitler was probably the greatest threat to all countries in the 20th Century. Osama, I believe, is that person at the moment. Saddam was simply one of many murderous dictators on the planet -- most of whom we're doing nothing about.

> simply one of many murderous dictators on the
> planet -- most of whom we're doing nothing
> about.

First of all, you gotta start somewhere, and as Nash notes, we're getting this cheap. (And such numbers are inherently speculative). And we can always cut back on public radio and television.

2nd, Iraq is our mess to clean up.

3rd, Saddam's defeat has wonderful exemplary power for all those other wretched despotisms, including the ones we installed. Read this:

http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2003/11/20031106-2.html

Fifty years from now we'll be celebrating the capture of Saddam in a free and democratic Iraq

What's so laughable yet pathetic about this patently absurd comment is that some poor fools actually believe this kind of fairytale crap.

As any historian will tell you, predicting the state of affairs in fifty years -- or even ten years -- is virtually impossible.

Using your "logic," Dwight Eisenhower should've predicted in the 1950s that terrorists would take down tall buildings in New York.

If the US was serious about turning Iraq into a peaceful nation, it wouldn't have disbanded the Iraqi army, yet let them take home their weapons.

Yes, Virginia, George W. Bush is that stupid.

"First of all, you gotta start somewhere"

Then why not start with the far greater threat? Iraq posed no threat to the US. Osama had ATTACKED the US and killed thousands.

Using your "logic," the US and Axis should've concentrated on removing Laszlo Bardossy from power, while ignoring Hitler. (Bardossy was the fascist premier of Hungary.)

Venus...What's so laughable yet pathetic about this patently absurd comment is that some poor fools actually believe this kind of fairytale crap.

Venus, you're a breath of fresh air. Why, yes, we'll just take out Saddam, rebuild Iraq, and let democracy bloom like a flower. Has anyone even bothered to examine the cultural impediments that would prevent a democracy from even existing, starting with the prevailing religion, the anti-Christianity and anti-Semitism, sexism and just plain hatred of the west?

Venus: W is your superior in the nuance of responsibility. Specifically, Osama was already dead when we went after Saddam... It's very hard to run up the desert mountain canyon from the screaming tumble of a daisy cutter when you're on doing dialysis.

Patrick says: The little brown people are neither capable nor desirous of freedom. They jus' *love* workin' the [oil] fields fo' massa! You should hear 'em sing!

Does this line of reasoning strike anyone as familiar? Or appealing?

I think that whether or not the common Iraqi desires liberation from the oil fields has little to do with all the impediments Patrick mentioned. Western style freedom blooming into existence seems unlikely, but we really only want them to buy Coca~Cola, Frito-Lay, and Marlboros anyhow. That would define success.

Yes, we want them to be a capitalist democracy. They deserve it as much as any other people on the globe. And lord knows they're equipped to have one, with all that oil underfoot!

"As any historian will tell you, predicting the state of affairs in fifty years -- or even ten years -- is virtually impossible." --Venus

Nobody can predict the future with 100% accuracy. But we can damn well influence the future with our actions today. If we had turned our back on Europe after WWII then we'd probably be fighting the same war in Europe today. But we didn't turn our back. We stayed and committed our resources in earnest. As a result, two of our most formidable former enemies are not only the economic superpowers of their regions but our allies as well.

If we could civilize and democratize post-war Germany and Japan, then we can do it in Iraq.

Right on Nash. See also this:

http://blog.simmins.org/2004/06/reconstruction-putting-it-in-context.html

And the opening passages of this:

http://oxblog.blogspot.com/2003_11_02_oxblog_archive.html#106821413951533888