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Google Causes Autism!
No, not really. But, there's as much evidence Google causes autism as there is for vaccines causing it. (Somebody please tell that to Jenny McCarthy, who thinks she's now an expert on autism, thanks to her ability to Google.)

Unfortunately, celebrity is one of the more dangerous weapons against science and reason, and McCarthy, who's the mother of an autistic child, is wielding hers like a baseball bat in a Wedgwood china outlet.

Here's Orac of Respectful Insolence on McCarthy's recent Oprah appearance, and "Google knowledge versus scientific knowledge":

Far be it from me to attack Jenny McCarthy for wanting to help her autistic son. Her devotion is admirable, and virtually all parents, other than crappy parents, want to help their children. The problem is that, in seeking to help her son, she's seriously drunk the Kool Aid and believes that vaccines contributed to her son's autism. Moreover, like so many parents, she's been subjecting him to a wide variety of "biomedical" treatments whose rationale is dubious at best and for which there is no good evidence of efficacy to try to "cure" his autism. Now, she's using her B-list celebrity to peddle a boatload of misinformation about autism, vaccines, and biomedical treatment.

Contrary to McCarthy's Googling would have her believe, the Measles/Mumps/Rubella vaccine has NEVER contained mercury or thimerosal. Sources are at the link.

Posted by aalkon at September 23, 2007 2:23 PM


And she's also got Jim Carrey's A-list celebrity backing her up. o_O

Posted by: Flynne at September 23, 2007 8:10 AM

Unfortunately, the googling part is all too true. Parents want answer in the beginning. There is a sea of information on google and it's certainly interesting to see which information gets the most hits. Pity we can't change the balance a bit.
Best wishes

Posted by: Maddy at September 23, 2007 9:14 AM

has anyone tried busting Oprah's balls for giving national exposure to this lunatic?

Posted by: Lena at September 23, 2007 10:25 AM

As the mom of a 4 year old on the severe end of the autism spectrum, I've spent hour upon hour Googling. In fact, that's how I found you today! But, even though they can be helpful, what I need more than Google or Playmates of the Year is some quality research to figure out the cause(s) of autism and effective treatments...(Autism research is EXTREMELY underfunded...)

Oprah .. it's great having girlfriends dispensing anectdotal advice ... But could you include a little peer-reviewed science in the mix?

Posted by: Autismville at September 23, 2007 11:37 AM

google "autism diet"
this is the boimedical treatment she talked about most. its has more google hits than any other intervention. even pier reviewed ones ..( sorry there a no pier reviewed interventions)

Posted by: apple_m at September 23, 2007 12:45 PM

Uh, apple_m, your spelling "peer-reviewed" as if studies are being reviewed by a dock on the lake says it all.

You get "peer-reviewed" studies from Pub Med (a service of the National Library of Medicine and National Institutes of Health), not from Google and Jenny McCarthy. Go here:

And search exactly this:

autism vaccines

Somebody please pass this information on to Jenny McCarthy before she sways more of those who tend to get their medical information from US Magazine.

Posted by: Amy Alkon at September 23, 2007 2:37 PM

Jenny McCarthy never stated that the mmr had thimerosal. It is a live virus vaccine. If one has an immune deficiency (such as many autistic children do) they should not receive this vaccine. It is a shame that is usually is not diagnosed before the MMR, as with my daughter who had seizures and a bulls eye rash after this vaccine.

Too many parents of autistic children have had to seek medical treeatment within 21 days of this vaccine because their children had a reaction.

Perhaps there is no connection. BUt the fact that my daughter displayed few signs of autism prior to this reaction, and was diagnosed with classic, or severe autism 6 months later causes me to question the link.

Also, it is interesting to learn that my daughter has since been diagnosed with immune deficiency. They found this out by testing her antibodies to the vaccines she has received. She has no antibodies to most. Her immunologist has said "no more live virus vaccines".

If a person cannot produce antibodies, live viruses in vaccines can replicate, and cause many things to happen, including encephalitis, and even death.

The polio vaccine was changed in the US in 2001. The old vaccine, the OPV was a live virus, given to infants in three doses. It was causing VDPV, or vaccine derived poliovirus in immune deficient children. We now use the IPV, or inactivated polio vaccine.

Children with immune deficiencies, or family history of immune deficiencies should not receive any live virus vaccinations until a definite diagnosis has been made, and the doctor determines they will have an adequate immune response. This is a fact supported by the NIH, WHO and CDC.

More information on imune deficiency here-

While my daughter never had thimerosal in any of her vaccines, she had an immune deficiency from birth. Immune dysfunction can be hereditary, and it can be caused by environmental factors.

I showed signs of immune deficiency for 12 yrs (27 hospitalizations requiring IV antibiotics to clear infections). It was not until I discovered what happenned to my daughter through GOOGLE and asked for the right referrals for my daughter (to immunology) that MY immune deficiency was also diagnosed!

Thank God for GOOGLE. It has saved BOTH our lives.

Thankfully, we have been able to successfully treat my daughter's immune deficiency. When her immune function was restored, her cognition improved, and best of all, her smile returned.

She is not cured, and has a long way to go, but thanks to GOOGLE and doctors willing to listen to me, she is doing amazing. At three, she is reading at a first grade level.

To see early signs of autism, and also amazing progress when dietary interventions are made, and immune function is restored watch my daughter's videos. She is amazing, her story is NOT unique, and the story needs to be told, again, and again, and again, until the CDC listens...

As a side note, I find it humorous that in the US it takes a playboy bunny to get people to listen.

Posted by: Monica at September 23, 2007 2:44 PM

FYI to everybody commenting here, post only one link per comment or your comment will go to my spam folder. If it does, I will retrieve it asap, but you have to write to me at adviceamy AT aol DOT com. Sorry - it's a problem caused by the huge volume of spam hitting my site, and Gregg is going to move servers in October in hopes of ameliorating this.

If you get your comment eaten, a note will appear telling you to write me. Except when I'm in France, I'm usually 12 inches from my computer, and except when I'm on deadline, I'm checking here like crazy, so I should get your comment uneaten and up to be read within minutes.

Posted by: Amy Alkon at September 23, 2007 3:32 PM

I'm finding it amazing that anyone actually thought Jenny McCarthy had a brain in her head. If I ever hear that she's off on some crusade regarding an issue that requires even a slight degree of intelligence (like autism), I just roll my eyes.

Posted by: Patrick at September 23, 2007 3:56 PM

Monica, your post is up here twice, so I'm removing the repeat. The first one is the one I rescued from my spam folder. It's already above.

Posted by: Amy Alkon at September 23, 2007 8:45 PM

Thank you Amy, I didn't see the first, and thought I would have to post again, and after I posted, then I saw my original post!

I just hope all who read this, pay close attention. Science may not have found the reason why this is hapenning, but it IS happening.

For all those who doubt, I encourage you to find an autism support group in your area, and attend. Ask the parents what happened to their children after the MMR. As I have said before, my daughter's story is NOT unique.

My daughter had mild signs of autism before the reaction to this vaccine, but something happened after this. Her smile was gone for months, she lost eye contact, and her health declined greatly.

Thankfully, there are doctors out there who entertain the possibility of a connection, and have listened to me, and helped my daughter to overcome the medical problems she faced.

All doctors need to start listening to the moms. We also must remember that the only studies DISproving a link between autism and vaccines have been epidemiologic studies, most funded by pharmaceutical companies.

There was a time in history when epidemiologic studies had convinced the world that smoking tobacco had nothing to with lung cancer, that it was just a big coincidence. These studies were funded by tobacco companies.

I think we all know the truth about cigarettes! Yet for over a decade, the entire medical establishment was convinced that the rise in lung cancer was due to pollutants, and had nothing to do with tobacco!

I am convinced, that in my lifetime, the truth will prevail.

Posted by: monica at September 24, 2007 6:48 AM

We also must remember that the only studies DISproving a link between autism and vaccines have been epidemiologic studies, most funded by pharmaceutical companies.

This isn't my area of expertise, but I suggest you turn to links within Respectful Insolence. Orac is a cancer surgeon and a researcher and has no agenda other than getting scientific truth out and debunking myths.

Posted by: Amy Alkon at September 24, 2007 6:51 AM

No one was ever healed by a sneer.

Posted by: nhokkanen at September 24, 2007 8:38 AM

> mild signs of autism before
> the reaction ...

Not making a case here, I have no pony in this race...

But isn't that the way it progresses anyway, that the effects of autism accelerate tragically in the toddler years?

Posted by: Crid at September 24, 2007 11:52 AM

I've followed autism for seven years (as a hobby). The rise is due to the fact counselors dont label them as mentally retarded anymore. Vaccines would be a too simple answer as to why autism occurs. Autism isnt an allergic reaction. Jenny, like most people would rather believe that her gene pool is 100% good. I've always felt I've a high chance of having an autistic kid (or with some other mental handicap) hence I choose not to reproduce. When I explain this to people, most dont seem to comprehend that despite my healthy apperance I am not the best gene candidate.

Posted by: PurplePen at September 24, 2007 1:00 PM

The verse applies in all contexts!

(Every day in every way, we love Purp a little more)

Posted by: Crid at September 24, 2007 1:15 PM

I'd be very interested to know what gives Amy Alkon the right to spread her version of advice in the first place, especially concerning autism. Raised a child with autism lately, Amy??

Well, Amy darling, we are!! You're hurting our fight and cause with your deliberately cruel, uneducated OPINION. Yes, let's call it what it opinion! Far different than advice.

As the mother of a child with autism, I've spent countless time and immense energy researching any avenue that may offer help to my child. You're dead wrong!!! There is AMPLE peer-reviewed, SCIENTIFIC evidence on the side of vaccine induced autism.

And, next time, please get your facts correct BEFORE spewing a bunch of garbage. Jenny NEVER attributed her son's autism to Thimerosal (mercury) in the MMR immunization. Maybe you need to watch the segment AGAIN. Better yet, you could ACTUALLY read the transcripts! Of course, that would require a sincere effort on your part.

So what was it again that makes you an expert on the subject? Google? Or is it the same bloated ego that makes you a self-proclaimed goddess?

At least Jenny McCarthy is offering something and more importantly, HOPE.

Posted by: Lin at September 24, 2007 3:31 PM

As a Pediatrician I engage in this discusion with parents quite a bit. I know many parents whose first child develops autism and they blame the vaccines. They are at least linked temporally so I understand the thought process. But in many cases with their second child they do not vaccinate and unfortunately the second child comes down with autism exactly as did the first. Only then does the parent realize what the scientific community already knows - that autism is a genetically based problem set off by an unknown immunologic trigger.

Posted by: griffin at September 24, 2007 3:36 PM

I'd be very interested to know why you even bothered to read and post here, if you're so bothered by Amy, who more often than not does meticulous research before posting blog items and advice columns.

Why don't you bother to read her post? SHE didn't say that Jenny McWingnut said that vaccines caused autism in her child. She posted what Orac said on HIS website. And for the record, this is not the advice column, this is her daily blog. See links at left for clarification. And take your self-righteousness elsewhere, please. If you'll read the good doctor's comment above, you might recognize that you may be wrong in your assumptions as well.

Posted by: Flynne at September 24, 2007 5:04 PM

I posted because I don't care for her slamming of Jenny who is finally giving us some hope for our children. We may actually be moving in a better direction after many, many years of resistance.

Amy chose to use the Orac's comments though.

BTW. I DID read the "good doctors" comment. I've also spoken with and visited enough doctors, pediatric specialists and the like to understand that many are truly are at a loss as to how to help heal those with autism, including my son. If you haven't noticed, autim is now being considered an epedemic. Hmmm....

I can be authoritative on my son and the autism that has claimed him. I've earned that right many times over. I don't expect you to understand. But, don't stand in my way as I fight for a better future for my child either!

Actually, this is the first time I've read this blog. I didn't give it the title (I assume Amy chose that for herself)and I won't be revisiting either. I don't have the time or energy to waste.

Posted by: Lin at September 24, 2007 5:32 PM

Thanks, Flynne, exactly right.

Posted by: Amy Alkon at September 24, 2007 5:35 PM

PurplePen says:
I've always felt I've a high chance of having an autistic kid (or with some other mental handicap) hence I choose not to reproduce. When I explain this to people, most dont seem to comprehend that despite my healthy apperance I am not the best gene candidate.

PurplePen, I find this statement interesting. I've felt this way about myself at times, but am not sure it's anything more than paranoia. If it's not too private I'm curious about what makes you feel this way.

Posted by: jaylyn at September 24, 2007 5:38 PM

Orac is not a pediatrician, but a researcher. Many doctors haven't read a study since med school, and believe in stuff that's not scientifically based. That's why we have "alternative medicine." In the words of former New England Journal of Medicine editor-in-chief Marcia Angell:

"There cannot be two kinds of medicine — conventional and alternative. There is only medicine that has been adequately tested and medicine that has not, medicine that works and medicine that may or may not work."

Orac is an excellent source of scientifically based medicine, and Jenny McCarthy is a lady I certainly feel for, but not one I'd turn to for anything more than, perhaps, advice on applying lip-liner.

In addition to Orac's blog, another blog I turn to for its rigorous, evidence-based postings is Neurologica:

Posted by: Amy Alkon at September 24, 2007 6:02 PM

Here are some of the consequences of denying science:

Posted by: Amy Alkon at September 24, 2007 6:05 PM

Jenny McCarthy from Oprah:

Jenny says she believes that childhood vaccinations may play a part. "What number will it take for people just to start listening to what the mothers of children who have seen autism have been saying for years, which is, 'We vaccinated our baby and something happened."

Posted by: Amy Alkon at September 24, 2007 6:12 PM

Lin - How old were you when you conceived? How old was the father? We already know that women have a sell-by date. We're also finding that men have a "best used before" date.

I'm not claiming to be an expert, because I'm not. But the last piece of research I read on autism indicated that there was a possible correlation between the age of the parents and the likelihood of autism.

And the trend for the past 20 years in America has been for couples to start families later and later.

Given that the vaccination schedule used today has been in use for about 40 years, and the increase in autism is far more recent, I'd say you're looking for causality in the wrong place.

But if it is age related, then you wouldn't have anyone to blame but yourself.

Posted by: brian at September 24, 2007 7:50 PM

Well, that's a little harsh... No matter what the ages of parents, that's a bad piece of luck, one that a reasonable person might have hoped to dodge.

Also (and where's Lena while all these discussions are going on?) -- I'd bet autism gets a lot more diagnoses than it used to get, because a much greater percentage of the population is getting medical care... There aren't entire extended families out in the holler, beyond the reach of revenoors and epidemiologists.

Paglia once spoke of how everyone wants to think about historical sexual conditions in contemporary, urban, middle-class American terms. She was talking about how artists were perceived by their societies (I forget which ones): "These men weren't gay... They were strange!

It was probably that way for most autistics until very recent times.

Posted by: Crid at September 24, 2007 9:24 PM

Brian - you're a heartless, ignorant jerk!!!
I doubt if you are educatable, but just in case...the same vaccine schedule for 40 yrs. Oh really...take a look for yourself. I assume you can read.
CDC (Center for Disease Control and Prevention) immunization comparison table.
It is so obvious most on this blog have NO first-hand experience with autism.

Posted by: Sam's DAD at September 24, 2007 9:51 PM

Sam's DAD: I'm willing to bet that you have no first-hand experience with measles. Or mumps. Or diptheria. Or polio. Want that to change? Then go on your merry unvaccinated way. I'm going to save my sympathy, and efforts, for the children in the Third World who are permanently disfigured or killed by diseases that could have been prevented by a vaccine. No one's speaking for them on "Oprah." If you wish to believe, despite numerous studies conducted using the actual scientific method, that autism can be easily explained away by blaming those eeeeevil vaccines, you go right ahead, but don't expect me (or Amy, or many of the other posters at this board) to support you in what seems to be your quest to undo one of the greatest advances in public health in human history.

Posted by: marion at September 24, 2007 10:29 PM

It is so obvious most on this blog have NO first-hand experience with autism.

It is not firsthand experience one should go by when making medical appraisals or decisions, but evidence-based medicine.

See my Marcia Angell quote above.

Medicine isn't my area, but it is Orac's. And Orac is among a number of doctor/researchers I count on for good data and correct readings of science and interpretations of science. (And misinterpretations.)

I do find, when I use data in my own column from psychological studies or differences between men and women, I frequently make people angry. I got a letter from a woman today who was IRATE at my use of a particular study, because she didn't like what it said -- but that didn't mean the study was wrong, bad methodology, or bad data. It wasn't. The woman called it "a stupid statistic" because she didn't like how it reflected on her, and intimated that I did shoddy work for using it. If only. I actually spent weeks dissecting that particular study, and called on a certain person who comments here (and several times) to help me be sure I was writing the findings exactly right.

And right on, Marion. I only wish they'd put Orac on Oprah (although he doesn't have the blonde hair, big boobs, or centerfold credits!)

Posted by: Amy Alkon at September 24, 2007 11:37 PM

Sam's DAD -

Cruel is what I do.

And I'm likely both more educated and more educable than you.

Whether you like it or not, there is a growing body of controlled and peer-reviewed work that shows a strong correlation between parental age and autism.

To date, the only work that shows a link between vaccine and autism is on the same level as the "studies" that show a link between violent video games and youth violence. That would be precisely dick.

If you've got an autistic child, hey, I wish you luck. But don't expect me to follow you on a crusade to eradicate vaccines.

Posted by: brian at September 25, 2007 4:04 AM

Oh, and one more link for you "peer-reviewed" types.

New England Journal of Medicine.

Money quote:

This study provides three strong arguments against a causal relation between MMR vaccination and autism. First, the risk of autism was similar in vaccinated and unvaccinated children, in both age-adjusted and fully adjusted analyses. Second, there was no temporal clustering of cases of autism at any time after immunization. Third, neither autistic disorder nor other autistic-spectrum disorders were associated with MMR vaccination. Furthermore, the results were derived from a nationwide cohort study with nearly complete follow-up data.

The study was done in Denmark.

Now, can we stop having this conversation?

Posted by: brian at September 25, 2007 4:11 AM

I'm reminded of Rachel Carson's misguidedness -- which was responsible for killing many, many people.

Posted by: Amy Alkon at September 25, 2007 4:41 AM

Yes, but Rachel made people feel good about killing all those people.

And that is the problem.

Emotion is not a sound basis for public policy.

Posted by: brian at September 25, 2007 4:53 AM

Guys, you're skipping all around something here without nailing it down, so let me do it for you: You, and everybody you know, are individuals. This includes the consequences of disease and its treatments.

We are constantly fooled by commonality as to our unique nature. We clamor for unity, for bonding; we are naturally gregarious.

But we should never count on any medical treatment having the same effectiveness for us as it does for others.

There is another thing to realize, here, too: there are degrees to the severity of diseases. This is a consequence of the genetic diversity I note above. We don't have "Star Trek" scanners you can use - yet. You're just going to have to wait, and remind yourself that you are not guaranteed a smooth path anywhere. I know you knew that.

Posted by: Radwaste at September 25, 2007 7:23 AM


I'm bi-polar on the low end of the scale. My biological father is bi-polar on the high end of the scale. My mom is attractive but dumb as rocks. There is history of mental illness on both sides of the family. The inside of my genes are not the best. On the outside I am perfectly normal and healthy.

Posted by: PurplePen at September 25, 2007 10:52 AM

Thanks for the answer PurplePen. You must be the lucky combo of the best genes from both sides of your family. I'm similar in ways. My dad almost certainly has some undiagnosed mental condition (people have been trying to get him to a psychiatrist for years - myself included), and my mom's two siblings are schizophrenic. I think I dodged the bullet myself, but who knows what's lurking in my DNA.

Posted by: jaylyn at September 25, 2007 4:45 PM

Lin, if you haven't actually disappeared -

I actually do have some experience with autism, though not as the parent of an autistic child. I have a few friends with autism and my son has three autistic playmates. I also dated a women who's brother was a very low functioning autistic.

I also have neurological disorders, that are likely genetic, bipolar disorder, congenital insomnia and sever ADHD. All of these cause a certain amount of difficulty in my life. But, like most autistic adults I know, I am very glad to have them. I, like the autistic adults that I know, do not want a "cure."

I am sorry that you have to deal with the very real, very, very difficult problems that raising a child with autism entails. While not as difficult, raising me was no treat for my folks. Raising a son with severe ADHD isn't a lot of fun, a lot of the time, either. Trying to help ensure that he doesn't make many of the same mistakes I did, trying not to make the same mistakes my parents did (indeed, figuring out what decisions were mistakes) is an extreme challenge. I can only imagine how much harder it is for you.

But talking about hope, well there is. There is hope that rather than wasting your time trying to figure out who to blame, how your child turned out to be autistic, you might just decide that, hey, my child is autistic, maybe I should accept and embrace it. Maybe I should try my damndest to raise that child to embrace and love who s/he is and make the best of it.

Here's a tip. At thirty-one, I am finally learning how best to function, as an adult with severe ADHD. Theoretically, I am higher functioning than most people with autism. In practice, most adults with autism I know, have far more lucrative careers than I do and have nearly the same functionality at home as I do.

Even my ex's brother, who at fifteen (when I was dating her and saw him almost daily) was happy to throw his poo around and "couldn't" talk, is designing microcircuitry for automated manufacturing robots at twenty-five. He's apparently rather "interesting" to work with, especially when he gets overstimulated, but the same is true of most autistic adults.

Point being, rather than being a simple curse, it is a trade-off. Your child has abilities that you probably can't begin to imagine right now. I managed to fail pre-algebra in high school, before I dropped out. I recently managed a 97 on my elementary calculus CLEP exam. If you made me take the same pre-algebra class, made me do the math the way the teachers required it then, I would still fail. I do math ass-backwards and inside out, I also do rather complex problems in my head.

I work with an autistic teen, who is regularly in and out of a care home. I am a semi-professional song writer (i.e. I derive about half my income and growing, selling my music) and he really loves music. He wanted to learn to write music, so I agreed to teach him music theory. He gets frustrated at times, he has gone seemingly catatonic a couple of times, hit me a few times, himself more often. He also understands the basics of music theory and can now play piano by ear, which, with the help of MIDI, makes it possible for him to write music, instinctively and brilliantly. Not at all like me (his only music teacher and only for about six months), I write with a lot of abstraction, while he is very literal. Plus, he learned to play piano from me, in spite of the fact that while I know how to play, I don't have the coordination to play. And he still can't read music very well. Unfortunately, he has been in the hospital for almost a month now, after he had a major breakdown, but he has a lot of options open for him, both in music and physics, when he gets it together again. Ask him, even now, as he sits in a mental ward and he will tell you that he wouldn't trade who he is for anything, even being nuerotypical.

I realize and understand that it is hard. I understand that it is a huge burden. But neurodiversity is a beautiful, wonderful thing. It's even hard for those of us who aren't autistic, bipolar and ADHD are a pain sometimes. It sucks to attempt to clean every room in the apartment, at exactly the same time. It sucks to get ready to take your child to the park, only to find yourself cleaning the bathroom, your child asking when we're leaving for the park. It sucks to get the list together, head for the grocery store, get into a conversation on the public trans and find yourself ten stops down the line at the bookstore, having entirely forgotten you were supposed to be getting food - it sucks getting that "look" from your partner when you get home with a stack of books, but nothing with which to make dinner. Still, I wouldn't trade it for the world. It's who I am, a part of what makes me, me.

So there is hope. Hope that you will do everything in your power to accept who and what your child is. Hope that you will help that child be the best them, they can potentially be, neurodiversity and all.

Posted by: DuWayne at September 25, 2007 11:47 PM

Geez, DuWayne, that was an awesome post! Thanks for sharing. o_O

Posted by: Flynne at September 26, 2007 5:57 AM

I want to make something painfully clear here...

Not all parents of vaccine injured children are anti-vaccine!

That is like stating "my mom took Vioxx, she had a heart attack and died, therefor, I don't beleive in ANY medication"

That is an ignorant statement, and not the view held by most parents of vaccine injured children.
Face it, we NEED vaccines. They have eliminated numerous diseases, and prevented many illnesses and death.

But we need SAFE vaccines. We need to make sure children receiving vaccines have a proper immune response, or we are simply putting these children in danger.

All vaccines are not designed for everyone, yet they are given to everyone. This needs to change.

Just as some are deathly allergic to penicillin, some have similar reactions to vaccines.

And again, I must state, my daughter had a reaction to the mmr, the doctors have told us no more vaccines. The doctors have also said Live Virus Vaccines (such as the mmr) can KILL my daughter! My daughter developed an empty sella, and her growth rate dropped after this reaction. For months after this reaction, my daughter was vacant, had no smile, had no spark. She became severely autistic. My daughter's MAINSTREAM doctors all agree that this reaction somehow contributed to her autism.

Many other autistic children have had the exact same experience.

Yet, we are told, "it is a GIANT coincidence" by the CDC.

If it was your child- what would you believe, what you have seen with your own eyes, or what people in the media are telling us to believe?

As for me, seeing is believing. Jenny may be a dimwit, but she is correct in her statement "It is time for the doctors to start listening to the moms".

Posted by: Monica at September 26, 2007 6:02 AM

Monica -

All it means is that at some point your child was going to simply turn off. Whether from the MMR, or actually being exposed to rubella, she would have had the same response.

Who would you have blamed then?

Your child has a genetic disorder. Triggering it was luck of the draw. That's why CDC maintains it was a coincidence.

Posted by: brian at September 26, 2007 6:46 AM

Oh, and another thing.

SAFE is defined how? Never causes an adverse reaction? Can't do it. Can't prove a negative.

The problem with medical science, and especially pharmaceuticals, is they work until they don't. You can do all the clinical trials in the world, and still not find the set of circumstances in which your drug is guaranteed lethal.

Posted by: brian at September 26, 2007 6:54 AM

Here it is, ladies and gents,the latest word on the great vaccine debate. There is NO link between
mercury in inoculations and children's neurological problems:>1=10412

Someone please send this link to Jenny McWingnut. Thanks. o_O

Posted by: Flynne at September 26, 2007 5:23 PM

"All it means is that at some point your child was going to simply turn off. Whether from the MMR, or actually being exposed to rubella, she would have had the same response.

Who would you have blamed then?

Your child has a genetic disorder. Triggering it was luck of the draw. That's why CDC maintains it was a coincidence."

If at some point, my child should have "turned off" as you say, and a natural virus could do this, then shouldn't we protect children like my daughter, that WILL be injured in this way?

Live viruses, such as those in the MMR and Varicella vaccine can replicate in immune deficient hosts, causing the disease in the host.

And, fwiw, if my daughter contracted ruebella, and had regressed after a natural occurence, I would blame the parents who have not vaccinated their HEALTHY kids.

Chances are high that a child in the US will not come into contact with Ruebella, but a 100% likelihood that child will receive the live virus vaccine for this.

The problem is, all kids are vaccinated the same, the healthy, the premature, the immune deficienct. We need to make sure HEALTHY children are vaccinated, and the others are kept safe in other ways.

My daughter depends on high vaccination rates, as she cannot produce antibodies to many vaccine preventable diseases, even though she received all vaccines on schedule.

there are no easy answers, other than doctors paying attention to immune deficiency prior to 12 months old, (which it is rarely diagnosed that early), or doing as we have with the polio vaccine, and switch to inactivated virus vaccines.

But we need to do something differently.

Posted by: Monica at September 27, 2007 10:05 PM

And, fwiw, if my daughter contracted ruebella, and had regressed after a natural occurence, I would blame the parents who have not vaccinated their HEALTHY kids.
Chances are high that a child in the US will not come into contact with Ruebella, but a 100% likelihood that child will receive the live virus vaccine for this.

Rubella, commonly known as German measles, is a disease caused by the rubella virus. It is often mild and an attack can pass unnoticed. However, this can make the virus difficult to diagnose. The virus usually enters the body through the nose or throat. The disease can last 1-5 days. Children recover more quickly than adults. Like most viruses living along the respiratory tract, it is passed from person to person by tiny droplets in the air that are breathed out. Rubella can pose a serious risk as it can also be transmitted from a mother to her developing baby through the bloodstream via the placenta. If the mother is infected within the first 20 weeks of pregnancy, the child may be born with congenital rubella syndrome, which includes a range of birth defects. The virus has an incubation period of 2 to 3 weeks during which it becomes established.

German measles were very common when I was a kid. I had it, all of my friends had it, and not one of us ended up autistic.

Posted by: Flynne at September 28, 2007 5:39 AM

I guess I have to form this as a question for some of you: Why do you think that diseases act the same on all people, that the symptoms and the treatments are the same, and that the world - not to mention the medical establishment - owes you a "cure"?

Posted by: Radwaste at September 28, 2007 6:36 AM

And, fwiw, if my daughter contracted ruebella, and had regressed after a natural occurence, I would blame the parents who have not vaccinated their HEALTHY kids.

If the mother is infected within the first 20 weeks of pregnancy, the child may be born with congenital rubella syndrome, which includes a range of birth defects.

Ahem. I believe there is really nowhere to lay blame.

Apparently, adults need vaccines, too:>1=10412

Posted by: Flynne at September 28, 2007 6:58 AM

Subacute sclerosing panencephalitis (SSPE) is a progressive neurological disorder characterized by inflammation of the brain (encephalitis). The disease may develop due to reactivation of the measles virus or an inappropriate immune response to the measles virus. SSPE usually develops 2 to 10 years after the original viral attack. Initial symptoms may include memory loss, irritability, seizures, involuntary muscle movements, and/or behavioral changes, leading to neurological deterioration.

Posted by: Monica at September 28, 2007 12:18 PM

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