While I wouldn't put much past our out-of-control court system, something about this story smells...

Among other things: "my word against yours" is rarely enough for a conviction - there would at least have to be some additional circumstantial evidence. And if it did, the girl would then likely be removed from the home.

A small attempt at googling found no other references to this case - it is apparently not on the Internet. Anyone else have any info or links?

My word against yours might not, but a demonstrable injury would help the accuser quite a bit, sounds like that is exactly what it was.

The mother in question is clearly not the brightest individual.

If she'd been hearing threats like that for awhile, she'd have been smart to carry a tape recorder, so she'd have some support against a false allegation.

Frankly though, the root problem appears to be that she never laid a finger on her children. Firm discipline is not pleasant, but it is not abuse, clearly someone forgot to tell her the difference and where to draw the line. She seems to have gone with the no discipline route, the result is no surprise.

She tried to be a decent mother I suppose, pouring out the liquor and whatnot, have no idea what the father/husband was up to. Not much apparently.

What an abusive little heifer! Throw her out of the house says I.

One of my daughters threatened that...once. I told her to make sure she was packed and out of my house before I got back because when I got home there would definitely be a reason for me to go to jail. She never followed through on her threat. It's good for children to have a little healthy fear of their parents. However, in that mother's defense, it is possible that her daughter was just a difficult child. Of my 3 daughters, my oldest has been the only one to give me any real trouble and they have all 3 been parented the same way.

And now a sidebar from Amy Alkon*

I know this is off topic, but I just had to share this with you.

Anyway, I was sitting in a Starbucks a few weeks ago when an Arabic man sitting across from me started speaking loudly on a cell phone. I found it so charming that he shared his intimate details with everyone around him, so I introduced myself to him and he introduced himself as Achmed. Well, to make a long story short, we had a whirlwind romance and he's asked me to marry him! Of course I said YES! I can't wait to have kids with him. I LOVE KIDS and I hope my firstborn is a son so I can name him Mohammed, after the great prophet (peace be on him). I want to have as many children as possible while I still can with my new love for the future Caliphate, as he calls it. You know, religion just makes so much sense to me now.

Achmed and I have also opened a joint bank account at Bank of America - a bank I highly recommend! I don't have to worry about this bank failing due to the bad economy due to the wise intervention of the federal government in the banking system. I'm all for government intervention - the more the better, I say!

Anyway, gotta run. I need to check out some hijab in local stores.

*Not really. Happy April Fool’s Day!

I think for the last couple of decades every kid tries that bluff once. When my daughter did, I said there's the phone, be my guest but make damned sure you want nothing to do with me again because they will take you away and not let you live in mommy's home again and I sure as hell won't be willing to risk such lies about me anyway. She thought about it, realized the threat could never be anything but empty and never used it again.

I too think this story sounds rather made up. But what's disturbing is that this kid is a teenager and threatening it. If true, someone is horribly lacking in parenting skills because that kind of threat should have been nipped in the bud around the age of 8, give or take.

It just doesn't sound plausible, though. This wild child is old and world weary enough to run around with two different boys in one night and drink but not savy enough to know what hell her life would be if she picked up that phone and made false accusations against her mother and/or father? To paraphrase Judge Judy, it just doesn't have the ring of truth. I don't buy it.

Damn. If my kid had made that threat to me, she'd have gotten the back of my hand.

And she could call the cops after she was through picking up her teeth.

Buh bye, sweetie.

When your daughter has demonstrated that she's in charge, it's time for her to be 100% in charge by herself. Especially when she's demonstrated the perfect profile of a sociopath; a manipulative little con, a sense of entitlement, pathological liar, lack of remorse, shallow emotions, incapacity for love, impulsivity, promiscuity, delinquency, the list goes on and on. This little monster has rung all the bells. Time to cut her loose and save the rest of the family.

I threatened to run away once and only once when I was about 13. My mom went to get the phone book and opened it to child services. She said good - GO! You can live in a foster home with 10 other kids. Do you think they will buy $60 jeans for you and you'll get your own room?

I wasn't spoiled by any means, but once I really thought about it, that life would have been a lot worse than I *thought* mine was at the time!

My mom is great - I still use a lot of her tactics with my kids!

I wholeheartedly agree that ALL kids need a healthy fear of their parents. I have that problem with my SO's kids. I demand respect and follow through with discipline (with all kids) unlike their own mom unfortunately. I am labeled mean (by her, not the kids). In spite of her opinion of me, we can take them everywhere and anywhere and have model children (with 6), their mother can't go with them to even the gas station without a temper tantrum!

A small attempt at googling found no other references to this case

It's escaped you that newspapers are firing their staffs and going out of business? Many, many stories go unreported and many more will very soon.

The legal system allows women to abuse other people. Social customs and the laws themselves unreasonably favor women in evidentiary disputes.

Typically, massive injustice against men moves neither men nor women to fix the problem. But a few, isolated cases like this -- injustices against a woman -- will provoke a huge reaction.

Bitter-sweet.

The kid would be in a foster home the next day if she ever tried that here. You will only get what you tolerate. Our house, our rules.

Once they are on their own, they are free to do what they like. My kids never had a problem with it. They were also too busy with sports and other activities to get into trouble.

I still cringe when I see these gangs of kids hanging around the mall. What are their parents thinking?

I have to agree with the first commenter. I have no way to prove that this story is false (or perhaps only half-true), but it just doesn't smell quite right.

For one thing, in the first paragraph, she refers to an "us" which implies that there was another adult in the household. So presumably there would have been another witness to the girl's prior threats, misbehavior, etc. Also, there is nothing said about what kind of lawyer did the woman have, a public defender or a private lawyer, or did she try to represent herself?

Having said that, I agree that the criminal "justice" system is so out of control that something like this undoubtedly *could* happen.

Okay, I think Thomas Fullery-as-Amy is hysterical, even if nobody else does.

The situation with my stepdaughter started sounding like it was headed the same way as the girl in the article. When she'd get punished for something she did - we'd later catch wind of extravagant tales of the "hell" she was living in.
The worst exaggerations were about me. When we found out that she had not only tried to make her friends' parents think I was an abuser but also a molester - but was proud of her efforts - she decided to move in with her father (who lives in a nearby city) as she couldn't understand why we were so pissed off and weren't letting her do the stuff she wants because she "said that stuff so long ago, get over it."

Fortunately, most of these people know her well enough to know she's a rather frequent liar (as well as being textbook ODD), and don't take her claims seriously - as her own actions make her out to be a liar. For example, she wanted to move BACK with us because we have a nicer/larger house and computers and whatnot. That's not the actions of someone who's in fear of of violent assault.

After over 4 years of trying to help her learn that lying is wrong and that these things she does is not in her own best interest and trying to work with counselors and such - I don't think I can easily say I WANT her back in our house.

My guess is that kid is just wired wrong.

I see kids like that once in a while. The sad part is, they are tough and savvy, like they think. Sure, it is easy to roll mom or dad with their stunts, they can even pull it in schools now, or intimidate suburban folks, who similarly fear the consequences of a mere allegation.

But in a few years, she will be out on her own. And with her behavior, she may well fall in with a crowd that don't really care much about people calling the cops. They will really beat her, maybe worse, for the sh-t she pulls.

Kids sometimes fail to apprehend that parental protection ends at some point, and then a world of uncaring people stands ready, *very* eager to interact with the cocksure, naive kid who thinks they are going to keep rolling people.

errata

"The sad part is, they are NOT tough and savvy, like they think."

I'd kick that kid out of my house. I wouldn't hesitate to do so. You cannot reason with children like that, and after a police charge of assault and being arrested in front of my neighbors, I'd lay it out; get out, or I'll force you out. Nobody should be a prison in thier own home.

Think of it as a Paternal Castle Doctrine ;)

(no april fools, I really would give her the boot)

Curious: does this happen with the males? or is it just females?

One of my friends had her stepson call the police on her for child abuse.

The police went to the house immediately - but after meeting with the parents and checking the stepson for priors (he'd apparently been a frequent flier of juvenile court), they decided the complaint was without merit.

"I actually recall doing it once in Shiawassee Park in Farmington, Michigan...flapping my arms and just taking off and buzzing around"

Is there a home movie of this that you could share with us?

This is why you can't wait till they are older to get a handle on it... discipline is established early on. Sad as it is, the door may be the only way for this one. If the kid is that old anyway, they are capable of making decisions even if they aren't perfect ones. There are some really sad things in this life, and having to let your kid go in this way is one of them, because the only options are bad or worse. At some point in time you can no longer control them. Normally a natural thing, but sometimes forced.

I don't know if this story is true or not and really don't care. With current abuse hysteria, this could have happened to the woman and I know of many similar false abuse claims that have been filed aganst men. As a society, we don't really care about fairness to men but eventually, once men have been sufficiently disempowered, the various victim groups will start to fight it out among themselves to see who is the biggest victim (in this case: child or woman?) Look at Oprah's all girl school where another girl on girl sex scandal has erupted. What will happen when people are being horribly abused but no men are involved? I'm sure there are trial lawyers who are already working on the possible scenarios.

See, I would ahve called the cops for her. Told her she was welcome to go live a foster family who would give her no allowance, probably not even her own room, no electronic goodies, etc. If you think you can do better elsewhere, go for it! Is my parenting motto. And I refuse to live in fear of my kids.

Not that that would happen here. Mine have heard No since they were born, pretty much, when it was appropriate.

She needs to let that kid go.

T's, it rings true to me. I grew up around some kids who were pretty much like that. One girl I knew was prostituting herself at the age of 15, and her mother had no idea. A guy I grew up with, who turned out to be a hood, was already a hood in the third grade; by the time he was 10 he was a slick, experienced liar and con man who habitually stole things from classmates and always talked his way out of it.

I agree with Juliana that the daughter is a sociopath. There is no treatment for sociopathy, and from what I've read about it, most sociopaths are born, not made. So it's quite possible that she was raised by exemplorary parents but, like my third-grade acquiantance, she was just born bad. Anyway, at this point, there is nothing the family can do, except put distance between them. If it were my daughter, and considering all of the hell she has probably put the family through already, I'm afraid my response would have to be: "You have violated a fundemental trust. As a result, it is no longer possible for you to continue living in this household. You have fifteen minutes to pack a bag. When you're done, there's the door." And the next day, get all the locks changed. Actions have consequences.

And, it's totally possible to get a conviction in a DV case with nothing other than the "victim"'s say-so. Glenn Sacks has many documented examples. The only thing unusual about this case is that there is no man involved. However, as Glenn has documented cases involving lesbian couples, the court will always cast whichever party is the more repsonsible, adult person into the "provider" role and assign that person all of the responsibility for the outcome. The person who gets the "providee" role has no responsbilities and is completely privileged. In this case, the mother was clearly the party who acted more responsibly, so she got assigned the provider role. Everything that happened after that was per the script.

The daughter should be kicked out of the house and left to fend for herself. I think she's a sociopath because she only sees other people as pawns in her life, and has no empathy. A great book is 'Without Conscience' by Robert D. Hare. There's no changing people like the daughter, because she sees nothing wrong with what she does.

I'm a little confused about the story, maybe someone here could clarify?

At the beginning of the mother's post, she writes her "then-17 year old daughter was out of control." Does that mean that this incident happened awhile ago? Also, is she implying that the daughter was out of control then, but isn't at this point?

Briefly, I am not sure what you can infer about parenting from the description.

I think the girl's behavior was "rational" in the sense that she had a problem she wanted to solve and knowing the rules, incentives, and punishments in the system, she solved the problem accordingly and without breaking any rules.

How was her behavior different from anyone who says, "I didn't make the rules, I am just playing the game"?

During our divorce my ex regularly accused me of domestic violence, rape, child molestation and used that to her benefit to get the court orders and judgments she needed. None of these accusations were true, she couldn't substantiate any of them, and yet she still got the orders she needed, because her claims were so devastating the court had to be careful. My ex has a Ph.D in psychology. She worked the court and got exactly what she needed and later told me she was doing only what she needed to do. So it was my fault that I forced her to lie to the court. In what way was my ex being irrational?

We give incentives for people to lie and there is no punishment for being found out. When they lie, when they abuse the process, why do we act surprised?

My surprise in this is the cops reactions which sound unbelievable and would never make it into a script as they lack sufficient cynicism and disbelief in the girl or the system.

I've heard that the educational system might be culpable in this type of threatening behavior. My aunt used to babysit her grandson quite regularly and he said that if she tried to discipline him he would call the police and tell them she was abusing him. He claimed that he was told that in school--by teachers and staff, not by other students.

Does this line seem probable to you?

| Our neighbor finally told us what
| was going on; her bedroom is
| upstairs so I had no idea she could
| do this undetected.

Not to me. Good families always know where everybody is. The parents know where the kids are, the kids know where the parents are, each parent knows where the other one is... That's just how it works. Even for grown children after college, it's simple courtesy to let people know where you are and when you'll be back. I'd bet there are very, very few loving families where people don't know what's going on with each member of the household all the time. (Connor has soccer practice on Thursdays and is late for dinner, but gets a ride home with the Hendersons; Dad usually stops by the office for 20 minutes early on Sunday night.)

From the very specific to the very general:

| She had no sense of
| responsibility whatsoever, did no
| chores, and her language was as
| vulgar as it gets.

These are not problems that pop up overnight.

Here's the daytime television payoff:

| I haven't the words to describe
| how this made me feel.

Words! Words for deep feeling! Straight out of Oprah's playbook.

It's impossible to tell how much editing has gone into a piece like this, but it's a safe bet the family wasn't cruising along nicely before this happened.

Also, notice that she refers to "my husband", not "her father." Just saying.

Not only that, the thing has the odor of a small-minded woman complaining that some longtime friend done her wrong, in a 7th-grade kind of way; stole a boyfriend, or a favorite hairbrush, or told lies to some fifth party in a prom night intrigue. You sure don't get the sense that she's talking about the her daughter, the young woman to whom she gave life and who she's guided to adulthood.

I'm not saying that stupid, small-minded people shouldn't have kids, because the world needs their kind, too. But it's the same reason you can never listen to more than about 3 minutes of Dr Laura... These people seemed to have been raised without boundaries and are making a point of raising the next generation that way too. Their brains stopped growing at age 12, which the reason the rest of us were so eager to get out of high school with them...

"I'm not saying that stupid, small-minded people shouldn't have kids, because the world needs their kind, too."

Whatever for? What good are stupid, small-minded people to anyone, and for what?

I have no doubt there are kids totally corrupted at an early age.

I come from white trash and grew up amongst white trash. Other families aside: I had a sister shoplifting, smoking, running away, breaking into a store at 5! I don't doubt the story because I believe all babes are innocent. I doubt the story because of the inconsistencies in it.

In addition to what Crid points out above, just the fact that this kid is savy enough to actually get mom arrested but has no clue as to what having mom arrested implies for her immediate comfort and well-being? Gimme a break.

Of course, lie or not, it is at least bringing up and getting an important issue discussed.

Frankly, if my daughter -- who I'd do damned near anything for and have forgiven a lot -- ever lied about me to the point of threatening my freedom, I'd have no daughter any more. Period. Point blank.

I'd sue for and get visitation rights to T but the extent of contact with his mother would be limited to handing him off and being civil at things like his graduation and wedding.

However, low as my daughter has sunk at times, this is a low I know she would never hit. There's a reason I know this. And it does make me question what came before in 17 years that it wasn't a bluff backed down from when called on like the parents here have said they've done.

Just the fact that this kid is savy enough to actually get mom arrested but has no clue as to what having mom arrested implies for her immediate comfort and well-being?

My own mother has an enormous threshhold for what she will tolerate from her children. My sister is 49 and living in the basement with her boyfriend, and I won't go into all the things she has pulled here that should have gotten her tossed out of the house. She stays because my mother is so scared of being abandoned and being a "bad mom" that she will put up with anything. That's why I have no problem believing this girl could set fire to her room and still have a place to sleep.

Hmm. Maybe I need to go read it again. Crid, are you saying you think the husband is not the girl's father? Could be. I hadn't thought of that.

Never, ever underestimate a teen's ability to cut off her nose to spite her face. I doubt she gave one realistic thought to what happened after. We are talking about the age group that runs away to california to become stars, after all.

yes, the schools are culpable. my four kids each heard all about being abused and calling 'child abuse' in the 3rd grade.

then, right on schedule, heretofore unheard of defiance began along with taunts of "i'm gonna tell my teacher!" and "i'm gonna call child abuse"...

this crap was a recurring theme with the kids. for being grounded, for being refused extra dessert, for being forced to go to bed... i finally got sick of it. the last time i heard that crap from my kids was when i placed my my very very naughty 10 yr old boy in a headlock whilst i punched random numbers into the telephone inbetween smacking him. "here. tell child abuse about THIS one!"

thanks school experts, for disrupting my family life and giving the kids several years of misery while they attempted to circumvent my authority. i already had a hard enough time keeping my kids under my thumb without a father for them.

it was one of the worst periods (yes, worse than when they were teens) we went through. i barely hung in there. if i hadn't been as stubborn as i am... ugh.

i'm still furious.

The writing tells me that this is probably a mom who wanted to be her daughter's "friend" more than a mom for most of her life, and then when she suddenly started saying "no" and acting more authoritarian than before, this is the monster she created.

Like Crid, I'm guessing that the bio-dad isn't there - she says "my husband" not "her dad". Years of reading Ann Landers & et al tell me that's code for "step-dad". Just instinct, but seems more than probable.

That being said, there is such a thing as a bad seed and children who will act out just to act out. Each of my two brothers and myself were raised the same, same values, same family structure (no divorce), same everything. Yet when he's around 13, my younger brother told a close family friend he was being physically abused by my dad.

No such abuse ever happened. What did happen is that my brother's increasing habit of lying about EVERYTHING was beginning to infect his school life, and he was lying about report cards, grades, and how the teachers were treating him. So my dad got real mad and yelled at him (and I mean really yelled). He and my dad had never been close, and he got so mad, he started telling people that he was abused.

That stopped when I backed him into a corner and explained to him in a not-so-nice way that they take kids away from parents who are abusive, and if he didn't quit telling people lies about my parents, I would beat him into oblivion, as a loving sister.

The saddest part... he's 23 and has learned that playing the victim earns him leeway where there didn't used to be any. So now he tells everyone he was abused (he wasn't), he has cancer (he doesn't), and a score of other lies. Anything to make himself look good.

He wasn't raised any different from my older brother & me... what makes him act like such a dick?

"He wasn't raised any different from my older brother & me... what makes him act like such a dick?"

Some people are just horrible people. I can believe this sh-t, since my ex-girlfriend threatened to call the police on me for no reason and out of the blue recently.

... and one of the most annoying parts is, people I tell automatically assume I must've done something bad. Yeah. Men are evil remember, women are sweet.

I guess the same is true of parents, people hear rumors spread by kids, and it damages the parents reputations. I remember seeing a show once where a girl eventually admitted that she had completely made up stories about the school bus driver molesting her, after the damage had been done. Yet I remember how even after admitting it, they showed little old ladies of the town saying they still believe it because, you know, "where there's smoke there's fire".

..

this story may be inconsistent, but that doesn't take away from it being very real for some parents/families. those who were able to successfully threaten their children/siblings into more acceptable behavior did well, and were lucky. it seems too few responders recognized this very real behavior in some humans as a sociopathy. i've lived it from my teen daughter. and have met many foster, adoptive, and biological parents who have lived it also.
amy- i'm usually with you on your posts, but even if this story is not fully accurate, you're way off with your comment:
"but, just guessing...child raised without boundaries? It sounds like there was a father present (in bodily terms, at least)...so...what were these two genetic material providers doing when they were supposed to be parenting their daughter?"
i was there 72 hours a day for my daughter, boundaries mean next to nothing to her and are accepted only when she finds them acceptable to her immediate circumstances. parents can be there, they can set boundaries, and they can parent, but there are some humans who are wired to not accept anything, even what will cause harm to themselves if they want revenge or some other goal.
and to those of you who said to kick her out, don't forget the law says you are responsible for the kids' actions until s/he turns 18. in some states if s/he commits a crime, you as the parent get to go to jail also. it's not always so easy as showing them the door.
what this girl did is well beyond usual teen rebellion that can be parented, teens and adults like this girl (if she isn't real there are others like her who are) need serious psychiatric help and medication even to find happiness for, and healthy relationships with, themselves.
this story true or not, the situation is real for many parents. we don't always find support in the schools, community, from the police, the courts, or others either. and don't ignore the hell parents of such people live through as they watch their children self destruct.