This was a real problem for ING bank in the last years of its life (by that identity). Their marketing and incidental advertising (messages on telephone hold, website) was so hip, so attuned, so ironic and so goddamn smarmy that there was no way to know what they were trying to communicate.

Or whether or not you were overdrawn.

Their marketing and incidental advertising (messages on telephone hold, website) was so hip, so attuned, so ironic and so goddamn smarmy that there was no way to know what they were trying to communicate. ~ Crid at December 1, 2017 10:56 PM

I read David Ogilvy's Ogilvy on Advertising years back. In it, he cautions that advertising can sometimes become so enamored of being hip and edgy, that it forgets to focus on the actual product.

Creativity is sometimes the enemy of communication.

...there was no way to know what they were trying to communicate.

Or whether or not you were overdrawn.

Crid at December 1, 2017 10:56 PM

I hate bank phone trees for that very reason. I don't need to go through four or five branches to get to the one that I need. And I certainly don't want to listen to the minutes-long pitch about how much you value my business at the beginning. Just send me to a person who can give me my balance.

Every customer touch should not be regarded as an opportunity to advertise or up-sell. Focus customer service on service.

I worked for DO (effectively, as an employee of Ogilvy New York) -- and walked up to his office and met him when we were still on 47/48th Street and Fifth. I said something that made him roar at me -- and I left. He was famously cranky. However, it was the best and smartest ad agency to work for.

I was hired to make funny Christmas and anniversary films there for a few years, and I did one parodying David Ogilvy's rules (hire people smarter than you, etc.)

Companies that run advertising on the phone make me near homicidal as I'm listening.

The other thing that bothers me is those who email out and snail mail out endless surveys for you to fill out about their customer service.

They are self selecting for only seriously pissed off people to reapond. The rest of us, are too busy.

To top it off they are usually so poorly written as to be almost uselss for what ever purpose they are intended for.

> those who email out and snail
> mail out endless surveys

I will no longer even start a multi-question, multi-pageload web survey of customer satisfaction.

1. I was your customer... I almost certainly spoke with one of your people and looked them in the eye. They, and you, should know if I'm "satisfied."


2. F. You... My time has value. In any case, I pay my bills, and our shared transaction is complete. I owe you nothing. I will not even start one... I know full well that your data-science is sophisticated enough to extract meaning from partially-completed forms, even if the corporate meetings in which they are reviewed lacks the statistical sophistication and morality to regard their contents.


3. I certainly don't owe you a machine-readable or batch-process datapoint which can be fecklessly merged into the responses of others, diminishing its worth (to myself, to your other customers, and to your company).


4. Nonetheless... Nonetheless, if you actually paid a native speaker of English to call me on the telephone to ask for an opinion, I'd give you twenty or twenty-five seconds, because I'm a generous guy. But you will never do that.

Because no matter how much your ass-covering management is paying to make it happen, "customer survey" is simply not for real.

Don't insult me by asking me to share your pretense that it is.

GFY. I hope Bezos swallows your balls from a single bite.

Meeting (singular) / lacks (plural).

Sorry. I hate large, lame companies.

"In it, he cautions that advertising can sometimes become so enamored of being hip and edgy, that it forgets to focus on the actual product."

You can do things to make your ad campaign stand out, though this is hit/miss.
Hit: Progressive Insurance's "Flo" playing multiple characters out camping, with lines like, "Where's your wife, Todd?".
Miss: Two whiter-than-white guys at Sonic with simple dialog always about the food. Hey, it's fast food. You think nobody knows? Ooo, I can save a DOLLAR if I get that combo to pack my guts!

Huge hit, not seen in years: the Taster's Choice "Just one cup?" romantic series. I know you have other favorites.

Rad, Ogilvy points out in the book that most of the Clio winning ads (in his day) were pulled quickly because they failed to sell the product. They were great ads, memorable, clever, and hip, but more enamored of being hip than of the pedestrian task of selling a product. To Ogilvy, advertising was a blue-collar endeavor, not art.

An annoying commercial is not always an ineffective one.

Those two Sonic guys are not as big a miss as you think. For example, you remembered the product was Sonic. Did those ads make you want to buy a Sonic burger? Perhaps not directly, but they put Sonic on your mind. Next time you see a Sonic sign, you'll know the basic concept of a Sonic franchise and that the menu has more than burgers on it.

I lived in North Florida in the '70s and '80s. There was a local guy selling house siding. He'd dress in a chicken suit in an obviously low-budget series of ads. He'd throw water at the camera while telling you the product was waterproof, turn on a giant fan and tell you it was wind-proof, then throttle a rubber chicken and scream that it was chicken-proof. I still remember the name of the product, Southern Brick and Stone. His commercials were stupid and would never have won a Clio, but they did advertise the product.

There was also a locally-based insurance company who aired a slick, high-budget, award-winning, funny commercial mocking the competition, Allstate, and its experiment with booths inside Sears stores. The commercial had a short run because, when focus groups were polled afterward on what the commercial advertised, they replied, "Allstate." The company had spent a great deal of money to advertise its competition.

John Wannamaker (1838-1922), department store founder, is reported to have said, "Half the money I spend on advertising is wasted; the trouble is I don't know which half."

"In it, he cautions that advertising can sometimes become so enamored of being hip and edgy, that it forgets to focus on the actual product."

I can name that tune in one note: Ford. They are trying so hard, so earnestly to be hip, it's painful to watch.

I've taken over advertising for my mineral/lapidary club and get about $4000 a year to play with.

I started tracking where the money for spent and asking everyone coming to outlet shows how they heard about us and I still have no clue as to whether I am spending that money effectively