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So, He Beats His Wife A Little When He's Drunk
The quote:

"I’ll beat up Betty when I’m drunk. I don’t think I’ve ever bruised her, but I do have my way. If she says one thing I don’t like then I’ll chin her."

Are you outraged?

Of course you are.

Are you still outraged when you learn it's really rocker Amy Winehouse talking about getting drunk and socking her husband one? The quote from the U.K. Sun:

“I’ll beat up Blake when I’m drunk. I don’t think I’ve ever bruised him, but I do have my way. If he says one thing I don’t like then I’ll chin him."

Posted by aalkon at July 10, 2007 12:59 PM

Comments

TO: Amy Alkon
RE: Hypocrisy, Anyone?

Like Mz Couric. Or, years before at a Fortune 500 corp I worked at, some manager started jack-slapping another manager in a meeting.

The assaultee was fired. He was a guy. The assaultor had nothing happen. She was a gal.

According to reports, all the guy had done was point out a problem. And not in any particularly offensive manner.

Regards,

Chuck(le)
[Where there is no religion, hypocrisy becomes good taste.]

Posted by: Chuck Pelto at July 10, 2007 5:53 AM

That's pretty appalling. Winehouse is a bit of a nut, IMO.

Posted by: deja pseu at July 10, 2007 6:06 AM

I always get mad at my male friends when they say they wouldn't punch me back if I punched them. Now granted I wouldn't punch them because I don't start fights I can't win. However, it totally breaches the whole concept of gender equality, if a man or a woman gets violent then they should be held accountable for their actions. (By someone else's fists if necessary.)

It is indoctrinated into boys from when they are so little "don't hit girls." Instead of no hitting ANYONE EVER male or female. maybe if girls got in fights more often growing up we'd be better able to defend ourselves as adults. (And possibly more able control our impulses against being inappropriately violent.) Totally theoretical of course.

I bet if Winehouse (what an appropriate name for a violent drunk) chinned Blake and he gave her a solid right hook she might feel a little differently about her right to smack him around.

Posted by: Shinobi at July 10, 2007 6:59 AM

Nobody has the "right" to smack anybody else around!
What really annoys me is when the hitter places the blame on the hittee: "If you hadn't said/done what you did, I wouldn't have hit/punched/kicked/whatever you." Yeah, as if. Personal responsibility has nothing to do with it, right? Sheesh.

Posted by: Flynne at July 10, 2007 7:04 AM

The UK's Sun is not what you'd call the nation's paper of record!

Even so, I bet the paper's famously sharky lawyers checked that quote six ways to Sunday.

It sounds exactly the sort of provocative shit Winehouse delights in tossing off as this tender stage of her career.

Posted by: Jody Tresidder at July 10, 2007 7:35 AM

Not to shrug off my own druken tirades, because there have been a few times where I've been known to get mean (not violent, I don't have the coordination to fight ... breakdancing and fighting: two things I'll never be good at) but I have a friend who is pretty prone to picking a fight after a few drops of any alcohol. Bad part is that she's trained in ju-jitsu (sp?) and is actually quite good at landing a punch with the force of 20 years of competitive swimming behind her, she's got the muscle to leave the worst impression. It's a conundrum: she works out constantly to releive all this anger/stress and convincing her to "relax" without alcohol or worse yet, having to monitor her inebriation while simultaneously attempting to relax with everyone else is probably one of the biggest hassles ever. I'll admit to attempting to drown my sorrows in alcohol and all that ended up happening is a headache and heaps of humiliation on top of whatever problem I had to begin with. It constantly amazes me that of all the mind altering substances made legal, alcohol, with all it's dangers (your liver, your drivers liscense, and your reputation), it's still the most legal and marketable substance available.

Posted by: Abby at July 10, 2007 7:40 AM

Outraged? Hardly... most of my friends wive's are completely nuts half the time anyway, and at least a punch is something that we can understand. (In many cases men may find it funny or even arousing. Just my opinion as a guy who has been married 20 years, and all my friends are married.)

I've known a woman who liked to be slapped around during sex, which was not my thing at all. I worried that it might get out of control or she could use it against me someday. But that was her fetish.

What goes on between a man and wife can not be fully understood by anyone else, or pigeon-holed into what is and is not acceptable. If it works for them, who cares? A man can always find a sofa to sleep on, or leave. A battered wife is a whole different affair...

PS- and the whole Katie Couric slapping incident is bullshit. It's a high stress job, she's struggling, and one of the writers screwed up. She slapped his shoulder back and forth a few times, which is really a frustrated way of communicating. Jeez this country is overly sensitive.

Posted by: eric at July 10, 2007 8:14 AM

"Jeez this country is overly sensitive."

On the mark, Eric.

In many cases, alcohol can make a person more lucid. It is a matter of quantity and how the person was raised to appreciate the beverage. While living overseas, I was a heavy drinker because of the high stress environment. Now stateside, I haven't been plastered in 9 years, but still appreciate a drink from time to time.

Anyone who has a need to express their anger through fighting (drunk or sober) is a massively insecure person. The key strategy for a fight is running. When you need to run away from a fight or run towards one. Even with my combative personality, I’ve been in 4 major altercations that were unavoidable.

Posted by: Joe at July 10, 2007 8:22 AM

I'm not outraged. I don't really care what Amy Winehouse says. I have no idea who she is. But I will say that I've notice over the years that there are a small, perhaps insignificant, number of women who engage in truly awful behavior simply because they know they won't get called on it the way a man would. They'll say things or do things that would almost certainly result in violent retaliation if said or done by a man. All too often booze is involved, but sometimes not. Most men learn at some point that if they do or say something truly obnoxious, they're going to get their ass kicked. It's a valuable lesson. For the most part, it's a lesson not forced upon women.

Stupid, really. And sad.

Posted by: Larry McKenna at July 10, 2007 9:15 AM

I'm less outraged hearing that is was a woman doing the hitting than a man. The likelihood of her seriously hurting her husband by chinning her husband is slight; if the husband were doing the hitting, it would be much higher. "You don't hit women" is a good rule for boys to learn. Though this guy could stand to be reminded that there's no need to let them hit you, either.

And what Larry said about some women never learning that it's not OK to say really awful things, just because they get away with it.

Posted by: justin case at July 10, 2007 9:59 AM

My ex-wife used to brag about beating guys up. She got drunk and tried to beat me up once. I kept blocking her punches until she tried to kick me in the balls, then I punched her. She never tried to hurt me again. I've never started violence against anybody, but have known 3 woman that did (ex-wife, ex-girlfriend, and my mother attacked my father). I read once that the majority of battered women hit the man first. I don't know if that's right and it doesn't excuse beating a women up, but I think that men generally do learn to control violent urges better than women because they have to.

Posted by: William at July 10, 2007 10:08 AM

Remember the scene where Jessica Lange smacked Jack Nicholson in "The Postman Always Rings Twice"? Or Scarlett slapping Rhett Butler? I think I am going to do something to really piss my wife off tonight...

Posted by: eric at July 10, 2007 10:24 AM

William, there is nothing wrong with what you did. You acted in self-defense, and only slugged her after she kept trying to hit you numerous times. Sometimes that's the only way to get a bully to leave you alone. It doesn't surprise me that you say she is an EX-wife, either.

Posted by: Pirate Jo at July 10, 2007 10:37 AM

Laughing my head off right now.
In college I played rugby (yes we had a ladies rugby team) and of course a large part of the game is learning how to tackle another player to the ground. The other thing you learn is how to avoid a tackle or maintain enough control over your fall to get the ball to a teammate. This is hard to practice unless you actually get tackled.

The problem was that we (guys and ladies team) could only afford one coach between the two of us. So we gals had to practice with the guys. All of whom adamantly refused to tackle us! It took weeks of (figurative) arm-twisting to convince them it was okay to tackle us.

I don't think it's wrong that a guy refuses to hit a woman even after provoked. I think it speaks of a great deal of class and gentility (Not saying a guy shouldn't defend himself - William you do sound like a class act.) And I have girlfriends who do get indignant that a man wouldn't hit her back if she hit him (equal rights and all that).

But great merciful Zarquon on a pogo stick, it is *not* okay in any way, shape, or form for grownups to be hitting each other. I don't care if you're man, woman, or other, you should not abuse people. You should *especially* not abuse the ones you claim to love. The genders of the assaulter and the assaulted shouldn't make a difference. (Other issues might make a difference - history of abuse for example - but gender shouldn't be one of them)

Posted by: Elle at July 10, 2007 11:04 AM

Well, I guess the outrage is how a large portion of women will exploit the double standard or view it as a perverted sense of self empowerment.

A malignant person is still a malignant person no matter what gender. Also, anyone has the right to defend themselves against a violent person regardless of gender, single or double standards.

Posted by: Joe at July 10, 2007 11:15 AM

"But great merciful Zarquon on a pogo stick, it is *not* okay in any way, shape, or form for grownups to be hitting each other."

True, dat. But the world is still full of white trash, and without them, where would Jerry Springer be?

Posted by: Pirate Jo at July 10, 2007 12:53 PM

I could see Springer as an anger management counselor.

Posted by: Joe at July 10, 2007 1:12 PM

I don't care who you are, hitting is not okay. Everyone has a right to defend themselves, or others, but that's as far as it should go. Anyone that hurts people for the hell of hit is a coward and a bully.

Posted by: Sharon at July 10, 2007 1:20 PM

Color me outraged.
She's a pig, and shouldn't be bragging on it.

Posted by: Deirdre B. at July 10, 2007 1:38 PM

Hitting your loved ones is wrong, no matter your gender. Has anyone noticed it seems to be more common among younger women to do the "cute" hitting thing? Well, at least they seem to think it's cute.

I didn't know many women when I was in my teens/twenties who thought it was okay to hit others, but a lot of the young women I know now don't seem to get that it's not cute or funny to watch them slapping or punching their dates.

Posted by: Kimberly at July 10, 2007 1:46 PM

As long as Amy Winehouse keeps singing fab songs about how fucked up her life is, I don't care how fucked up her life is. Besides, she lives in Britain, so America's manhood (and male chins) are safe...

Posted by: modestproposal at July 10, 2007 3:22 PM

William, my mom hits my dad all the time. She usually slaps him upside the head. He doesn't do anything. I haven't spoken to my mom in a long time, can't stand her, because she's a narcissist, probably a sociopath, rating about a 3 on the Hare scale, but someone would have to test her-I'm just guesstimating.

I think it indicates a lack of respect for your boyfriend, and also a lack of awareness of how much control men have to exercise over their own emotions because of their greater potential for causing damage.

Posted by: Chrissy at July 10, 2007 3:50 PM

Well, Amy Winehouse could stand next to Saddam Hussein and someone would still say: "What a bitch."

First rule on being an adult: Ignore all celebrities, unless you are watching them in a movie or lip synching songs at a concert.

Posted by: Joe at July 10, 2007 4:32 PM

Safe, sane & consensual!

Posted by: Paul Hrissikopoulos at July 10, 2007 5:01 PM

As a woman with all the arm strength of a baby bunny, and as somebody who sees violence as a lower form of relating, my response to an attack is "Run, self, run!"

As far as the Couric thing goes, you can't really know what happened. Sounds like she might have been playfully slapping somebody. Since we can't know for sure, I'll abstain from that one.

As for Winehouse, see the violence/lower form of relating comment above. Nobody should be hit. Furthermore, a violent drunk, woman or not, can pick up a gun or a lamp and maim or kill a man.

And I despise the double standard...which is why I posted this as I did. Again, imagine the outrage if a man bragged about this - and all the people who'd be going on and on and on about the serious violence that could be inflicted.

Furthermore, I've spent about four days reading about testosterone, the aggression hormone. Men, on average, have 10 to 20 times the testosterone women do. (Women who are violent criminals have more than most women, and working women have more than homemakers, generally speaking.) Anyway, biochemically speaking, it seems likely men have to exercise a greater level of control over their anger -- to keep it from going too far.

P.S. Been on deadline all day or I would've posted a comment on this sooner.

Posted by: Amy Alkon at July 10, 2007 6:22 PM

DOn't you knid of get the sense that people for whom this is a problem were going to have trouble anyway? I don't think anyone should get beaten up, IJS... Double standards aren't really the problem here. People who beat people up (the beat-ees who put up with it are the problem)

Posted by: Crid at July 10, 2007 8:10 PM

What is the world coming to ... when i was a kid we had a lodger, and old fellow called Frank Owen, who had been gassed in WWI and never recovered. He was tall and thin and wheezed around the house. But he was a real treasure of a man. One of the many things he said was, "Norman, always remember that a gentleman is a gentle man." It went without saying that being a gentleman was something to aspire to. I think he was right on both counts.

Posted by: Norman at July 10, 2007 11:16 PM

Man, I so need to proofread.

...who put up with it are PART OF the problem...

Posted by: Crid at July 11, 2007 1:34 AM

There she goes again-- totally dismissing the male experience of sexism/double standards/ female special privelege. Apparently there are no set of facts that would establish that a man has ever been discrimanted against because of his gender ( see GB divorced fatrher nightmares) or that women have a double standard.
First-- its not true ! She really did not say that, the paper is unreliable.
Second, if she did say that, its a stunt, don't take it seriously.
Just don't draw any conclusions from this-- like don't learn anything from reports of massive bias against divorced fathers in the courts of GB.
Any report that depicts men as victims of discrimination or double standards are always to be dismissed. They never happen. Only women are victims. We don't need to address male concerns at all. Only women count. The essence of feminism.
Maybe the public profession of assaulting your mate should always be taken seriously, even if it is just a man who is being hit.

Posted by: jedwards at July 11, 2007 3:42 AM

Jedwards - There she goes again ...

Who are you referring to?

Posted by: Norman at July 11, 2007 8:59 AM

I don't think jedwards read any of the posts. He's a professional victim!

Posted by: Chrissy at July 11, 2007 1:01 PM

Good ole Jody... whose world-view is so compulsively pro-feminist/misandric even the most blatant cases of bias against men are dismissed.

Chrissy-- why is it when a man complains about a woman publicly acknowledging beating her husband-- its being a"professional victim". You are right though-- it would take an army of professionals working around the clock to follow all the incidents and reports of double standards, sexism against men, discrimination against men.
Since I referred to one post, I didn't need to read them all.

Its hilarious how feminists and their men- on- a-leash try to shut men up who complain about sexism and discrimination against men. "Whining", "rants" ,"past bad experiences with women", "anger" etc-- the same attitudes that greeted the beloved feminists years ago, interestly enough...
Perhaps when established sterotypes are challenged the women who benefit from them squeal like the proverbial stuffed pig. A lot more squealing is in store for many women.

Women who complain incessantly --see feminists -- are seriously listened to-- becauase women think they ARE indeed victims. Since men really are not victims- none of this is true or important-- all complaints are just "whining".


Stop whining about "professional victim"-- if this was a man quoted in a newspaper about beating up his wife while he was drunk-- vast armadas of pot-banging women would be in front of his door, requests for his arrest would pour in at the local PD, substance abuse counseling would be de riguer, followed by forced-feeding of the feminist anti- male view on DV,etc ad nausem.

Instead a 'Jody " is pulled-- 1) its not true 2) Even if it is , its a publicity stunt. Either way , it has no significance and not to be taken seriously.. To take it seriously would mean you actually believe in EQUALITY and not female entitlement/ beatification.

Also-- young women are more likely to hit their dates, boyfriends and do not find it improper. Amazingly, these findings were published in GB from surveys of huge numbers of college age women last year. We know many young women think hitting and assualting men is fun, funny and acceptable-- they told us so.

Posted by: jedwards at July 11, 2007 3:16 PM

Hey -how's it hangin', jed!

Posted by: Jody Tresidder at July 11, 2007 3:49 PM

I'd take the 5th too, if I were you Jody... by the way-- I'm a girl...

Posted by: jedwards at July 16, 2007 3:06 PM

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