Talk Dirt-Cheap To Me
My husband of a year is very tight with cash. It's always save, save, save. I recently traded in my car, and I needed $1,000 more for the new one, but he never offered to give it to me. My parents ended up paying it. I make my own money, but not a lot, and I'm wondering what kind of financial arrangement makes sense in a marriage.
--Confused
Your husband comes into the living room, and there you are -- sitting on the floor with a Starbucks cup and a cardboard sign that says, "Anything helps. God bless."
Unfortunately, the passive-aggressiveness of the wife-as-panhandler approach is toxic in the long run. However, the theatrics would get your message across better than the nonverbal forms of communication you've probably been using -- pouting and closing cabinet doors a little more forcefully than usual.
Like a lot of women, you may assume that whatever subtle emotional cues you can read, men can also read. However, research by social psychologist Judith A. Hall finds that women are far better than men at spotting and decoding nonverbal signals in facial expressions and body language. Women's having evolved greater aptitude for this makes sense, as newborn infants generally aren't in the habit of expressing their needs with, "Hey, mom-lady...would you grab me a pack of smokes and a beer?"
So, yes, if you want something from your husband, you do have to put that out there in spoken-word form. But beyond that, you two need to sit down and hammer out a fiscal policy for your relationship -- where the lines get drawn on "yours"/"mine"/"ours" and "what if one of us has a financial crisis and needs an alternative to, oh, stealing a mule to get to work every day?"
In coming up with this policy, it's important to go beyond the cold dollars-and-cents view and discuss each other's attitudes surrounding money, especially any issues and fears. Then, when there's a conflict, each of you can maybe start with a little compassion for the other's point of view.
It also might help to understand that our views about money are influenced by genetics and what behavioral ecologists call our "life history strategy" -- a term that relates to whether our upbringing was stable and "safe" or risky and unpredictable. Child development researcher Jay Belsky and his colleagues find that a stable childhood environment tends to lead to a more future-oriented approach (saving, for example), whereas, say, growing up ducking gunfire or just having divorced parents and getting moved around a lot tends to lead to a more now-oriented approach (spendorama!).
Whatever your past, going off into the sunset being chased by creditors can be a marriage killer. Family studies researcher Jeffrey Dew finds that married couples with a bunch of "consumer debt" (owing on credit cards, loans for consumer goods, and past-due bills) fight more about everything -- from sex to chores to in-laws. And research by sociologist Carolyn Vogler, among others, finds that couples who pool their money (like their money got married, too!) tend to be happier. I would guess that the spirit in this is important -- going all in financially..."us against the world!" instead of, "If you lose your job and can't pay your share of the rent, don't worry, baby. I'll help you pitch your tent on the front lawn."
I imagine this as the conversation she had with him over the cost of the car:
Him: Hey! How did it go with that car?
Her: Well, the trade in offer came in $1,000 short of what I was expecting.
Him: So, you're not getting the car?
Her: No, I'm getting the car. I just have to figure out how to finance that $1,000.
Him: Okay. Well, let me know what you figure out.
Her: I may have to ask my parents for the money, but I don't want to do that.
Him: Well, go ahead and do that. I've never seen them turn you down before.
Her: Whatever.
Amy hit this on the head. The letter writer needed to directly ask her husband for the money and see what would have happened.
Fayd at November 22, 2016 5:43 PM
My Pirate Wench thought the way to get me over to her house for an 'emergency' was by calling me up and screaming at me... without actually saying what it was she needed.
We're not together now.
jefe at November 22, 2016 5:46 PM
I'm sorry, why did the car need to be traded in on a new one again?
Isnt buying a big ticket item like a new car something married couples do together?
And if you agreed when you got married to keep your finances seperate,why is he now responsible for coughing up the dough for an impulse purchase?
He may be quite tight with money. This isnt a characteristic you overlook up front, figuring out that you can *fix him later*
On the negative side, extrme stinginess is a sign of a cold person. On the plus side, someone needs to be able to do the math, and keep the rent paid.
Isab at November 22, 2016 7:36 PM
Perhaps your husband treats you like a child because your first reaction is run to your parents and ask for $1,000 for a new car.
Resolve why you don't make alot of money instead of resenting your possibly cheap ass tightwad husband. Making money will give you the ability to tell him to fuck off next time he shows his cheapish ways. And well if he isn't actually unreasonably cheap it will give you the ability to decide where the next surplus $1,000 goes.
Ppen at November 22, 2016 11:34 PM
So yeah, there needed to be a conversation a while back about who is contributing what to the household. The guy may be just a tightwad. If he is, he isn't going to change just because she wants him to. There can be advantages to being married to a tightwad. My great-uncle was one, and when he died at the age of 68, he left my great-aunt with a paid-for house and car, investments, and enough money in the bank to pay her bills for the rest of her life. (I think she would have traded it all in to have him back, though.)
Although the idea of "fairness" in a relationship can be a bottomless rathole, it is necessary for a healthy relationship that neither partner feels like they are being taken advantage of. What does each partner contribute to the marriage and the household? There can be different tradeoffs. Maybe one spouse is working part time or not at all, and agrees to take the main responsibility for keeping up the household. Or maybe both spouses work full time and make about the same amount of money, and they have an agreement about who pays which bills. Or maybe one is putting the other through school, and it is understood that the spouse in school will reciprocate at some point in the future, maybe when the working spouse decides to start their own business.
My wife and I have separate checking and savings accounts. We did that back in the days when we wrote a lot of checks for bills, to make sure we didn't accidentally bounce a check. Nowdays we pay for nearly everything on line, so that motivation isn't there any more. What we do now is use the different accounts for different purposes. The mortgage gets paid out of my checking account, and utilities and taxes get paid out of hers. One of the savings account is our house fund, going towards paying off the house, and it also serves as the major-emergency fund. The other is long-term savings for larger expenses, like cars, vacations, or home improvements. We move money between accounts as needed (keeping the other spouse in the loop). At one point we had a bunch of money moving in and out of CD's, but they don't pay enough any more to make it worth the trouble.
Listen to what Amy said about consumer debt. I've seen it break up many couples who loved each other but couldn't deal with the financial strain. Our only debt is our mortgage. We pay cash for cars, and we pay off our credit cards at the end of the month, always.
Cousin Dave at November 23, 2016 6:37 AM
Cant really speak on this because I don't believe in the separate money thing when you become married. When two people join as One then all decisions are made by that One. All money goes in one account and all the bills are paid from that account. Neither of the One has to asks about small purchases and all large purchases are made together. If I don't trust you enough wit my money then we shouldn't be together. Then again I don't give a shit bout money so that's just me. We make it, we spend it, repeat. My woman is worth more than me then some paper
Wisewords at November 23, 2016 9:06 AM
Isn't this what a pre-nup should include? Everyone treats pre-nups like an exit plan for failing marriages, which is why so many women hate the idea... despite the fact that prenups were invented to protect women.
IMO, if marriage is like a business, there should be a business plan, with 1-year, 5-year and 10-year goals. Her replacement car can be included here. THAT is what a working pre-nup should have.
jefe at November 23, 2016 12:07 PM
That's a good question regarding how necessary her trade-in was. If the difference was only 1K, then her existing car was pretty damn new and in excellent shape. You don't often get that close in a trade-in unless you're downgrading.
"You're bored with your car after one year? Sure trade it in, but I'm not financing you being fickle."
He might be an overzealous tightwad, but sounds like she's a piece of work as well.
Treadwell at November 23, 2016 2:39 PM
An unrelated note, but pre-nups are useless when it comes to ending a marriage. All the judge has to do is decide that the pre-nup "isn't fair," based on whatever arbitrary standards he has of fairness, and the contract is void.
Or if the woman testifies that she had even a single drop of alcohol in her system at the time she signed it, the pre-nup is again made void.
Guys, if you think you're going to avoid being taken to the cleaners when your marriage fails by having a pre-nup, you thought wrong.
Don't. Get. Married.
It's as simple as that.
Do not get married. Do not even cohabitate. If you value your house, your car, your income, do not get married and don't cohabitate.
Patrick at November 23, 2016 9:13 PM
She said she needed $1000 MORE, not that she only needed $1000. She could have traded in her her old car, plus a put down a few grand, but still needed another thousand.
The type of financial arrangement that makes sense in a marriage is one that you've both agreed on.
Ahw at November 23, 2016 9:13 PM
The parts of this I am having the most trouble with here are as follows:
"I recently traded in my car"
"I needed $1,000 more for the new one"
"I make my own money"
Why all the "I" statements?
It seems like she wants to be able to make all of her own independent financial decisions without consulting her partner beforehand... and she expects him to finance it after the decision has already been made without getting any input.
If one wants to make unilateral financial decisions then it isn't reasonable to expect someone else to pay for those decisions.
It seems like the partnership only exists after the decisions have been made.
In a real partnership the decisions are made together and then financed together.
Artemis at November 24, 2016 8:21 AM
You straighten this stuff out BEFORE you get married.
My wife of 30 years and I talked before our wedding. I suggested the "big pot approach" where everything earned and inherited by either is put together jointly and we talk about anything consequential. She said ok. Case closed.
Our biggest asset by far (likely 75% of net worth) is her retirement account, hers 100% by law. Guess some guys would be worried, because maybe she could screw me. Not me. We max it out every year. Because we have always exhibited fairness, we trust one another.
Chester White at November 25, 2016 1:52 AM
Like most letters, this one does not have enough information, but is entertaining. My SO hates to talk about money, but I find it very easy to. So I initiate it. I'd hate to be a marriage counselor, because I have such great advice, but my clients would not take it and I'd be frustrated! As an aside, my SO and I have really different backgrounds/histories and I am learning that I have many blind spots that she points out in a loving way. She's making me a better person.
nchappycamper at November 25, 2016 6:44 AM
Is it common in today's marriages for the husband to be treated like "daddy"? (Did leave out "sugar"?)
"He did not offer the money." ????????????
That to me is a very weird phrasing that implies a lot of uncomplimentary things about LW, although Billary shows that there are a lot of "definitions" for marriage so what do I know.
Bob in Texas at November 25, 2016 7:12 AM
"My car isn't working any more, it needs repairs and they aren't worth it. I think we need to get a new car. How much do you think we can afford? Let's go look at cars on Saturday!"
is how the conversation would have gone at the K household.
NicoleK at November 25, 2016 10:34 AM
So, start earning more money. Get a second job. Get a better job. Stop asking your husband or your parents for money.
Pirate Jo at November 27, 2016 10:53 AM
You decided to buy a car you can't afford and expected he must simply throw in the shortfall? WTF? Kudos to your husband for standing up to you and not giving you that $1000 - you should be thankful you have a man who can manage money and is willing to stand up to his partner's attempts to recklessly spend ... stick with him.
Lobster at December 14, 2016 4:07 PM
In my household all income is pooled. Then we have a budget that covers agreed upon expenses. Mortgage, utilities, and such all come out of family money. And it comes out first because it has to be paid no matter what. After that is taken care of we split a fixed amount each month. I get to spend my money on my things and she gets to spend her money on her things. If she spends too much I don't have to bail her out and she doesn't have to take care of my overspending as well. And neither of us gets to criticize the others spending on our personal money.
The we both share one account and spend from it wouldn't work for us. And the we both make and spend our own money really wouldn't work for us either.
Ben at December 15, 2016 1:05 PM
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