Where's My Faithless-Based Initiative?
When will politicians start pandering to Brights like me -- people who don't believe in god? Math prof John Allen Paulos wonders about that, on ABCNews.com:
...Since we're now at the beginning of a presidential campaign, it's reasonable to ask not only President Bush, but also each of the ten contenders for the Democratic nomination to state their attitude toward Brights (designated by whatever term they choose).We might also speculate about which of these candidates might be closet Brights? Which would evince anything like the free-thinking of Thomas Jefferson or Abraham Lincoln? Which would put forward a Bright Supreme Court nominee? Which would support self-avowed Brights in positions of authority over children?
Which of them would even include Brights in inclusive platitudes about Catholics, Protestants, Jews, and Muslims? Doing so might be good politics. Although unorganized and relatively invisible, Brights constitute a large group to whom politicians almost never appeal. Moreover, it would be interesting to see and hear the squirming responses of the candidates to the above questions.
In reason we trust! Well, not all of us, but more of us than you think.
Republicans can't appeal to brights because they'll piss off their evangelical base of support. And they've been trying to win over traditionally Democrat black and latino church groups with money through the faith-based initiative.
I have a hard time imagining how a good campaign to attract brights AS BRIGHTS would look. I don't think we'd want to elect someone who puts down religion all the time, since many of us place high priority on pluralism.
Lena Cuisina at October 9, 2003 8:41 AM
Michael Shermer's Skeptic Soc. took a poll and a huge number of those polled rejected the "Brights" tag as too cutesy for words. Feel free to use atheist. "Brights" sounds inane beyond, well, belief.
Sasha at October 9, 2003 9:01 AM
I agree. It also sounds kind of cult-ish. Makes me think of flying saucers with bright lights carrying off the remains of a mass suicide in Orange County.
Lena Cuisina at October 9, 2003 9:19 AM
Well, it wouldn't be the name I'd choose either (my business card says, simply, "Amy Alkon, godless harlot,") but I'm all for a mob of rational people.
Amy Alkon at October 9, 2003 10:04 AM
Really? I always assumed your business card said
"Amy Alkon. Ask my about my pink Rambler. Please."
Well, live and learn.
Sasha at October 10, 2003 5:21 PM
Sasha are you needing a little extra attention these days? Poor dear. I'd much rather talk about not believing in god than about a car I no longer have. Isn't that obvious to everybody but you?
Amy Alkon at October 10, 2003 8:15 PM
Just about 1 month ago:
September 16, 2003
Crime Pays, It Just Doesn?t Pay Me
The LA City Attorney just called me about George Gomez, my car thief. (The LA Times legal department weenies made me call him ?Fred Lopez? in my story even though it was clear I had his real name, along with an answering machine message from him apologizing for stealing my car and a signed letter of apology.) Anyway, the City Attorney had contacted me once before, last August, to see if George ?had made his restitution payment of $75 this month" for the damage he?d done to my pink Rambler when he?d stolen it.
?$75 dollars this month!? I said. ?That would be $75 more than I?ve ever gotten from George.?
Well, she called me this morning to let me know that George was ?in custody,? and again asked if he?s been "keeping up with his payments." (Of course he hasn?t!) She told me he?ll be in court this afternoon (she mentioned that he has ?lots of parole violations? -- surprise, surprise!), and said if the judge thinks George isn?t likely to pay, he'll throw him in jail for 180 days instead. This is fine by me, except the part about the 180 days in jail meaning he doesn?t have to pay me.
I don?t see why he can?t combine jail and paying me. I think of it as "The Hamster Wheel Principle." Let him run on the wheel (or hammer out license plates) until he earns what he owes me, then let him out. That?s the way it should be for all prisoners. Unfortunately, government isn?t quite the cold, cruel bitch I am, so they?ll probably just lock him up someplace with a better color TV than I have, and let him sleep off his time.
Sasha at October 11, 2003 12:34 AM
Sasha, you make my point -- that you're bitter and angry and lacking in attention. Of the hundreds of items I've posted on my blog, I posted how many about my stolen car? Yet, that's all you see. In fact, you drag mention of my car forward to a piece about not believing in god that doesn't even have transportation! let alone my car in it. PS Too bad you aren't more intelligent, or you'd understand that the piece copied in above really isn't about my car; it's about crime, and how criminals are allowed to get away with crime without paying back the victim. Obviously, you have a really big hard-on for anybody who gets any attention. I suggest you paint your body pink and run around the USC campus until you get some of your own. Maybe they'll put you in jail with my car thief and you can both talk endlessly about how much you despise me. PS If you're going to put up nasty little attacks on my blog, do post your last name. Come on, don't be shy!
Amy Alkon at October 11, 2003 8:44 AM
Actually, Amy, I can relate very well. When I was in the Army, the bulk of my check was going toward paying off loans and I couldn't afford a car. Fortunately, I had one that I let my mother use while I was in Basic Training. When I finally arrived at my permanent duty station, Ft. Bragg, NC, I let my mother know that I would be picking up my car. Less than a month later, my car had been totalled. My mother, a lifelong resident of Bennington, Vermont and a very trusting person, took to leaving the car keys hidden in the car's ashtray. Oy veh.
Some punks from a rather sleazy part of town happened upon the car and found the keys. They took the car and tipped it over on its side in Harwood Hill Apple Orchard and pelted it with rocks.
Because these were minors, nothing was done to them, and no restitution was made. Their names were not listed in the police blotter in the local paper even. In short, they enjoy complete anonymity and impunity.
Patrick at October 12, 2003 7:57 PM
You couldn't sue their beyond-lame excuses for parents?
Amy Alkon at October 12, 2003 8:02 PM
Patrick -- Your mother is a lifelong resident of Bennington, Vermont! By any chance, is she a lesbian?
Lena Cuisina at October 12, 2003 9:48 PM
I don't know about suing them, Amy. These families are indigent and I would get nothing but legal expenses for my trouble. Restitution was already ordered.
As for my mother being a lesbian, that is a distinct possibility. Although she has had nine children from her two husbands (the last of which is yours truly), she seems content to live out her remaining years with her lady friend. While visiting their home, I did happen once upon a topless photo of my mother carelessly left out in plain sight.
Coming out to her was probably the most anti-climactic thing I've ever done. It went basically like this:
"Mom, I'm gay."
"Oh, okay. When do you think you'll be home next?"
Patrick at October 14, 2003 5:46 AM
That's my kind of coming out story. Are there actually any straight women in Bennington?
Amy Alkon at October 15, 2003 12:46 AM
You're asking me??? Although a heterosexual acquaintance of mine did describe Bennington as "the lesbian capital of the world." It should be noted however, that my acquaintance is a paragon of narcissism, and believes that any woman not in love with him is a lesbian.
I love vain people, by the way. They are sooo much fun to pick on.
Patrick at October 15, 2003 7:28 PM
I'm pretty sure that Lesbianism is now an official minor at Vassar. Amy -- you know that fat woman who hangs out at Hal's bar wearing overalls? Big surprise: She studied art history at Vassar.
Lena Lesbiana at October 18, 2003 10:26 AM
um...is this about godlessness? or lesbians and cars (two topics i know nothing about!)?????
I am originally from Australia and we have very little mention of god (of any faith) in politics...although John Howard (Prime Minister) has a crush on Bush and has taken to God Blessing Australia in his speeches now...
I have to admit when i first arrived I was a little alarmed at how religious the US is. Isn't there supposed to be a separation of religion and state? and yet god is everywhere (!). Amen.
Rowena at October 18, 2003 6:22 PM
"god" is everywhere the money is. Strange how that works!
Amy Alkon at October 19, 2003 1:39 AM
God, lesbians, cars. A new political platform! Perhaps we can swing this discussion thread back to the brights before it's archived?
Lena for President at October 19, 2003 6:42 AM
Amy,
You have an absurd faith, faith that you have no faith. You say you don't believe in faith. Faith is to believe in something. You have faith in yourself don't you? You seem to have faith that there is no god. Correct? Everyone has some kind of faith. Even denial is a kind of faith, negative faith against some other belief.
No evidence for God? Only if you disallow the definition of God being the Creator. If Creator, then creation, existence is the evidence. Of course if there is no such God, the existence would then be the evidence that there is no god.
Existence is an evidence. The correct question is, is it evidence for God (Genesis 1:1?) The Bible definition of God would make it so.
Respectfully,
Paul E. Schippnick.
I saw you on the Faith Under Fire show 12/18/2004. And is the reason for the above comments.
Paul E. Schippnick at December 19, 2004 5:27 AM
I have no faith. I don't believe in anything without evidence, and there's no evidence that there is a god. Anyone who believes in anything without evidence is...well, somebody who isn't using their capacity to reason, to put it politely. Disallow the "definition" of god as the creator? There's evidence of evolution (ie, the fossil record, Galapagos bird beak changes over time), and only your preacher's word that there is a god. Genesis is a nice book, but there's no proof that it happened. Aren't you embarrassed to believe in this stuff without proof? Apparently not. You should be. You have the capacity to reason. You might not leave it on the shelf with the expired batteries, you know? Why does it matter if there is or isn't a god? God and all the ensuing hell baggage (please, seen anybody who's been to hell or do you just believe EVERYTHING you get shoved?) is a great concept to make little people be fearful enough to be prevented from doing shitty little things to each other. It's total self-interest, religious based morality. You don't want to go to "hell" so you're good. I'm good because I have ethics -- because I choose to, not because I'm terrified Satan's going to chase me around while cracking a whip. (That sort of thing does sound a lot more fun than the way heaven's made out to be.) And love those ideas - the Jews are the chosen people, if you're not Christian you'll burn in hell, and Muslims sending their teenagers out to blow up themselves and others who aren't Muslims. Religion is really a wonderful thing, isn't it? And I don't respect you, because you have the capacity to reason and you do not use it...just repeat what you're told, like a small, dumb child.
Amy Alkon at December 19, 2004 7:15 AM
PS Religion is big business. Witness all those churches telling poor people to give their last 12 cents so they can get rich. Please. Is it any wonder poor, uneducated people are the ones who believe in god, and Richard Dawkins doesn't?
Amy Alkon at December 19, 2004 7:16 AM
Amy,
You say, "I have no faith." Yet you say, "In reason we trust!" That is absurd. Either you have faith in reason or you do not. If you do not, then you do not trust in reason either.
If you have no faith in evidence, what is the point in asking for evidence? If you have no faith in reason, how can you be rational?
Fossil record is evidence of dead animals in sediments. The order in which they were buried. They had to be buried relatively soon after death in order for there to be a fossil. How and why were they soon buried? And why is do any of these layers of fossils exist? And in the same layer world wide?
How may different religious beliefs are there? The odds are most, if not all, are false. And belief in reason alone, is just one of many beliefs. And there is diversity among those who claim reason alone too.
Have faith in reason. Have faith in evidence.
Respectfully,
Paul E. Schippnick
Paul E.Schippnick at December 19, 2004 6:16 PM
Reason is a methodology, not an idol.
Amy Alkon at December 19, 2004 6:25 PM
Amy,
By the way. According to Christian teaching, no one is good enough to go to heaven (Romans 3:10,11,23, etc.)
And only the "dumb small children" are going to make it (Matthew 19:14, Matthew 18:3.)
Sincerely,
Paul E. Schippnick
Paul E.Schippnick at December 19, 2004 6:27 PM
"Reason is a methodology, not an idol." Yes, and you know nothing without some kind of belief, i.e. faith.
Paul E.Schippnick at December 19, 2004 6:30 PM