A Child Support Story
Tony Fantetti posted his story in the comments on the post about the realities of some of the guys who get dubbed "deadbeat dads." I'm reposting it here:
I was fired from my last job after the "Fugitive Warrant Unit" went to my former employer's place of business to arrest me on a Civil Contempt Warrant.I was found guilty of contempt in absentia for "refusing" to pay the court cost (as ordered) associated with my divorce, and sentenced to 60 days incarceration. Debtor's prison I suppose.
I couldn't pay court costs because I was indigent. I was indigent because my income was regularly seized for "child support."
I challenge anyone reading this to slice 70% of their net monthly income out of their monthly budget and to simultaneously continue to support their family.
I saw a recent (published) study that found only between 1/3 and 1/5 of a father's "child support payment" is actually spent on the children. The rest supports the custodial mother's lifestyle.
I couldn't pay my utility bills, my mortgages (my three homes were foreclosed), car payment, went bankrupt and lost my entire (nearly six-figure) life's savings.
I felt less than worthless when during a brutally cold Midwest winter day my daughter would look me square in the eyes and through the fog of her breath and while wearing a coat hat and gloves inside our "home" innocently ask, "why is it always cold over here daddy?"
Back then, I was fortunate enough to have my daughter exactly 50% of the time. Sadly, most of my parenting time was revoked after I moved out of state to secure a job one year post-termination.
I wanted to have my daughter's step mom (my wife)exercise my weekday parenting time so I could "visit" my daughter via webcam over the internet and continue doing her homework with her.
The court wouldn't allow just a "step-mom" whose a "nobody" to exercise my parenting time to establish interstate "visitation" over the internet.My daughter has fallen from her advanced level standing in school since then.
I was essentially punished for "willfully" moving away from my eight year old daughter. The three of us cried immensely.
Either I moved out of state to secure a job and continue paying my financially devastating "child support" obligation, or I face a felony "deadbeat" indictment for "refusing" to pay child support following the cessation of my unemployment compensation.
After "the system" forced me into poverty then caused me to be fired from my job (for the first time in my life) over a mere $663 in court costs, I was awarded unemployment benefits.
After my motion to reduce my child support was denied to account for my new and significantly lower monthly income of $1688 in unemployment compensation. The Hamilton County "Child Support" Enforcement Agency raised my order to over $1000/mo. Under Ohio law, they can seize up to 65% of a father's net monthly income for "child support."
I was left with a meager $848 a month to support a family of five (my two step sons included) while gasoline was over $4.00 per gallon.
Thankfully, we lived on a busy street and could hold weekly yard sales that we jokingly called "garbage sales" given we "garbage-picked" three to five times weekly to earn money for food and to keep the utilities on.
Today I drive over 1100 miles bi-weekly (assuming my vehicle is road worthy) to see my daughter for sometimes only 28 hours during my visitation.
I've lost much of the "visitation time" I was awarded due to travel time. That can be over 20 hours round trip, depending on traffic.
The court refused to allow my wife to pick my step daughter up in place of me on Friday nights, so that day was taken away.
I'm allowed to pick my daughter up every other Saturday morning. I must return her early Sunday morning to make the return trip (up to ten hours) home.
Sadly, I can no longer sustain my present "visitation schedule." I can't afford it as my child support has been raised yet again to over $1200 per month to satisfy an arrears that never existed.
After they seized nearly $4,000 in my present wife's income tax rebates and refunds to satisfy the non-existent aforementioned $2,700 arrears, it was erased.
However, they continue taking an additional $200 per month of my net pay and will do so until my outstanding arrears of $0 is paid in full.
That will continue until I can pay an attorney to fight the insanity now that I'm a "long distance deadbeat."
Admittedly, I still feel guilty for leaving the state to secure employment and feel I've abandoned my daughter.
At times, I must look away from her smiling face in that school picture of her hanging in my cubicle at work.Otherwise, the guilt associated with abandoning her would overwhelm me and and cause me to cry uncontrollably at work. Thank God I was raised to suppress my emotions and 'suck it up."
However, the alternative to me moving ten hours away from her,was an impending felony conviction as a "deadbeat dad" and most likely, a one year prison sentence for my first offense.
Next, I (and like many Ohio fathers) probably would have been re-indicted during my incarceration on a more serious felony charge carrying a 2-5 year prison sentence for "refusing" to pay my child support during my incarceration and while earning maybe .20 cents an hour in prison wages.
This is because the State of Ohio considers child support paying fathers who are incarcerated to be voluntarily under-employed and "refusing" to pay their child support.
I hope you know how much words fail to express my gratitude for your efforts on behalf of fathers Amy. Thanks again.
Tony
Dude. Sorry to hear of it. I thought the 53% of take home I'm paying was bad. Whenever I think that, I run across someone whose got it worse. If I wasn't 1500 miles away, I'd buy you a beer.
It's small consolation, but your kids will figure it out, when they grow up. They'll remember who fought for them.
Fall down 7 times.
Get back up 8.
SwissArmyD at May 1, 2009 8:03 AM
For men, getting married and/or having children is like inviting Dracula over the threshhold.
I must assume this is the way women want it. Yet, they still endlessly bitch about men's fear of commitment.
Jay R at May 1, 2009 8:10 AM
"I must assume this is the way women want it."
It may look that way from where you stand, but women didn't make these laws, or for the most part run the courts that execute them.* Blame chivalrous men. You can bet that the woman married to this guy doesn't want it this way, for starters. His mother doesn't want it this way either, probably.
I bet you could even dig up case where the custodial mother has sent back some of the CS to help even things out. I can easily imagine a situation where in the heat of battle during the divorce the mom extracts a really lop-sided CS arrangement, but then as tempers cool she sees how it is hurting her kid/s, because ther eare in fact mothers who care more about what is good for their kids than what is bad for their exes. It does happen; there really are grown women out there. And then she finds that there is almost no way to get it changed in the courts, because the state is making so much money off of holding her CS payments for several weeks before they get disbursed. Hm, what to do? When the law is an ass, someone has to step up and be the vibrator.
*Someone could do a very interesting study looking at gender bias in family court decisions comapring male and female judges. The conventional wisdom is that women judges favor women less and are more even-handed.
Jim at May 1, 2009 8:35 AM
It's pretty baffling to me that anyone is forced to pay out over 50% of their income, but I don't think that's the case here, as we are not an alimony state, the CS cap is around 25%, and we are also a community property state (i.e. the couple splits what was earned/aquired only during the marriage.) However, it's my understanding that Dad's often required to pay the child's health insurance ($250/month at a minimum, I'd guess), plus all or a portion of private school or preschool tuition, depending on the divorce decree. Really, though, I don't know: my parents are still married, and so am I.
My friend and her husband have 3 children; he also has one from a previous marriage. They have calculated that, if they were to divorce, he would be able to contribute substantially more of his income to his wife and 3 daughters, because if you've got more than one CS order, there is a smaller cap per child. (As it is, he's paying something like 1/4 of his income, plus insurance, to his ex- who outearns him and is remarried to someone who is rather wealthy- when he has 3 children with whom he lives. So 75% of his offspring are supported by less than 70% of his income.) Lucky for him, my friend-his wife- is a high earner.
ahw at May 1, 2009 9:15 AM
I don't know Jim....unless child support works differently south of the border.
It's true our divorce settlement required some amount of child support, but I never really wanted any as I was always the primary earner and I thought the amount they chose was ridiculous. While the laywers were involved, I was pretty much forced to take some money which I deposited into my son's account, but as soon as they were gone I just quit cashing the cheques and eventually he quit sending them. Being an "adult woman" I just avoid the system.
Isn't it true that the only way a guy is forced into the system is if the woman pushes him into it?
moreta at May 1, 2009 9:17 AM
Ohio sucks. I live there and can't wait to move. Ohio has some of the most ass backwards laws. I could go on and on about them.
My FIL was arrested for failure to pay child support. He had been paying, to my MIL directly. The state didn't like that. Never mind he had receipts from her. The judge wouldn't even look @ them. The judge also made him pay for a period of time where he had custody of my husband. My FIL is disabled, living off of social security, and barely makes ends meet. He'll be paying back child support until the day he dies.
He's been paying $250.00 a month for twelve years. My MIL has received $200.00 of that money. (She had gave the money to DH to return to his father.)
Every month, my FIL gets a letter from the state of Ohio, threatening him w/ arrest because he hasn't paid. He has to mail his receipts in to prove he's been paying. (He lives in TN now.)
What gets me, is over half of his payments go towards administrative costs. Administrative costs for what? They aren't administrating anything.
A few years ago, there was a huge story about how the state is sitting on a Billion dollar + of child support payments. To my knowledge, the money still hasn't been disbursed. The story was pretty much killed in the papers.
The bureaucracy here is mind numbingly fucked. DH and I have already agreed, that if we do divorce, we're going out of state to do it. I don't want to see him crippled financially and he doesn't want to see me crippled either. We would want a 50/50 split of custody and possessions. You can't get that in Ohio if there are kids involved. The state throws out whatever agreements the two parties have and enforces their draconian views of how it should be. All for the children's sake.
I'm sorry if this post is a bit off. I've been up for over 24 hrs. *Insomnia sucks!*
Truth at May 1, 2009 9:30 AM
These things vary by state. Just like alimony and palimony (California). Some states leave it up to the mom to pursue CS payments. Some states clean out the father without involving the mom.
A far as all this goes my finger points to both the system that can't adapt to modern times and stay at homes. The system has a formula to figure this out. If the stay at home is a vicious conniving wretch they can stay home "for the kids" then after five years or seven depending on the state they file for divorce and are then declared destitute as their last 5/7 years of income is zero. Stay at homes (especially after 5 years) have lots of time to lobby for all these great deals.
vlad at May 1, 2009 9:40 AM
The way Ohio is set up (and I understand several other states) that even if you have every canceled check and a signed receipt from the ex, the judge (system) does not have to accept that you have been paying your child support.
You have to pay it through the county's Child Support Enforcement Agency. If they don't have a record of the payment, you are a deadbeat and they will come after you. This also means that the county has a processing fee and takes it's sweet time before disbursing the money. It is legalized theft.
Jim P. at May 1, 2009 9:47 AM
The system is broken.
It needs to be fixed.
The problem is that fixing a broken system is even harder than making one from scratch.
The horrendous abuses of said system are largely out of the public eye, and as such are low priority and high risk. They are high risk because certain parties, chiefly left wing women, (Deny it if you like, but it is feminist organizations out to protect female privilege that would scream the loudest) have a vested interest in this system.
For it to change, even if every man in the country simultaneously marched on courthouses and legislatures, it would not be enough.
The fact is that we need SANE women to take action as well as sane men.
What will prompt this?
When women are forced to ask themselves, "Is this the system I want my son to live under?"
I'm not a big fan of the 1960's, but it would be nice to see the general population interested in promoting serious change.
Robert at May 1, 2009 10:04 AM
"It's small consolation, but your kids will figure it out, when they grow up. They'll remember who fought for them."
SwissArmy D is right; UNLESS the mom does a stellar job of brainwashing the kids so that they never want to see dad again. It took me a long time to realize everything that happened. My p's had a textbook 80's divorce. Dad's departure was pretty despicable (his dirty tactics were leverage to get her to agree to the divorce), but he provided financially. Mom bitched incessantly about how impoverished we were, slandered Dad, and terrorized us, but I finally put two and two together. The CS definitely went to her lifestyle. She socked away $50k a year (early 1980's dollars) half of which was child support, the other half alimony, and wouldn't spend anything on us, because it was "her" money. She shopped at Talbot's, and my stepmother took us shopping out of sheer disgust at the state of our clothes whenever we visited. Mom went so far as to present us with itemized bills on how much beyond the CS we cost her. This included mortgage payments, so I asked if when she sold the house, would my brother and I get proceeds from the sale? All I got was a slapped face for my answer.
The irony being, Dad has never badmouthed Mom, but he has always truthfully answered my questions, now that I'm old enough, parenting enough, and married enough to get it.
The situation SCREAMS for accountability. If anyone can save up their receipts for expense reports for an employer, why can't it be done for this? I know, I know, I'm being naive.....
Juliana at May 1, 2009 11:17 AM
Oh, Jay R. For goodness' sakes, grow a pair.
Oh, wait. *snerk*
Most married guys, at least the ones I know, weren't sold into marriage from some Eastern bloc country. They even got a say in who they married!
Our child support system is totally fucked, and it's going to stay fucked because state bureaucracy has a stake in keeping it fucked.
Seriously, though, 1,000 a month?! Are they really that expensive?
hamsa at May 1, 2009 11:41 AM
If anyone can save up their receipts for expense reports for an employer, why can't it be done for this?
For the simple fact that receipts and direct payments don't let the government get its cut.
The old line: Don't steal; the government hates competition.
Jim P. at May 1, 2009 12:00 PM
"Seriously, though, 1,000 a month?! Are they really that expensive?" hamsa
Depends on where they figure it out. My state has a formula. What you both make, minus some stuff, depending on who they live with most, sprinkle with fairy dust, and out pops a number. THEN they take that number and divide it based on the percentages you pay into the whole. In my case I make 75% of the whole so I have to pay 75% of everything. Other obligations are taken into account on both sides, of course... This also counts for extraordinary medical costs, they are percentaged by the split. Luckily I have it in the decree that she has to pay and then I re-imburse, else she would never feel the pain.
You can see how this might incentivise an engineer to instead make minimum wage part time answering phones. As long as I have a decent job where the CS and alimony are enough for her to live on... why should she have the added stress of having a career?
Bofore you say it, yes I could take her to court for being under employed. My lawyer estimated it would cost $4-6K and he said it was unlikely that I would win, and even if I did, she would likely not pay... and I would never recoup the loss, so what's the point?
It's simple. When you are this close to the edge, you have to be pragmatic. Tilting at windmills is all well and good if you have plenty o'money to burn. But when your ex's answer to making her let you have the kids at Christmas every other year [per the decree] is "so? sue me." You know that you have to look to the day When the kids are grown up, because there is almost nothing to be done. Without hiring a lawyer, naturally. How're you gonna afford that? AND going to court can make things worse if you lose, so there isn't much upside.
What my ex doesn't realise is 2 things. One is that when the CS and alimony end, she will be 50, and have no experience doing anything. I'm thinkin' the reality check will be ugly.
#2 is that my son, almost 15, has already figured out who got the studio apt. and who got the 4 bedroom house. Think it might effect his interest in marriage? Could be.
SwissArmyD at May 1, 2009 12:29 PM
Swiss, my husband's parents were divorced, and his mother was a bit of a spoiled bitch... and he still married me. But, I'm nothing like his mother. (At 28, I've already worked for 12 years, vs. her lifetime total of 10; and that's just a start.) Maybe he'll just avoid anyone who's anything like her.
ahw at May 1, 2009 2:04 PM
"Seriously, though, 1,000 a month?! Are they really that expensive?"
Hamsa, dear, whether you know it or not, you just admitted your ignorance on the subject. Your general good sense makes your comments still worth reading, but please go school up on this first.
Good sense - although this is certainly a lapse:
"Most married guys, at least the ones I know, weren't sold into marriage from some Eastern bloc country. They even got a say in who they married! "
Is that what you would say to someone who starts getting slapped around in a marriage for instance? You seem to think people make rational judgements when they are in lust/love. Please, go school up.
Jim at May 1, 2009 2:08 PM
You want to stop the garbage that is currently called child support? Stop the title IV matching of $.60 from the federal government for each dollar collected by the state. The perverse monetary incentive screams for the maximum collection possible, without regard for how much damage it does to the NCP (non custodial parent).
Lets start with a presumption of 50/50 shared custody, and if that isn't going to work, reimbursement for actual expenses (accountablility), rather than just write a check for a certain amount. I know of a case currently, where someone is paying day care expenses for a 16 year old.
The Family (hah!) courts have monetary incentive, while proceedings are secret. How is that not a recipe for abuse and corruption. Open up the proceedings, and kill the federal monetary matching, and watch things change quickly.
wolfboy69 at May 1, 2009 2:21 PM
Yes Vlad, it's much, much better to pay someone who makes minimum wage, with no education, to raise your kids for you so that mommy can make money. Let me tell ya, that's a way to get some real quality generations growing up.
momof3 at May 1, 2009 5:54 PM
How many of you would give your children up for adoption if it meant you never had to spend another dime on them and would never see them again? (i.e., your ex remarried and he new husband wanted to adopt your child[ren].)
nonmom at May 1, 2009 8:30 PM
And what about the mother who loses her job and can't afford a lawyer to get a temporary increase in child support even though she has always paid far more than half of their children's expenses?
I imagine every one of you guys blasting your exes or women in general would just offer the money up to her, the same way she's supposed to have the same bills but take less when it's your hard times.
I hate when guys get screwed, but I sense that more than a few of you would have happily screwed the ex -- and your children along with her, as collateral financial damage -- if you could have.
Tony, your story breaks my heart. But would you have allowed the ex to take your daughter so far away from you for a job? Would you allow the man she marries, whether you know him or not, to have your daughter for web cam visits? I hope your stepsons' father is helping support them. And I gotta ask: If you were indigent due to child support you couldn't pay (and perhaps shouldn't have had to pay), why have another child?
AMom at May 1, 2009 9:14 PM
I've been doing the child support thing for twelve years now...1 more month to go.
It's been hard at times. I've lowered my standard of living substantialy to make ends meet. I've watched my ex marry a man that made six figures (way more than me) and inheret over 250k. But none of this was taken into account when she tried to raise (and succeeded) my child support.
If not for my faith, I don't think I could have made it. Thank God.
Yes, the system is broken and needs a total overhall!
todd at May 2, 2009 8:21 AM
"but I sense that more than a few of you would have happily screwed the ex -- and your children along with her, as collateral financial damage -- if you could have." Amom.
And why do you believe that? Is it too hard for you to believe that men will do the right thing? Essentially the reason the laws are skewd is because there are certainly guys who simply refuse to do their part. So, the government makes law designed to punish them. Except for the part that since they aren't doing the right thing anyway, they are simply going to do what is necessary to get around the law.
Which means that basic conscientious guys get the backblast, because we are the one trying to do right by the kids.
And?
"How many of you would give your children up for adoption if it meant you never had to spend another dime on them and would never see them again? (i.e., your ex remarried and the new WIFE [husband] wanted to adopt your child[ren].)" Nonmom.
How do you think a Mother would respond to this VERY SAME QUESTION?
Unless I couldn't support them at all, I rather chew my leg off. They are also MY children. Not just hers.
SwissArmyD at May 2, 2009 10:43 AM
AMom, I mean no disrepute in saying this, but you offer me a grain of sand in place of the beach as your rebuttal?
There's always an exception to everything.
As an answer to your question, let's start with statistics.
Of all noncustodial child support paying parents nationwide, approximately 85% of the 30 million plus are fathers. Most of them didn’t "choose" to be turned into paying visitors of their own children. It's a statistical fact that women file for divorce far more often than do men. Often times, their decision to do so is financially motivated.
Many fathers were unwillingly divorced (usually the man's fault though as evidenced in nearly all high-profile divorces) while others fathered children out of wedlock, and yet others (and as Amy explains) are known victims of paternity fraud and must pay child support for children who are proven through DNA analysis not to be theirs.
Regarding those who fathered children out of wedlock, keep in mind that some of them wanted the mothers to abort, but she refused. Hence, he must pay child support on a child he didn't want for the next 18-25 years.
As Amy has pointed out before, a man has one (temporary) choice for birth control, a condom. A woman? -Diaphragms, female condoms, implants, the pill, the "morning-after" pill.
Yet, after she turns up pregnant, it's the man's fault. "He should have thought about that ahead of time." Wherein lies her responsibility? Equal rights means sharing equally in the financial costs associated with rearing children. Given our antiquated child support statutes (many written over 30+ years ago when tube socks pulled to the knees and plaid pants were in vogue) single fathers are presently bearing 100% of the costs of child rearing through their “child support” payments in many (probably most) cases.
Keep in mind that today, more women than man are entering and graduating colleges with bachelor's and more advanced degrees. Why then, are men paying women child support based on outdated statutes that where written when the stay-at-home-mom was the norm rather than the exception, and more mothers than not weren’t college educated?
In my own case, I have an Associates Degree and my Ex has a Bachelors and an Associates and at the time of our divorce, she made more money in any given single year than I ever did. Throw into that equation that I had my daughter exactly “50%” of the time. Why then, was I ordered to pay child support and thereby bankrupted in the first place?
I’ll tell you why; for Ohio (or any state for that matter) to reap their highest profit from child support payments one parent (usually the father and in approximately 85% of all 30+ million child support cases nationwide) someone must be labeled a “noncustodial parent” so a “child support” order can be set astronomically and unjustifiably for a state to maximize its profit.
When I was arrested for contempt, the Hamilton County Fugitive Warrant Unit went to my place of employment on two occasions to find me. For the record, I was fired the very day they showed up to arrest me at work the first time.
I was apprehended one month post-termination the very day after the Hamilton County Sheriff’s (Simon Leis) helicopter hovered above my house for more than 15 minutes, and while I hid inside after instructing my wife on what to say if there was a knock at the door.
The very next day, I was walking in a hallway and saw a laser beam hit the wall to my right, looking to my left, I saw a man on my first floor roof pointing a gun at me through a window. He was not wearing a uniform, and did not announce himself. After they knocked the glass out of my front door and came up the steps was guns drawn, I was apprehended without incident.
At the time, my daughter suffered from severe separation anxiety (that started after she saw me wrongfully arrested at gunpoint the first time, and related to my case) and I was supposed to pick her up that evening from daycare. Knowing she’d cry and panic if I didn’t show up or call to explain my absence, I pleaded with those cops to get a message to my daughter as they escorted me at the jail.
I explained she’d have a terrible panic attack and needed to be told of my whereabouts as nobody knew I was being arrested. One of them replied. “We don’t care about your f*****g daughter a**hole.”
While I was being booked along with five other black males, I asked each one, “What are you in for?” All five responded “child support.” My point? A few months ago, a convicted registered sex offender was released onto the streets of Cincinnati.
He was repeatedly charged with sex offenses over the years and had served time in one case where he raped a 16 year old girl then burned her alive. A few weeks post release, he raped, murdered and burned the body of a 13 year old beautiful and precious little Cincinnati girl.
The Hamilton County Fugitive Warrant Unit, the same one who went to such extent to arrest me, and when questioned by local press said, “they couldn’t find him” when the public demanded to know why that animal was roaming the streets of Cincinnati as he preyed upon his next victim.
How does that correlate to your question asked of me? It’s simple, based on your reply directed at me, I infer that you support the draconian efforts of our modern day child support inquisition.
How come a "fugitive warrant unit" will exert such incredible efforts to locate and find an indigent father who has an outstanding civil warrant, but they can't find a violent and vicious hardened criminal with an outstanding criminal warrant?
A man has no choice in the birth of a child, but he'll pay either way. If he's pro-life, his child can be aborted without his consent. If he's pro-choice, she can carry (against his demand that she abort) and he’s forced (under the threat of a felony arrest) into paying hundreds of thousands of dollars (sometimes millions)for that child, along with paying medical insurance premiums, the "mother's" out-of-pocket medical expenses, daycare expenses, orthodontic expenses and college tuition for the next 18-25 years.
Where are a father's rights? There are none. You asked me, “What about that “poor single mother?” I ask you , is she single by her choice?
I don't seek sympathy and or empathy and would rather not use my own story to make a point, I'd rather use the stories of those I've helped, you know why? Mine is one of the better stories. Actually, it's a "good" and "happy" one given all I've heard and been involved with.
One Ohio father (now living in Florida) is facing paralysis because it's alleged he's behind in his child support payments in Ohio. Therefore, he doesn't qualify (as a "deadbeat") for "any" public assistance in Florida and Ohio won't remove his "deadbeat" label.
I know this is true from my own experiences after I broke my leg last year, and after a piece of wood completely pierced my left middle finger. It broke off after I tried to pull it out. It remains lodged in my finger today and is evidenced by the lump that extends beyond both sides of that finger. I could not get medical assistance beyond the ER care that stabilized both injuries because I was without insurance after being terminated (through no fault of my own) by my last employer.
I called and inquired about public assistance in Hamilton County Ohio, as I risked losing my finger to infection, and needed surgery to have the wood removed. Doing so was beyond the skills of the ER doctor that treated me, and required the expertise of a hand surgeon, and given the nerves involved.
However, because I was said to be a “deadbeat” and allegedly behind in my child support payments (I wasn’t and am not), I was refused any type of public assistance. Be it food stamps, medical insurance, or help paying my utilities. As far as my leg goes, I fashioned my own cast using materials from Walmart and Goodwill and walked on crutches for three weeks.
The aforementioned father’s request for county provided health care services in Florida were denied because he's unable to work and is behind in child support. He advises, "my doctor said I'll be paralyzed within six months if I don't get surgery." This, due to a degenerative medical condition that will assuredly render him paralyzed (due to impending nerve damage) without medical intervention.
That was last July, and about the time I was facing homeless and the organization's phone was disconnected for nonpayment. What about that father? I don’t know, I suspect he’s paralyzed by now. The last message his fiancé left for me was heart=breaking to say the least. Out of frustration, she left me a voicemail where she screamed at and berated me for not helping him more than I was. My own stress at the time severely impeded my efforts to successfully intervene on behalf of others.
Another Ohio father who relocated to Tennessee (to secure employment) called me and stated, "help me, I broke my back, I can't work, can't eat, bathe or get around without assistance, and Ohio's Child Support Enforcement Agency keeps calling me and threatening me with incarceration if I don't pay up, what do I do? What about that father.
Or worse, let's examine the black Dayton Ohio father (black fathers have been castigated and demonized as deadbeats far more than any other race, especially the indigent ones) who was incarcerated "twice" by Ohio's Montgomery County Child Support Enforcement Agency as a "deadbeat" for failing to pay child support to the mother of his "deceased" daughter.
I personally had words (that recording will eventually be placed on my websites) with the Lead Montgomery County CSEA Prosecuting Attorney who ultimately incarcerated him. When I questioned her despicable behavior as she sat on a panel with other attorneys in a public child support forum presented by the Hamilton County Child Support Enforcement Agency, her reply to me was as follows:
"That was a very difficult case." I ask, what was difficult about it, successfully convicting and thereby incarcerating another indigent black father for "refusing" to pay child support on his deceased daughter; and without presenting it as the racially motivated social and criminal injustice that it was?
That, as sickening as it is, occurred while he's simultaneously, grieving the loss of numerous family members through tragic circumstances, Ohio is indicting him for felony criminal nonsupport.
I recently received an email from another Ohio father who said (paraphrased) "I need help, the Ohio Child Support Enforcement Agency (CSEA) is seizing my weekly unemployment compensation and leaving me only $1 to support myself, and I haven't seen my daughter in almost three years."
Guess what that father’s "primary" concern was? Seeing his precious daughter he so desperately wanted to be involved with, not the $1 per week that was left after the Ohio CSEA seized his unemployment compensation. This, so Ohio can continue earning "hundreds of millions" of dollars in "profits" from her annual "child support" collections.
You read that right, all of the 50 states profit off of each and every child support payment that made by a father, through the "Child Support" Enforcement Agency (so they can collect "their cut") and then make the payment to the mother. Their cut, as mentioned by another LW is provided through Title IV of the Social Security Act.
That's precisely why all payments (even 18 years worth) made directly from father to mother (and with canceled checks and the mothers testimony to prove it) are deemed to be "gifts." This because said monies did not pass through the CSEAs, which is a "requirement" before the state can collect their profit from the federal government through us (the taxpayer) using the social security taxes we pay. I explain this in more detail on my ohiofathersrights.com website.
I could continue with endless child support horror stories that clearly demonstrate the true nature of this beast. However, and out of my respect for Amy, I will not turn her blog into a crusade for father's rights and will therefore close with the following in response to your question:
You asked,
In response, and statistically speaking, you inquire about an aberration and as a rebuttal to my post about "the norm" involving child support stories. That said, and before I answer you, can we first discuss the truly disturbing cases I've been involved with?
Tony Fantetti
Ohio Council for Fathers Rights
Tony Fantetti at May 2, 2009 11:44 AM
Thank you for all of the time you've taken in your messages, Tony. I've never seen so much information on this topic presented, not even spread out over time and various sources. Why is that? Why aren't we hearing more about this disgrace in major media outlets? This is despicable.... though I'm not surprised the gov't is taking chunks of money from kids (they say it's from the dads, but it's really from the kids too), they'll tax, levy a fine, or penalize anyone.
Juliana at May 3, 2009 5:10 PM
"I've never seen so much information on this topic presented, not even spread out over time and various sources. Why is that? Why aren't we hearing more about this disgrace in major media outlets? This is despicable.... "
Juliana, it's the "Lace Curtain" of feminism controlling the MSM. Accurate and even-handed coverage of issues where men's and women's interests collide in society is not permissible. We can't have mass cognitive dissonance now, can we?
Now repeat after me: "Women are good, men are bad. Women are good, men are bad. Women...."
Jay R at May 4, 2009 11:51 AM
P.S. The past suppression of The Advice Goddess column alone is sufficient to prove the point that the Lace Curtain is not easily breached.
Jay R at May 4, 2009 11:53 AM
It's not just the "lace curtain." It's the Leviathan State known as the Federal Government that is deliberately instituting the programs that offer incentives for State Governments to partake in the destruction of families.
This is THE KEYSTONE.
And it was certainly no accident.
The purpose is to deliberately create a system of broken families with single mothers dependent on the State, and children raised without Paternal influence.
The pathologies of the offspring raised in the single mother households are undeniable.
Not only are the CSA agencies of every State profiting off of the destruction of families through the title IV of the SS act...but so too does the prison-industrial complex extract their pound of flesh from the debris of destroyed families when the children being raised in such chaotic and negative environments grow up and become just another statistic of the most highly incarcerated society in the world.
Dave from Hawaii at May 4, 2009 5:30 PM
It's not just the "lace curtain." It's the Leviathan State known as the Federal Government that is deliberately instituting the programs that offer incentives for State Governments to partake in the destruction of families.
This is THE KEYSTONE.
And it was certainly no accident.
The purpose is to deliberately create a system of broken families with single mothers dependent on the State, and children raised without Paternal influence.
The pathologies of the offspring raised in the single mother households are undeniable.
Not only are the CSA agencies of every State profiting off of the destruction of families through the title IV of the SS act...but so too does the prison-industrial complex extract their pound of flesh from the debris of destroyed families when the children being raised in such chaotic and negative environments grow up and become just another statistic of the most highly incarcerated society in the world.
Dave from Hawaii at May 4, 2009 5:31 PM
You're welcome Juliana, thanks for taking the time to read everything. I thank everyone for their compassion, comments and support.
Amy, thanks for such an incredible forum, and more importantly, thanks for being a heroine to all fathers like myself.
I think other LWs answered the question correctly as to why we don't hear about this in the mainstream media; radical feminism, aka feminazis, and the word "profit."
IMHO, another reason the ever-elusive and mythological "deadbeat dad" was created and highly publicized (IE Ohio used to hold annually televised "deadbeat dad" roundups that were "live" and done on TV right in front of children) was to divert the public's attention away from the state's "profiteering" (on child support), and that at the expense of fathers and their children.
Imagine an innocent child who in a terrifying panic screams out, "mommy, why are they taking daddy away?" Eyes glazed, they stare in utter horror, watching live on their own televisions, and amidst a whirlwind of flashing red and blue lights and reporters, as their father is handcuffed, placed into a cruiser, and then disappears as he's driven off into the horizon.
That's wanton, reckless, despicable but "necessary" to divert an ignorant public's attention away from the billions of dollars in profits the states have and continue to make. That perversion ended in December 2007 in Ohio http://www.wsaz.com/home/headlines/12852962.html, but only after a decade of humiliating loving fathers on live TV.
Coincidentally, it was the same year I formed the organization and publicly "got in Ohio's face" about it I used the aforementioned child's perspective to make an important point.
I asked, "what about the innocent children who see their daddies arrested on live TV? What about the scorn, ridicule and humiliation they endure at school the next day and after their classmates saw it as well?"
I'll never know if my efforts played a part in Ohio's decision to end the roundups, and it really doesn't matter. What matters is that they stopped. Sadly, and as Amy blogged about, we may see some of the same on a national level if we can't get the necessary public support to pressure Lifetime to abandon their "deadbeat dad" reality show.
Tony Fantetti at May 4, 2009 11:00 PM
Walter Olson -- http://www.overlawyered.com -- just Twittered this post, which is really wonderful. I hope others get to see your story and understand.
Amy Alkon at May 6, 2009 4:27 PM
Other than "thank you" Amy, I'm speechless as well as honored by your kindness and empathy towards us good and loving fathers.
Tony Fantetti at May 8, 2009 12:03 AM
Can I play the Devil's Advocate here?
First, yes, there needs to be a better way.
BUT, a percentage of the father's 'income' is hardly fair to a single mom who bore his children FOR him. At his REQUEST. Only for him to leave her with a small one and another on the way. The woman is me, and the "Daddy" in question, was in the military, and with the 'allotment' he would receive for having dependents, he could have offered some help to me at a time when I was carrying his child and unable to work.
But, "Daddy Dearest" had taken me for everything I had, (I was the one WITH the money)left us HOMELESS, and took a vehicle that I could have used to make a living (we had a hauling biz, started and backed by me that he had come close to running into the ground, but I still had the truck and one trailer. I could have hired a driver and made a living, but he made sure I couldn't, knew I couldn't work because I was a high risk pregnancy, and then refused to support us.)
So what do we do about THESE guys?
Vanessa Blais at May 24, 2009 4:29 PM
i'm just wondering why you had 3 houses and a six figure savings yet you owed child support? and you're upset that they came after you for it?
me at June 10, 2009 9:19 AM
I'm saddened by this story. The court system is broken and slow to be fixed so that father's can take care of their children. We've experienced both...the court ordering the mother to repay as a result of an overpayment and the court penalizing me as a father because I moved out of state to seek better employment.
Sometimes it's not always about the money...it's about our childrens emotional welfare and security!
All I can do is pray for your strength and fortitude.
Let's work to put the children first.
Micah and Fran at August 2, 2009 10:04 AM
The system is definitely broken.
Please take a look at ACFC (American Coalition for Fathers and Children), or "Friends of American..." on FB.
The above mentioned BLOG, is sadly, not unique. It coulda been virtually any NCPs story.
Melissa Weber at December 30, 2009 9:00 PM
This was an interesting article alleging even the world famous Mars Venus John Gray won't honor a court ordered wage assignment to garnish wages for his CEO.
(eWebWire.com) January 29, 2010 — WORLD WIDE WEB, January 29, 2010 (FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE) — Nevada ranks 54th in its rate of child support collection. They have consistently ranked near the bottom of the nation in payment collections. To say their child support enforcement system is broken is not accurate. It’s beyond abysmal. Nevada also hugged the bottom of state rankings in establishing paternity for children in support cases, obtaining court orders for support payments and running cost-effective collections and enforcement programs.
Assemblywoman Barbara Buckley, D-Las Vegas, called Nevada’s national standings for child support collection “pathetic.” Children in the state are not receiving the money they are entitled to by court order, Buckley said, which means they may be deprived of things as basic as medical care and shelter. “It is frustrating for all the custodial parents, we are worse than Guam, Puerto Rico and the Virgin Islands.”
One mother has spoken out claiming that Nevada ranks so low because they only target African- Americans and Latinos. Ms Collins a single mom of three feels many of these fathers are out of work and unable to pay so any enforcement measures are useless. In her case the father of her three children is a white male, gainfully employed in an Executive Position, owns a sprawling 2 acre ranch in Las Vegas and drives a Bentley. In spite of this Ms. Collins claims that the Nevada District Attorney has made little effort to collect not only the current child support but the $22,794.12 in arrears the father of her children owes. Ms Collins further added that Nevada does not pursue white offenders and goes out of their way to keep white deadbeat dads out of jail.
Nevada has a number of tools to collect child support arrears. Bank accounts can be levied to collect past due support, wages can be garnished, property can be levied even a notice of the delinquency could be filed with the IRS who would divert any income tax refund to the DA to apply to the debt. Nevada can also suspend a driver’s license due to unpaid child support or even suspend an occupational license if a parent owes child support.
In spite of this Ms Collins claims none of these enforcement methods are used to collect child support for her children. “I have a court ordered wage assignment but it’s not worth the paper it’s written on.” The father of her three children Richard Bernstein is the CEO and President of Mars Venus Coaching. Ms Collins added that although Mr. Bernstein testified in a Los Angeles court that the company is owned by John Gray the world famous author of “Men are from Mars Women are from Venus” the DA refuses to take any action against Mr. Gray for failing to honor a court ordered wage assignment. Ms. Collins believes Nevada has done nothing because Mr. Bernstein along with Mr. Gray are both white.
Ms Collins pointed out that the Nevada DA went after Dr. Conrad Murray (Michael Jackson's personal physician) with a vengeance claiming that he’d shown a pattern of failing to abide by child support orders. At the time Dr. Murray owed just $13,311.47 for missed child support payments. Ms Collins believes if Dr. Murray was white it would be no different from the father of her children and further stated “They only pursued him because he is African American. I am owed over $22,000.00 in back child support, Mr. Bernstein was previously convicted in a Los Angeles court for failing to pay child support that definitely shows a pattern but because he is white it puts him above the law in Nevada. Ms Collins also added my children deserve better they are entitled to the same rights as everyone else regardless of the color of their skin. If their father worked for a company owned by a minority the DA would definitely pursue that company to make sure that they honored a wage assignment for child support.
Ms Collins conveyed that she provided the Nevada District Attorney with copies of press releases for Mars Venus Coaching posted all over the internet listing Mr. Bernstein’s name as being responsible for selling franchises in China, Poland, Nevada and Arizona in just six weeks. In spite of this Ms Collins said her children failed to receive a penny in court ordered child support during that period.
This may very well be the reason Nevada consistently ranks near the bottom of the nation in payment collection. Last year the state collected about 52 percent of the payments owed. The national average is about 61 percent. A Nevada state task force is looking at ways to improve the collection of delinquent child support payments after a legislative audit found deficiencies. A good start might be looking into why Nevada is not pursuing white deadbeat parents that are gainfully employed, have assets and show a pattern of failing to pay support after being convicted.
lynn at March 24, 2010 10:53 PM
I just want to comment on another comment written earlier Posted by: Jay R at May 1, 2009 8:10 AM.
Even though the woman are not the ones who make the laws or carry them out they are given a choice to state what their limits are. For example if I had a child and my husband and I were seperating I could choose to receive no child support and still allow visitation, or I could take him for all he has and refuse visitation. We are simply told what our maximum options are through the laws made. It does not mean that we have to go for the max.
Amanda at August 3, 2010 9:40 AM
Child support needs to be capped at 30k/year per kid... unless the kid needs extraordinary care Otherwise the child support just becomes a windfall profit to the custodial parent. California CS laws are atrocious
cerbico at September 21, 2010 9:38 PM
These are pretty horrible situations, I just wonder why the situation is not brought up to public scrutiny. I know many women use the kids to get back at their ex especially if there is a new woman. But this is out of touch with reality, something must be done to bring back justice in child support.
Madison Styles at December 11, 2010 9:28 AM
Heya just wanted to give you a brief heads up and let you know a few of the images aren't loading correctly. I'm not sure why but I think its a linking issue. I've tried it in two different browsers and both show the same outcome.
improvvisazione at July 8, 2011 6:14 PM
I just want my daughters dead beat sperm donor to give up his rights! he is $11,000 behind in child support at $200 a month. He was fired from the railroad so he wouldn't have to pay. That was 8 years ago. He now has a federal warrant out for non payment and contempt. He hasnt been in her life at all for the last 8 years and shes 10.
mom to disabled child at July 10, 2013 10:35 AM
Ok, so you have a mother that has her second cousin hear her divorce case, same said second cousin refuses to prosecute mother when she makes false claim of sexual abuse during divorce. Then steps in the Ohio Child Support Enforcement Agency. A government entity of thugs and thieves. They set child support at whatever level they want, and good luck getting them to justify it, as they dont answer calls, dont return calls, and dont actually contact you, unless it is to tell you they are coming after you for money. What is your recourse as a father? None, you pay, you live in poverty, while your deadbeat ex-wife uses up the money you send for your kids, as verified by their own words, and you can do nothing about it! Welcome to the living hell of what is turning out to be a lot of good men, good fathers! We travel hundreds of miles to see our kids, pay out of pocket for the travel, we pay for all the childrens real high dollar items, we take care of our kids, but we still get screwed by the system. Way to go OHIO!!!
Screwedblue at September 28, 2013 12:24 PM
How about the so called dead beat mothers she took care of her kids till they were 16 years she got cancer lost everything including her exhusband came from ohio where he never paid child support for 16 years and now 6 years later ohio after her after she is already paying north carolina now how is this legal does these states ever communicate need some help with this situation if anyone has any suggestions the father was behind when he took them almost 6000 now there saying she owes 8900 in 2 years cause he had the kids from 16 to 18 they were twins anyway any help would be appeciated
yours truly at April 8, 2016 9:27 AM
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