There's a guy in my town facing similar issues. He operates a medical marijuana dispensary, but the Feds have been on his ass. They recently offered him a deal-- I think it was spend 5 months in jail for possession of more than an ounce. If he doesn't, they intend to nail him for a lot more than that.
Meloni
at December 4, 2012 1:19 PM
This is why jury nullification can be so important. I recently had jury duty, as was fully prepared. Son of a bitch was guilty of assault and battery with a gunthough, and it was obvious. On the other hand, he just came back from Iraq with PTSD and a few other details... he hasn't been sentenced yet.
Eric
at December 4, 2012 1:54 PM
Erm, no. He got 80 years for operating a "grow facility" for drugs which are currently illegal under Federal law.
Nobody goes to jail for a mixed green salad.
Still, hats off to the pioneers who force the issue of states' rights.
Gog_Magog_Carpet_Reclaimers
at December 4, 2012 5:10 PM
"Erm, no. He got 80 years for operating a "grow facility" for drugs which are currently illegal under Federal law."
Erm, that's the whole point, that it shouldn't be illegal. And 'operating a "grow facility"' = growing plants, that's what was said.
Lobster
at December 4, 2012 5:15 PM
Eric: "This is why jury nullification can be so important."
I agree. Jurors can refuse to enforce unjust laws. They do not need to set aside their conscience. They can't be punished for their verdict. More people need to know that.
Trial by jury is one of the checks and balances on tyranny. A corrupt government may impose unjust laws, but jurors can refuse to convict.
The problem is getting the jury nullification message out to enough jurors (especially in the BS cases) to matter.
In the Chris Williams case that may matter if he can get enough evidence to actually re-try the case in front of a jury.
There's a guy in my town facing similar issues. He operates a medical marijuana dispensary, but the Feds have been on his ass. They recently offered him a deal-- I think it was spend 5 months in jail for possession of more than an ounce. If he doesn't, they intend to nail him for a lot more than that. -- Meloni at December 4, 2012 1:19 PM
Then throw in case like this. The federal prosecutor (and DEA/FBI/ATF) will come in, shut him down, seize his product (and possibly all his assets) and then start the actual prosecution. Then with no income, he will have to get out of jail, hire a lawyer and fight for every motion to use state codes over the federal codes (or nullify the federal code in favor of the state's code).
The prosecutor, of course, will throw in a couple of "emergency" motions when he knows the defendant's lawyer is tied up in another case and can't appear, getting a default judgement that will turn the five month plea bargain into an eleven month plea bargain.
Meanwhile the lawyer's bill has doubled or tripled. But by this time the case against the defendant is so fucked that the defendant is facing 35 years, and a felony, if he loses with a jury or a misdemeanor eleven months.
How many of these cases are going in front of a jury?
How about two years in prison for putting lobster in plastic wrap rather then a cardboard containers.
The US government protecting you. How civilized.
John Paulson
at December 4, 2012 9:59 PM
> What if he was growing poppies?
Not sure what you're getting at... And the tone of this blog posts and some its comments ("How civilized.") is probably why.
I love sarcasm more than everyone else who read this blog item put together... But sarcasm isn't affirmative rhetoric. It doesn't argue for things. It expresses the emotions of disagreement, not their basis.
"Plants" aren't the problem: This is about inebriants, not botany. Drug dealers (and selected others) are sent to prisons, not mere "cages."
Crid [CridComment at gmail]
at December 5, 2012 5:38 AM
How about prison for lying to a Fed when you're innocent of any crime?
MarkD
at December 5, 2012 5:41 AM
My opinion will change when lying to us by the Feds is punished equally. That would put new meaning into "political prisoner."
MarkD
at December 5, 2012 5:44 AM
Y'know... once upon a time, we had a great, upstanding organization for situations like this. It was called the American Civil Liberties Union, and it was widely respected across the land. But these days... stuff like that is too hard, and it doesn't get the ACLU lawyers' names in the papers. Much easier to go around suing small towns that put up manger scenes at City Hall. OK, establishment of religion, I get that, but... how about a sense of priorities?
Cousin Dave
at December 5, 2012 6:35 AM
"How about two years in prison for putting lobster in plastic wrap"
Whoa there now - Lobster's post hardly calls for suffocation!
Gog_Magog_Carpet_Reclaimers
at December 5, 2012 2:14 PM
80 years? That's not right.
There's a case in Humboldt County, California where the Executive Director of an organization that promotes business, arts and festivals was busted last month for growing 267 pot plants in her garage, and for child endangerment for dangerous grow-light wiring.
I wonder what her punishment will be since it's being handled by the County Drug Task Force.
They look like decent enough folks, and as much as I think we should experiment with drug legalization, there still are some real unsavory characters associated with growing "just a plant".
There's a guy in my town facing similar issues. He operates a medical marijuana dispensary, but the Feds have been on his ass. They recently offered him a deal-- I think it was spend 5 months in jail for possession of more than an ounce. If he doesn't, they intend to nail him for a lot more than that.
Meloni at December 4, 2012 1:19 PM
This is why jury nullification can be so important. I recently had jury duty, as was fully prepared. Son of a bitch was guilty of assault and battery with a gunthough, and it was obvious. On the other hand, he just came back from Iraq with PTSD and a few other details... he hasn't been sentenced yet.
Eric at December 4, 2012 1:54 PM
Erm, no. He got 80 years for operating a "grow facility" for drugs which are currently illegal under Federal law.
Nobody goes to jail for a mixed green salad.
Still, hats off to the pioneers who force the issue of states' rights.
Gog_Magog_Carpet_Reclaimers at December 4, 2012 5:10 PM
"Erm, no. He got 80 years for operating a "grow facility" for drugs which are currently illegal under Federal law."
Erm, that's the whole point, that it shouldn't be illegal. And 'operating a "grow facility"' = growing plants, that's what was said.
Lobster at December 4, 2012 5:15 PM
Eric: "This is why jury nullification can be so important."
I agree. Jurors can refuse to enforce unjust laws. They do not need to set aside their conscience. They can't be punished for their verdict. More people need to know that.
Trial by jury is one of the checks and balances on tyranny. A corrupt government may impose unjust laws, but jurors can refuse to convict.
http://fija.org/
Ken R at December 4, 2012 6:13 PM
The problem is getting the jury nullification message out to enough jurors (especially in the BS cases) to matter.
In the Chris Williams case that may matter if he can get enough evidence to actually re-try the case in front of a jury.
Then throw in case like this. The federal prosecutor (and DEA/FBI/ATF) will come in, shut him down, seize his product (and possibly all his assets) and then start the actual prosecution. Then with no income, he will have to get out of jail, hire a lawyer and fight for every motion to use state codes over the federal codes (or nullify the federal code in favor of the state's code).
The prosecutor, of course, will throw in a couple of "emergency" motions when he knows the defendant's lawyer is tied up in another case and can't appear, getting a default judgement that will turn the five month plea bargain into an eleven month plea bargain.
Meanwhile the lawyer's bill has doubled or tripled. But by this time the case against the defendant is so fucked that the defendant is facing 35 years, and a felony, if he loses with a jury or a misdemeanor eleven months.
How many of these cases are going in front of a jury?
Jim P. at December 4, 2012 7:17 PM
Be bitter if you want, but no righteousness can be heard through sarcasm. Dope isn't about 'growing plants'.
Crid [CridComment at gmail] at December 4, 2012 7:37 PM
What if he was growing poppies?
And why isn't Mallinckrodt, Inc. raided every month?
Jim P. at December 4, 2012 9:54 PM
How about two years in prison for putting lobster in plastic wrap rather then a cardboard containers.
The US government protecting you. How civilized.
John Paulson at December 4, 2012 9:59 PM
> What if he was growing poppies?
Not sure what you're getting at... And the tone of this blog posts and some its comments ("How civilized.") is probably why.
I love sarcasm more than everyone else who read this blog item put together... But sarcasm isn't affirmative rhetoric. It doesn't argue for things. It expresses the emotions of disagreement, not their basis.
"Plants" aren't the problem: This is about inebriants, not botany. Drug dealers (and selected others) are sent to prisons, not mere "cages."
Crid [CridComment at gmail] at December 5, 2012 5:38 AM
How about prison for lying to a Fed when you're innocent of any crime?
MarkD at December 5, 2012 5:41 AM
My opinion will change when lying to us by the Feds is punished equally. That would put new meaning into "political prisoner."
MarkD at December 5, 2012 5:44 AM
Y'know... once upon a time, we had a great, upstanding organization for situations like this. It was called the American Civil Liberties Union, and it was widely respected across the land. But these days... stuff like that is too hard, and it doesn't get the ACLU lawyers' names in the papers. Much easier to go around suing small towns that put up manger scenes at City Hall. OK, establishment of religion, I get that, but... how about a sense of priorities?
Cousin Dave at December 5, 2012 6:35 AM
"How about two years in prison for putting lobster in plastic wrap"
Whoa there now - Lobster's post hardly calls for suffocation!
Gog_Magog_Carpet_Reclaimers at December 5, 2012 2:14 PM
80 years? That's not right.
There's a case in Humboldt County, California where the Executive Director of an organization that promotes business, arts and festivals was busted last month for growing 267 pot plants in her garage, and for child endangerment for dangerous grow-light wiring.
I wonder what her punishment will be since it's being handled by the County Drug Task Force.
They look like decent enough folks, and as much as I think we should experiment with drug legalization, there still are some real unsavory characters associated with growing "just a plant".
Jason S. at December 5, 2012 2:48 PM
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