Y'know, I like vulgar, shocking stuff. It's what comes with being a cheerfully bitter bachelor.

But there's no one involved in that magazine cover with whom I want to interact. Not the tits-out, norm-transgressive (with a sincere message!) Mom. Not the exploited, soon-to-be-taunted-by-peers schoolboy. Not the word-of-mouth-seeking publisher. Not his idiotic, internet-overwhelmed reporters. Not their ball-squeezing, in-command-during-a-recession advertisers.

What does a copy of Time magazine cost nowadays? When was the last time anyone felt good about paying the cover price for one at an airport or newsstand?

I find myself agreeing with Cridster on this one.

The kid even looks like he knows the peer abuse to come.

If you think this mom is going to send her son somewhere he would get made fun of, you don't know attachment parents very well. He will attend a Montessori school where everyone was extended bf'D. And so what? By college, no one will know, except he will be better educated than the average american.
Some people really need to grow up. It's a breast. It lactates. Children are nourished by it. So what.

I'd say more like 5. Longer than I hope to breastfeed my kid either way.

According to google, he's 4.

What I find ridiculous is that it is even an issue. Breast feeding is a natural thing that mothers do. Numerous studies show it as beneficial to kids. Why the uproar? I'm sorry I didn't breastfeed. I knew a few moms who breastfed longer than what was deemed normal and they have very nice relationships with their kids. I won't credit the breast milk as much as I'll credit the parenting style that comes with the attitude of those parents.

I saw them on TV this morning.

I'm just wondering what happens to these kids when they get to the real world? When the rest of the population of the planet doesn't give a fuck whether they get a trophy for doing the job they're paid to do.

They were just on Today a half hour ago. The kid is about to turn 4 and, according to the mom, is "self-weaning".

1. If the kid is old enough to ask for it, he's too old.
2. She has a 5 year old who was breast fed for a long time, too. There ain't no way her boobs are that perky. Which leads me to conclude they were touched up. It doesn't surprise me one bit, but adds a little more creepiness.

There ain't no way her boobs are that perky.

Never breast-fed here but could they be perky because they are somewhat small?

That boy definitely looks healthy. Milk-fed, indeed.

I personally don't give a rat's ass how long any mom breastfeeds their kid(s), I just don't want to see it. If you have to do it in public, please, just show a little modesty and cover up, even if you just use a little towel. And yeah, I agree with Gretchen. If he's old enough to ask for it, he's too old. I just don't get it though, how these moms are still lactating when the kid is more than 1 year old. I was done when my girls started eating solids foods, at about 4 months old, when they started teething. As soon as they could eat jarred foods and Cheerios, that was it. I couldn't wait to be done with breastfeeding! I had 'em both using sippy-cups by the time they were 10 months old. That used to be the standard by which they started to become "big kids" - no more boob or bottle, they were big kids now, using sippy-cups! They'd look down on their peers that were still using bottles! "what a baby!" "learn to drink like a big kid!" You know, that kind of thing. Boy were they cruel!

>>"I personally don't give a rat's ass how long any mom breastfeeds their kid(s), I just don't want to see it."

Amen! I'm all for bf'ing. Go for it! It's the best thing for your baby! Woo! But please cover up. Please don't have a stage show in which you have to manuever little Calgon's mouth around your nip in full view of everyone. Please don't have a detailed conversation about it. A little modesty never hurt.

As for age... it grosses me out once they can talk and walk. I know, I know, it's natural and it's really good for them, and all that. And I'm sure people in the olden days had to breastfeed for a long time to make it last longer, but I'm not sure it's that beneficial today. Especially the health benefits, because I know when I was getting ready to bf, a lot of the there would be recommendations for giving baby iron supplements and such, because generally bf didn't have enough. Hell, most of the bf'ers I know still had to supplement with formula, too.

Still, I do regret not bf'ing. It didn't work out for us b/c baby had reflux issues, and while he's a perfectly healthy one year old, I feel like we missed something.

The raising of eunichs.....

Just Google the "bitty" sketches from "Little Britain."

Numerous studies show it as beneficial to kids. Why the uproar?

Because juvenile humans with teeth don't need to be breastfed?

I think they're still perky because they're still milky.

And it IS creepy. Poor kid.

Breast feeding is a natural thing that mothers do.

Up until the kid starts eating solid foods. For most women I know, up until the kid gets teeth.

After that it ISN'T good for them; human mother's milk is geared toward infants.

(Of my four kids, the oldest absolutely refused to breast feed--she wouldn't even latch on--two refused after two days and the last we had to supplement even though my wife was producing enough.

The oldest was able to breastfeed her daughter for six months, then came the teeth. My granddaughter willingly transitioned to solid food faster than any infant I've known.)

They are called milk-teeth for a reason-it ISN'T that teeth are your clue to quit.

BF'd kids have higher IQ's among any number of perks-not sure "I didn't do it!" or "I quit ridiculously early!" is something I'd brag about in relation to your kids. It's right up there with bragging you couldn't be bothered to read to your kids. Yeah, some people can't for various reasons, but to brag...no.

"1. If the kid is old enough to ask for it, he's too old.
2. She has a 5 year old who was breast fed for a long time, too. There ain't no way her boobs are that perky. Which leads me to conclude they were touched up. It doesn't surprise me one bit, but adds a little more creepiness."

1. according to you. Which means little to nothing to others.

2. My boobs are that perky too. It's called 1) not having huge ones in the first place-gravity is not your friend and 2) not gaining and losing a lot of weight. It's the getting fat, not the BFing, that screws your boobs.

I pumped exclusively for my twins (they never did get the hang of it-a peril of being super-preemie), did #3 for about 20 months, and weaned #4 at 12 months exactly and am STILL paying for that. The twins went through a horrific period of being sick almost constantly from 18 months to 3 years. if I could have put them back on breast milk, I would have then.

This kid is…

A) Never going to hear the end of this at school
B) The Luckiest Kid in the world
C) Both A and B.

Pretty much what Crid said.

I don't have an issue with breastfeeding until it becomes attention-whoring.

Mom of 4 - remember correlation is not causation. No one has done a controlled experiment of breast feeding where people were randomly assigned to a treatment group and told to breast-feed or not. The studies are all longitudinal studies of self-reported behavior. To their credit, the studies have tried to control for multiple variables, such as parental income and involvement, and educational attainment, however different studies have different results.

Plus, the IQ differential is small - only a few points on average, which only really makes a difference on outcomes in life when we are talking about the differences in outcomes for people with IQs well below average. Otherwise, it's the difference between 100 and 105, or 140 and 145.

I am not sure how I feel about the extended breast-feeders (I tend to the idea that once they can talk and use a cup consistently, I'd find it creepy, but that's me).

Before reliable birth control, people often had a gap of two-three years between children, if they were exclusively breast feeding. Part of this may be because breast feeding requires an additional 500 calories and supplements or so a day to maintain weight and mineral and vitamin levels. By the time the child was eating solid food most of the time, a woman may have gotten her weight up enough that she returned to normal ovulation, and was less likely to miscarry. At that point, the child would be weaned involuntarily due to decreased milk production. So historically speaking, most children were probably weaned between 1 and 2.

Janie4, thank you for the informative comment. I've never read a historical perspective of bf'ing (even when I was absolutely devouring the books)and its interesting to try and figure out when parents weaned back in the day. For instance, I'm still trying to figure out how old Baby Carrie is in Little House, since it was considered a big deal to let her drink milk.

This seems to be a pretty extreme example of attachment parenting, anyway. The co-sleeping, baby-wearing Waldorf/Montessori/CoOp parents I know didn't breastfeed long after 24months, and most did it more like 18 months.

Flynne: You're absolutely right. She should show some modesty
insted of offending you. How dare she leave her bare face exposed!?
She should be wearing a burkha as all the moral women do.

Ya, Ron, because Flynne is one of them uptight type broads.... s/o

Ron, if they want to bare the boobs to feed baby in public, go for it. Just don't get all huffy when I stare, either in surprise/shock or lust (real or fake just to cheese her off). Heaven forfend the kid eat in privacy and the woman think of propriety for others.

Favorite comment from another blog:
"Where is the father?

And on what is he sucking?"

My favorite photoshop so far is this one:
http://evilbloggerlady.blogspot.com/2012/05/barack-obama-i-am-from-government-and-i.html

Lady Fluke and the nanny state.

I saw 6 lactation consultants before I accepted that my daughter would never breastfeed. So I admit I'm a little jealous of this woman.

The issue isn't breastfeeding, but exhibitionism. She doesn't just want the world to know she breastfeeds her son. She wants us all to SEE it. Whether we want to or not.

"Hey, hey, look at me! I have a boob! And my son is sucking on it! Look look look look LOOK!!!"

Posted by: Sosij at May 11, 2012 11:07 AM

Precisely.

Fuck off, Ron. Did you not read my entire post, where I said I ALSO breastfed? I guess NOT.

I just didn't expose my naked breast in public for the whole damn world to see. My boobs, my kid, nunya business. Actually there were only a few times that I had to breastfeed in public and I used a receiveing blanket (lightweight) to cover myself and baby. No one else needs to see. It's called being considerate of others. Obviously something you know nothing about. Sheesh.

Thanks for the backup, Feebs. How ya been?

Flynne: Loves ya, sister.

Life has been good. Can't complain. You?

I didn't have to wait at the dentist's so I didn't know Time was still published.

> Re: perkiness - people with naturally pert
> breasts gravitate to Los Angeles.

And we have 350 cloudless days a year.

Our city is better than your city.

(Wait a minute... Is gravitating perkies a contradiction in terms?)

> I didn't have to wait at the dentist's so I
> didn't know Time was still published.

☑

Also, Flynne's right, Ron's being a ninny.

I really like all the strong, complicated, nuanced feelings Americans have about tits. It's just the best of all possible worlds.

Don't care about Europe... Don't care about Africa... Gimme Sioux City on a Saturdey night.

Flynne: Yes, I did read your entire post.

"I just didn't expose my naked breast in public for the whole damn
world to see. My boobs, my kid, nunya business."

Yes, we're in complete agreement. Your body, your boobs, your
choice.

The part you don't get to do is decide that nobody else is allowed
to offend your delicate sensibilities with their own body. In order
to not be a hypocrite, if you feel entitled to not be exposed to
immodest behavior X, then you should feel obliged to not offend
someone else with your own immodest behavior Y.

Flynne said: I just didn't expose my naked breast in public for the whole damn world to see. My boobs, my kid, nunya business. Actually there were only a few times that I had to breastfeed in public and I used a receiveing blanket (lightweight) to cover myself and baby. No one else needs to see. It's called being considerate of others. Obviously something you know nothing about. Sheesh.
I breast-fed my eldest til she bit me. True story, one day at about 9 months or so, she got that "I'm gonna do something bad!" look on her face and bit me *HARD*. I weaned her, after they scraped me off of the ceiling.
I was working when I had my second girl, so she got the bottle. I never noticed any difference in growth rate, intelligence, or anything else between my 2 girls. I think genetics and parenting has a lot more to do with it than bf'ding.
But that's just my experience.

That many years without wine? fuck that.

Ron-rule of thumb: when you are exercising the non-sexual function of your sexy parts in public, face the tree.

I breastfed all three of my daughters, oldest until she was 18 months, middle until she was 28 months (her choice, not mine) and the youngest was 13 months. I had anticpated allowing them each to wean themselves, but I weaned the oldest when I became pregnant with my middle daughter, and after 28 months of nursing the middle daughter, I took her off...she would eat a full meal and then still nurse for another hour and she wanted to nurse all the time...it was a comfort thing. She was a very high needs baby. Needless to say, I was exhausted. The youngest weaned herself. I believe I was a considerate nurser...I made sure I wasn't exposed when out in public, it's easy to do. I just didn't feel the need to allow anyone and everyone to watch me feed my baby, and no one wants to see those big milk jugs exposed! In fact, more often than not, people had no idea I was nursing.

As to the perky boob comment...boobs are perky when they're full of milk. Before my first baby, I was an A cup (don't laugh). I was a D when I was nursing. I could have nursed my kid and the rest of the neighborhoods if I had been inclined. Milk boobs are not attractive...just saying. Had to get them perked up after nursing three babies.

...if you feel entitled to not be exposed to
immodest behavior X, then you should feel obliged to not offend someone else with your own immodest behavior Y.

Where was I being immodest?? I posted I used a receiveing blanket (lightweight) to cover myself and baby. No one else needs to see. It's called being considerate of others.

What about this are you not getting Ron? That I was considerate and that some others are/were not? Because that's the only point I was making. Apparently your comprehension skills need work.

Hey Feebie. Life's good here, too. Got a job, finally, even though it's part time. I'm hoping it'll work into full time before the end of the year. I plan on making it known right after Memorial Day that I'd like full time, and see what they say. It's been 3 months already, I figure if they didn't like me, they'd have said something by now...

First thing I was thinkin' was 'bet her husband is happy that everyone in the world can leer at her boobs' :eyeroll:
My ex did the whole attachment parenting thing too, and when I raised any question I was invited to butt out. Because I didn't have experience, and she somehow did. Even though I had taken care of my own kid sisters and others, and she had never even had a babysitting job.

In the groups she belonged to, I would commiserate with the other dads about how this had been foisted on us... But whatcha gonna do? Have big fights about it?

By the second kid, most of that was over because my ex was tired of doing it.

Seems to be another example of how everything is taken to extreme. If it's good to BF for 12mo, it must be better to go for 24... IQ's are higher! Because not only is it well proven that it works that way, but every IQ point is worth $5 to someone somehow.

I wonder for these kids how advantageous this is when they get in to daycare, and suddenly there is no-one to attach to, like that... It's a good theory and all, but the jury Is out on practice.

There was a set of siblings in my daughter's daycare that were the poster children for Attachment Parented screw-ups. The eldest boy, a 5yr old, was especially messed up. He was a bully, he would pee on furniture, the Christmas tree, other childrens lunchboxes. He once took a pair of those little safety scissors and cut through the cord on the radio. How he managed that, I will never figure out.
If the staff didn't have a person on him all the time, he would do the most horrible things, and his parents would just shrug when told about them, take him home and the next day would be a repeat of the last.
You do your child absolutely no favors by treating them as the center of the universe. They are important, and no one loves them like mommy loves them, but from day one they need to know that they have to respect others, and understand their place in the cosmic scheme of things.
My children know that I am their Mom, not their best friend. I love them, and I'm glad they love me, but I do not demand their love. I do demand their respect, by right of the fact that I have done everything I know how to do to raise them to be honest, self-sufficient, happy human beings. And people who do not understand that "self-sufficient" is a major goal, handicap their children in a terrible way. I was able to give my kids the room to fall down, pick themselves up, brush themselves off, and try again. Unless there is blood gushing, it is your parental duty to suck it up, and let them fail, so that they can learn to succeed.
That being said, I would never let my kids starve, as long as Ramen noodles and Mac-n-cheese are available.

I have two thoughts:
What happens when his friends are over and they want to stay for lunch?

I think the gum analogy is appropriate. You can't have any unless you brought enough to share with everyone present.

(the gum analogy comes from a teacher saying,when a kid pulled out some gum, you better have brought enough to share with everyone. -- I don't know how widely that is known)

Re: the purported health benefits of breastfeeding:

The Case Against Breastfeeding

Don't be put off by the title; it's actually a well-thought, balanced piece that really looks at studies (and meta-analyses) and examines different groups' biases in both directions.

Janie4's absolutely right. Apparently, the IQ difference between the groups of kids is 5-7 points, which is not at all statistically significant. A kid's score could vary 5-7 points from one day to the next. The takeaway from the article is that breast milk seems to be a little bit better for kids (though it's impossible to separate the breastfeeding from the overall experiences of the kids in regard to parenting), but that "it seems reasonable to put breast-feeding’s health benefits on the plus side of the ledger and other things—modesty, independence, career, sanity—on the minus side, and then tally them up and make a decision." As the author says, it's the shaming for making a considered choice one way or the other that's the bigger issue.

If you want your kid to grow up to be independent, get them off your tits when they're don't have to be there.

It made sense in the middle ages to breastfeed for a long time, that offered children the best chance of survival.

But for fucks sake once a kids are old enough that they can make a sandwich on their own, they shouldn't be jumping into their mother's lap for lunch.

Speaking of sandwiches.....

John Rosemond once said: "The modern woman wouldn't dream of making her husband a sandwich on command, but she'll jump up and draw a glass of water for an able-bodied 4-year-old."

So, he went on to say, until mothers start demanding that kids work for them and not the other way around, women will never shake their image as a sex that LIKES being enslaved by one age group or another. "What's that I hear? Screaming and gnashing of teeth? Well ladies, all ya gotta do is prove me wrong."

And, somehow, carrying "attachment parenting" to this level DOES seem like slavery.