It Seems We Should Be Groping People Prior To Immigration
Who seems more likely to you to blow up a crowd of people standing at a Christmas display, the autistic little boy who got groped at the airport or the guy born in Somalia, a hotbed of "the religion of peace"? Bryan Denson writes for the Oregonian:
Mohamed Osman Mohamud, 19, a Somali-born U.S. citizen, was arrested at 5:42 p.m., 18 minutes before the tree lighting was to occur, on an accusation of attempting to use a weapon of mass destruction. The felony charge carries a maximum sentence of life in prison and a $250,000 fine....According to the FBI affidavit, the case began in August 2009 when Mohamud was in e-mail contact with an unindicted associate overseas who was believed to be involved in terrorist activities. In December 2009, while the unindicted associate was in a frontier province of Pakistan, Mohamud and the associate discussed the possibility of Mohamud traveling to Pakistan to participate in violent jihad.
The associate allegedly referred Mohamud to a second associate overseas and provided him with a name and e-mail address. In the months that followed, Mohamud made several unsuccessful attempts to contact the second associate.
Ultimately, an FBI undercover operative contacted Mohamud in a June 2010 e-mail under the guise of being an associate of the first unindicted associate.
Good job, FBI! (Look for terrorists, not tweezers!)
I'm rewriting the Emma Lazarus poem on the Statue of Liberty:
Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled jihadists yearning to blow the infidel to smithereens...
The suspicious thing about this is, the FBI strung him along and actually let him try to blow it up using "fake" bomb sold to him by a fbi plant. Supposedly anyway according to the local news I heard earlier.
Sio at November 27, 2010 12:33 AM
The first clue is when the suspect has a name like Mohummed Mohummed Mohummed Mohummed Mohummed Mohummed Baked Beans Mohummed. Seriously, this guy was a piece of work. I would ask "how the hell did he get citizenship", but given his age he probably entered the country as a child, either immigrating with his parents or maybe as a child-rescue during the Somali war in the '90s.
Sio, I guess the FBI strong it along for two reasons. First, they wanted to completely establish that the guy had the intent to commit an act of terrorism and collect plenty of evidence for the court case. Second, they wanted to see if he would reveal any other operational contacts. On that second point, the report Amy quoted is not clear. But note the un-asked question about how the FBI found out about this guy in the first place... apparently this is actually just one facet of a larger investigation.
And yeah, say what you will about the FBI, but they aren't interested in groping you at the airport. They know what the solution to the problem is.
Cousin Dave at November 27, 2010 7:53 AM
Why oh why do we let these barbarians immigrate here?
kishke at November 28, 2010 12:44 PM
http://www.salon.com/news/opinion/glenn_greenwald/2010/11/28/fbi/index.html
The FBI foiling a terrorist plot of its own making doesn't make us any safer. When someone in a uniform is telling you how afraid you should be - especially when that person is part of an organization with a documented history of illegality and deceit - don't take it at face value. And here, just a little bit of digging shows how sketchy the FBI's claims (and that's all they are at this point, since all of the information being reported comes from the FBI affidavit) are. Like the fact that key statements allegedly made by Mohamud weren't recorded due to "technical problems." And the fact that the FBI put him on a no-fly list, preventing him from going up to meet a friend in Alaska for a summer job, and then set him up with an apartment and funding for terrorism.
The FBI spent a year and a half encouraging, funding, and providing bomb-making materials to a teenager. This is not anti-terrorism, this is propaganda.
CB at November 28, 2010 8:38 PM
CB, do you really believe anything that Glenn Greenwald the Sock-Puppet Master pulls out of his ass?
Cousin Dave at November 29, 2010 6:07 PM
Cousin Dave, how was that a relevant contribution to this discussion? If you have evidence that Mr. Greenwald (and the many, many people who agree with him on this issue) are wrong, please provide it. If you have evidence that he's a sock-puppet for some person or entity, tell us who that person or entity is. And surely you realize that, absent any of those facts I just requested, disbelieving something solely based on the source is just as stupid as the reverse?
I know I've said this before, but it never fails to surprise me how so many of the people on this board suddenly become good little sheep, blindly supporting the government, whenever "terrorism" is invoked. (Though clearly there is a line - when it affects them personally, like the TSA searches, then the libertarian spirit returns.) So, Cousin Dave, tell us - why do you think the FBI should create terrorist plots of its own? Why do you think they should target young loner-types and spend a year and a half giving them every form of material support for terrorism? And why do you think we should believe them when they say that key conversations weren't recorded due to technical difficulties?
CB at November 30, 2010 7:19 AM
CB, when you state that the FBI created this out of whole cloth, you are flat-out lying. I shouldn't be surprised since you are such a fan of the proven liar Greenwald. His massive sock-puppetry operation was a major blogosphere scandal four years ago and it cost him a job. Here's a link for your perusal:
http://ace.mu.nu/archives/187585.php
It is not the responsibility of rational people to have to systematically refute every single piece of BS that every fabulist makes up. Greenwald is a proven unreliable source, and if I were a teacher and you submitted a paper to me citing Greenwald as your major source, I'd give you an F. If you expect to be taken seriously, you have to do better than that.
I also note that the whole meme you are trying to spread is being led by that notorious ultra-left-wing (and misandrist) hate site Firedoglake. That would be like me trying to "prove" something about black people by quoting the American Nazi Party. So if you still want to make that claim, go do your fucking research and come back with some credible links. It is up to you to prove your claims; it isn't up to me to have to disprove it when you have offered no credible evidence.
And besides, if you had been paying attention here, which you obviously have not, you'd know that I am very anti-TSA. Idiot.
Cousin Dave at November 30, 2010 7:04 PM
Civil discourse is a wonderful thing, Cousin Dave; please do give it a try. Not only does it keep the discussion focused on the actual issues at hand (rather than irrelevant personal attacks), but it gives you credibility as someone actually interested in truth-seeking.
Setting that aside, thank you for the link about Glenn Greenwald. I wasn't aware of this sock puppet issue, and the fact that he posted under false identities is certainly disappointing. What it isn't, however, is an argument against Mr. Greenwald's actual positions. So while I join you in condemning shady tactics like sock puppetry, I'm afraid that's not enough to get you to "everything Greenwald says is false."
Would you be so kind as to point out to me where I said that "the FBI created this out of whole cloth"? I think you're mistaken; I did say that the FBI creates terrorist plots of its own, and I stand by that statement. What else do you call it when a bunch of trained law enforcement professionals, with virtually unlimited authority and resources, start funding and encouraging a teenager for the purpose of creating terrorist activity? After all, this is not the first time the FBI has manufactured plots: the Rolling Stone story here - http://www.truth-out.org/article/guy-lawson-the-fear-factory - has excellent accounts of other instances of this same questionable behavior by law enforcement. So what exactly do you think Mahomud would have done without the involvement of the FBI? Please be specific, and it wouldn't hurt to cite some evidence in favor of your position.
I don't read Firedoglake, and I wasn't quoting Greenwald as an authority - his article just happens to be an excellent analysis of the evidence that's been put forth by the FBI so far. Again, please try to stay on topic rather than randomly invoking the American Nazi party to disprove a point I wasn't making.
And I'm not trying to embarrass you, but it's pretty clear that you're the one not paying attention. I obviously know that you and others are very anti-TSA, which is why I included the caveat: "Though clearly there is a line - when it affects them personally, like the TSA searches, then the libertarian spirit returns." Being anti-TSA is foolish, pointless, and hugely hypocritical if you're willing to accept government overreach in other areas. If you think terrorism is such a grave threat that you're willing to give the FBI vast and unaccountable power in order to fight it, it's awfully selfish and short-sighted of you to fuss about something as comparatively minor as going through a scanner or getting patted down.
One thing we can agree on is that it's not the responsibility of rational people to refute every piece of made-up BS. Fortunately, that's not the issue here: the "made-up BS" that you're so hostile to consists of citations to the FBI's court documents, and direct inferences therefrom. A rational person recognizes that uncritical acceptance of government policy isn't a good or moral strategy; do you disagree?
Perhaps I'm the foolish one for devoting this many paragraphs to someone who thinks "Idiot." is an acceptable contribution to a discussion, but I really am curious why you trust the government so much on this one issue. Care to take a stab at explaining that?
CB at December 1, 2010 9:18 AM
Leave a comment