The New Rudeness
Public manners, more and more, seem to be a thing of the past. I'm writing something about this now, and I could use your help. I'd like to know about experiences that go beyond people shouting into cell phones -- unless you have a particularly funny or unique story about that. Please post any experiences you'd like to share below...rude neighbors, cube rudeness at work, restaurant rudeness, rudesters on the road, etc., if you'd like to sound off and/or help me put the "civil" back in "civilization."
This story is part of a post and really happened to me back in the early summer.
"A few weeks ago during my lunch hour, I was standing in line at a restaurant. The guy in front of me was a few cents short, so I dug down in my purse and gave the cashier a nickel. She smiled. He smiled. He thanked me and then promptly asked if there was more where that came from. The cashier’s smile disappeared immediately and she began to berate him in some urban dialect that I couldn’t catch a word of. He tucked his tail, took his lunch and left. In the meantime, everyone looked at me like I’d turned him into the principal."
Obi's Sister at October 18, 2007 10:46 AM
Thanks so much...and a word about posting links for the unitiated. If you have a link to a story, please just post one per comment as Obi's Sister did above. If you want to post separate links, please post them in separate comments (a separate comment for each link), lest they be swallowed by my rather aggressive spam filter.
Amy Alkon at October 18, 2007 10:53 AM
I would like to sound off about automobile drivers who pay no attention to drivers on motorcycles...I dont know how many times people have pulled out in front of us, went around us we were trying to turn in that direction, stopped suddenly in front us not using turn signals, and numerous other things....Motorcyclists have just as much right to be on the road as automobile drivers do and a little common courtesy goes a long way...Remember that a motorcycle takes longer to get stoped than a vehicle does so please always give advanced warning to a motorcyclist that is following behind you if you are going to stop or turn....Always try to keep a safe distance between you and a motorcyclist if you are following behind them...These people are someones sons, daughters, husbands, and wives just like you and your family members are so please try to be a little understanding and a little more courteus to those of us who are out there on our motorcycles....THANX,CORY
Cory at October 18, 2007 11:39 AM
Bicyclists, too.
I do have to say, I used to just rage all over Manhattan on my bike, and outside of shouting at people who were about to "door" me, I was very alert, and felt that was enough to keep me safe.
These days, with people not only talking on cell phones but texting in cars, I'm terrified just getting to the bike path here, which involves going through about 3/4 of a mile of streets with cars on them.
Amy Alkon at October 18, 2007 11:47 AM
Thank you for this Amy!!! I'm all set with two things.
1) People coughing and/or sneezing on me while we're on the train. Yes, we all need to sneeze and stifling it isn't satisfying but luckily, it's also not necessary. All it takes is a handy-dandy tissue to cover your schnoz before you let Mount St. Helen's erupt from your nostrils. Coughing is even easier to manage b/c there isn't messiness. Just cover your mouth w/ your hand or bury it into the inside of your arm. In the event of either a cough or sneeze, turn your head, too. So, let's recap. When you have to sneeze: cover nose w/ tissue and turn head away from the person standing three inches from you. Even if it's just allergies and not contagious I don't want your fucking snot plastered to my face. Thanks.
2) People who saunter through an intersection when the cars have a green light; people who think that since pedestrians have the right of way they can walk the same speed as a dead turtle. I get it - you're 18 and like to wear your pants down around your ankles - nice choice of boxers, friend, the blue plaid brings out sparkle in your 100 carat "diamond studs" from Sears. I know you have no where to be (School? Nah. Work? HAH!) and I know you like to give society the middle finger. But one of these days I'm going to down shift into second and fucking floor it into your over exposed ass. I don't car if my car is new and shiny and I'd go to jail: the satisfaction would be like a million orgasms rolled into one w/ a side order of Cinnabons. Hustle, just a little mi amigo. You don't need to frantically sprint just stop crawling! And while we're at it, give me a slight head nod to politely acknowledge that I'm waiting for you to move out of the fucking road as you jaywalk during rush hour and there are ten cars beeping at me to move b/c they can't see you. I'll nod back, maybe even smile, and be a lot less likely to kill someone at the next intersection.
Gretchen at October 18, 2007 11:52 AM
I'm used to people cutting me off in traffic, that is just a given around here. But the lack of consideration in actual public is getting to be a bit much.
At the grocery store, I didn't want to jump in front of the first lady because her kids were trailing behind her & knocking a kid down with your cart is just wrong. So I waited till she went thru the door, then the next three people look at me & just go right in. Like I am the Greeter at Wallmart, standing here with my cart.
At work, I go out of my way to pass a door to someone, so I don't expect everyone to wait a whole 5 mins & hold a door for me, but you could at least pass it on, if someone is right there. We work in the same building, I'll see you again, no need to be rude.
But this lady the other day, I'm three feet from the door, it's glass, you can see I'm coming on the other side! She goes thru & drops the door in my face. Gotta hurry & get to the cafeteria! It's feeding time at the Zoo!
=)
MeganNJ at October 18, 2007 11:53 AM
"down shift into second " ...that is, unless I'm already at a complete stop. Then I'd just floor it.
P.S: my friend read that and asked "angry?" - not really, just annoyed, and having fun w/ this!
Gretchen at October 18, 2007 11:59 AM
Do you all think people are ruder? Is society in general ruder and meaner and less civilized?
Amy Alkon at October 18, 2007 12:11 PM
I see this all too often on my way home from work, where I need to switch from a north/south interstate to an east/west one.
About half a mile before the junction, there is a single lane for traffic that needs to switch over to the east/west interstate.
About a quarter of a mile before the junction, that single lane divides into 2 lanes, one for traffic intending to go west, one for traffic intending to go east. A solid white line divides these two lanes. Then, the lanes split off completely, going their respective directions.
In my city, west leads to the suburbs, while east leads to downtown. Therefore, during rush hour, MUCH more traffic needs to go west. I live near downtown, so I need to go east. In theory, this is awesome because, while lane for the west-bound traffic is backed up bumper to bumper, the east lane is practically clear. However, one must remember to add 10 minutes to the commute for rudeness.
About once a week or so, I see some jerk who decides they do not need to wait in the west-bound lane. So, they stay in the nice, clear eastbound lane until the last possible second where it separates from the west-bound lane and wait for some kind soul who has likely traveled .25 miles in the last 15 minutes to let them in. Of course, no one WANTS to let their self-centered ass in, so there they sit, in the east-bound lane blocking me and ALL the east-bound traffic behind them.
sofar at October 18, 2007 12:12 PM
I think we're all forgetting how useful it is to have trust in our lives.
As in, trust that the motorcyclist will follow you in your blind spot, then blame you when you don't see him.
Trust that the guys ambling slowly against the red light are losers with no power in their lives other than to stop traffic for a few moments.
Trust that everyone around you is going to think of themselves first with no regard for your comfort or safety or health.
Trust that America, having shipped our industries overseas and flung open the doors to 11 million undocumented aliens, is going down the toilet and no politician cares beyond how that affects the next election.
Trust. It's the key to survival.
Gog_Magog_Carpet_Reclaimers at October 18, 2007 12:15 PM
Oh, P.S. Here I am writing about the disintegration of public manners, and I'm into this particularly good jag, and then, some woman behind me starts clucking into her phone...loud enough to cut through my music, turned up all the way...and all of a sudden, bye-bye flow!
And yes, I'm writing in a place with a no-cell phones sign, but people often make excuses like, "I just had to get on the phone for a minute," or "It's a really important call," or "It's my brother."
FYI: I don't care if it's Jesus giving you the ETA for the second coming. The sign applies to you.
Amy Alkon at October 18, 2007 12:17 PM
Yep, yep, yep!! You all have covered the vast majority so far,except for the rude line-hoppers at the local sammich shop! I'm standing there, 2 or so feet behind the person at the register, giving her a little space, and in walks a boisterous couple, one on her cell phone, the other yapping into her pal's ear, and they both blithely walk in front of me and start to order their meals, while the lady at the register is still counting her change and gathering up her belongings. So, I tap the one "young lady" on the shoulder, say, "Excuse, me, I'm next" and you would have thought I tried to stab her in the eye and yank her friend's cell phone away (not that I didn't want to, mind you!)! And the cashier backs me up, saying, "that's right, she's next" and the 2 little cuties start with "Well then why wasn't she in the line?" and "WTF?" I just said, "be done in a minute" order my stuff, and walk away, while the 2 of them are still standing there, arguing with the cashier and holding up the line! Sheeesh. o_O
Flynne at October 18, 2007 12:38 PM
Three of us had agreed to go to a neighbourhood theatre, kind-of similar to 6th/Penn in Hillcrest, San Diego. Extremely similar, in fact. The show was a Rosina Reynolds one-woman piece, very well reviewed. The deal was "please pick up your tix at least 30 min before curtain-up". So, we did that, and went off to Arrivederci for a little something. Bill-paying took a tad longer than expected, and we arrived back at the theatre dead on 8pm, to be met by the Artistic Director no less, furiously yelling "You're late!! You can't come in!! Get out of my theatre!!!" (The audience was seated but we could plainly see that the performance had not started). It so happened that I'd lost my voice that night, so it was left to the women to explain that "Look, we have tickets. See?" "I've given those seats away," he said. "No latecomers". The performance then started, so we all moved out into the little mall that the theatre occupies. Of course we insisted that, if we weren't to be admitted, we expected a full refund. With extremely ill grace he summoned his cashier and got her to plunder the cash box (poor girl looked terrified). Then, UNBELIEVABLY, he called the police on his cell phone and said he wanted to report three trespassers. "They refuse to leave my theatre," he yelled (in spite of the fact that we were already outside his damned theatre). We finally got our cash and left. Guess whether we'll ever go back there again....
This was one incredible, utterly unforgiveable, incident. I don't really share your feeling that there's been a general decline in public manners. I've been tolerating queue-jumpers, wrong-way cyclists and door-slammers all my life, it seems.
Stu "El Inglés" Harris at October 18, 2007 12:40 PM
Rudeness has been around as long as humans have, I'm pretty sure. I just think there's more of it than ever. You go through your day and you can pretty much count on experiencing a few of these episodes daily where people take an aggressive "fuck you, move out of my way" attitude (literally or figuratively) to others.
Amy Alkon at October 18, 2007 12:50 PM
Just as I was walking into my apartment building before reading this my neighbour saw me through the door and promptly locked it. What an asshole. He doesn't like us- he's complained about (low levels of) noise a few times. But is that really a reason to intentionally close a door in someones face and lock it??? Ah, the Viennese...
Arthur Cornwell at October 18, 2007 12:56 PM
"Do you all think people are ruder? Is society in general ruder and meaner and less civilized? "
I think people in general are more self-absorbed, feel more self-important, and are much less likely to stop and think about how their actions will affect those around them. (or even consider that there are other people around them!) The reason someone cuts you off in traffic or cuts in front of you at the grocery store is the same, they either didn't bother to see you, or they think their time is more important and their obligations are more pressing than yours. I think our society has stressed individualism to the point where people confuse it with complete selfishness.
sam at October 18, 2007 1:17 PM
I live in France, where people are, if not "friendly", at least polite. It is funny that you bring up this topic, because I have NEVER experienced rudeness from a French person in the four years that I have lived here. Sorry to bust the stereotypes! But, twice in the last two days I have had people yell and make rude gestures to me for getting in their way. Yesterday I was literally standing on a sidewalk when a jogger came winging around the corner and gave me a nice "watch where you are going, bitch" as he nearly avoided me, and just today, in the parking garage, we tried to very timidly and unsuccessfully to pass a 10 point parking genius to be bitched at about giving him time to park, which we were doing anyway. Both times I was so shocked by the blatant rudeness that I couldn't even formulate a nice vulgarity, even in English, in response.
I visited the US for the first time in a long time recently, and was surprised at how pushy people were, especially in terms of cutting in line. The French tend to be more deferential, but it appears that that is changing for the worse...
liz at October 18, 2007 1:20 PM
Do you all think people are ruder? Is society in general ruder and meaner and less civilized?
I like the term "elevator meme." I think it explains a lot of the kinds of thing you blog about. Elevators, like other technologies, force people to interact in contexts they have no memes for so they just shut down, socially, and ignore each other. Elevators have been with us for a while but it seems only recently that the elevator meme has spread to any public area where people are lumped together but have no social interest in each other. Some of the confrontations you have documented recently show people reacting to your contravention of the elevator meme; they wonder what you are doing inside their bubble. They are bemused, frightened or angry.
People seem more certain than ever that, when they cut you off for a parking spot, you are not the very person they are rushing to interview with for a great job.
I am not in particularly isolating line of work but, due to technology, I can easily get through an entire day without interacting with another human being if I ever wanted to; but at the end of that day, I will be bone-tired and feel that the day was pointless.
People have lost interest in talking to anybody outside their address book (or fave-five.) They live their lives with a primary goal of avoiding boredom and it causes people to treat each other like shit.
martin at October 18, 2007 1:37 PM
"Do you all think people are ruder? Is society in general ruder and meaner and less civilized?"
No, but there are a heck of lot more people than ever jamming the sidewalks and streets.
My pet peeve is drivers who make those speeding left turns against potentially oncoming traffic when the light first turns green. Way to go, Andretti.
snakeman99 at October 18, 2007 1:41 PM
As a supplement to Cory's comment: Motorcycle drivers, please show some sense and dress to be noticed. Cory's point is totally valid, but it seems like half the riders I hear it from never stop to think, "hey, maybe other drivers would be more aware of my presence if I wasn't dressed entirely in black, blue, or gray." I'm not saying you need to be decked out in day-glo orange, but get a brightly-colored shirt or a red helmet or something for crying out loud.
SeanH at October 18, 2007 1:42 PM
People seem more certain than ever that, when they cut you off for a parking spot, you are not the very person they are rushing to interview with for a great job.
Love that.
I think rude people probably think of people they're ruding on not as people at all, but merely as impediments to whatever they're going for.
Amy Alkon at October 18, 2007 1:42 PM
And since you asked for stories before philosophy, here is a war story from my days of urban bicycling.
I was tearing down a long, gentle downgrade and enjoying the easy conservation of momentum that human powered vehiclists can appreciate when I spotted a guy waiting to make a left from the other direction. A quick scan of traffic showed that he would get a break in the cars just about the time I was crossing the path of his turn and applying my brakes was NOT something I felt like doing since I had the right of way (or right to die as it is known by cyclists.) I sat up tall and pointed directly at him and the gesture had the intended effect; I could see him looking straight back at me. He was in a big SUV (and this is before SUV's were ubiquitous, you could tell he thought he was a big deal.) He gunned his engine and nosed over slightly, signaling that he had no problem cutting me off if it meant getting on his way with no more waiting. The decision point zipped past and I started pouring on the coal. If I could get through before the last car was out of his path, I could forget the whole thing. No such luck, the last car passed, he gunned for the turn just as I entered the interesection and a prickling sensation scoured my body. He slammed on his brakes and I whizzed past his chrome bumper close enough to recognize my own reflection.
That much adrenaline doesn't just evaporate. I jumped the curb and raced back to catch up with him and he saw me turn and made himself easy to find.
I enthusiastically discussed with him how left turns always yield to oncoming traffic and he snorted, "not bicycles," and drove away.
The whole thing was kind of invigorating.
martin at October 18, 2007 1:53 PM
Dear Rude People:
At the supermarket, if the sign clearly states "10 items or less" and you have closer to 50, please find another fucking line.
If you are at the movies, the people around you have no wish to her about your latest blowjob during the movie. I did not just spend $10/person for a movie to listen to your shit. Save it for home.
If you are not going to buy the deodorant/make-up/hairspray that you are looking at, please do not take it off the shelf, use it, and then return it to the shelf. Some of us do not want used toiletries.
Do not glare at me for telling my children in a store, "If you do not behave, we will have to leave," and then following through if they then start misbehaving. Do not then tell me as I pass by you that "boys will be boys" or that I am too strict. They are my children, I am their mother, and I will damn well discipline as I see fit. Just because your children are misbehaving in the store, it doesn't mean that mine have to be as well.
Kristen at October 18, 2007 1:57 PM
Thank you for asking us to give examples of rude experiences, Amy. These all happened in the last couple of days and I needed to vent (obviously). And sorry for the excess spacing.
Kristen at October 18, 2007 2:02 PM
Come to think of it, one particularly inconsiderate habit does seem to have increased dramatically in the past ten years or so. Lurking in a parking lot because you think somebody else is about to yield a prime spot. People do this, blocking everyone else, quite shamelessly now. Drives me crazy....
Stu "El Inglés" Harris at October 18, 2007 2:13 PM
Makes me insane, too, Stu.
And this, Kristen:
Do not glare at me for telling my children in a store, "If you do not behave, we will have to leave," and then following through if they then start misbehaving. Do not then tell me as I pass by you that "boys will be boys" or that I am too strict. They are my children, I am their mother, and I will damn well discipline as I see fit. Just because your children are misbehaving in the store, it doesn't mean that mine have to be as well.
Thank you.
Amy Alkon at October 18, 2007 2:17 PM
I do believe that people are becoming ruder. This is especially taking place in the workplace as people are crammed together in tiny cubicles and spend more time with each other than they do their families. My boss said something the other day that bowled me over. I went into her office to tell her that I had finished the task she had given me and to show her my findings and analysis. She looked at me and said "Why is it that every time you come into my office I have to go to the bathroom?" I went blank. I had no response. I laughed uneasily and said "I don't quite know how to take that statement." She shrugged her shoulders and said "Oh." I don't think she was trying to be rude. I think that people honestly don't know what is rude and what isn't.
SarahBeth at October 18, 2007 2:28 PM
How awful. I think people make such mistakes in how they treat their employees. To have a good employee be miserable because they're working for you is so awful, and also, unnecessary. People just want to know their work is appreciated, and if it is, it's really nice to tell them so. I get letters from readers about my column that sometimes really make my day. Like this one from this morning:
Amy,I am a single guy in Sarasota,Fla.I love your fresh and not typical advice.Also I can always expect to Laugh out loud more than once every time I read your column.Thanks Again,John
Amy Alkon at October 18, 2007 2:44 PM
I am a waitress and I will not approach a customer if they are on the phone. Most of the time they are too into their conversations to notice me anyway and I don't want to stand there looking like an idiot and wasting my time. Well today I had a woman on her cell phone sit down. I had walked by a few times and she was still talking so I didn't approach the table. After a few minutes she turns to me and asks "Can I get some service?" To which I promtly replied, "It looks as if you are getting great service in here. What provider do you have, Verizon?" and walked away.
Esther at October 18, 2007 2:50 PM
i find it amazing how many people think it's totally acceptable to comment on your weight so long as they're not telling you you're overweight. i don't consider myself a particularly small person, but i am active and don't eat a lot of crap, i do happen to be somewhat smaller than many people in my office. two weeks ago, a co-worker who i don't know well told me she liked my skirt but that it would only look good if "you were really skinny." (looking back, i guess she could have been telling me it looked bad on me!) it wasn't an insult, but i still felt uncomfortable. i just feel like weight can be a touchy subject, and moreover it's not very interesting (for example, i hate hearing about other people's diets and gym efforts, etc) so i don't consider it a good conversation topic.
not that skinny at October 18, 2007 3:04 PM
sofar are you in Minneapolis?
In addition to agreeing with all of the above, here are a few commonly unobserved courtesies:
1. Don't be a moving roadblock in the left lane of a limited access road. The difference between a traffic snake and a real snake is that with the real snake the ass is in the back. For this one I can say that there is a definite trend for the worse. Even the truck drivers have started to do it and that almost never used to happen.
2. Understand the meaning of a yield sign. This is probably more ignorance than rudeness, but isn't it rude to share the road with other people without knowing the basic rules? I was rear-ended by a lady while I was stopped at a yield sign to wait for a school bus to go in front of me. The school bus had the right of way. I had to stand there for 5-10 minutes with other driver watching the traffic before she grudgingly acknowledged that, indeed, the sign meant yield the right of way. Yield signs are disappearing and I suspect it is because people don't obey them.
3. Stand on the right when riding an escalator.
4. When inside a restaurant, use your inside voice. The French are so good at this. I confess this is something that I struggle with due to years of bad habit. It's delightful when everyone does it.
5. If you have something to sell me and I say no, take that as a hint that I mean no. Otherwise, I will very quickly be ruder than you.
A story representative of probably nothing:
I'm currently living in Rome on a dead end street that is about 30 feet wide including sidewalks with 6 story buildings on both sides and capping the end. So, basically I face an echo chamber. The other night this younger, dipshit cabbie drives in and blasts his "Dukes of Hazzard" horn at about 90 decibels. After 11:00pm. Twice. I have nice double pane windows that block a lot of sound and it was still loud. I mean someone fiddled with the stereo while it was off and you turned it on without noticing kind of loud. By the time I got to my window he was out of the car and people were throwing things at him from their windows. When he complained about it in English, I told him to fuck off. He replied that I should remember who was a guest in Italy and who lived there, but he didn't blow the horn again.
Shawn at October 18, 2007 3:17 PM
I blame Dr. Spock. Seriously, at least some of this seems to stem from the idea that children must be allowed to Express Themselves rather than being disciplined. Don't get me wrong - I am not a fan of cold, authoritarian parenting, and I think the insights that have been gained over the past few decades into how the parent/child dynamic works and how children's brains evolve are invaluable. But at some point, many people seem to have decided to believe that children don't need to be civilized. They do. Not beaten, not belittled, not berated - but civilized. Which is tough. I wonder if part of this is the total supplanting of the extended family structure by the nuclear family. I spent time around kids in my youth, so I know that, for example, small children get overstimulated easily and that a two-year-old can't be expected to sit still for four hours at a time. I see a lot of parents who genuinely don't seem to know how kids work on any basic level. Some are willing to learn - others are not.
Aside from that, I wonder what effect the increase in the percentage of our communication that is non-face-to-face has had. If you spend more of your time communicating via e-mail and phone than you do in person, you may forget that there are higher standards of behavior that you should adhere to when you communicate in person. I know that neither of these are new insights, but...
marion at October 18, 2007 3:24 PM
3. Stand on the right when riding an escalator.
This is a pet peeve of mine...on escalators and moving walks. Somehow, Europeans tend to get this, and Americans often do not...even when there are signs saying "walk left/stand right." Why is that?!
Amy Alkon at October 18, 2007 3:24 PM
Seriously, at least some of this seems to stem from the idea that children must be allowed to Express Themselves rather than being disciplined.
I'm so with you, Marion. You reminded me of a line I wrote in my column a while back:
Amy Alkon at October 18, 2007 3:27 PM
In response to martin's comment regarding obliviousness to people outside one's bubble:
About ten years ago, when I was working as a barista in a small coffeeshop, a woman came in, walked up the counter, shoved in front of the man I was waiting on, and said "Sesame bagel with cream cheese." I replied, "Of course, just let me finish waiting on this gentleman." She turned around, jumped with shock, then turned back to me and said, "Well I don't know these things! You have to tell me!"
Needless to say, she became a regular, the kind who is always surprised that other customers have arrived before her.
A few weeks later, I was in the left-hand lane of a four-lane residential road in the neighborhood of the coffee shop, making a stop. I looked left, then right, saw the Bagel Buyer in the car next to me, thought "oh damn she drives," looked left again and prepared to move forward. Unfortunately, Bagel Buyer chose that moment to make an unsignaled left-hand turn right in front of my car. I was about a 3' away from slamming into her driver's side door when the brakes kicked in.
Stepping out of the bubble can save your life, people.
Stephanie at October 18, 2007 3:46 PM
Amy, I have three examples for you.
-----
The venue makes all the difference there can be. I have been at packed gun shows, Daytona Bike Week on Main Street and Dragoncon, and typically, the enormous armed and armored guy is pleasant to chat with and polite if he bumps into you. It appears to be the commonality of the occasion priming people to be nice to others, who are clearly neighbors of some kind. In nearly all cases, these people are outside, are ready to be seen and know that they'll be noticed. Sometimes a lesser group, such as those standing in line at a hot dog stand, can get that sort of vibe going. I find it delightful.
-----
Then, there are a couple of individual cases I found astounding.
At a grocery store with free (but not very good) wireless broadband, I was doing some surfing. I had just started the daily gig of "updates" when this fellow approached from my left and asked if I would be here long. I thought he worked there, and said no, just a few minutes - which is when he started making things up about a broken fuel gauge, etc., and can he get a ride "just down the street". At this point, I told him, "No, you'll have to find someone else". For the next few minutes, including the time it took me to get properly shut down, he insisted that I explain why I had become so negative, and tried repeatedly to get me involved in conversation; he ignored direct commands on the order of and including "be on your way". This within 300 feet of the solution to his professed problem - a gas station. I am still wondering what it is about working on a computer that would compel someone to interrupt like that; I suppose it's a need to be noticed.
At Dragoncon, I am delighted by the show. Amateur and professional, there always seems to be something I haven't seen before - and there is a lot to be seen again, like Cruxshadows, but I digress. Among the professionals, you know there is a "Walk of Fame", where we mortals can engage in conversation with people like Traci Lords and Lou Ferrigno. Some of these people are hyper-multi-talented, and the idea that they see things differently fascinates me. So, I introduce myself and get along famously. I usually have a couple of unusual questions for actors, who do have a different world, more highly competitive than most think. But then I meet one who is so eager to speak, herself, I can't get to the part about studying her show. I started out apologizing that I had missed her performance among the others in her cast, and that's all it took. I got the irrational, "Those who can't do, judge" (hello, so do those who can!) and things went downhill from there despite backpedaling on my part, culminating with "I'm a fantastic actress" and "I didn't come here to be insulted, go, and have a great weekend!". People like Ron Glass, Stephen Furst, David Faustino, Peter Jurasik, John DeLancie, Mira Furlan, George Takei and Peter Woodward don't treat me like a carnival mark, whose only purpose is to cough up cash. But the former General Ivanova does. I guess I wasn't fawning enough...
Radwaste at October 18, 2007 4:17 PM
You folks with motorcycle and car stories probably know this, but here goes:
People act that way because they don't know how to drive, or ride.
Nobody believes that - until they are shown, at a school, and then the response is the same a thousand times a year: slapped forehead, and the exclamation, "Man, how could I not have known!"
Motorcycle folks can look for the names Jason Pridmore and Keith Code. Their schools literally give you double the safety margin you had beforehand by removing the panic responses which cause you to crash. In short, nothing about driving a car or riding a motorcycle responds to your "fight or flight" response.
But people will not go to these schools as they should. They think they are "commanding" a powerful and beautiful vehicle the "right way" already, usually rationalizing accidents and their potential away.
Radwaste at October 18, 2007 4:29 PM
I suspect that people who feel powerful and like they have nothing to prove are often less rude and more polite. Like the big guy at the gun show.
Amy Alkon at October 18, 2007 5:34 PM
People like Ron Glass, Stephen Furst, David Faustino, Peter Jurasik, John DeLancie, Mira Furlan, George Takei and Peter Woodward don't treat me like a carnival mark, whose only purpose is to cough up cash. But the former General Ivanova does.
Claudia?!?
Oh well, guess she *would* have a chip on her shoulder. The others you mention didn't leave a show with a strong cult following early for "other career opportunities" only to have those opportunities totally fail to materialize.
Harlan Ellison can express himself quite...vividly, but I think he's sort of beyond conventional definitions of etiquette. Plus, he's highly entertaining. In my experience, rude people tend to be boring.
marion at October 18, 2007 6:31 PM
Interesting book regarding rudeness and general decline of civilization:
martin at October 18, 2007 6:47 PM
While I respect Cory's POV, I think bad motorcyclists are the biggest pain in the ass ever...especially the kind of guys who weave in and out of crowded freeway traffic, splitting lanes at about a zillion miles an hour. Ugh. I just moved to San Diego and am horrified at how rude the motorcyclists are!
And the MOST irritating thing is, if I hit someone who jumps in front of my car without warning, I'm the one who's going to jail! How unfair is that?
Oh, and Amy... "I don't care if it's Jesus giving you the ETA for the second coming. The sign applies to you" ...I love you! I'm going to have to steal this and throw it in someone's face. ;)
Sarah at October 18, 2007 8:28 PM
I don't have any interesting anecdotes or insights, but it seems like everything wrong with human nature is a matter of boundaries. Maybe that's pretty obvious too... A person who decides to be an asshole who keeps to himself isn't really an asshole.
> rude people tend to
> be boring.
How dare you.
Crid at October 18, 2007 9:20 PM
Unless I've missed it, nobody has mentioned loud mp3 players. Mr. I-have-an-ipod treated a few rows of passengers on the train to his music, including seat dancing and leg drumming; and that was after the woman with him had told him she could hear the music through his open earphones. "WHAT, YOU CAN HEAR THIS?" But no lowering of volume.
To continue with music. I don't expect to hear nothing of the music being practiced, but couldn't the neighbors shut the balcony doors and the windows before the kids start squeeking the same song out over and over again on their annoying instruments? Recorders are evil.
The country I am in is supposedly "child unfriendly". I didn't find it so, but many parents seem to go on the offensive and assume that any person's desire for their children to behave themselves or to be considerate of others is an infringement upon the little darling's right to free development. It's then no wonder if they grow up to be rude.
My other little bit of theorizing; I tend to assume that my tendency to find people ruder than years ago is perhaps due to getting older and I worry about slowly turning into a grouchy "things used to be better" nag. Of course, cell phone rudeness didn't really exist 30 years ago. There are some whole new areas of possibilties for rudeness. Who would have stood in line for a coffee with cell-phone holding mp3 playing people years ago? Wasn't even a line for cappuccino.
ohwell at October 19, 2007 5:54 AM
I was standing in the customer service line at Target with a friend, waiting to make a return. A roughly 40 year old woman was chatting to her older male companion loudly behind us. When a teenage girl with bright pink hair entered the store, this woman started practically shouting, "OH my GOD, why would anyone do that to their hair? That is SO disrespectful. That's just like saying F*** YOU!" At this point I calmly turned around, looked her in the eye, and said, "Pink hair is not nearly as disrespectful as saying Eff you loudly in public, especially when there are small children in line." I pointed at the 3-5 year olds in front of me.
Seriously, what is more disrespectful, dying your hair, or loudly berating people in public for doing so? Truly obnoxious.
Allison at October 19, 2007 6:05 AM
Unless I've missed it, nobody has mentioned loud mp3 players
This drives me nuts.
All in all, there's a lack of concern for anyone but oneself that seems to be epidemic.
Amy Alkon at October 19, 2007 6:37 AM
Yes! I've always hated being treated to someone else's music, even long before MP3s players. I always thought I was alone in this, because everyone around me always seems resigned to it.
But...remember that early- to mid-eighties phenomenon of people walking around with the boom boxes perched on their shoulders? I guess that was so egregious that other people probably felt justified in telling them to keep it down.
Another thing that gets on my nerves is loud gum-chewing and gum-cracking. I may really be alone on this one, but it drives me nuts to share public transportation with people chewing and cracking away like cows.
MD at October 19, 2007 7:23 AM
My fence is about four feet from the curb, and my house is about eight feet from my fence. My neighbor's window is about seven feet, total, from where cars park. What I particularly love is when people park their cars in our neighborhood and sit there with their bass booming for 10 minutes while they, I dunno, apply lipgloss or something.
Amy Alkon at October 19, 2007 7:25 AM
Marion: yep. And I was mortified, because I admire the power she can bring. I liked her work and still do, even though she had absolute crap written for her in a bunch of places in that show. I guess there was something else going on I didn't know about that set me up. So now I'm a bigger fan of the others I mentioned.
Sarah, California law expressly (good pun, eh?) permits lane-splitting. It's one of many efforts to cope with the idea that one has a right to live many miles from work. The leading motorcycle magazines try to be good citizens by publishing articles about it about twice a year. But think: doesn't the major part of your annoyance stem from the fact that they zip on down the road, and you're stuck? Have you noticed how little gas and parking space they use, too?
Now for the fun: it is possible to halt the big-noise car thumping, though it has some risk; I've seen it done. The audio cables in some hurried audio lash-ups are prone to interference. A buddy with a powerful Citizen's Band radio (OK, powerful enough to get confiscated by the FCC) would just edge closer in traffic and whistle into the microphone. The hard part is keeping a straight face after hearing the "ScreeeTHUMP" as the breakers or fuses trip, and pointedly not watching the now-furious thumper pounding on his dashboard.
Radwaste at October 19, 2007 8:33 AM
Here's how not to deal w/ someone when you think they're being "rude":
My friend is going blind b/c she has retinitis pigmentosa in addition to already being severely near sighted. Her sight is very compromised. Her vision problems have, to say the least, caused her to become fairly oblivious to her surroundings. She is acutely aware of her...unawareness, and is one of the nicest people I know.
That said, on the T this AM my friend's largish bag was imposing on some woman's space while we were all standing on the crowded train. Instead of politely tapping my friend and saying "excuse me, but your bag keeps hitting me" she started, loudly, saying stuff about her "large fucking bag" and how it kept hitting her. I noticed this and said "Hey, your bag keeps hitting that woman" so my friend apologized (she honestly couldn't tell if her bag was hitting a person or the train wall). She pulled her bag in front of her - problem solved.
Is it so hard to carry on a polite interaction? No one wants to be whacked w/ the large bags which are so common right now, but if she changed her attitude a bit maybe she'd be happier. Brooding moodily and not addressing a bothersome situation only exacerbates the frustration. The fact that this bitch was oh so passive aggressively grumbling profanities and my nearly-blind friend made me feel very little sympathy towards her - I almost wanted to keep my mouth shut and let the bag keep hitting her.
Gretchen at October 19, 2007 9:52 AM
Shawn: Nope. I'm in St. Louis, where bad driving and horrible infrastructure seen to double the amount of traffic.
Marion wrote: "I blame Dr. Spock. Seriously, at least some of this seems to stem from the idea that children must be allowed to Express Themselves rather than being disciplined."
I agree, and I have had the "pleasure" of knowing some now-adult victims of this parenting style. Children "expressing themselves naturally" beyond toddler-hood is NOT charming or cute...and it becomes significantly less charming and cute as they get older.
I've always found it interesting to see the end result of the different methods with which my sister (3 years younger than I am) were raised. I'm not sure if my mom was just plain exhausted by the time my sister reached preschool or whether the childrearing books she read convinced her that manners were stifling. Or maybe it was because my sister spent more time w/ my dad, while I spent more time with my Grandmother. But my early life was dominated by the knowledge that, to avoid a mild beating and solitary confinement, I would have to abide by the following:
*Thank-you notes WILL be written within a week of receiving a gift.
*Burping in public is something to avoid and, if it occurs, to be embarassed about.
*Food that is different from my personal taste must be politely sampled and NEVER complained about.
*While at a dinner with family or friends of your parents, you must remain seated, remain politely silent during conversation or make pertinent contributions, and politely answer questions from adults.
It has somehow been imparted on my sister that
* Thank you notes are optional. No one really wants to receive them anyway, and you're just wasting money on stamps.
* Burping is endearing. People will just smile and say "oh, that's just like so-and-so." If you are smart and funny, manners like that don't really matter. Anyone who is shocked by your behavior is just being stuffy.
* It's perfectly acceptable, to ask, "What the hell is this stuff?" When served a dish you have never seen before. If you try some, gag, spit it out, and say "eeeew," that is not a reflection on your bad manners but on the poor judgement of the host/cook to even serve it.
* If the conversation at a sit-down dinner w/ family is boring, just say "Ummm, can I GO now?" Or sigh and roll your eyes. (and, yes, my sister, at the age of 20 will, at a restaurant when with family, listen to her iPod and text-message friends, if she hasn't already answered the phone at the table).
sofar at October 19, 2007 9:58 AM
I find myself saying all the time lately where has common courtesy gone? Pet peeve: people who stand around blocking sidewalks, hallways, grocery aisles, etc chatting. I have arthritis in both knees and don't know how many times they've chosen the moment I'm maneuvering around them to step back without looking. Hello? When standing with your back to well traveled foot traffic, someone might be behind you. Queen of rudeness story: I was sitting at a bus stop at one end of the bench. A young couple with a baby get off a bus sit down. Daddy holds sleeping infant on other end of bench while Mom sits in between and lights up without so much as a do you mind then raises and lowers the cigarette so close to my knee that I feel the heat of it. I kinda felt compelled to comment so I said, "Excuse me, but could you watch out for my knee, please." I thought she was just being ignorant and unmindful but she actually shrugged and said, "Not my problem." Somehow, I no longer felt the need to treat her with respect and snarled, "It will be if you burn me because I'll shove it up your fucking ass." Needless to say, she kept it away after that. To his credit, Dad looked embarrassed by Mom and thank God the baby was sleeping.
Donna at October 19, 2007 9:58 AM
oh and...any votes for people who insist on backing out of a parking space while holding a cell to their ear?!? HINT: YOU SUCK! HANG UP!
Also, to the woman who insisted on DWTC (drive while talking on cell): 1) have your money and ticket ready to get out of the garage. Digging around your purse for 2 minutes isn't cool 2) get in the correct lane to exit the garage so you don't hold everyone up...but, hey, at least you were talking to your friend.
Gretchen at October 19, 2007 10:04 AM
Good manners aren't without rewards. I almost always write a thank you note after I'm invited to any event at anyone's house. Perhaps there are times I've forgotten, but it's typically something I do. Somebody goes to the trouble to put on a party - rarer and rarer these days - the least I can do is express a little appreciation (and I do appreciate it...especially if there's great conversation).
Anyway, Gregg and I were among a handful of people invited to a rather interesting and exclusive party a few weeks ago...and I think it was because I wrote a thank you note after the co-hostess had a party at her house a few months back. I don't know her well at all, but I think rudeness and just lack of attention to expressing appreciation is so rare that I really stood out by writing a thank you note.
Amy Alkon at October 19, 2007 10:26 AM
As a mother who's trying to raise kids to have at least some basic manners, I/ve noticed that parents now seem to treat their own kids like miniature adults who can be expected to respond to the same cues adults will.
Rolling your eyes and sighing loudly will NOT make your out of control kid settle down.
Gasping and giving your kid an incredulous look when he wallops another kid is NOT enough to teach him that that behavior is wrong.
Calling out your kid's name in an exasperated tone is NOT all it takes to let him know he's out of line.
My two main pet peeves from small-child-land:
- bringing your extra kids to a party they weren't invited to.
- parents endlessly thanking and praising their kids for exhibiting the most barely civilized behavior.
BerthaMinerva at October 19, 2007 10:41 AM
How about call-waiting (not in a business setting but on home phones and cell phones)? Fundamentally, the concept is rude (cutting off the person with whom you are speaking to immediately take up another conversation with another, then cutting that person off to return to your previous conversation). If a friend puts me on hold because, "hold on a minute, B is on the other line", if they are a repeat offender, and if I'm in anything less than a VERY good mood, I will generally just hang up. However, when used in moderation and in extrememe circumstances, I understant that call-waiting is a useful tool.
However, since (too) many people find it impossible to use ANY technology in moderation and in only extreme circumstances, you end up with the phone convo I had w/ a friend the other day when I called her:
Phone: ring ring...
Friend: Hi! How's it going?
Me: Fine. Can't wait for Friday. Hey, are you still on for dinner on Saturday?
Friend: Yeah, definitely. Where do you want to go?
Me: hmmmmm I'm thinking Thai because I don't want to spend a lot of money, you know? What do you think:
Friend: Yeah, Thai sounds good. Which restaurant?
Me: Well...ummmm...the one in my neighborhood is really busy, so I'm thinking...
Friend: (sounding impatient) Hey, uh, I've already got B on the other line, and she's probably getting sick of waiting...I'll call you back (hangs up).
Augh. If you're already talking to someone, and I call, just wait till you're done and call me back! I'll be OK, seriously!
Since this particular friend is a repeat offener, her rudeness has been brough to her attention several times. Her response, "Seriously, if someone calls me, I'm going to pick up no matter what, because what if they need me and it's an emergency?"
Um, no offense, but if its REALLY an emergency, you will NOT be the first person I call. I hope you'll understand that I would call 911!
sofar at October 19, 2007 12:12 PM
Any discussion of rudeness keeps coming back to cell phones. Has anyone had any experience with these?
There are certain FCC and import/export 'ahem' formalities involved in owning one but I'd be fascinated to know if anyone has given one of these a try.
martin at October 19, 2007 12:16 PM
Some crazy lady attacked me in Paris, made fun of my Patagonia jacket (hey it was cold and rainy) and took pictures of me.
I mean how rude can you get??
haha
midwesterner in paris at October 19, 2007 1:23 PM
I kinda felt compelled to comment so I said, "Excuse me, but could you watch out for my knee, please." I thought she was just being ignorant and unmindful but she actually shrugged and said, "Not my problem." Somehow, I no longer felt the need to treat her with respect and snarled, "It will be if you burn me because I'll shove it up your fucking ass." Needless to say, she kept it away after that. To his credit, Dad looked embarrassed by Mom and thank God the baby was sleeping.
Just noticed this one.
The person should have paid attention to you in the first place. (I call this "lunar landing behavior," as in, "Unless you came in for a lunar landing, chances are you're on earth where there are a lot of other people, a number of whom are probably very disturbed by your behavior.")
Next, they should have been apologetic that they didn't.
When all of that doesn't happen, then it gets ugly.
And why should you have to go to turbo-ugly just to get what should have been common decency in the first place?
Amy Alkon at October 19, 2007 5:03 PM
As a mother who's trying to raise kids to have at least some basic manners, I/ve noticed that parents now seem to treat their own kids like miniature adults who can be expected to respond to the same cues adults will.
You know, I think this goes beyond just the expectation that they'll respond to the same cues. Whether it's the parents who are seeking to give their 2- or 3-year-olds Ritalin because they "can't sit still" (I'm quoting from an article I read a while back) or the parents who take a six-hour flight with their tiny children without bringing anything for those kids to do, I seem to be surrounded by people who have had children without realizing that those children are not just short adults. Yes, yes, I know it's easy for the childless to criticize. But we seem to have lost track of the fact that childhood is a very specific phase of life with its own expected behaviors. Yes, your two-year-old can't sit through a two-hour wedding ceremony. Yes, your four-year-old is going to be defiant. Yes, your 18-month-old is going to get exhausted and overstimulated if you drag her along on your shopping trip during her naptime. All of those aren't bugs - they're features of those particular ages. I just wanted to bring that up because we mostly talk about the failure to discipline kids, but I think that's on the same spectrum of people who whine about the fact that their kids have different needs from theirs. And I think this...self-centeredness/lack of empathy/what have you is intimately connected to the increase in public rudeness that we're all noticing.
Don't get me started on the loud MP3 players. However, I comfort myself with the thought that, if I can hear it, the listener is damaging his/her hearing, while my delicate little ears are well-preserved.
marion at October 19, 2007 7:49 PM
I'm with you, Marion. My neighbors, as I just wrote in a column, haven't eaten at a restaurant that has waiters instead of clowns for the better part of a decade. They have two small children, and that's where you take two small children. It's the requirements of the job. It's not the kid's fault that he's acting out in many places, but the parent's fault for bringing him places he doesn't belong. Sometimes, this can't be helped. A lot of times, it's a case of "Fuck you, deal with it!" stuck on the rest of the world.
Amy Alkon at October 19, 2007 7:57 PM
How about last night - I was out on a first date with a guy, and he takes a cell phone call in the middle of dinner? It was a short convo, confirming tee-off time with his buddy. But still, I'm wondering whether to give him a second chance.
Tori at October 19, 2007 11:34 PM
How about meta-rudeness? Oops, I saw you just in time. Nothing really happened, it was all my fault and I apologize profusely. Now stop bitching at me, accept the apology and begone! Although I must add that in the vast majority of cases an irritated person turns into a friendly one at the drop of a "sorry", perhaps with added explanation and attempts, for example, to pick up the dropped goods. Sometimes an interesting acceptance of blame match ensues; now we are all friends and go on our merry way thinking good thoughts of mankind until the next person lets the door fall into our laden arms, spits on the ground right in front of us (new one that), blows smoke in our faces and barges along the sidewalk never giving way even an inch for others.
ohwell at October 20, 2007 5:14 AM
How about last night - I was out on a first date with a guy, and he takes a cell phone call in the middle of dinner? It was a short convo, confirming tee-off time with his buddy.
Tori: I'd say there's a decent chance that that was a potential save-me call. As in, if your date hadn't been going well, that call would have provided him with the excuse to leave early. Just a thought...
marion at October 20, 2007 5:16 AM
I think the "save me" call is a bit rude. If you have a date to go out to dinner, you've committed to the entire dinner. You don't need to sit through seven courses -- but you can't rush out of the restaurant saying you have a crisis with a major client in Europe or that your mother has been hit by a car.
Either party can end the date after dinner or whatever agreed on activity, at which point the onus of being polite is now on the other party who should accept the end of the date graciously.
Mario at October 20, 2007 7:08 AM
If you have a date to go out to dinner, you've committed to the entire dinner.
I agree. Which is why first dates should not be for dinner, but for drinks. And be a grownup and sit through the whole damn thing.
People who take cellphone calls in the middle of a date, who do not have a babysitter potentially calling to tell them the house is on fire and the children and the cats are crawling out the upstairs window...are offering you helpful information: Never date them again, they are rude.
Amy Alkon at October 20, 2007 7:45 AM
Just wondering... where does Miss Manners stand on this? Aren't you about to step into Judith Martin's territory? (Written in black or blue-black ink on white writing paper...)
Radwaste at October 20, 2007 9:15 AM
I don't really know or care about where the finger bowl goes, but manners in dating are very much my territory. I really like Miss Manners, although she has a rather disappointing short piece in this month's Atlantic. I usually find her wise and subtly witty.
Amy Alkon at October 20, 2007 9:56 AM
TO: Amy Alkon, et al.
RE: You Asked for It....
...so here it is.
Last January I was attending a public, i.e. membership, meeting of an organization I belong to.
The president of the organization, presiding, dropped into the vernacular because he was irritated about how some people were complaining of his over-ridding the organizations by-laws, the city ordinances, not to forget the state statutes about how a non-profit corporation should be 'managed'.
So. I raised my voice in objection to the foul language the president was using.
At this point, the president, supposedly under the concept of Robert's Rules of Order, tries to run around the grouped tables, towards the attending membership.
He is blocked by a more burly member of the Board of Directors.
At this point, he reverses direction and tries to run around the other end of the assembled tables.
Again...he is blocked by a somewhat more burly member of the BoD.
All the while, cursing and fuming a blue streak.
Finally, he returns to the head of the tables. At which point he hurls a soda-pop can at me.
This is the way to run a non-profit corporation?
Just because someone doesn't care to hear the f-bomb tossed by the president?
Regards,
Chuck(le)
Chuck Pelto at October 20, 2007 3:26 PM
I'll read other comments when I get the chance, but I have limited time online, since my connection took a dump.
Rudeness issues, where to start?
First one. Living in the ghetto, I notice people (usually men, occasionally women too) pissing wherever they please. Recently, while passing a bus shelter, I first noticed a women sitting there, looking very uncomfortable. Then I noticed the asshole standing in the corner, three feet away from her, was pissing in the corner. Another time, my partner was out with our five year old. He had discovered a little stream, running down the sidewalk, which he promptly started dropping leaves into. As there were a couple sprinklers running nearby, momma didn't think anything of it, until it suddenly stopped and this asshole steps out of the bushes, zipping up on his way out. The bar parking lot that our balcony looks out on is the worse. Regularly see men and women, using it as their personal toilet, often right under our balcony. Recently someone even took a shit down there.
Public trans is another haven for rude behavior. People who like to "share" their music with everyone, are among the worse. Then there are the people who are into mashing face, like there's no tomorrow. The worse, was the afternoon my son noticed a couple fucking, not five feet away from us - the grunting and screaming drawing his attention. The worse thing, they looked at me all pissy when I interrupted their obvious climax to bitch them out - cause I was obviously the asshole there. Not so much rude, as just incredibly annoying, are those who bust out the crack, to sell it on the trains.
So I would say the moral is;
When you need to pee outside, please find a very subtle, private spot in which to do so. Preferably not under my fucking balcony.
If you want to listen to your music on the train or bus, do as I (and most people) do, wear fucking headphones.
If you're horny, get a fucking room. Don't mash face a few feet away. People who are not you, really don't want to listen to the slurping. Some of us find it nauseating, many of our kids do to.
If you're really horny, please, please get a fucking room. Many of us would really rather not explain to our young children what you're doing. Also, while most of us would agree that sex is great, it's not so great watching others do it on the way to the store. I like porn as much as the next guy, but I prefer it on my terms, not yours. Usually when I am on the MAX, I really don't have the urge to see that.
And if you really need to sell your shite right then and there, please be more fucking subtle about it. Personally, I am all about making it legal, so assholes like you can't make a living as a criminal. But again, I really hate having to explain this sort of thing to my very inquisitive five year old, on the fly. I have already had to explain the use of illicit drugs to him. I really don't like to have this conversation on a regular basis, because you think it's ok to sell shit right in front of him. Not to mention, I still have urges to use the meth and coke on occasion. It makes it awfully tough to avoid, when assholes like you put it out in front of me. I don't go to the streets where it is readily available for a fucking reason.
I don't inflict my squalling child on others, on the rare occasions he does that in public. I don't scratch my testis in front of others, no matter how much they itch. I don't pick my nose in front of you, no matter how irritating that booger is getting. I cover my mouth with my elbow, when I have to sneeze or even cough (and make my child do the same).
I'm not asking anyone to do these things, no matter how obnoxious those behaviors can be. I don't think that I'm expecting too much, with what I am balking at. So when people insist on those behaviors around me, don't be surprised when I am an asshole about it. Including, but not limited to, taking photos of you committing such social atrocities (as soon as I get a new camera).
DuWayne at October 21, 2007 1:24 PM
A lot of excellent points brought up, many mirror my own experiences. I am a very laid back person, it takes a lot of rudeness to get me to bow up on anybody but when I do it usually is a sight to see.
When holding a door for somebody, I always tell them "you are welcome" even if they do not say thanks. To the people that mentioned the yield signs, I am 100% right there with you, they might as well take them all down, nobody heeds them at all and from what several cop friends have told me they no longer write tickets for failure to yield unless it leads to an accident.
My theory on rudeness is that it stems from what many people here have touched on, a somewhat inflated sense of self worth or entitlement, I try to explain it to people like this.
Do you remember the movie Jim Carey did "The Truman Show"? In it, Truman was the focus of every person in the world who watched the show yet he did not know this. The opposite of this is what I think is the cause for both intentional and unintentional rudeness, people are starring in their own little movie about their own lives, nothing and nobody else matters in THEIR movie, it is all about them. And also unlike "The Truman Show", nobody gives a shit about them.
I think it is more prevalent in the youth who are totally oblivious to anybody elses life outside of their own.
Rho Zeta at October 22, 2007 11:49 AM
Well, since you asked: what gets me is how rude people are on the internet. I am just appalled at how much name-calling, sarcasm, stereotyping and just plain nastiness goes on when people can't directly confront each other. And I have to include this site as well. The other day I was reading a comment where a woman called another woman an idiot and Amy congratulated her for it. How is that not rude? And your little cards on SUVs - I agree 100% that they are horrible, but, Amy, those cards are rude. You could have written a reasonable card that challenges them and gets them to think without telling them they're wretched human beings. And it's obvious from the messages that you get that you're not changing anyone's mind, you're just upsetting them and making them defensive, while the people who also have the same aggressive feelings jump on your bandwagon.
And nothing is solved.
What's wrong with us all that we have so much aggresion?
Rebecca at October 25, 2007 5:10 PM
Rebecca, those cards on SUVs are right in tune with costly signaling out of Zahavi & Zahavi ("The Handicap Principle"), and humor allowed me to spread the message for very little money ($35 for 1,000 business cards at Staples).
Would I be rude to call you humorless?
Amy Alkon at October 26, 2007 1:31 AM
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