That same cultural attitude extends to business in Japan as well, where loyalty and honor extend both ways.. Loyalty to your employer and honor in how employees are treated.

One reason Japans economy does so well is their companies do long range plans out 100 years. Their CEO's and executives have reasonable salaries based on their position, but not the obscene multi-million dollor amounts you see here in the US (US executives and board members pay themselves more than any other country).

Here in the US our "capitalism at all costs" is based on the attitude of "I'm getting mine - screw the rest of you," and laws unions and regulations are required to force companies to treat their employees well.

Of course, suggest that, perhaps, unbridled capitalism is not the best way and the corporate propaganda machine labels you a commie, pinko. How dare you suggest that free market everything isn't perfect? After all, you can TRUST corporations to do the right thing -we only have your best interests at heart.

And, by the way... Let's privatize social security and Medicare and turn it over to those fine folks that run our health care system. They'll do a great job with it... In fact they just hired some great new executive talent.. Former Enron executives and those nice Lehman guys. Yeah, let's let them handle our money. Oh, and of course, lets make sure to lift those horrible restrictive regulations. After all, we can trust them. What could go wrong?

Bullshit! Sue! Complete Bullshit! Japan is not the FIVE RINGS and that Samurai honor crap. Long range plans then how the fuck did the country and many companies end up screwed in the housing/property bubble the 1990 before the USA on 2008. Millions/Billions of tax payers money spent on projects that where to revitalize the economy. Japans economy has been pretty stagnant for the last 15 years. Hate to break it to you. I bet some of those executives also get large bonuses and know a days half of the major Japanese companies are now run by foreigners.

Also you do not completely understand that in Japan their is not complete true capitalism it is more conglomeration of government and large companies. A whole lotta back scratching goes on.

And your point would be?

I was there in Japan during the occupation and cannot believe the honesty of the Japanese people. There were many instances of sailors leaving wallets or cash on the bar and the owner/bartender chased them down to return their property, some of it equal to a monthly wage for the Japanese and yet in nearly 2 years I never saw one sailor ripped off. Compare that with Fleet Week in NYC--every hustler descended on us like locusts and very few of us escaped the hustles. At 75 years of age I honestly felt safer in Japan than in any Navy town in the US.

Old Tin Can Sailor

His point would be that Se is either a liar or a fool - and he right.

Also we dont have capalism here in the US, whe have coperate crony capatalism where big business lobyists write laws which stifle their prospective competition from interferingwith their business.

As to shy the Japaneese arent rioting I'd say it has more to do with the fact that they dont depend on their gverment for food, amd shelter, and money, and micromanaging every aspect of their lives

When you depend on the government for everything and its suddnely no longer there(slums in america, and the socialst regimes of latin america) you get an almost psychotic version of seperation anxiety.

I would surmise that the ethnic homogeneity and relative affluence of Japanese society have a lot to do with it. I think people find it easier to steal from people who are seen as being unlike themselves.

I've seen behavior similar to the Japanese here in the good ol' USA. Back in 1997 Grand Forks, North Dakota was hit by a catastrophic flood (downtown completely flooded). No looting, no people acting like trapped rats, just quiet determination to re-build.

The governor of ND was asked about how well the people of North Dakota acted as their state was devastated explained it thus:

"Forty below tends to keep the riff-raff out."

Do you people even look at what you have typed? It's hard to think much of your opinions when every other word is misspelled or is a typo.

Absurd sentence fragment of the day: "the corporate propaganda machine labels you".

Luj, Japan is one of the most bureaucratic societies in the world. Even in a national tragedy, it delayed entry to specialized search and rescue dog teams http://abcnews.go.com/International/japanese-bureaucracy-delays-foreign-search-rescue-teams/story?id=13126904
As to why they don't steal or riot, they were under centralized feudalism for 260 years under the Tokugawa installed samurai caste system (1600 AD). After centuries of samurai wars, peace prevailed. People knew their place and were forced to keep it. No outside world penetrated Japan for all those years. Bushido (samurai honor codes) became ritualized in peace time and imbued the national consciousness. That carried over under the Meiji restoration and modern Japan. If you asked a Japanese now why they don't steal or push for attention, they will say, "I don't know" or, "We just don't" but that programming is 400 years old now.

Yes, centuries of Japanese culture--the same culture that produced an imperial army infamous for rape, murder and infanticide only two generations ago.

An interesting question is why Japan produced such monsters only two generatiosn ago, and is so civil now (ditto Germany).

I don't think the answer is found in either right- or left-wing blabber.

FG - I would like your opinion on my neighbors up in Grand Forks, ND noted by David Crawford above. He could have added the behavior of those around Fargo, ND who rush in to help with sandbagging instead of looting.

Never said a thing about beuracracy, said socialism

I have heard of absolutely no sociological evidence to support that looting is rampant during natural disasters, this applying especially to Hurricane Katrina.

Never know when Ninja behind counter.

"Japanese people," he told me, "are like passengers on a cruise ship. They know that they are stuck with the same people around them for the foreseeable future, so they are polite, and behave in ways that don't make enemies, and keep everything on a friendly and gracious basis."

"Americans," he said, "are like ferryboat passengers. They know that at the end of a short voyage they will get off and may never see each other again. So if they push ahead of others to get off first, there are no real consequences to face. It is every man for himself."

http://www.americanthinker.com/2011/03/why_the_japanese_arent_looting.html

Hexari, are you implying there was NO looting after Hurricane Katrina?? Because I SAW it with my own eyes! As did the majority of people who watched any news programs during and after the fact. The NOPD swooped down on innocent people and confiscated their firearms, while letting the looters have carte blanche all over Canal Street and beyond! And that I got first hand from a fellow NRA member who lives near St. John's Bayou.

the easiest thing to say about the Japanese is that they are quite different than us... but disitilling that down to some paragraph is a fool's errand. These non-looting Japanese also have the Yakuza [The Japaese Mob] entranched in their midst, and most Taro's on the street don't bat an eye at that...

You just can't reduce their behavior to one simple thing, any more than you can ours. If there was one thing, it might be that they cleave to traditional ways far longer than we do... after all their country isn't an upstart like ours. They have had a LONG time to develop those ways, as complex as they are.

"The governor of ND was asked about how well the people of North Dakota acted as their state was devastated explained it thus:
"Forty below tends to keep the riff-raff out."

Someone else somewhere says it comes down to trust, the trust you tend to have when you live in a homogeneous community, even on the national level. Japan has been rigorously homogenized over the last 1,000 years. And 40 below doesn't just keep the riff-raff out, it keeps everyone out who has better sense, which is going to leave basically Sweedes and Norwegians - so there's your homogeneity.

And Just sayin' - Amy was nice with you. You're a superficial twit.

We didn't have looting here in Nashville during the flood either. Nor did we jump up and down screaming that noone was helping us. WE took care of ourselves and helped each other out. It didn't hurt that telecommuting is possible in this age either. Some people were able to stay home and work. I guess that could be a disincentive to loot houses. THe shope were empty though.

I think it isn't a particular nation or honor. It is having respect for your common man. The golden rule..

Flynne,regarding Hurricane Katrina, most looting only happened as a result of looking for necessities for survival, with very isolated instances for the purpose of profit. Almost every case study of natural disasters actively contradicts how the media chooses to portray them. The news spun the situation into what they thought would be interesting, whether on purpose or based on their conception of natural disasters. In fact, because of this spin that has been socially constructed, some people post-Katrina were worried that people would come to loot their houses and chose to stand guard instead of joining the growing civilian efforts to save others, which is a very common civilian reaction to disasters. For more information, you should watch "When the Levees Broke: A Requiem in Four Acts" by Spike Lee. Although the question of government neglect because of race is questionable, I feel like it still has a lot to offer.

The news media employs experts in whatever field they are reporting, except for sociologists.

Hex- Sorry, but my town had hundreds of people go down to Louisiana for an entire month to help out, and they saw much of what you deny. One of my neighbors is a paramedic who went down with his employer (an ambulance service). They should have given him a firearm for the number of times he was held up by drug seekers. In addition, when would-be thieves wanted his food, he offered up his MRE's, and they refused to believe that was all he had. They wanted "real food". That was all he got to eat for a month. They must not have been hungry enough.

Also, read this:

http://www.frfrogspad.com/disastr.htm

Specifically, under "Second Post: Social implications of a disaster situation"

...most looting only happened as a result of looking for necessities for survival, with very isolated instances for the purpose of profit.

Uh HUH. That's what my buddy told me about the guys with the shopping carts full of new clothes, new sneakers, CDs, DVDs, booze and big screen TVs that the kids were balancing on top of all the loot. And the jewelry, too. Yeah, they needed all those things to survive.
Yes they did too!

/sarc

Make no mistake, Hexari, I'm not harehin on ya, but Nawlins is my FAVORITE city to vacation in. I LOVE the place, gods know why. I have friends down there who live in Metarie and they told me in no uncertain terms what a nightmare it was for DAYS after the levees broke. They told me Spike Lee's "requiem" was designed to evoke sympathy and that he left out a lot of the nasty stuff on purpose, because he "didn't want his people portrayed in a bad light". That's a quote from my friend's wife. Another couple I know, who run a hotel in the historic district, told me they were trying to help the stranded cats by trapping them, taking them to the vet and getting them spayed, then letting them go again, and some of the people in the neighborhood actually harrassed them for it. Yet another couple I know, older, friends of my parents, were so disgusted with the way people were behaving, they were being very vocal about it, and they were told if they didn't like it they could leave! The old man said he didn't go anywhere without his shotgun for weeks afterwards, once he got it back.

I was in New Orlean in May 2005, before Katrina. I went back in June of '07, and while the French Quarter hadn't sustained any real damage, places were still boarded up because of the rising costs of insurance and rents. There were a lot of people that were still in good spirits, but some were discouraged that "we still haven't really recovered". My parents' friends had us over for dinner and were talking about moving either back up north or going to the Carolinas. They ended up in Savannah with their oldest daughter.

And even I felt that it was "different", not the same as before Katrina. There was a faint sense of distrust that I found to be disturbing. I havne't been back since then, and I want to go, but I'm still hesitating. Probably more because of the TSA than anything else, really, but last time I was there, I was a little more skittish than I should have been.

Sorry, that should have read harShing on you, not harehing on you! LOL!

Flynne, It sounds like I clearly haven't done enough reading on the subject.

I don't feel warm and fuzzy about trusting my savings with the corporate loonies on Wall Street. But when I could see that my financial advisor was just trying to make himself rich off my money and was primarily acting in his own self-interest - even when it went against MY best interest - I fired him and started managing my own portfolio. I'm getting just as good of a return and never have to question whose best interest I am acting in. I allocate my money according to what I think is best, and sometimes I am wrong, but at least I am making my own mistakes and not someone else's. And I'm sure as hell not getting stuck in some dud of a fund because it pays a 'financial planner' a good trailing commission.

Sue makes a point that you can't always trust people who are trying to sell you something. But if that's the case, then DON'T! Privatizing Social Security would involve letting people allocate their own contributions just like people do with a 401K. And that doesn't mean you have to sink it into the stock market. You could put all of it in U.S. T-bills if you wanted. And in the absence of Social Security, it would be wise to invest some of your money in a deferred annuity, one that would start paying you a fixed monthly amount beginning at a certain age until death, to be sure you don't outlive your money.

But it's not ridiculous to expect people in a first world country to educate themselves on these things. In fact, that's the best weapon of all if you want to insulate people from the kind of dishonesty we see on Wall Street. People turn their 401K money over to a bunch of mutual funds, and they have no idea whatsoever what makes up those funds. They just think their 401Ks are magic boxes that will miraculously grow if they throw six or eight or ten percent of what they make into them. It would not be so easy for Wall Street to take advantage of us if we didn't make ourselves such easy targets.

But to have a government-run program like Social Security as an alternative? How is that any better? How is the government ripping us off any less than corporate America is? Out of our $14.3 trillion and counting national debt, $4.6 trillion makes up the Social Security trust fund. To the extent that the Baby Boomers' contributions weren't immediately spent on the older generations, the trust fund is where the money went. But that only consists of IOUs, and do you see the government in any kind of situation to pay back its debts? All it does is add another $1.5 to $2 trillion TO the debt each year.

Don't get so caught up in bashing corporate America that you default to the government as a safe solution. They are all crooks, and it is largely because these crooks are in bed with each other that we are in such a rotten financial situation. We have to take care of ourselves. Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but no you really can't trust anybody.

This makes me want to go live in Japan. I'm feeling really discouraged. I spend $50-100 on supplies each month from my own pocket. There are programs to provide school supplies for those who need them. Yet I am robbed blind by my students.

Last week I was hit by a rock. The student wasn't even in any of my classes. Oh how I miss civilization!

I love Julianaaaa!

Because she knows about the Renaissance Amphibian!

An interesting question is why Japan produced such monsters only two generatiosn ago, and is so civil now (ditto Germany).

Careful BOTU, you'll lose your status as Official Troll on this blog if you make too many intelligent comments. Good question.

A lot of the reason Japan is the way it is comes down to very careful management of post WWII reconstruction by Macarthur et al. The Emperor was quietly shuffled into the background, peace and tolerance - sort of - promoted.

As a few people have pointed out, centuries of social conditioning have produced a very compliant populace. So a shift of priorities at the top took hold a lot faster than you would expect in most western societies.

Of course, the downside of that is that the shift back could be just as fast. It may not happen though, younger Japanese are less respectful of authority. Certainly the innate racism and hierarchical nature of Japanese society is starting to be undermined. And 20 years of economic stagnation is reducing support for the zaibatsu corporate model.

I remember reading a story by someone (may have been Steven Den Beste I think) about learning to speak Japanese 20+ years ago, and being taught a certain word to describe Koreans. He went back later and used that word - to have his young friend blanch and tell him to never say it again. It was basically the equivalent of nigger...

As to what explains Germany's conversion to pacifism after centuries of martial tradition, well, I've heard a lot of theories but I don't know which are true. Maybe the old joke about the true reason for NATO is the best - that it was to "keep the Americans in, the Russians out, and the Germans down".

Dosen't it seem rather too simplistic to reduce such a complex phenomenon that has evolved over centuries to just one word or one paragraph? I think this person should read Aravind Adiga's White Tiger to get a glimpse of the complexity of these things instead of just reducing these things to 1 word.

An interesting question is why Japan produced such monsters only two generatiosn ago, and is so civil now (ditto Germany).

Even back when they were monsters to the Chinese the Japanese were still civil to each other.

Why, thank you Rad!!!

I found him some time ago through his shooting pages. His truisms compilation is nothing to sneeze at either. :)

This country, for the most part, has lost all of its values and its honor. During WW2 (before my time) it seems that people in this country were very honorable, and people cared for eachother and took care of eachother. Now, it is every man for himself, and any opportunity to steal or take advantage of anyone is taken up by most. Maybe the poster above has a good idea, that alot of the "less desireable" states still carry values and honor high...states like ND, SD, Wyoming, Montana, Idaho, NH, and VT. Of course, these states all share a few things in common: very little "diversity", small population, and small towns. And of course the weather. No wonder more people are moving to these "backward" states than other states.

The Japanese have a strong concept of the whole and the importance of the individual playing their part of the whole. On the news they interviewed an elderly couple cleaning up their home. The husband said (translation quoted), "We are old. The young will rebuild us." The us clearly referring to the nation. Another story talked about this very issue and noted that Japanese has a word for doing your part for the group and becoming integrated with the group. Sorry, I forgot the word.

What I have read about WWII is that a big factor for the Japanese was fighting for your honor, your families honor and even you towns honor. Giving up was disgracing them all. The Kamakazi certainly didn't benefit personally.

TEPCO boss cries as he admits radiation levels so high it will kill people

Interestingly enough, if I might add, is the situation recently reported (whether sensationalized or incompletely rendered by the media large-scale, I don't know)... the Fukushima 50, about 300 nuclear workers, seem to be resigned or determined to get the job done of cooling down the reactor(s)even if it means exposure to thousands percent higher levels of "safe" radiation, and likely death and sickness as a result.

See: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/world/2011/04/01/2011-04-01_members_of_japans_fukushima_50_have_come_to_terms_with_the_fact_they_may_die_fro.html

Consider this...
Someone has to go in there, right? It is a monstrous sacrifice. "Me and the pain of my immediate family or the city/town/country suffers for generations". Remember, they have already suffered and continue to suffer through one of the most devastating man-made disasters in modern history (right or wrong... America inflicted something it has NEVER had to endure)
Think of any similar situation of the grandest scale (apart from 9/11), have we as a nation observed the rather fast decision-making and organized resolve to fix something of that magnitude? Forgive me, I am only 29 and just happened upon this thread and felt intrigued enough to want to join the conversation and receive wisdom and insight.

I would appreciate thoughtful comments and responses, no visceral ignorant tongue-lashings, please.