I can't blame them. They bought into all the bullshit society told them. I have a similar background as this couple and they where about my age so based on my upbringing I can guess that they were taught all cultures are beautiful, only whites are evil, Muslims are peaceful and morally superior to white Christians and so on. My natural inclinations led me down a path where I discovered all this was bullshit. This couple probably just did their own thing and never questioned what their society told them. They where like rabbits who never learned about wolves; and thus they frolicked through a field they should never have entered and where devoured.

I'm sad this happend.

Look at their photo - physiognomy is real.

And right on cue ten years after the late Pippa Bacca pulled a similar stunt.

"By and large, humans are kind" is a code phrase for an entitlement mentality. It should be read as, "By and large, humans will give me stuff whenever I want it". It's the result of today's parenting, in which kids are shielded from challenges and have the (supposed) adults doing all of their thinking for them. From reading bits of his blog, it's pretty clear that they expected people along their route to provide for them, not to mention that Mommy and Daddy must have been funding the thing in the first place. They weren't college students; IIRC he was 29 years old and she was 27. And yes, they were making themselves conspicuous wherever they went.

That all said... they were doing what they wanted to do, and as far as I can tell, they weren't expecting the U.S. taxpayer to pay for it. Liberty includes the right to be stupid, as long as you don't harm others along the way. Unlike some other impetuous kids who will say that they despise the U.S. military, but then expect same to come bail them out whenever they get into a jam in some godforsaken corner of the world.

Do we know that they were "murdered by ISIS?" Or were they simply murdered in a country with an ISIS presence?

Given ISIS's predilection for encouraging independent action by fans and followers, it's possible it was both.

Would that the world were the kind of place where two young and idealistic idiots could bicycle their way along, unmolested, free to smile and take selfies at milestones along the way. Unfortunately, it's not that kind of place.

I've seen several articles trying to blame this incident on the victims, and post modernism. But there is no evidence that post modernism, leftism, snowflakism or whatever played any role.

They were in a vulnerable situation where they were attacked by malicious people. The same thing could have happened in California or New Jersey. Travel brings a heightened risk of violence, especially when traveling by road and on a bicycle.

Stopping kicking the dead.

> Stopping kicking the dead.

Way to make sure it happens to you, too!

I propose a John Sedgwick award for people who put their own heads on the chopping block this stupidly.

This guy has been successfully circling the globe for some time. I met him in 2006. He's also here.

I suspect he knows who and what to avoid.

I read about this last week. Frankly am not sure what the lessons are here, if any.

I thought maybe the narrative was going to be that a poor naive little woman gets bullied into making a round the world bicycle trip by an evil white male, who gets them both killed.

Gotta put the blame in the appropriate place you know.

But really who cares? Their familes, but that is where it ends.

On a side note, I know a family whose son got himself killed on K2 several years ago. Now that was a risky endevor. His mother never recovered from it.

I wonder if that isnt the worst part of the *me*generations. Never a thought that you might have obligations, and other things and people to live for other than gratifing your own selfish desires for adventure and ego stroking.

"Never a thought that you might have obligations, and other things and people to live for other than gratifying your own selfish desires for adventure and ego stroking." -Isab

We had a 25-year-old intern last winter that loved to lecture about how travel should be a priority for everyone. This was, of course, someone who routinely job-hops and lives with her grandmother.

What happened to these people is very sad, and yes, it could have happened in any number of places. They certainly didn't deserve it. It's just hard to care too much about people who quit their jobs to travel the world (and live off family money, maybe? I don't understand how people can afford to travel for months at a time. I certainly couldn't in my 20's, even before I had "real" financial obligations...) so they can write blogs and post on Instagram and let those of us who are working our asses off and taking care of our families know that we're "doing it wrong." At least, hopefully, no one was dependent on these people. Unlike the mom whose minivan gets t-boned at a stoplight when she's running errands while the kids are at school.

"not sure what the lessons are here"

The lesson is "don't be smug". You might end up trying to bicycle through a war zone.

They would have been fine if he'd grown out his beard, and learned enough Arabic or Turk to sound like a convert. She'd need a burqa, but that's not a big deal. All cultures are equal, right?

Oh, they were run over by a vehicle. If it was an SUV, it is probably the evvvvvvvil SUV that did the dirty deed.

I'd like to believe that I could walk my lily white ass thru Harlem at 3am. I'm not dumb enough to try.

I applaud that couple for having the courage to live their convictions, I encourage all progressives to do the same to prove all people are kind, obviously (like communism) this couple failed to do it the right was so liberals need to keep trying

You can do it IRA. The trick is to mess up your hair and clothes. Then talk to yourself while you are passing through. Even the gangbangers don't want to mess with the crazy guy. (Actually knew a guy who did exactly this on his way too and from work. And that was when Harlem was far more dangerous than it is today.)

The lesson is "don't be smug". You might end up trying to bicycle through a war zone.

Gog_Magog_Carpet_Reclaimers at August 17, 2018 8:27 AM

In my experience smug is the natural state of humans raised in affluence. It seldom ever gets the death penalty.

Half the world is a war zone, and the other half can be dicy if you are in the wrong place at the wrong time.

There is a reason woman are naturally timid and not risk takers. Those that arent rarely survive to pass down their genes.

I have told this story before, but about ten years ago I knew a woman who was the adventurous sort who decided to take her daughter on a trip to an island nation near Africa to look at some species of chameleon,
They landed in the middle of a revolution and then instead of turing around and getting back on the plane and coming home they decided to hire an armed guard so they could go out and look at the chameleons.

She said she had never been so scared in her life.

What kind of an idot puts her twenty something daughter in that kind of danger?

What took the cake was coming back and telling us all about it like she deserved a medal for bravery or something.

Even the gangbangers don't want to mess with the crazy guy.

The animated Ghostbusters hit that same note back in the mid 80s. Egon is wondering thru the hood with his gear muttering to himself. The first gang banger is like let's go mess that fool up and the second says no, man, never mess with a guy crazier than you are.

If one appears to pose enough of a potential risk to the bad guys, they'll leave you alone.

But there is no evidence that post modernism, leftism, snowflakism or whatever played any role.

So, they're fluent, or at least can make themselves understood in the native languages of the lands they're traveling thru? without having to consult a phrase book?? and know enough about the culture and customs to not give offense?

I'll leave you with a punch line from very old joke: Oh, we know of your Miranda, but in this country, Miranda wears a funny hat and dances on tables.

..Way to make sure it happens to you, too!

What's that supposed to mean?!?

Folks, they weren't in a war zone or anywhere you'd expect some ISIS lunatic to deliberately run them over. Stop distorting the facts.

Also I don't see how they are 'smug' and somehow deserving of murder.

Here's a corollary - my sister and BIL are missionaries, they literally set-up churches in foreign countries and minister to people.

They also advise churches on their mission programs, which are popular among evangelical denominations who like sending kids into 'underprivileged' areas to minister to people.

Well if you've ever spent time among evangelicals, you know that they tend to be extremely naive people and could give any 'smug' pomo hippie type a run for their money when it comes to wishful thinking and irrationality about the world.

Alot of the advice my BIL gives them is very basic, go in teams, don't go after dark, don't go into bad areas, don't bring people home with you etc.. It's advice that any reasonable person would infer or themselves, but the evangelical types need to be told explicitly because they don't think that way. They honestly think that God will look out for them because they're good people and doing his work.

But every year there are robberies, assaults, even rapes and murders. Partly because they're naive and partly because they're unknowingly exposing themselves to dangerous people.

Now do you think that these kids deserve to be raped and murdered because they're smug?

I read about this last week. Frankly am not sure what the lessons are here, if any.

The only lesson is the old adage, "Well, that'll learn ya."

They're still not as dumb as the dingleberry who went on a drinking holiday in North Korea and came home in pieces.

Evil exists. I define evil as the intentional harming of someone who isn't currently violating you in any way.

Philip Zimbardo, in The Lucifer Effect, defines it thusly: “Evil consists in intentionally behaving in ways that harm, abuse, demean, dehumanize, or destroy innocent others—or using one’s authority and systemic power to encourage or permit others to do so on your behalf.

Deserve's got nothin' to do with it.

As my Pap used to say, if you go looking for trouble you'll find it. There's a reason I try very hard to get home by midnight: very few things that occur between midnight and 5am are good.

Well, muggers may not be "evil" but you still better watch out for them because whatever they are ("misunderstood" maybe) they do exist. Same with terrorists.

Question above re: do we know this was ISIS? From what I've read, we do. They took credit and posted pictures. Also, one article noted that it was 5 ISIS men and they followed up their vehicle attack by stabbing the victims to ensure death.

Comment above re: Otto Warmbier. I wouldn't sleep for one minute if my kid went to North Korea on a guided tour, but in terms of wrongdoing we don't know that he did do anything wrong. The Koreans said he stole a poster--you gonna take their word for it? In any case, he was apparently a very nice young man who made a naive mistake and was beaten to death for it.

Comment above re: Otto Warmbier. I wouldn't sleep for one minute if my kid went to North Korea on a guided tour, but in terms of wrongdoing we don't know that he did do anything wrong. The Koreans said he stole a poster--you gonna take their word for it? In any case, he was apparently a very nice young man who made a naive mistake and was beaten to death for it.

RigelDog at August 17, 2018 12:13 PM

If I recall correctly, it wasn't just the Koreans who said this. It was some of his fellow neophytes in Totalitarian Disneyland, but I could be wrong.

Agreed, you shouldnt get the death penalty for getting drunk and doing something stupid, but sadly, North Korea has a low tolerance for pranks. From my understanding the students were warned about this repeatedly.

Exactly “what” he did was never the issue. It could have been anything which is why you don't go there to begin with.

"Also I don't see how they are 'smug' and somehow deserving of murder."

I just don't understand how you can come here and post about hating black people like that! Shameful.

“Folks, they weren't in a war zone or anywhere you'd expect some ISIS lunatic to deliberately run them over. Stop distorting the facts.”

I don't think you understand how jaw dropping silly this statement is to anyone who has ever been in the military.

Yes this is very much the area you would expect ISIS or Taliban partisans to do something like this. It is hardly surprising.

As for the 'they didn't deserve this' argument. Most people don't deserve throat cancer. But if you smoke a pack a day you probably are going to get it. Deserve is meaningless.

OK people - can you cite me some credible evidence on who / how that area is a 'war zone' and should be considered a hotbed of ISIS activity?

Until this incident occurred, the region of Tajikistan they were traveling was rated a level 1 ( no threat ) by the State Department, with a similar rating by EU countries.

And yes Afghanistan is across the border from Tajikistan - they were nowhere near the border.

https://www.straitstimes.com/sites/default/files/articles/2018/08/01/180801-online-map-of-tajikistan.jpg

Or is it your contention that anyplace outside the US is a war zone and hotbed of ISIS activity. Been listening to Sean Hannity have you?

"Been listening to Sean Hannity have you?"

Red herrings in snark sauce. Mmmm. Tasty!

Or is it your contention that anyplace outside the US is a war zone and hotbed of ISIS activity. Been listening to Sean Hannity have you?

brucey at August 18, 2018 8:18

Actually no. My contention is that when you are battling an insurgency, like radical Islam, there is no such thing as a *War Zone*

Your enemies move around and if you have to be aware of that.

Nice little colored zones on a map designating safe and unsafe areas are a fools game. Get out of the fucking map room and look around.
If you must go ino a sparely populated area with large numbers of poor people, jobless young men, and readily availbale weapons, do so with some protections like maybe a SUV, and some ability to unass the AO quickly when things go south.

Baffles the mind that people with enough sense to avoid the south side of Chicago and the bad areas of LA (which arent war zones either by the way) feel perfectly ok waltzing into a country where they dont speak the language, dont understand the culture, which is politically unstable and in close proximity to active ongoing hostilities, on fucking bicycles.

Brazil aint a war zone. But if you get into the wrong kind of cab in Rio de Janeiro you will get a personally guided tour of the Amazon rain forest while you hope someone cares enough to ransom you back. Who cares about war zones? Same deal in north Afghanistan. Big cities you are mostly safe. Rural areas are a different story. Bring armed guards you can trust (a lot of people get robbed by their guards) and travel in a group. All on your own like this? Getting decapitated isn't an odd event.

Brazil is not a war zone but hotel security in Sao Paolo stopped me from strolling out alone one evening - the phrase "You'll be kidnapped in five minutes" still rings in my ears.

So I traveled under protection for the rest of the week and, aside from some mild work conflict with a spicy Brasileira (and overindulging in caipirinha), made it home intact.

The world is not a vegan worker's paradise yet.

I know a fellow who was working in Costa Rica if memory serves. This was many many years ago. He got knifed in the back by his security detail, stripped, and tossed in a ditch. Amazingly he walked back to a US consulate and survived. Understandably he recommended changing security companies after that.

It doesn't sound like you guys actually disagree with me, but believe that these people should have exercised more caution - I totally agree with that point.

But what I'm reacting to is all of the articles on Conservative sites smearing this couple because they were smug Progressive types. Sites like Instapundit have published literally dozens of posts on this subject crowing about how they had it coming to them. It's pretty sick.

And I'd bet anyone $10,000 that if this guy was an ex Marine who was killed in Tajikistan with his wife, we'd be hearing about how he was so brave and intrepid, and how the Tajiks need to be nuked from space for letting him die.

Brucey. He wasn't a former Marine. There may be a reason for that: Marines, former or otherwise, have too much experience with the real world, probably by the time they reach junior high if not sooner, to be this stupid.
This is not a matter of not knowing something. This is a matter of knowing it and purposely unknowing yourself on the subject in order to feel virtuous.
Nobody can be this stupid without some effort.

But what I'm reacting to is all of the articles on Conservative sites smearing this couple because they were smug Progressive types. Sites like Instapundit have published literally dozens of posts on this subject crowing about how they had it coming to them. It's pretty sick.

And I'd bet anyone $10,000 that if this guy was an ex Marine who was killed in Tajikistan with his wife, we'd be hearing about how he was so brave and intrepid, and how the Tajiks need to be nuked from space for letting him die.

brucey at August 19, 2018 10:54 AM

So in other words, you have a lot of animus towards conservatives, and you are a similar age and economic demographic as the couple in question, so you are throwing up a lot of strawmen and what ifs, that arent really germane to the topic, in order to justify their behavior.

When you got caught, you moved the goal posts.

Yes, conservative missionaries in general are just as dumb and naive about the world as idiot new age millennials. They suffer from the same misplaced belief in the goodness of mankind. They just look to a different book, and a different God for their crackpot ideas.

And I'd bet anyone $10,000 that if this guy was an ex Marine who was killed in Tajikistan with his wife, we'd be hearing about how he was so brave and intrepid, and how the Tajiks need to be nuked from space for letting him die. ~ brucey at August 19, 2018 10:54 AM

Well, brucey, you might not hear anything about nuking the Tajiks, but you'd definitely catch some flak for that "ex Marine" comment. Any Corps veteran will tell you, "there's no such thing as an ex Marine." They take that one pretty seriously, preferring "former Marine." As a former president might have said, "the Marines have a high esprit de corpse."

Fair point Conan. Isab you're a kook. I think I'm done here. Thanks for playing.