"Does it ever work, the relationship between the 45- or 50-year-old woman and the 20-to-25-year-old guy?"

I assume by "work" you mean a loving, committed sexual and romantic relationship that is largely monogamous.

It may "work" in the sense that the guy will have sex with the older woman, and they may get along quite well and enjoy each other's company, but will he stay with her as she gets older still? Such that in his early thirties he will be with her as she approaches sixty?

No. Of course not. And she knows that, hence her writing to you, hoping you will tell her something different.

You can mark the end of this relationship "working" per my above description pretty much when he starts saying, "Hey, time for me to have sex with others. Okay?"

The gal involved should warmly and smilingly enjoy the dying embers of this relationship for a bit longer, and then when she is ready (which should be soon), tell him that their time together was great, but everything must end...

He's started saying that, Spartee. But, says he loves her and wants to be with her.

He says he loves her and wants to be with her? But he now wants to have sex with other people?

Who can say what lies in a person's heart, but my guess is he is simply conflicted. He fears her reaction if he told her the truth, because he genuinely likes her, and does not want to cause her distress.

If he were my son, I would likely tell him that what he is looking for now with this older woman is called friendship. Friendship is what a woman is left with in this case, if she is lucky, when her (much) younger male lover wants to have sex with other people, but still likes her a great deal, and wants to be in her life going forward.

I predict that when the guys' head clears a bit more, and she is over the sadness of mourning this love affair, they will appreciate that friendship, if they still have it.

But the chances of that friendship remaining intact as she watches him lustily pursue hard-bodied twenty-somethings (themselves seeking him as a marital partner), while her heart breaks over his desire for them, are slim.

Given how life plays out for most, he will likely go on to have children, marry a woman his own age, and experience all the things a young man does as he grows into middle age. In sum, he will likely live his life as most men do. And she cannot participate in that life in the way a younger woman could. Bearing children, raising a family, etc. are all behind her now.

Nature is cruel, at times, to her children. Nature is particularly cruel to young men and middle-aged women, I think. (I mean that sincerely.) Both often have a hard time accepting what human sexuality means for their lives and their choices.

So again, does it ever "work"? Perhaps, sometimes, for a time. Long term? Highly, highly unlikely.

I think many if not most people want to try sex with more than one person in their 20's and there's nothing to be gained for her in trying to stop him. If she issues an ultimatum and he acquiesces, he would probably resent it some day if not now and it might be difficult for her to continue trusting him after this has been raised. Can she bear to keep seeing him while he does this or can she bear to wait while he does this and see if he comes back, or does she need to make a clean break now? Only she knows.

The guy is lying. He doesn't "love" her any more -- not in the romantic sense. He wants out of the relationship, period.

But he doesn't have the balls to tell her.

Which is partially a good thing. He cares enough about her to just not coldly dump her. I'm sure he appreciated very much the years of their relationship, but he's ready to move on and looking for a way out.

I would be very insecure in a relationship with a man who was 20-plus years younger than me. (Well, and he'd be ten...)

We have a friend who dated an older woman for a while- he was in his early 30's and she was in her mid-50's. They broke up after a year or so, and the woman he ended up marrying is a few years younger than him. There is another friend who has had a few long-term relationships with women that are slightly older- 5 years or so- he seems to like it that way. I think he prefers a more mature personality. But, he's not out there dating women who are old enough to be his mother. And the ladies are always in really, really good shape.

Oh, and he was only 20 when he started dating her? Of course he's itching to explore!

The guy is lying. He doesn't "love" her any more -- not in the romantic sense. He wants out of the relationship, period.

Maybe, maybe not. The only think that's clear is that he wants to have sex with other people. If she were younger, I'd recommend she try to spice it up at home and see if that does the trick before making a decision. Since she is an older woman whose man wants to experience sex with (I assume) women closer to his own age, that's not going to work. Mrs. Robinson can break up with her cub; she can consent to open up the relationship - and if that's the case I hope she takes advantage of their new status herself; or she can deny there's anything wrong and a)let his sexual frustration destroy what they have, or b)let his cheating destroy what they have.

The relationship will either end, become a drawn out mess, or evolve. Which one it will be depends entirely on the personalities involved.

She's been taking advantage of him, and he's started to realize what the world is actually like. Soon he may wake up a resent her. So she should find some way of ending things while saving face. I suspect that this would be more apparent if the sexes were reversed. Would we really be so considerate of a 50 year old man who'd taken six years from a 20 year old woman?!?

Also this scenario isn't so uncommon. I know a young man who was corralled by a much older woman. He's 24 and she's in her early 40's. She dominated his life for several years and has steered him into marriage, and now lives off of his income. But no amount of manipulation can hide the affects of time, and now they're running into problems.

"Mrs. Robinson can break up with her cub"

A menopausal woman will likely destroy a relationship with her 26 year old lover if she calls him a "cub". I hope the letterwriter knows better, if she wants to remain friends with this guy after the love affair ends.

Paul, the situation you outline sounds darker than this one, but yes, that surely will not end well. This one could, but that likely requires the letterwriter to take a deep breath and accept where this is headed. And then make it easy on both of them as they wind down their sexual relationship, so the young man can get back to building the life he will likely live....without her.

I think that the age thing is a red herring. If the guy is inclined to sleep around it doesn't matter if his significant other is 50 or 25. I'm willing to bet that relationships between younger men and older women have at least the same success rate as between same age couples. The examples given above indicate specific personality defects that are not age related. My wife is 12 years older than me and we've been happily married for 24 years.

They don't allen, they're actually very rare.

Show me your statistics Mel, and then we'll talk. I'm not interested in opinions.

You made claims, too, Allens. Where are your stats?

"I'm willing to bet that relationships between younger men and older women have at least the same success rate as between same age couples."

Terms like "success" and the relevant age difference would need definition, I suppose. How about success = more than ten years together and age difference is +12 years difference?

My guess is Mel is more right than Allen, both in terms of frequency of such pairings relative to older men/younger women and the chances for long term success.

Not sure the age difference is as big of a factor as simply the fact that he hasn't been with anyone else and wants to try some variety. Couples in their 20s who have been together since high school often experience the same thing.

of course the realtionship works, but like everything in this life, it's transitory... and she should know that. A 44 year old woman and a 20 yr old boyo... hopefully it was fun for both of them. 6years of relationship is a nice length, but it sounds like they need to move on to other people.

Age IS soemwhat important to some people, but can we say it was for these two? What is a better predictor is experience. He may go on to find another cougar if that is his taste, but a different one. She may well also find a new boyo. Maybe not quite so young to start with...

But the whole thing about him dating closer to his own age? Maybe yeah, maybe no. If that was the main factor, their relationship wouldn't have lasted so long. Maybe he'll find another 40yr old hot tamale, who he will be on a more equal footing with, now that he has more experience.

There's a lot of ways this one could go, but the first step is probably different directions. Some things last longer than others, but nothing is constant.

Also? If she has been in boyo's life since he was 20? He may not really know how to break up with her, without nuking everything...

Hmm. Be picky and this could work.

Ask Ashton Kutcher.

Really none of the possible scenarios is a good one for her.

Well let me just throw this out as a contrast:

My ex is 12 years younger than I am. At age 41, he's not looking too hot, and I've been told that at age 53, I look younger than he does! BUT - we broke up because of, among other things, his irresponsibility (which he still exhibits to this day). Since our divorce, he's only dated one older woman that I know of, and that lasted maybe a month. He's dated a few younger women, but none of those lasted either. I dated one other guy younger than me, and he was more of a nightmare than my ex, so that ended pretty quickly. The man I'm with now is 2 years older than me, and we both like it that way. I think it has a lot to do with personalities and compatability more than anything else. But that's just me. YMMV.

@Radwaste: Yeah, BUT the gossip rags claim that Ashton and Demi have an "open relationship..."
And most women approaching 50 don't look like Demi More.

I see a lot of "I think" and "I guess". So let me weigh in from the point of view of someone who actually has some experience with this sort of thing.
The first thing that matters is personality and maturity, of both partners. If he is more mature, and she is more fun loving and adventurous, than their age-mates, it helps balance the differences.
Of course it goes without saying that good genes and graceful aging help.
As in *any* relationship, love, teamwork, respect, etc are still very much the bedrock, good sex is not possible without those.
So, given all that, Hell Yes it is just as possible for a woman who is 20 years older than her man to have a successful relationship as it is for a man who is 20 years older. If this was a letter about Catherine Zeta Jones would there even be a debate? Or Jeri Thompson?
My husband and I will be celebrating our 7 th anniversary this year, I am 47, he's 28. He was the first younger man I ever dated, in fact I had just (well, a year or so before) come out of a nasty divorce from a man 14 years older than me. He was very persistent, and I am so very, very glad that he was.

That's great, Kat. But then, it sounds as though this circumstance has the additional factor of the much younger man explaining his interest in having sex with others, which distresses the gal. Given those facts, well, life is properly lived not just as a matter of possibility (maybe I will make the NBA all-star team!), but also probability (highly, highly unlikely I will), and decisions need be made on the basis of considering both possibility and probability.

Per the thoughts regarding AllenS and Mel, I find myself wondering what the stats say.

My guess is when 26-year-olds start pitching an open relationship to their nervous 50-ish girlfriends, the stats say, "Game Soon to Be Over".

A 12-year difference is not comparable to a 25-year one as exemplified in the letter.

Can't believe there is even a debate about this. Of course its over. LW is a middle-aged woman dating a child. LW should be dating men her own age or older if she wants something that lasts.

*sigh*
I'm 20 years older than my husband, Nicole, not 12. And yes, there is a difference between my relationship and the LW, in that my husband had had a life before I met him, had relationships and had grown into himself. I didn't "rob the cradle" as it were.
My main point is that if the genders were reversed, y'all would be patting the guy on the back and saying "you go, boy!" but in my experience, a woman dating a much younger man is always given a hard time, or told to "date someone your own age" *shudder*.
Do you know how boring, stodgy, absolutely awful the guys "my own age" are to me? They don't play video games, or dress in steampunk costumes and go to Comic conventions, or go to Renn faires in garb, or help me set up the new shelves for my BJD's without rolling their eyes. They don't have cool hobbies like playing the Great Pipes in a kilt. Guys my own age tell me to "grow up" when I want to play D&D. Screw that noise. I pay my bills, raised one child to go all the way to her Masters in materials science, and the other will be graduating HS this year. I fulfill my "adult" responsibilities. Why the HELL shouldn't I still have fun? With a good looking, sexy, has-the-same interests fun man?

Kat, I believe Nicole's comment was directed at me. But even so, I did state that I thought personalities had a lot to more to do with it than just age.

I'm pretty much with Snakeman99 here. I also have to question the maturity level of the woman. I mean, really, what 44-year-old woman picks up a college junior for anything more than a fun little sex fling? What could they have possibly had to discuss for six years - the relative merits of The Cure versus Muse? Jimmy Carter versus Barack Obama? Mainframes versus cloud computing?

This guy SHOULD be meeting women approximately his own age, and there's no tragedy in that. In a decade, she'll be practically ready to collect Social Security (if it still exists) while he will still be in his spry middle 30s and probably able to afford all kinds of fun adventures. He'll want to go whitewater rafting and rock climbing while she'll probably prefer scrapbooking and shopping for antiques. When he decides he wants kids - and he may have already decided that - she'll be completely out the window.

This guy probably has warm feelings for his sex instructor of six years, but he's awakened and realized he can be putting those skills to good use banging hot little 20-somethings as he looks for someone with whom he can have a long and activity-filled future.

"My main point is that if the genders were reversed, y'all would be patting the guy on the back and saying "you go, boy!"

I cannot speak for others, but sticking to the letter presented, not the topic more generally, if a 50ish man was writing in, asking what it meant that his 26 year old gal (dating six years...) wanted to have sex with other men, my take would be: game over. Enjoy the memories, dude.

So, in all relationships, if there is the slightest doubt, it's "game over". Don't work it out, or fight for it? I mean, that's like, hard, right? It's not worth sitting down and talking things out, or making and effort to see if there is something else you can do to keep an otherwise good thing going, right?
He's feeling a little itchy. You know what? I bet your wife has looked at a hot guy on the street and said to herself "hmmm". And not done anything about it, because that isn't the be-all and end-all of her existence. The fact that he went to his girlfriend and told her means he wants to work it out. He didn't just trot off and cheat. He has a stake in their relationship, and he wants to work on it. She needs to keep that in mind as she talks to him.
Human nature says we will always look. I think he is living up to her trust by coming to her, instead of stepping out on her to try and work things out.

"So, in all relationships, if there is the slightest doubt, it's 'game over'".

I didn't say that.

Again, if a 50ish person writes in, asking what it meant that his 26 year old s/o (dating six years...) wanted to have sex with other people, my take would be: game over. Enjoy the memories, dude(tte).

That is particularly true where, as here, the 50ish person is apparently threatened by that request and not given to agreement absent the threat of losing the younger lover. Does that sound like a situation that ends well?

I think that spartee is right, and I'm not so sure that a man would get off any easier. People are generally pretty leary of May / December relationships, and especially when the younger person is soo young. If anything women seem to be judged less harshly. Look at all the incidents of teachers having sex with male students. No one even wants to punish them. But if the teacher is a male they want to string him up.

The obvious problem is the difference in ages going forward. When he's in his early 30's she'll be sixty, and then 70 when he's forty. So no kids, no adult life of his own. Maybe he's more mature than we're assuming and has thought about that.

"Not sure the age difference is as big of a factor as simply the fact that he hasn't been with anyone else and wants to try some variety. Couples in their 20s who have been together since high school often experience the same thing."

This is so true and the main issue. I think 20 yr age differences sometimes work if the younger person involved has sewn some wild oats beforehand, which would mean he/she should be in their 30s at least.

From what I've seen and experienced - having been the younger person (by 15 yrs) brought into a relationship at such a young age that I hadn't had had many other experiences - this doesn't usually work out much better when the man is older.

So many male friends have married or dated women 15-20 yrs younger, and it usually never lasts, even when the guy has a lot of money. The rare ones that do start out when both people are older and more experienced (my BIL, for instance, is married to a younger women, but he's in his 60s, and she's in her 40s).

Trying to take a 20-something and convince them that they shouldn't have the sexual experiences that their peers are having - and that you, yourself, probably had - begins to seem quite unfair and unbalanced to the younger person.

It's like the older person is saying, "Oh you don't need to know about that!" even though they themselves screwed around in their youth and probably have very fond memories and even friendly ex-lovers from those times.

Eventually, the younger person will start to feel that they've missed out on those experiences, and, once that happens, it's best to let them go. It's not that he doesn't love her, but he still has some growing to do.

LW needs to accept that he's trying to work it out where he won't hurt her by finding some sort of compromise, which is admirable, but, practically-speaking, there's really no way that he can have the experiences he craves while still being coupled with her.

Open marriage would be the only option, and that would probably be quite hurtful and depressing for the LW - seeing him highly in demand with much younger women while she would rarely be able to attract someone younger. Open marriages usually involve couple-swaps and they tend to be around the same age (mate to mate).

Juliet Mills and Maxwell Caufield have managed to make it work for over 30 years.

I think that everyone is avoiding the likelihood that they both have issues. What woman in her 40's is going to want to be in a 'relationship' with a 20 year old boy? What boy that age wants to be with a 50 year old woman? Any time that I've seen this kind of set-up, it's been a very weird and creepy thing.

Here's a clue folks, when it happens in hollywood, it's for publicity. Demi Moore is with Ashton Kutcher because he's gay. She doesn't look anything like her picture. The whole thing is a put on.

The fact that he went to his girlfriend and told her means he wants to work it out."

Or, he wants out, and is starting to crack open that door. You know, a "your cat is in a tree and we can't get it down" sort of thing. Very few people- and I rather doubt a 26 year old- can know enough what they want and why to say "I love you and the time we've had, but it's time for us to part". Beating around the bush is much more common. There's a misconception it's less cruel that being direct.

The original question Amy asks is
Does it ever work, the relationship between the 45- or 50-year-old woman and the 20-to-25-year-old guy?

And in my reply I give a solid, I have seen it work, YES.
Your examples, on the other hand, are based on your biases, sexist, agist or otherwise. I mean, really, So no kids, no adult life of his own. Maybe he's more mature than we're assuming and has thought about that. No adult life of his own? WTF do you call what he has now? Do you think she keeps him in a box and just takes him out for special occasions? Do you think my husband doesn't have a job, friends, hobbies? Seriously.
And this gem:
If anything women seem to be judged less harshly. Look at all the incidents of teachers having sex with male students. No one even wants to punish them. But if the teacher is a male they want to string him up.
Oh, no you did not just compare a relationship between 2 consenting adults to a pedophile preying on children. Because there is no, I repeat NO, comparison.

As for this
Eventually, the younger person will start to feel that they've missed out on those experiences, and, once that happens, it's best to let them go. It's not that he doesn't love her, but he still has some growing to do.
Ok, how about:
Eventually, the older person will start to feel that they've been saddled with too much responsibility, and, once that happens, it's best to let them go. It's not that she doesn't love him, but he still has some growing to do.
Because, you can justify leaving any relationship if you try hard enough.

What Amy was asking wasn't "Should this marriage/relationship/whatever be saved" because we don't have enough data for that. She was asking if it *ever* works, and in my case, and others that I know, it does. When I'm 80, and my hubby is still chasing me around the house (He promised me a rocket powered scooter chair!) I will remember y'all and... wait, no I won't.

Kat, I do hope it works out for you. There are exceptions to every rule. And I suppose it really depends on the definition of "work". I think we're taking that to mean lasting forever, rather than enjoying the moment with someone.

I was only trying to share the side of the young man in this scenario because I was in his place myself. I started feeling like I'd missed out on being with other men and having those experiences. I became extremely curious about what it would be like.

True, I wasn't very mature or happy in my relationship in general, so perhaps it would've been different otherwise. But I recall wanting to have the freedom to date, and becoming very envious of my single friends who could, and lustful towards almost every cute man I saw - wondering, with my limited experience, what they'd be like in bed. There were days when all I did was fantasize.

And it wasn't that my husband wasn't technically proficient in bed. It just came to a point where he no longer turned me on physically. Not just because he was older - there were other issues - but his being older was certainly a factor, starting when he was around 50 and I was only 35.

Our friends and interests started to be vastly different then. I grew tired of sitting around listening to older men tell golf stories, talk business, and detail their various ailments. I felt way too young to be living that old yet!

After my divorce, I dated a very nice guy who was 12 years younger, and though we had so much fun, I felt uncomfortable with the age difference. Sure, it was great at that moment, but I could imagine him feeling the way I did once I turned 50 and he'd be only 38.

If the LW's boyfriend was content and wasn't asking to have these experiences, it would be different, but he is clearly where I was back in my marriage. You don't ask to sleep with other people if you're truly happy.

I know exactly what he's doing. He's trying to find a compromise, thinking that a fling or two will solve it - allow him to keep the good parts of his relationship with her, while fulfilling his physical desire to be with someone closer in age - but once he gets a taste of the kind of physical passion he's missing, he likely will be gone anyway. So, she should let him go.

He's feeling a little itchy. You know what? I bet your wife has looked at a hot guy on the street and said to herself "hmmm". And not done anything about it, because that isn't the be-all and end-all of her existence. The fact that he went to his girlfriend and told her means he wants to work it out. He didn't just trot off and cheat. He has a stake in their relationship, and he wants to work on it. She needs to keep that in mind as she talks to him.

I spent 13 years with my lady, until she passed. She was 15 years older than me. Granted I was 27 at the time and ex-USAF with some overseas tours under my belt. (Read: I know what the inside of a whorehouse smells like.)

Somewhere in there we had a conversation that sounds similar to what is described by the LW. I said some things not deliberately hurtful, but it put us into a position to have a frank talk.

Basically we had done the same things the same way for a long time. She asked me to make a few changes. She also made a few changes. Things as simple as when I made it home from work, on occasion, she would be wearing heels, hose and nice lingerie. Dinner would be served late those nights. :-D

As Kat pointed out -- the good news is he hasn't just gone and done it.

My caveat on this is the start at 20 may say it is doomed. The difference between 18, 20, and 25 can be significant. After 25 the changes and personality have "stabilized", in a general sense.

So I won't say doomed -- but the LW needs a frank talk with the S/O to find out why he is looking around and/or thinking this.

The problem is he hasn't fucked around. I remember how in love I was with someone but I wanted to fuck around. So glad when he broke up with me. I fucked around like crazy.

lol, Ppen.

The things is, aging is very strange and inevitable. I met my ex when I was 19 and he was 34. Now, the same age difference existed, but, physically, between two people of those ages, there aren't a lot of visible differences yet.

Yet, people begin to age a lot in their 40s and certainly their 50s. I think this is generally even worse for women. There starts to be a lot more wrinkling, sagging, and just a general change in appearance. The physical chasm widens, and that absolutely effects sex.

My ex is now in his 60s and I'm in my 40s. Lately, whenever I see him, I'm shocked at how much older he looks. I don't say that to be mean because I still care a great deal for him, but I also know that if we had met today - if he came up to me in a bar - there's no way I would even date him, much less marry him. And this was a man I found dazzling at 19.

So, it's really hard to predict in your 20s how aging will effect the relationship, and the sexual attraction/dynamics, but, in general, the odds are against the younger person still finding the older person sexually attractive...which would be tolerable if they were older too and had basically the same issues, sharing the same stage of life...but they're not.

Especially when the younger person is already voicing a need to experience sex with others his own age, the odds are extremely low that this relationship will last long-term...even if she puts on her best teddie and high heels. She can only play Mrs Robinson for so long.

The age question is interesting, but I think it's secondary in this case.

When your monogamous partner tells you he/she wants to start sleeping with other people--and maybe this guy is looking at other 50-year-olds; who knows?--that is a death knell. If you say no, cheating and/or a break-up will follow. Hell, it will probably happen as soon as he sleeps with someone new that he really likes.

I'd say rarely (and statistically, no.)

This discussion came up on another blog and nobody could think of any marriage lasting where the woman was more than three years older than the man. That doesn't mean there aren't, there are, but they really are rare.

As for the other way around, I think a big age disparity works if the woman has children with the man. I do wonder if that plays a factor when women are older.

With all due respect, you never looked.
From the first page of googling:
http://www.mental-health-matters.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=455

Joe, a mere three years? Seriously? I know many successful couples in which the woman is older than that.

FWIW, my own mother is 16 years older than her husband, and they have been together happily for 16 years. My grandmother was 12 years older than my grandfather. He loved her devotedly, escorted her into dotage (she had Alzheimer's), and was her full-time carer until she died. He said he couldn't live without her and thereafter declined swiftly himself, refusing treatment for his cancer, dying at 80.

Not sure if anyone is paying attention anymore, but here is another link for your edification
http://www.webmd.com/sex-relationships/guide/older-woman-younger-man-relationships
I really have to say to those knee-jerk "It can't work" types, do you have the same reaction to couples who come from different races, or cultures, or maybe are the same sex? Because your attitudes are pretty much the same as the people who object to those types of marriages. What ever happened to letting adults choose what is best for themselves, being happy that they actually found someone, and being, you know, supportive?
I have 2 daughters, one is married to a great guy, one is gay. I don't go around giving the one "atta-girls" and the other a hard time because she doesn't conform to the societal norm. I just want her to be happy, and hope that whoever she finds as a lifemate will be a good person and treat her well.