The Easily Insulted Again
I just posted another Advice Goddess column, A Man On The Meek. It starts out like this:
Guys these days will find any excuse to avoid asking women out: It’s too hot, it’s too cold, the moon’s in Aquarius, or isn’t in Aquarius, or making a move could cause a woman to have an epileptic seizure, go into diabetic shock, or start speaking in tongues. And sure, those last few are serious concerns, especially if she’s epileptic, diabetic, or has given some indication she’s possessed.But, assuming the woman’s head doesn’t start whirling around like it’s on the spin cycle, and she doesn’t ask you to drop by for coffee in a Satan voice, a guy could make the leap that she’s less in need of an exorcist than a cute guy to take her to the movies on Saturday night.
I got this e-mail about it:
Hello Amy.I wrote back:
My name is Michelle, and I wanted to write to you about your article I read online, “Man on the Meek”.
What I need to express might sound like I'm being overly sensitive, but I promise I have a very good reason. I have epilepsy. I won't bore you with details of what to do, what not to do, etc. I can give you those details if you wish, but your article didn't touch on them, and they're not important to me right now.
What is most important to me, though, is the stigma that goes with epilepsy. I've personally been affected by this stigma, to the point of losing a job over it. People don't know how to react to the news "I have epilepsy", and so they usually react poorly (cringe, grimace, “oh, I’m sorry”) In fact, quite a few of them are so uneducated about epilepsy that they will even go so far as to shun me. Most people have a “Hollywood” education about epilepsy.
And that's why I was saddened to see references to “epilepsy” and “possessed” within the same paragraph. Quote: “or making a move could cause a woman to have an epileptic seizure, go into diabetic shock, or start speaking in tongues. And sure, those last few are serious concerns, especially if she's epileptic, diabetic, or has given some indication she's possessed.”
In my life, the stigma is still here. Although it’s lessened over the last generation, it’s still around. But it doesn’t help when people write articles that imply some of these incorrect, old, outdated, inaccurate urban legends about seizures!
I don’t want you to write a recall/ change / edit article. I just want you to know that what you wrote does NOT help the people with epilepsy get away from the stigma of it. I want you to understand, and accept that the longer the stigma is around…the ignorance abounds.
Thank you,
Michelle
So sorry I have offended you, but being possessed was a joke and the others were medical problems. I have ADHD and I joke about how I have to leave the house four times and can't remember which flight my boyfriend comes home on (We've been dating five years and he takes it twice a month). My friend John Callahan jokes about being quadriplegic. And the Tourrette's people are exploring using humor -- I know, because I was going to make a joke about Tourrette's and I called their press person to see whether she thought it was funny. Clearly, you and I have a different approach. Best,-A
Note that I said I'm sorry I offended her, which isn't the same as being sorry for what I wrote. And then, I wrote back again:
PS FYI, just to let you know, you haven't "educated" me about epilepsy in the slightest -- other than the fact that you're offended. Perhaps you should change your focus?
She writes back:
Amy, if you have any questions at all, please feel free to ask me…I’ll give you the best information / links that I can find. Michelle
Well, gee, that was helpful. Guess the effort only extends to the effort to COMPLAIN.







Your original comments weren't offensive nor was her letter to you of the self-pitying whiner variety, just passing along information. I think you over-reacted.
Rodger at February 27, 2008 4:31 AM
This is stupid. I have epilepsy and I have grand mal seizures if I don't take my medication properly or sleep enough. Yes, I scream, convulse, foam at the mouth, you name it, it's pretty scary and disgusting - and, see, this is where the accurate reference comes in - the guy making a move could cause something scary, oh no. Someone doesn't quite comprehend sarcasm.
Additionally, some of my best graduate work was on epilepsy in women during the 19th century and the stigma attached - and I found it very funny, even though in the case of that particular research, the medical opinions of the day had absolutely no sarcasm involved.
Jessica
at February 27, 2008 6:16 AM
You're my kinda woman, Jessica.
Roger, there was no information in her letter other than the fact that it was offensive to her because she lacks a sense of humor.
Amy Alkon
at February 27, 2008 6:46 AM
The letter writer engages in a fallacy that I've lately encountered more and more. The fallacy consists in assuming without evidence that the source of a dispute is the other party's ignorance. As if two "educated" people couldn't have a reasonable disagreement. As if facts are always so clear that one must be unreasonable to disagree with a particular interpretation of the facts.
I've noticed that the fallacy goes hand in hand with easily taking offense.
Jeff
at February 27, 2008 6:58 AM
Remarkable.
Amy, the way you used three examples of non-mundane behavior to make a point was clear and incisive: UNLESS the woman in the office has shown some sign that her reaction might fall outside expected norms, "Meek" can feel free to approach her within expected norms.
This silly Michelle seems to be offended at the mere mention of the word epilepsy. If anyone is attaching a stigma to a medical condition, it is her. She doesn't want to be treated like everyone else, she wants to be carried through life on a gilded pillow, not gonna happen.
martin
at February 27, 2008 7:18 AM
Sounds like she was pretty shaken up.
Jim Treacher at February 27, 2008 8:01 AM
My friend has epilepsy and is not the slightest offended when someone uses phrases like "I am going to have a fit". (I'm sure this Michelle would be!) She thinks being politically correct is utter nonsense. I can only agree with her.
franziska at February 27, 2008 8:08 AM
I think the "kid gloves" approach to problems and disease is part of what makes them off-putting. People sometimes find it hard to look at or interact with people in wheelchairs, and if the people in wheelchairs joke about themselves, it "humanizes" them. They become people, not objects of pity.
Callahan in his motorized wheelchair, picking up chicks: "See my new shoes? I hear they're very comfortable!"
Amy Alkon at February 27, 2008 10:23 AM
EXACTLY, Amy. This is why I tell my boyfriend, "You'd better let me sleep or the demonic possession will emerge."
Jessica
at February 27, 2008 11:01 AM
People don't know how to react to the news "I have epilepsy", and so they usually react poorly (cringe, grimace, “oh, I’m sorry”)
I wonder if she's ever thought that maybe her reputation precedes her, and people grimace, cringe, and say "oh I'm sorry" because they're bracing themselves for a lecture...
Flynne
at February 27, 2008 11:13 AM
So what is the right response to someone saying "I have epilepsy"? I'm sure its not exactly a fun thing to deal with so the context of the announcement may be generating the response.
I had a girl work for me a while back who has IBS and was happy to tell anyone, anytime the topic of food came up. And she couldn't figure out why she wasn't getting dates.
I don't see why something like this would come up unless it was immediately relevant -- everyone's off to the disco or you're being interviewed to operate heavy machinery.
I think its a natural to have an initial feeling of sympathy for someone who suffers any health challenge. A reactionary "sorry" response shouldn't be a surprise. How people go from there is going to depend a lot on how the sufferee handles it. Humor is a great tool to let people know its no big deal.
moreta
at February 27, 2008 11:54 AM
I don't tell people I have ADHD, which I don't consider a "disorder," by the way, simply a different sort of brain functioning, unless it's somehow pertinent to the discussion. I mean, isn't there enough happening in American politics and the rest of the world that you don't have to give a medical history to keep the conversation flowing?
Amy Alkon at February 27, 2008 12:06 PM
I have only announced "I have epilepsy" on a few pertinent occasions, so I don't know why this girl sounds like it's her standard introduction. That's the only way she could be getting any weird responses. My occasions:
1) Filling out scholarship applications for graduate school, trying to express an additional expense (uninsured student on necessary meds)
2) Sleeping with someone - as in, spending hours asleep vs. having sex. Sex without sleeping over did not necessitate this element of conversation; it becomes necessary with the sleeping activity because even though the chances of a seizure are slim, the risk is there, and my seizures generally have happened in between falling asleep and hitting REM. Therefore I believe it is only fair to give some preparatory warning so that should it happen, the person doesn't think I'm dying (possession is fine - be afraid, very very afraid).
3) This column, to illustrate the point that this girl is an oversensitive airhead with a chip on her shoulder and a victim's complex.
Jessica
at February 27, 2008 1:19 PM
An additional thought - I wonder what variety of epilepsy she has? Epilepsy is a description of neurological symptoms rather than of an actual cause or specific disorder. So, I wonder, is she someone who is affected by lights? That I suppose might necessitate conversation with an employer. Or perhaps what are referred to as absentia seizures? Randomly "spacing out"? Plus, the fact that epilepsy is a collection of varying symptoms diffuses her issues with its supposed "stigma" - there are stigmas associated with different types of seizures, including petit mal, grand mal, absentia, etc., but not necessarily the term "epilepsy," at least not in my experience.
Maybe I was too quick to judge her conversational choices. However, her lack of a sense of humor and her obvious deficiency in the IQ department are unappealing enough to negate my natural tendency toward sympathy. I have the seizures with the worst type of stigma - the grand mal seizures I mentioned above - and I don't feel victimized or categorized. The fact that I'm demonically possessed simply adds to my charm.
Jessica
at February 27, 2008 1:53 PM
When awkward people are lonely but realize they can't reach out to others without bringing more awkwardness into the world, they'll sometimes pounce on the one topic for which they can claim expertise as they (backhandedly) reach out to make contact. Yes? No? Especially when it's a topic with a victim-y tinge of pathos.
So now it's my turn!
I was a petit mal kinda guy as a teenager. They weren't actually seizures, but I'd pass out with spectacular falls when rising after sitting with my feet up for twenty minutes. Eventually the family saw this happen and grew concerned.
It was probably just adolescent low blood pressure. Nowadays I spend good money for pills because the numbers are too high. Sports statisticians will argue that my lifetime average is respectable. This analysis is not comforting.
Anyway, the doctor prescribed a Dilantin, a sometimes-psychoactive compound which was later implicated in those wacky stunts that President Nixon was pulling while under the same medication in those selfsame years.
Furthermore, I too had an irrational fascination with audio recordings. It's work out better for my career than for his, though.
Crid
at February 28, 2008 12:14 AM
Eww. I hope I didn't come across like that in this topic, Crid. I guess I really did say too much. Sorry.
Jessica
at March 4, 2008 8:06 AM
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