For the life of me, I don't see why I (or anyone) would want to wear a t-shirt branding me a victim for life. It happened, yes. Do I want it to define the rest of my life? Hell, NO.

so, has baumgardner had this experience herself? I would be more inclined to accept this sort of thing from somebody that already "owns" it, though I don't know if that is a good thing or a bad one. In any case, who is she wanting to start a conversation with? Who is she trying to gain acceptance from? I suppose it could be an internal conversation, or maybe one in a group, but this certainly isn't approachable externally. Taking ownership is a little different than accepting the existance of something. Ownership implies responsibility, which would not be the case for this, seems like.

This certainly smacks of confrontation as therapy, and I dunno how well that works for people...

You're missing the point here.

This is about making men uncomfortable. It's about The Narrative™.

All men are potential rapists.

This is protection. "The Patriarchy already got me. Go find a new victim."

I don't get it. Actual feminist defense lawyers like Jeralyn Merritt of TalkLeft have been talking for years that the way to remove the stigma of rape is to have rape victims named in court.

The folks opposed to that are most of the other feminists who think that rape has such a societal stigma that the rape victims should not be named in court, only their accusers.

To that extent the pink shirt is not enough, it needs a name tag on it. "My name is Jane Jetson and I have been raped." And feminists need to start pushing to have rape victims named in court, the same as in any other crime not involving minors.

I find the "safe" also a bizarre fetish and throwback to old "patriarchal" notions of virginity.

"Young lady, the most valuable thing you have to offer your husband is your virginity.... Your virginity was stolen by rape? Time for an honor killing because you have been despoiled."

This is the best kinda blog post, where you follow the link, then come back to make a comment and see that the blogger already said it all. Props.

What sort of person thinks a passer-by is going to look at a t-shirt like this and divine all the darling little ironies and resentments, and then respond with the appropriate curiosity and concern? What kind of home do you have to be raised in to presume that's a good way to communicate with people?

(Probably one too safe and coddling.)

We need to fight snot with snot.

I resent having to offer sympathies to women who've been raped when making a comment like this, but will do so anyway. Sincerely. And more to the point, I never raped anybody.

Paglia agrees with Flynne: Bright people who've been raped figure out if their own behavior had put them at risk, and then they move forward. They're grownups: As expressed above, my sympathies are more than enough for them. But a T-shirt like this presumes a sort of worldwide fascination with one's interior life which suggests that the wearer is still at risk.

Please own the experience of reading this blog comment. Really own it.

Thank you very, very much.

Jane was the little Jetson girl, right?

Now that you mention it, I might actually take short,

I'll make her my ten-frame-per second sex toy!

Damn! Take a SHOT.

Freud just frosted my balls.

If this woman has been raped and is doing the T-shirt program because it makes her feel better for whatever reason...well, my take still aligns with Amy's, but I give her some leeway for trying to recover from the incident the best way she knows how. I don't think this is the way to do that, but at least she's trying.

If she hasn't been raped...then, OY. Couldn't the energy she's spending on this be used instead to organize self-defense classes or write a book on safety tips for women? (Yes, I know that men get raped, but she seems to want to focus on women.)

There's a part of the feminist movement that seems very invested in the idea that EVERY female has been or at some point will be raped/sexually molested/whatever. I find it icky on multiple levels, not least because I don't think it truly addresses the real issues with rape. It also, as Flynne has pointed out, perpetuates the idea of women as constant victims. That's not good for ANYONE, except maybe certain groups that are trying to boost fundraising.

I think I'm going to go read The Moon Is a Harsh Mistress again, and wish that I lived in Luna City...

Jane was the little Jetson girl, right?

Um, no.

"Meet George Jetson.
His boy, Elroy,
Daughter Judy.
Jane his wife!"

Egads, I'm almost embarrassed to admit I still remember that cartoon. Almost. Loved Astro, though (the dog, Crid, the dog!). o_O

Jane was the wife during the cartoon show. Currently she is an 18 year old living in Peoria, Arizona. She'll meet George in a few years.

Elroy's gay.

IJS

Marion, I don't think making these T-shirts "truly addresses the real issues of rape," but neither does organizing self-defense classes or writing a book of safety tips for women.

sj: So what does?

Can any investor wear these shirts or are they only for real estate and dotcom players?

I'm going to have ball caps made that say, "I'm a potential victim of a false rape charge."

Should sell like hotcakes!

I wonder how many would sell if you left out "potential" Jay

Jennifer B. has not been raped:
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/04/04/nyregion/04bigcity.html

And you may also remember her from her breast feeding escapades:
http://www.babble.com/content/articles/features/personalessays/baumgardner/breastfriends/

Of course the rape t-shirt "...will function mainly as publicity for Jennifer Baumgardner."

This woman is a slug.

From the breastfeeding piece:

"My instinct is that Anastasia sees nursing each other's babies as a way for you two to bond," she told me. "You're very close and this is an expression of that intimacy."

Amazing how some of us manage to have close friendships without passing around our excretions.

Then again, anybody up for a tupperware container of urine? You flush mine, I'll flush yours?

"Then again, anybody up for a tupperware container of urine?" Do you really want to make an offer like that on the internet??? You might get a few cases of slightly used tupperware with a surprise inside.

Nursing each other's babies is probably an interesting topic to consider.

"We" would donate breast milk -- my wife ended up donating more than I. And she did have a point about the history of wet-nurses.

I thought she failed to examine why her friend wanted to exchange nursing duties in the first place. Or why her other friend was jealous.

**I'm going to have ball caps made that say, "I'm a potential victim of a false rape charge."**

But wouldn't you need to pull down your pants for anyone to read them?

Oh, wait, BASEBALL caps! Ha!

Never mind. Carry on.

You know, this would have been hilarious had the same shirt been spotted over at, say, Engrish.com. But since it's not? Creepy central.

I think this is a symptom of that peculiar sickness that makes some people think that, a) bad things can't happen to them, and b) other people are responsible for their protection. Even 9/11, where people with cell phones had to wait for "someone else" to "do something", hasn't abated this fever. But some have been inoculated against this foolishness. Here's Julie Cochrane's story, part way down the page...

Marion, I don't think making these T-shirts "truly addresses the real issues of rape," but neither does organizing self-defense classes or writing a book of safety tips for women.

Nothing short of reorganizing our society along the exact lines of Heinlein's Luna City (not just adopting one or two elements) is ever going to *eliminate* rape. But organizing self-defense classes and writing books about living one's life safely, but to the fullest, are at least going to be more effective at *preventing some rapes* than will producing T-shirts reading, "I was raped." Having women buy guns and training them on how to use them wouldn't hurt either.

Again, nothing is going to make the rape count go to zero. Nothing. You can do everything "right" and still be raped/robbed/murdered whatever. But there are a fair number of things you can do in your life if you're a woman that will reduce your risk, starting off by following your instincts. I do think the world has room for a coordinated campaign designed to reduce the incidence of rape in a blame-free, shame-free manner. I don't think these T-shirts will accomplish that - if anything, they would appear to me to be fetishizing rape.

As a guy, I would refuse to wear a shirt that said "my girlfriend got raped and all I got was this lousy t-shirt."

Waiting for the "I got raped by a subprime mortgage" t-shirt.

Hey - you asked for the sub-prime mortgage. Frilly little interest rate and all. Your shirt would say, "I was rated." And still, people would go, "ick", then avoid you.

Rad -

agreed. That's why I don't have one. Still think the shirt would be funny.

> starting off by following
> your instincts.

Yeah that's true, but I think a person like our T-shirt maker is backhandedly announcing that she has no applicable instincts... That she has so little experience with human nature in the wild that her fantasy life has no boundaries.

> Hey - you asked for the sub-
> prime mortgage.

Man, I wish I'd said that.

About to break up the funny here...

I can see how people would find these shirts needlessly confrontational, pointless, and more.

I can also see how someone could use them to try and gain some control over the experience. Part of the whole horror of being raped is supposed to be losing your notion that you are in control of your life, your body, and even the information about both. If you are raped, usually either no one else or only 1 or 2 others know, or you report it and have to see that information get passed around and see the looks that people give you, or worse, how they refuse to meet your eyes, hear their opinions, etc. This shirt could really read "I was raped. I'm not afraid of your thoughts about it. I'm a person, too." At least, in my opinion.

This womans' motivations are unknown, and it may seem like hocus-pocus mumbo-jumbo bull to some people, but I thought I'd throw out an alternate viewpoint. YMMV

"Gaining control of an experience" sounds much like owning it.

A few things on this one...

Um, first, I'm assuming this T-shirt isn't given out as an incentive bonus to fill out a police report...so it can be bought by anybody...well:

A. Its about as likely to be worn by a wacko who equates being felt up with being raped...as someone who was actually raped.

B. It could just as easily be worn by somebody just looking for sympathy.

C. I'm not a criminal, so I don't know the criminal mind...but it seems like there'd be more than a few dangerous minds that might take it as an invitation for a "second act" if the meaning of the expression carries here.

D. Well its just bloody stupid. Why the hell would every stranger on the street want to know that?

D. Well its just bloody stupid. Why the hell would every stranger on the street want to know that?

Even stupider, why would you want them to?

Hey - you asked for the sub-prime mortgage. Frilly little interest rate and all. Your shirt would say, "I was rated." And still, people would go, "ick", then avoid you.

I thought it was for taxpayers.

You got a subprime mortage and all I got was this lousy t shirt? And the bill?

@Christina: how do you feel about the notion of many liberal defense attorneys, and many feminist ones at that, that the victims' names should be public information, and that that would help remove the stigma?

"Remove the stigma" my PC-avoiding butt.

Advertise you're a victim, you're advertising you're a loser. There's no real way to do any "ownership" crap. You can cry the rest of your life, or you can figure out how not to let it happen again. So you've been impressed by the degree of loss. It's still just losing, named after a pretty horrible act.

It's nowhere near as horrible as poisoning by methyl mercury, being tortured to death or a dozen other things which strip us of dignity just as thoroughly. Some of us are just fascinated by sex crimes.

I think "owning" an experience sounds a lot like "owning" a mistake - accepting responsibility and using it to learn. Sure, you can accept responsibility for your actions that may have made it easier to be raped, and you can use that to learn about how to be safer thereafter.

I think that what I meant was that when you say it, or wear something that says it, it could be a way to make that information yours again. The worst part for me about having painful experiences is other people talking about it, and about you as an object of pity. Having other people know of your very personal feelings and experiences and discussing it feels weird. I'm sorry I can't express this better, but the best example I can give is a death in the family. It feels wrong to have it discussed casually, and it feels wrong to have people look at you that way, to discuss you and your feelings as they look across the room. If you've ever felt irritated to be pitied, you may understand the impulse to just get it out there and not have it tip-toed around. Yes, so-and-such is dead. Yes, I've been raped.

They say that saying things like this aloud is part of the healing process. A t-shirt is not really the forum to do this as it brings others into your life without their permission to do so. It's not rational, which may be why so many have an issue with it. But I can understand it. People deal with their crazy-intense feelings in crazy-intense ways. All of which is kinda pointless given that the woman who came up with this wasn't raped. But it reminds me of breast cancer survivors who used to be expected not to talk about their illness, to wear wigs, to have prosthetic breasts, all so that others weren't made uncomfortable by their illness.

As far as rape victims being named, I can't really say that I support that. I don't think that the stigma will ever go away, and naming people against their will isn't going to have any effect.

> I think "owning" an experience sounds
> a lot like "owning" a mistake -
> accepting responsibility and using
> it to learn.

Then "accepting responsibility and using it to learn" is what we should say. Obfuscating jargon should be avoided, especially in times of profound stress (which I imagine a rape recovery would be)

Obviously the only way to deal with this nonsense is with more nonsense.
I suggest we all get shirts that say "You were asking for it, the way you were dressed", and call the NY Times for an interview.