Cute.

But if anyone was hoping that the TSA wouldn't still be at the airports, they'll be there. Government's going to give them IOUs.

And of course, the government always makes good on their debts to the American people, right?

Pass the popcorn. I intend to enjoy this.

Down in DC, going by how traffic is, you wouldn't tell anything was shut down. It's a joke here, they consider everyone essential.

Don't worry, there is always state and local gov'ts to spy on you via ALPR and closed circuit cameras!

Also, Facebook.

Well, I hope they're all back soon. I'm flying home for Thanksgiving. I wanna get sexually molested at the airport, goddamnit!

Nick Gillespie (Reason) on why Obama bears the burden of responsbility here - despite John Boehner and Harry Reid being worse than useless.

http://reason.com/archives/2013/10/01/let-us-be-clear-obama-deserves-chief-res

"...you didn't make sure to get a spending plan in place when there was more time to screw around. [...] Like a head-in-the-clouds grad-school layabout, you yourself were late on just about everything too, such as Obamacare deadlines and this year's budget plan. Think about it: You became unpopular enough that Americans were willing to vote back into partial power the same team that gave us the goddamn Bush years."

Gingrich advises the GOP not to give in, but conceding that the Republicans have now lost the next election cycle. (And if anyone's an authority on the backlash of government shutdowns, it's Newt.)

Bad advice, though. Give it up and let it go forward. Let the chips fall as they may.

>i>If 900,000 federal workers can be furloughed as "non-essential," why employ them?

So they can later say they "created jobs" and then blame the *insert your favorite political party to hate on* for costing those people their jobs.

Gingrich advises the GOP not to give in....

When it comes to government shut downs, the Republicans should listen to what Newt Gingrich says ... and do the opposite.

While Professor Gingrich is still one of the smartest guys in the political arena, his record of overreaching in government shut downs speaks for itself.

Conan: thanks for that Reason.com link!! That piece is fantastic. And I like that it doesn't let either party off the hook. :-)

Oh, and to anyone with a healthy sense of humor: I absolutely recommend you look up the comments at the Ace of Spades blog's Overnight Open Thread last night. Their comments on how the world is ending thanks to the Fed shutdown are incredibly funny. :-)

I remember having a government...just like it was yesterday!

Policy is complicated. Libertarian Republicans have decided after long observation and thought that a small set of principles guide public policy to the correct path. Spend a lot less through government, reduce the federal payroll, regulate only what is absolutely necessary in business, and remove government mandates like Obamacare which increase the costs of health care, hiring, and working. I agree.

The worst part of Republican infighting is that it suggests to many undecided voters that Republicans are hacks and a free market philosophy merely hides their heartlessness.

A large middle of independents sit on the fence. The Left says that if government spends less money, it will kill private sector jobs through lack of Keynesian demand. Government workers don't want to be fired. People like the idea of a protective government, and 40% of the public gets a government check. Why should they believe that they would be better off without big government? Why not tax the rich? Why not go on as before?

Leftist politicians proclaim attractive goals and principles as if they were possible, and argue through emotion. They say anything and fight for every inch. They present a vision of a glorious future. They fight for that future with conviction, not daunted by the contradictions and idiocies which they proclaim, not daunted by the poor "short term" 5 year results. They make aggressive moves toward their goals and then compromise on how much they win.

The Republican opposition shows fear. They want a better future within the bounds of morality and reality, but they don't act like this is supremely important. They say that reality requires conservative policies, and then they make compromises which ignore that reality. This makes them appear opportunistic, trading away the results which they say are necessary. They compromise on how much they lose.

If Conservative and Libertarian policies are good for almost everyone, then why don't Republicans act like it? An observer on the fence can infer that Republicans don't really believe in the reality they describe. For example, they started a fight over the debt ceiling before. They said correctly that increased debt is dangerous to the productivity and living standard of our country. They said that spending must be controlled, and correctly that the disruption from a temporary government default was worth it, because otherwise we would face higher taxes and a lowered living standard.

It is not enough to have a good policy, one must fight for that policy as if it were actually good. People judge conviction as much as the facts.

EasyOpinions

I wish I was in DC today with these guys!

http://blog.gulflive.com/mississippi-press-news/2013/10/honor_flight_vets_arrive_at_wo.html

Conan: When it comes to government shut downs, the Republicans should listen to what Newt Gingrich says ... and do the opposite.

Oh, good. Conan and I agree on something. Someone, call Ripley's.

Seriously, I got a good chuckle out of this line, and I agree that Gingrich overreaches during shutdowns, not to mention his reasons for starting them.

I understand there's more to his rationale besides being forced to sit at the back of Air Force One during a trip to the Israeli Prime Minister's funeral, but even his lickspittles in the New York Post managed to characterize it that way.

(As an aside, why the hell did the President, Vice President, and the Speaker of the House ride the same plane?

I don't even know who would be President if God forbid, that plane was shot down!)

"If Conservative and Libertarian policies are good for almost everyone, then why don't Republicans act like it?"

Because when they do, they lose elections.

Because the press, is a wholy owned subsidiary of the democratic party,

And will demonize them for wanting to take away Grandma's medicare and social security.

Where have you been for the last thirty years Andrew?

This is the reason Obamacare was structured the way it was. Designed to hammer the young who dont vote in sufficient numbers for the dems to care about them, and the Medicare costs and benefits look ok on paper, until they get sucked into a system, that will be defacto rationing to control costs.

This is where the medical device tax comes in on pacemakers hearing aids, hip replacements.

I am NOT authorized to speak for my company, Savannah River Remediation, a contractor for the Department of Energy at Savannah River Site.

That said, I recommend you take a look at http://www.srs.gov.

Why?

We process radioactive waste, and we have to stop that in the next few days.

Do you think it might be important to process radioactive waste?

My point is that "government shutdown" does not simply mean "office workers with dubious purpose stay home".

As time goes by, we MAY not have anyone to meet Federal and State legal and regulatory requirements. Enjoy that thought.

@Andrew, when talking about convictions, remember how many Obama supporters got waivers for Obamacare. Nope it is as Isab said they have the press as their wholy owned subsidiary, even doing wire tapping on them didn't budge their slavish adoration.

Kudos to JFP on the vets story. I hope it works its way out to the public and they realize what it really meant. The memorial is an open air walkable monument. open 24/7, because there is nothing to close about it. But to make people "miss" gov't, the gov't does the dick move of barricading it and posting guards to prevent people.

Not having tour guides (many are volunteers) or turning off lights would be one thing, but this is having more gov't people doing jobs they never do before just to be dicks.

"My point is that "government shutdown" does not simply mean "office workers with dubious purpose stay home"."

Actually they are the ones at work. They have picked anc chosen what is essential based on political theatre not any rational basis. So Presidential shoe shiner would be essential, as would both calligraphers, as would TSA, but not those anyone would consider actually useful.

The thing that gets me is Obama was willing to sign the military funding bill but is now refusing to sign the vets payment bill.

That shows me that he (and Reid) is playing as much a political game as the Republicans.

But I'd rather have the Republicans win. The [un]Affordable Care Act is a disaster for the economy, working poor, the 40 hour work week, and just so much else.

What Joe says is correct.

For example, my husband is Chief Engineer in charge of all construction and maintenance on a large Air force base in Asia.

Is he mission essential? Well, no, as the Air force defines it, he is not.

This means they can get along without him for a while, or at least until the lighting system fails on the runway. :-)

I don't even know who would be President if God forbid, that plane was shot down!)

Patrick Leahy, if I remember my succession correctly.

I just took six different flights and the TSA had announcements posted in several of the airports, listing the rights of the TSA workers!

Talk about a clueless bunch of sycophantic tax-fattened leeches.

"Because the press, is a wholy owned subsidiary of the democratic party, "

Like Fox News, owned and operated by a foreign billionaire, for instance. Bunch of lousy Democrats.

Because the press, is a wholy owned subsidiary of the democratic party, "

Like Fox News, owned and operated by a foreign billionaire, for instance. Bunch of lousy Democrats.

Posted by: Gog_Magog_Carpet_Reclaimers at October 1, 2013 6:43 PM

Fox doesn't even come close to making up for the five other networks that are in the tank for Obama. Not even close to parity or any kind of fair and balanced on US TV.

I just took six different flights and the TSA had announcements posted in several of the airports, listing the rights of the TSA workers!

Talk about a clueless bunch of sycophantic tax-fattened leeches.

Posted by: Gog_Magog_Carpet_Reclaimers at October 1, 2013 6:41 PM

Gog, all those TSA workers are your " public employee Union buddies"

And those signs are required by law, when you have union labor on a job site.

Isab, you're still in the military. You don't pay taxes.

You live off of mine, and when you're done sitting on your ass for 20 years, you'll retire and let the real Americans pay you for the rest of your life - and provide you with medical care.

Leeches. You're everywhere these days.

You live off of mine, and when you're done sitting on your ass for 20 years, you'll retire and let the real Americans pay you for the rest of your life - and provide you with medical care.

Leeches. You're everywhere these days. -- Gog_Magog_Carpet_Reclaimers at October 1, 2013 8:35 PM

The "survival" rate to 20+ years is hard because both of the parties plays with the military like a cat plays with a mouse.

I know I pay for retirees, but making it to that requires skill.

I will also argue the other side that there should be only about 300K active duty military that we should have to pay for, and the rest should be state's militia. But that is a separate argument.

Oh, gee. Trolling...

I am always amused that anyone thinks a military is "leeches". Clearly, they cannot read. History teaches what happens to a society that abandons the idea of defending itself. We're apparently pretty effective at indoctrinating the public that surrender should be your first choice when a thug appears. So, why not adopt that stance for the entire nation? It's just so hard to maintain a defense!

There is waste in every human endeavor, and there is now a system in place which misuses American military power continuously (thank you, Commander-in-Chief).

It is also easy to see that some people think that in the event of some crisis, a response can be miraculously generated from nothing. The services have always paid for their successes with budget and manpower cuts. I suppose that's what you want, Gog, but I dunno why you're so hot about it.

Painting with such a broad brush is simply shallow, and not indicative of any serious thought.

-------------

In other news, I see that the "shutdown" has sent only about a third of the government home. What are the other two-thirds being paid?

How long ago did the military not pay taxes? I'm wondering if I can get a refund, because they took them out of my pay check. Back when the ships were wood...

Thanks, Rad, I was happy to defend my country from the hordes of Vietnamese attempting to invade us.

I'm sure you're proud of your service as well.

"I don't even know who would be President if God forbid, that plane was shot down!"

God forbid, I think it would be Eric Holder.

"Down in DC, going by how traffic is, you wouldn't tell anything was shut down. It's a joke here, they consider everyone essential. " ...and... "This means they can get along without him for a while, or at least until the lighting system fails on the runway."

Yes, that's the way these things always work out. Washington, other than the inconvenience to tourists, is hardly effected, while it's the government facilities (mostly military bases) out in flyover country that get slammed. And don't forget, most of these people have already lost 8 days' pay this year due to sequestration.

"Isab, you're still in the military. You don't pay taxes"

You are sadly mistaken. I havent been in the military since 1987, and I have no retirement.

The last year my husband and I were in the army, we paid 16,000 in Federal income taxes alone on less than 50k worth of taxable income. Do the math on that one.

Isab - My bad, I thought you were a lifer!

Anyway - back to the government shutdown:

The House may have been drunk on the job.

"Isab, you're still in the military. You don't pay taxes."

Bull shite. Military people pay taxes. My E-4 son currently pays taxes on the income he is lucky to get during the shut down. From 1987 to 1999 I paid taxes, Federal and State. I even paid my taxes during the LAST shutdown where I didn't have any money coming in and almost got evicted.

"'I don't even know who would be President if God forbid, that plane was shot down!)'

Patrick Leahy, if I remember my succession correctly."

Correct, if he chooses to resign from the Senate to do so. If not, it goes to John Kerry, then Jack Lew, Chuck Hagel, and only then Eric Holder.

"Thanks, Rad, I was happy to defend my country from the hordes of Vietnamese attempting to invade us."

Ah. One of the many misuses. No wonder you're, um, stained.

silverpie, thanks for the correction. I knew I should have looked up the succession order. It's pretty long, but the first few are: Vice President, Speaker of the House, President Pro Temp of the Senate, Secretary of State. Attorney General is 7th. An interesting bit I note is that the Secretary of the Interior is normally 8th, but that office is currently held by Sally Jewel, a naturalized citizen and therefore ineligible to hold the office of President.