Kudos to you for helping and you probably are a felon now..
The stupidity of politicians trying to do "good" never ceases to amaze me.

One problem is: politicians have no reason not to pass legislation. There should be some consequence, some price to be paid, some reason to ask "do we really need this?"

One idea that I like a lot: Set a hard and fast limit on the amount of legislation that can be active at any one time. It should be possible for a person to know what laws affect them - so limit the total size of legislation affecting individuals to the size of a fat novel. Further: require the laws to be written in plain English (like tax instructions).

Want to pass a new law? Which old law are you going to strike out?

This all just amounts to another way for society to shuffle aside low-status males.

In FL, it has been illegal for anyone to go through the trash for some time. The contract is between the homeowner - the waste generator - and the disposal agency, the licensed garbage company - to see that anything collected is disposed of properly w/r/t hazmat laws. Nobody is actually allowed to go shopping in your trash. That was invented by people who extended, "you gonna eat that?" opportunism to waste.

The question I'd ask is:

If they have so much free time that they can pass such needless legislation...shouldn't the community consider cutting their pay? I mean aren't they showing that they no longer have pressing or vital issues demanding great talent to deal with?

Hubby works for a recycling company. The materials set out at the curb are in fact contracted for as their goods, at least in the 4 states where they have business. So by definition, it is theft. However, by virtue of the 200,000 tons they process each month, it tells me what one man can retrieve is negligible. In addition, the market has pretty much bottomed out on recyclables right now. So whomever is digging through your trash for these days is pretty damned desperate. Maybe that's what makes everyone squirmy, the thought of someone that desperate at the end of their driveway.

What about the Freegans? Dumpster Divers?

Oh, and the homeless people used to leave our trash in a mess, too, but, wonder of wonders, I was somehow able to stop this, too, and without legislation.

How?

I left a note on a piece of hot pink typing paper taped to the top of our trash can asking them to be considerate.

My dog Lucy voted yes for this, in case you're wondering.

I do love the notion that by making something illegal, you stop it. Murder rate, anyone?

If you want to prevent somebody from going through your papers, buy a micro shredder.

If you want to guard your precious used soup cans...I guess, rent a storage unit.

The real motive for the law is the very last one cited by the city spokesman: They want to prevent "theft of recyclable material". All the rest of the justifications are just lipstick on the pig.

Probably the only thing homeless scavengers are going to steal are the alumimum soda and beer cans which also happen to be the only portion of the recycling intake that the city can expect to consistently make a profit on.

I really have mixed feelings about this. On one hand I don't begrudge the homeless who are going out and trying to make some money for themselves without begging. On the other hand, the thought of a homeless guy scattering trash all over my yard in a search for recyclables is not appealing. I'm surprised your note worked, Amy, but I'm glad it did.

What will the students do? In Boston, a lot of students would "shop" on garbage day, when people would leave out all sorts of furniture. Particularly at the end and beginning of the school year, when people would be moving.

My parents picked up some lovely furniture in the 70s this way. And when I was in grad school a few years back I knew people who were doing it, too.

I don't know -- call me crazy -- but I think they've got a point.

Also call me crazy but I'm not really keen on having desperate people encouraged to crouch on the edge of my living space pawing through my trash. They may or may not be harmless and I don't want to find out.

Sometimes I think the stance on this blog is self-contradictory. We condemn people for breaking laws with one breath then praise them the next? Likewise with being unfortunately poor. WTF? I mean aren't you wondering why anyone's desperate enough to do this? I'm betting it wasn't because they made the smart moves in life and were they doing anything else, hell, a few yards past the curb stealing from you instead of a company, you'd condemn them for it.

Seriously, I am starting to wonder where the line is drawn from they-should-have-known-better to they're-just-down-on-their-luck.

"What will the students do? In Boston, a lot of students would "shop" on garbage day, when people would leave out all sorts of furniture."

Well, one could always ask permission...

I know nothing about the 30s that I haven't read in a James M. Cain story, many of which were stories of good people who had no permanent job and making do with day jobs. Plus of course, there is the literature of Bill Bixby as the Hulk, and so many other heroes in our fiction who were basically day laborers (Kwai Chang Caine too.)

Instead of making it illegal to find day jobs, we should be making it much easier.

Would there be more jobs if employers could hire a laborer for the day or week? Are there jobs of that sort anymore, that don't require a ton of training or safety oversight?

When I lived in a house, my experience was that the City got upset with homeless people stealing THEIR recyclable material and getting paid for it. In the case where homeowners already had to separate out the recyclables, I think the City has a point about not wanting to pay twice for separation and delivery of the material.

I guess I'd rather make it easy and legal to hire a day laborer, but would say that the garbage should be left alone, especially in places where separation of the trash is already going on.

Anyway, this is rather ambiguous: "Today I even chased after a homeless guy with a big bag of empty Pellegrino bottles."

I don't like the idea of people going through my garbage, but I don't think it should be illegal. I'd rather someone dig for aluminum than go on wellfare. I don't know if we have any laws about dumpster diving here.

We don't have an issue with garbage digging where I live, but if I knew someone was going through my recycling bin, I'd probably just separate the good stuff for them and put it in a bag next to the bin.

If someone is so destitute that they are going through garbage, there is probably an issue with mental illness at play, and my heart goes out to them.

"What will the students do? In Boston, a lot of students would "shop" on garbage day, when people would leave out all sorts of furniture."

Well, one could always ask permission...

In case the people who put the stuff out at the curb are particular as to exactly who hauls it off?

If someone came to my door asking for that sort of permission, I'd have a hard time not laughing.

If someone came to my door asking for that sort of permission, I'd have a hard time not laughing.

Right? That would be me, too. I mean, really, I threw that (sofa, chair, table, whatever) out for a reason, ya know? You want it, sure, take it! o.O

Here the garbage men won't take away things like furniture and stuff that doesn't fit into a couple garbage bags. However, back a couple years ago when things were prosperous and charities weren't accepting old furniture and stuff, I'd just put it out by our garbage for a few days with a sign on it saying "Free Stuff". Then whatever didn't disappear by the end of the week, we'd load up and take to the dump. That left no moral dilemma for anyone.

In my area (Toronto, Canada), as I understand it, once items are placed curbside in the Blue Bins (recycling), they are essentially property of the city. The city sorts and recycles (or is supposed to, anyhow) and sells.

However, we also have a bottle deposit on alcohol bottles. Not enough to make it worth my while hauling empties to the liquor store, but the average home might throw out a buck's worth every couple of weeks. That means that homeless folks, or just low-rent opportunists, come around on recycling day to snag booze bottles. Which is illegal, once they're in the Blue Bin.

Personally, I put my deposit-return bottles into something other than the Blue Bin, and leave them on my bottom step (my steps go right to the sidewalk), in the apparently-universal "Take Me" position. The local bottle-scavenger gets them without worry of harassment. Bingo.

We have a right-to-work law in TX, so you can't keep people from working or attempting to. Day labor or panhandling or anything else.

When we lived in an apt, a man came twice a week diving the dumpster. Most people left their cans etc in a bag to the side for him. Why not?

Most things I freecycle. There's a market for almost anything if it's free and you're honest about it's condition etc.

Bad, bad, felonious Amy!

And to think I wrote a letter to the OC Register demanding that they keep your on-line column .... WHAT was I thinking?!

Amy,

FYI, the OC Register sent me the following response to my letter asking them to retain your column:

"Mr. R____,

First, thank you for reading the Orange County Register.

I'm sorry to say that Amy Alkon's Advice Goddess column will be online only
for the time being. We are doing our best to keep as many of the
features that readers love as possible during this difficult economic time,
but we have had to make some very hard choices. As you have probably
read, many newspaper companies, including the one that owns the Los
Angeles Times, have declared bankruptcy. Some papers, like Denver's Rocky
Mountain News and the Seattle Post-Intelligencer have closed their doors.

During this financial slump, people have stopped buying things and, as a
consequence, some of our best advertisers have stopped or cut back buying
ads. When our advertizers are hurting, it hurts your newspaper too.

You may read Amy's column online a
ocregister.com/ocregister/sections/life/columns/amyalkon/ If we see that
she has a large following online, we will continue to run her on our Web
site, and when the economy improves, consider reinstating the column in the
newspaper.

I sincerely hope that you will bear with us during this time."

Glad to do it!

> The local bottle-scavenger gets
> them without worry of harassment.
> Bingo.

Good for you and good for them.

My favorite book about this makes this case very well. A better society would allow people to comb through trash to find and trade things of value, because that's what "recycling" really means. But most us don't want winos crawling around behind our houses. It's a collision of values

Down here in the trendy downtown LA arts district, we don't get city trash pickup, so we all dump everything in the dumpster, and leave the bottles outside for the LHG (local homeless guy). Works for me. But I don't trust people pawing through bags of letters, etc. and not everyone shreds that stuff.

Where's the trendy downtown LA arts district?

Everyone I ever knew who was in a warehouse space downtown was out of there by the time of Desert Storm.

(But Moca's Helter Skelter was the best art show I ever saw)

IN FACT, before finishing this comment, I went and looked up some old articles about it. This one from the New York Times is wonderfully comical for being so prissy. I wonder if the guy would have been so unresponsive to the gore and anger if he'd known that the six was going to go up in flames just five weeks later.

The city, not the six. Sorry. Distracted by noisy neighbors....

The point is, if there's actually a bustling art scene in Los Angeles, paying attention to it may help one anticipate riots.

There are days when hubby comes home from work and I start up with the theme song from "Sanford and Son". He finds some amazing stuff. My last laptop computer (now resides on our 10-yr-old's desk) came straight from the trash at the recycling facility. Someone chucked it and it works just fine. Canning jars aplenty (brands Kerr and Ball, not just old mayo jars) and booksbooksbooks galore. Toys? Try the large Step 2 or Little Tykes cottages and slides, in good shape, not bleached out or busted up in the least bit, worth $400-500. People can't be bothered to hold a yard sale anymore? Craigslist?

There are destruction jobs from manufacturing companies that make you want to scream at them, "Donate them to a shelter and take the charitable tax deduction!" The semi-truckload of beverages from the Coke distributorship that were past their freshness date by two weeks? A truckload of fully functioning brand new Braun hair trimmers to be crushed in the baler to take them off the market?

The funny one is the magazines that are removed from the racks to make way for the next edition. More porn moves through your recycling facility than actually gets sold. I wouldn't recommend donating those anywhere....

In my neighborhood, there's a nice Filipina who pops by every trash day to get the bottles and cans from our recycling bin. I don't get the sense that she's homeless. She has a little cart and is dressed in clean clothes. She gets the stuff that can be reedemed for CRV and makes a few bucks from empties. Never makes a mess. I'm always happy to let her have stuff, and keep things separate for her. When she doesn't pick things is up is when there's a risk drunk homeless guys knocking the cans over and make a huge mess (we live on a steep hill, things go everywhere, cleaning it up takes a long time). She's a constructive part of the neighborhood ecosystem, they're a huge annoyance. I understand why people get upset with the homeless going through their trash; there are a lot more drunk/high/crazy fools than nice little ladies doing it. A new law seems excessive, since there's already laws against littering (which is the real problem when homeless make a mess of things).

It's the LAWSUITS, Julianna, not a lack of common sense by anyone in those corporations. Their attorney on staff has no doubt advised them, that in NO WAY are they to do any of these decent things, as, otherwise, they will someday be sued until broke.

"The funny one is the magazines that are removed from the racks to make way for the next edition. More porn moves through your recycling facility than actually gets sold. I wouldn't recommend donating those anywhere...."

But, of course not. My friend Apu can give me all of these he wants ... and you wonder why all of those 7-11 guys are so inattentive. It's not that they don't speak English. I mean, they don't, but that's not it. They've got years' supplies of unreturned hot babes to peruse at their leisure (I mean productivity break time, oops).