Oh, so that's who put her cold feet on my legs last night...

What's the difference between this and allowing the police to investigate misconduct in their own organization?

"The side agreement, known as "separate arrangement 2," diverges from normal procedures, AP reported, by allowing Iran to employ its own experts and equipment in the search for evidence of activities it has consistently denied: trying to develop nuclear weapons."

http://www.voanews.com/content/reported-nuclear-side-deal-allows-iran-to-conduct-self-inspections/2925137.html

These wonderful, compassionate Fox News viewers have decided to weigh in on Jimmy Carter's announcement that brain cancer has spread thoughout his body.

And what's this? Debbie Schlussel, of whom Amy and Crid are both fans, has tweeted, "A cancer has a cancer. Oops, I mean Jimmy Carter has cancer. Same diff."

Patrick; I'm with you on that - mocking Carter's cancer is disgusting.

Sadly, this isn't the first time and won't be the last time for such behavior.

I remember several folks who were thrilled when Reagan was shot "Good, he deserved it!"; and when he and Thatcher died there were also shouts of joy. "Ding dong, the witch is dead!" was heard when Thatcher passed away.

Today with social media making it even easier for folks to show their lack of compassion and flash everyone with their boorish behavior I suspect we will see even more such nonsense.

I think Carter was the second worst president in modern times (Obama being the worst by far), and I think it was completely unethical behavior of his grandson to make a recording of Romney's 47% remark - which he then edited! But, even so I wouldn't wish him cancer nor would I take glee in his illness.

charles: I think Carter was the second worst president in modern times (Obama being the worst by far)

I would love to know by what criteria you judge presidents.

Patrick, how old were you in the '70's and where were you.

I remember and was there. Obama is not as bad Carter 'cause in my opinion Carter set up the Middle East travesty by destroying the CIA, not making self-sufficiency in gas/oil a priority (oil embargo), personally botching a rescue attempt by micro-managing, and other things I don't feel like remembering. The entire country drew in a breath of fresh air when he left.

Obama has tried and failed in many things but Carter succeeded is doing a lot of long-term damage.

Well, Debbie Schlussel is enjoying the attention. She's on Twitter, keeping track of the number of times she's been called a "cunt."

Bob, in September of 1970, I turned five years old.

I think really, really, really not liking Jimmy Carter is a bit of an overstatement. His life, post-presidency, has been exemplary. How many people can say that they built homes for the needy to their 90th year?

I only started paying attention to politics in the late 90's when I turned 18.

And only REALLY started paying attention in the mid 00's.

And from what I've read Carter is definitely in the top 5 worst presidents ever.

But, probably the best post president we've ever had, even considering his anti Israeli stance.

As a President, he was terrible. As a humanitarian, a very good guy. Seems to be a very likeable guy, by accounts. I can't fathom people saying such filth, and I sincerely hope it doesn't get back to him or his family. All Fox comments are by far the worst of the news boards, and all the news boards are bad but Fox has a special crop of filthy bards. If they would like their news to be considered more fair and balanced, they should disable the comments board.

Carter:

• made a terrible mess of the economy, and then told people they had to suck it up!


• Carter messed up the Iranian situation, then had the botched rescue mission, because in addition to what Bob in TX said, Carter cut a lot of the funding to military and others needed to do their job.


• Carter made threats to remove US support for the Republic of Korea in a stupid attempt to demand "human rights" for Koreans; while ignoring North Korea's own violation of human rights.


• Jumped at the chance to redeem his presidency by "normalizing" relations between the US and the People's Republic of China. While this was something that was going to happen sooner or later; he could have gotten more out of China than he did. He could have pushed for a "Two China" policy instead of throwing the Republic of China (Taiwan) under the bus by cutting off all official diplomatic relations with the ROC.


• Carter did succeed in helping to create a peace, however tenuous it might be, between Egypt and Israel.


• Carter has been a wonderful humanitarian by helping to bring attention to Habitat for Humanity.

• has fucked up the economy worse than Carter. I say worse because the unemployment numbers under Obama are not reported the same as under Carter - it was Carter that changed the way the Dept. of Labor counts unemployment because the numbers made him look bad. But, the new way of counting didn't take effect until after he was gone.


• is the food stamp president; food stamp recipients have increased 80% under his watch. This isn't generosity, these are people who have had their incomes shrink under his administration.


• created the monster called Obamacare - totally fucks with the job market, totally fucks with your health insurance, and ultimately it will totally fuck with your health by making some forms of healthcare unavailable or unaffordable.


• has insulted allies, while bowing to Saudi Kings and kissing ass of enemies.


• has created a greater divide between blacks and other Americans. This isn't just referring to his stupid rhetoric; see the items about food stamps and unemployment. Blacks and other disadvantaged minorities have become economically worse off under the Obama administration.


• has run up a HUGE federal deficit. Under Obama, and no other modern President, have US treasury bonds been downgraded. Downgraded! This might not sound like much going from AAA to AA+; but it IS a big deal. The U.S. since World War II has never NOT been at the top rating. And now there are other entities rated higher than the US. This isn't just an "ego" thing; there could be long term effects to this downgrade that we have not yet experienced.


• has made more excuses than any other President in my memory. Is a longer way from Truman's "the buck stops here" than any other President.


• has thrown more people, supposed political allies, under the bus than any one else I can remember. Just see my comment in the next of Amy's posts about how many younger people are in the Republican party compared to the Democrats. Obama hasn't done much to prepare his own party for post-Obama.


• has taken Carter's messed up Middle-East and made it worse! For example, the "deal" made with Iran. This deal isn't just a bad deal; it is something that could help the Iranians to follow through on their desire to "wipe Israel off the map." It is too obvious a reason why some many pundits are calling Obama the new Chamberlain.


• While other President's may have intense dislikes (or even hatred) for certain journalists; I don't remember any president picking a fight with individual journalists or even whole networks the way Obama has. It is petty shit and should be below the President's office.


• All politicians (and celebrities too) have a higher than usual self-esteem, Obama is just plain a self-absorbed, egotistical, anti-social, psychotic, narcissist. Everything is about HIM, and others don't matter. Trayvon could have been HIS son, Dr. Gates was HIS friend (although it was the cop while at the White house Press conference who helped Dr. Gates, who walks with a cane, walk up the stairs while Obama swaggered up to the Podium to be the first to talk after the "beer summit" ignoring his "friend" Dr. Gates struggling to walk), He has been caught numerous times making the obscene middle-finger gesture to political opponents. While this last act of narcissism is always done slyly there is no doubt as to what he is doing. Only a third-grader, or a narcissist, engages in such childish behavior - not the President of the US.

Now, that, Patrick, is just stuff I can remember off the top of my head.

Yes, Carter has been a wonderful post-president; but, that doesn't mean that his administration was successful. I also think he is a nice guy; but, that doesn't redeem his presidency.

Obama? I have not got one single nice thing to say about him. Oh, maybe he is the first black president? He "won" the Nobel Peace prize? His kids might be nice? Okay, when forced to think of something nice I can do it; but, those nice things aren't much are they?

P.S. sorry for the long rambling rant; but, I have never disliked a president as much as Obama; not just because of what his policies are, but, because of the long-term damage and threat to the U.S. he has helped to create.

While I agree with the points you made, Charles, I can't help but think some of them are petty. Yes, Obama has a not-so-endearing habit of weighing in on matters that should be beneath his notice, such as Dr. Gates altercation with the Concord Police Department, Trayvon Martin, Michael Brown -- will the man ever learn to shut up and let the authorities deal with this, since it's their job, not his?

But does his habit of weighing on matters left to local law enforcement really affect his job as President? I would say not. But if we're talking about recent presidents, let's make the case for W.

1. Created 1.1 million jobs in eight years. That is the worst rate of job creation since Hoover.

2. Broke his campaign promise not to touch Social Security funding, and that only took him six months.

3. Turned an inherited surplus into a deficit.

4. Started two wars of choice, the longest in U.S. history.

5. Ignored repeated warnings leading to the worst terrorist attack on American soil in history.

6. Here's what Bush inherited:

a) 4% unemployment,
b) $200 billion budget surplus,
c) A stock market that had tripled in value over the previous 8 years,
d) The best rate of job creation in history (22 million new jobs in 8 years).

Here's what he left us with:

a) almost 10% unemployment,
b) trillion dollar budget deficit,
c) CRASH!
d) Worst job creation since Hoover.

7. Ignored Katrina.

8. Used coercive pressures on the EPA to issue a statement that the air was safe to breathe at ground zero following 9/11, when in fact, the EPA had discovered unsafe levels of toxins, such as asbestos.

9. Used two wars to impoverish America and enrich their friends.

Yes, I agree Obama is an asshole, but compared to Bush's transparently self-serving agenda, I don't see how any president in the last fifty years could compare as far as long-term damage to the U.S.

Some people are immature, and celebrate putting down someone with differing views than their own. These people celebrate Carters cancer return, called Palin a cunt, called Bush Hitler, state they want to smear their period blood on people, make fun of a tv personality's looks while her mentally ill daughter is missing,.....this immature person happens to work for Fox. SO what?

It has little to do with political party affiliation, or even with the US. Read up about contests between the tories and whigs sometime. Their insults make us look tame.

Did Bush ignore Katrina? I don't remember it that way. The only reason Katrina was made such a big deal is it affected people literally incapable of doing anything for themselves, even getting to a shelter-the obvious and expected outcome of government treating them like kids for generations. Obama ignored the floods in the Midwest. He could, because these people take care of themselves, and the news companies pretty much ignore the center of the country.

What a surprise! Obama is OK, because… Bush!

Predictable: the Two Wrongs fallacy, again.

Again, Rad, you cite logical fallacies that do not apply. Again, you should leave the logical fallacies shtick of yours because you have no idea what you're talking about.

Did I announce of even imply a premise that "Obama is OK"? No, I did not. My premise was that out of the presidents in the last fifty years, Bush was worse than Obama.

Does this imply that Obama is good or OK? No, it does not. It is only to stay that Bush was worse than Obama. Obama can still be terrible. I'm only arguing that Bush was worse.

So, AGAIN, a misapplication of logical fallacies, because, AGAIN, you don't know what the fuck you're talking about.

"Ignored Katrina"

What would you have had him do? The New Orleans city government and the Louisiana state government were criminally negligent. They sat on their asses, literally, and waited for the feds to ride to their rescue. They had resources to evacuate people, but didn't use them. And besides, the damage in New Orleans was nothing compared to Biloxi and Gulfport, which were on the east side of the storm and were hit with Cat 5 winds and 20-foot storm surges. But because those cities are in Mississippi, and because they took care of their own, the media ignored them.

Also: Katrina, indirectly, did New Orleans a huge favor. It was sort of a natural urban renewal, and it encouraged a lot of the scummier residents to go elsewhere. I was there last year, and the city is vastly improved over the New Orleans that I remember from the 1980s.

Patrick - if you ever read a tutorial on them, you'd know.

You don't.

What other purpose can an Obama supporter have for talking about "W", than making their guy look better?

You're Obama's girl. You defend your man. You offer Bush time and again specifically to counter insults to Obama.

If you were NOT applying "two wrongs", you would instead compare the achievements of any President to what could have been done during their administration, with extra credit being available for distinguishing between the duties of the President and those of Congress, and/or for noting what economic situations occurred during a Presidency that no sane person would suggest was his doing (ex: dot-com boom). That part should be easy - unless one thinks that one's President is personally responsible for everything.

Hey. You're out. You should celibrate being out.

Maybe you forgot:

"Yes, I agree Obama is an asshole, but compared to Bush's transparently self-serving agenda, I don't see how any president in the last fifty years could compare as far as long-term damage to the U.S."

Yep. Bush is worse. Why was that offered? To say that Obama is better.

That's all. Well, the implication that Bush had a "self-serving agenda" and Obama does not is a bellywhopper, but... damn.

Also, the Camp David accords had a lot less to do with Carter and a lot more to do with Anwar Sadat, who was determined to modernize Egypt and had, after the Yom Kippur War, realized the futility of trying to defeat Israel. (It was Sadat's assassination in 1981 that set the Middle East onto the backwards trajectory that it has been on ever since.) Carter insisted that the Soviet Union and its puppet government in Syria should have a role, which Sadat rejected. Had Carter gotten his way, Israel would have pulled out.

Carter's other "contribution" to the process was his promotion of Yassir Arafat, who before then was regarded as a common thug. Carter put a sheen of respectibility on him, giving him a free hand in the Palistinean territories, and thereby creating the whole Palistinean "cause" and everything that has happened with it since. This was only five years after Arafat had helped plan and execute the Black September terrorist murders at the 1972 Olympics. The most charitable thing I can say about Carter regarding this is that he was a terrible judge of character.

Rad, you already know you lost this one. You switched gears in mid-stream.

You insisted I committed the fallacy of "two wrongs making a right." To commit this fallacy, I would have to be saying that Obama is "right." I didn't and never did. Would it surprise you to know I never voted for him? It's true. I never did. And I wouldn't. I find Obama's connections to be very disturbing. And I think that if he were a white person who, for instance, attended the church services of a blatant racist, he would never have been elected. In fact, he never would have been the democratic nominee.

But Obama is a member of a congregation whose pastor is a blatant and unapologetic racist. But because of the pervading double-standard, that makes it okay. To say nothing of the fact that he had his political career launched in the home of Bill Ayers.

The fallacy being committed is by you, and it's called "straw man," meaning that you misrepresent your opponent's position, then attack the misrepresented position.

First you accused me of saying "Obama is OK, because Bush." That's a verbatim quote. And it's a misrepresented position. I never Obama was OK. I said Bush was worse. Worse being a relative term. I could say both are bad, but Bush is the worse of the two.

So, realizing that you failed, you decided to revise your tactic. "Yep. Bush is worse. Why was that offered? To say that Obama is better."

Yes, I am saying Obama is better than Bush, but that is not to imply that Obama is "okay." I am not committing a fallacy of "two wrongs make a right" unless I am saying that Obama is "right," which I am not. Moreover, I would have to be saying that Bush somehow makes Obama "right" to be committing this fallacy.

I am not.

Say, if I were grading the two presidents and I gave Obama a D+ as President, but gave Bush a D-. Is that saying that Obama is "OK" or "right"? No, that would be saying that they both suck, but Obama sucks less, hence is better than Bush.

And yes, I do believe that Bush's agenda is transparently self-serving. His administration doctored intelligence to push a completely unjustifiable invasion of Iraq for the sole purpose of enriching his cronies. That's pretty damned brazen. Over 4000 of our troops dead, to say nothing of the Iraqis killed or displaced...all so Halliburton and company could get rich(er).

Does Obama have a self-serving agenda? Perhaps he does but at least serving his agenda doesn't involve bankrupting the nation, which Bush beat him to anyway.

And as far as your grade when it comes to assessing logical fallacies, Rad? You get a solid F.

And by the way, I did not take kindly to your calling me Obama's "girl." Kindly keep your fucking filthy homophobic slurs to yourself, asshole. I've seen your pictures, Rad, on Facebook, and all I can say is, if I'm any kind of "girl," then you must be a three-year-old girl in a frilly pink dress with pink hair ribbons and an oversized lollipop.