The Reverse Boohoo: What If A Female Scientist Wore A Shirt With Images Of Hot Men On It?
For anyone who's been living under a rock this week, here a photo "offending" shirt.
David Burge with the nutshell on the furor:
@Iowahawkblog
"Man Forced to Apologize for Sexist Shirt After Successfully Landing Spacecraft on Comet" has to be the ultimate headline for our age.
And that question again: What if a female scientist wore a shirt with images of hot men?
Do you think there's a man alive whose response would be to whimper that he is being chased out of science?
Clearly, feminism is no longer about demanding that women be treated as equals, but as eggshells.
Thanks, but I'll be having no part of that -- or of feminism's lack of interest for the rights of anyone who lacks a vagina and outright calls for discrimination against men.
And I hope more and more women start to be vocal in saying the same.
On a side note, there's a certain kind of nerd who wears that kind of shirt, and I've always had a soft spot for that guy and the way he sees the world. The sort of hope and love of space fantasy and dream of a bullet-bra'd fantasy woman of that guy is the stuff jobs landing spacecraft on comets are made of.
Having seen the shirt now, I am surprised they let him on TV with it. So many colors! A decade ago the camera would have had trouble capturing it.
Ben at November 15, 2014 6:46 AM
"On a side note, there's a certain kind of nerd who wears that kind of shirt, and I've always had a soft spot for that guy and the way he sees the world. The sort of hope and love of space fantasy and dream of a bullet-bra'd fantasy woman of that guy is the stuff jobs landing spacecraft on comets are made of."
I have never loved you more than at this moment
Ken Pontac at November 15, 2014 6:59 AM
Woman wears shirt with sexy guys,Feminazis be like
Feminists: ye, damn gurl power. independence, mature,yo go gurll strong etxc.
Man wears shirt with sexy girls, Feminazis be like
Feminist: well da-eff is that, muh-soggy-knees!
#justfeministthings
Rimmonen at November 15, 2014 8:15 AM
Modern feminism = tribalism.
Lobster at November 15, 2014 8:18 AM
There was a news story some time back, about some bullies at a high school, harrasing a gay student wearing pink.
To their credit, the next day (or thereabouts), a lot of students wore pink, even some of the most popular ones. The bullies *hated* that.
I think something similar should happen here (but too bad the shirts are sold out, I would buy one in a heartbeat).
I'd like to see a whole bunch of people wearing that shirt in public, just to piss off the morons.
there are some who call me 'Tim?' at November 15, 2014 8:20 AM
Amy Alkon
http://www.advicegoddess.com/archives/2014/11/15/the_reverse_boo.html#comment-5496467">comment from there are some who call me 'Tim?'I'd wear it in a hot second, despite finding it horribly ugly.
Amy Alkon at November 15, 2014 9:02 AM
Yes, it goes both ways, and I have no problem with that. I think Astra put it best in the last related thread:
"Meh, the shirt doesn't offend me or keep me from doing science, but it was particularly inappropriate for wearing when you are in front of the world in a professional capacity, and I see no problem with pointing that out."
Posted by: Astra at November 14, 2014 6:32 AM
_______________________________
Reminds me of what I told a friend a few years ago after returning from my first trip to Italy (I was staying maybe one hour's drive or less from Pisa, on the coast):
"It was SO refreshing to be in a society where you're surrounded by adults who DRESS like adults!"
(For example, I don't recall a single adult - and hardly even any teens, Italian or not, who wore T-shirts with pictures, writing, or cartoons on them.)
As humorist/journalist Fran Lebowitz wrote nearly 40 years ago: "If people don't want to hear from you, what makes you think they want to hear from your sweater?"
lenona at November 15, 2014 9:10 AM
"On a side note, there's a certain kind of nerd who wears that kind of shirt, and I've always had a soft spot for that guy and the way he sees the world."
Amy, we male nerds don't like being reduced to caricatures who wear clothing that screams tone-blind, if not arrested development.
:p
DaveG at November 15, 2014 9:13 AM
From the BBC:
South African cosmologist Renee Hlozek wrote a blog post addressed to budding female scientists. "Yes, you are capable of being taken seriously," she wrote.
http://www.bbc.com/news/blogs-trending-30055278
Going into a hysterical meltdown over a silly Hawaiian shirt won't help you be taken seriously.
Martin at November 15, 2014 9:40 AM
If a female scientist wore a shirt with a bunch of half-naked guys on it I would think exactly the same thing: Extraordinarily unprofessional, tacky, and classless.
Elle at November 15, 2014 12:40 PM
Certainly, the shirt was inappropriate for a professional settting.
The problem is that the response to it was *far* more inappropriate.
there are some who call me 'Tim?' at November 15, 2014 1:02 PM
All my Hawaiian shirts have flowers on them. Guess I went to the wrong island.
Wfjag at November 15, 2014 1:57 PM
If you want to argue that the shirt is unprofessional, I'd agree. If you want to argue that it creates a hostile work environment, then well OK. But this argument that this is what is keeping women on out of STEM fields seems a bit far-fetched. How are you going to pass quantum mechanics if the mere sight of a sexist shirt deters you?
Ted at November 15, 2014 3:40 PM
The funny thing is, when I saw an online video of the guy wearing that shirt, I wouldn't have known there were women on it if the accompanying article hadn't told me. It looked like one big abstract color splash. Maybe it came across clearer on TV, I don't know.
Rex Little at November 15, 2014 3:51 PM
Amy Alkon
http://www.advicegoddess.com/archives/2014/11/15/the_reverse_boo.html#comment-5498317">comment from ElleIf a female scientist wore a shirt with a bunch of half-naked guys on it I would think exactly the same thing: Extraordinarily unprofessional, tacky, and classless.
You might THINK the same thing, but would there be international outrage over it?
Amy Alkon at November 15, 2014 4:36 PM
@Elle
Judging scientists by their shirts is "extraordinarily unprofessional, tacky, classless", childish, stupid, and indicative of a total inability to understand what science and engineering are actually about.
Landing a spaceship on a comet is extraordinarily professional, classy, and awesome. His qualities as a professional are world-class, beyond any possible doubt. He. Is. One. Of. The. Best. There. Is. -- in a field you can't begin to understand the basics of. If you're unable to grasp that, shut up and fetch him coffee. What he does is so far over your head, you aren't fit to have an opinion.
People like you are so stupid, real people can't even communicate with you. Yet somehow you've become so amazingly entitled and privileged that people listen to your opinions. Do you even know what a comet IS?
Lars Grobian at November 15, 2014 4:41 PM
Knock it off Lars. The shirt is unprofessional, tacky, and classless. I personally think it makes the guy look color blind. If I was the person picking people to represent my group on TV I would have told him to wear a calmer shirt that day. Part of doing the interview is representing his organization and in that capacity appearance does matter.
But as Ted said, if a shirt is enough to keep you out of a STEM field there is no loss there. You never would have made it anyways.
The real issue is does a shirt constitute a hostile workplace. And that level of stupidity is probably why you, me, and most men in America don't have a lot of patience with feminists. They have passed beyond stupidity in mouth foaming lunacy. Please don't join them.
Ben at November 15, 2014 5:06 PM
I also think his tattoos are sexy.
And it's the job of the people who manage media where he works to say, "Umm, hmm...that might be a bit 'busy' for camera."
What too often constitutes a "hostile" workplace is people who can't behave like adults and open their mouth when something disturbs them and ask the person to stop doing it.
And people who can't take a joke or take a compliment (and I mean "nice skirt," not something about what's underneath) without running up to squeal to human resources that they have been ruined for all eternity.
Grow the fuck up.
Also, if you are that sensitive, you should not be in the workplace; you should be in a facility where the most stressful thing you do all day is match colored blocks.
Amy Alkon at November 15, 2014 6:49 PM
Lars may have gone a bit overboard with the insult at the end but he has a point.
Imagine firing a bullet from the top of the empire state building to hit a humming bird in Colorado that will be feeding at this one flower for five seconds 3 days from now.
What this guy did was harder, who gives a fuck what he wore?
Those that do are the problem. His job isnt public relations, or begging for money.
Just becuase his job is in an office doesnt mean he need to wear a suit.
Who here wold expect the construction worker how just riveted the last bolt into a skyscraper to come directly from that shift to give an interview and the bitch about how he failed to dress properly in a suit and tie to give a statement to the camera?
lujlp at November 15, 2014 7:00 PM
If a female scientist wore a shirt with a bunch of half-naked guys on it I would think exactly the same thing: Extraordinarily unprofessional, tacky, and classless.
Posted by: Elle at November 15, 2014 12:40 PM
I guess we are really fortunate then, that the academic panel that this guy went in front of, to be awarded his doctorate,isn't composed of the same demographic that elects high school cheerleaders.
It isn't about the fucking shirt. It is, as usual, about optics over substance.
Something that seems ingrained into women's psyches.
Lars is right. Both you, and Lenona come across as nitwits.
This is same kind of idiocy that got us Barack H. Obama as president of the U.S.
Isab at November 15, 2014 7:21 PM
Thanks Amy. Your common sense much appreciated.
Robert at November 16, 2014 4:17 AM
For what it's worth, the shirt in question was a present from a friend of his, a woman:
http://ellyprizemanupdate.blogspot.co.uk/2014/11/decisions-and-comments.html
Not, sadly, that I think the fact that all the guy was doing was showing off a gift from a friend would weigh on the minds of the SJW lynch mob.
Bill Dalasio at November 16, 2014 4:20 AM
Do the people accusing the guy of being "unprofessional" have any clue about the norms and customs of the professions of science and engineering? Have they spent any time at all among practicing scientists? I very much doubt it.
The guy is a scientist. He's not a banker, a salesman, or a TV pundit. Judge him by the standards of his own profession, not yours.
DH at November 16, 2014 4:43 AM
"Do you think there's a man alive whose response would be to whimper that he is being chased out of science?"
There is now. Ms.Rose Eveleth and the Feminists have shown every beta male everywhere how to feel important and self-satisfied without actually accomplishing anything.
Kurtis at November 16, 2014 4:58 AM
"if you are that sensitive, you should not be in the workplace; you should be in a facility where the most stressful thing you do all day is match colored blocks."
ROFL. Thank you. I've been thinking this for years - if you can't handle a a shirt, how will you handle a genuine problem?
Tom at November 16, 2014 5:01 AM
"ROFL. Thank you. I've been thinking this for years - if you can't handle a a shirt, how will you handle a genuine problem?"
That's the thing.
These people don't actually care about real problems, just the ones they manufacture so they can feel some sort of outrage.
Real problems require actual effort, they can't be bothered by that.
there are some who call me 'Tim?' at November 16, 2014 5:09 AM
@"It was SO refreshing to be in a society where you're surrounded by adults who DRESS like adults!"
People may dress more like 'adults' in Western Europe, but the women also dress more like WOMEN. I found it "refreshing" to be in a society where women didn't have so many hangups about embracing and expressing and enjoying their own femininity. (And it doesn't hold them back from their careers.)
Lobster at November 16, 2014 5:15 AM
The "feminists" here are just petty dictators looking for someone to bully ... there is nothing constructive to be achieved by attacking the guy for wearing that shirt - it's just pure destruction. Which is my problem with modern feminism, it's not a rights movement, it doesn't seek to improve the world, it doesn't offer anything of value that actually helps anyone, it's just a smug tribalist gang of bullies throwing their weight around.
Lobster at November 16, 2014 5:21 AM
"Clearly, feminism is no longer about demanding that women be treated as equals, but as eggshells."
Thanks for that. I'm going to repurpose it for discussions.
"Pardon me, I thought you said "eggshells" not "equals". Because any man would not be whining about that."
Darth Chocolate at November 16, 2014 5:23 AM
I think everyone should be allowed to dress how they want as long as it isn't obviously harmful, and we should stand up against petty bullies who want to dictate otherwise.
Lobster at November 16, 2014 5:24 AM
Let's see......
Kim Kardashian naked? Empowering!
Topless women at the Vatican shoving Crucifixes up their 'Arses'? Empowering!! (That gets a double Exclamation point, because it's that empowering)
Man with colorful shirt? Sexist and Oppressive.
Yep. We've got our priorities in order.
MagicalPat at November 16, 2014 5:40 AM
First, I am wholeheartedly with the guy who says I love you more than ever right now!
On the the point, I will paraphrase Val Con yosPhelium. When it comes to allies, the most important considerations are 1. Can he shoot. 2. Will he aim at my enemies. Likewise, when it comes to landing my breadbox on a comet 100 million miles away 1. Can he pilot 2. Is he brilliant enough to pilot with a several second delay in communications?!
If so, I could care less if he wears polka dot bikinis without shaving. That doesn't have a hell of a lot to do with getting my breadbox on the comet in one piece.
And to those who judge others by what they wear or don't wear, or who think they know the one true way adults are supposed to dress.....I pity you.
Tim McD at November 16, 2014 5:41 AM
From a comment by Tim Maguire on Instapundit, and probably one of the real reasons the idiots are so offended:
"Also worth noting--the women on his shirt are powerful women of action. They may be scantily clad, but they will never need smelling salts or a fainting couch"
(small spelling correction included :) )
there are some who call me 'Tim?' at November 16, 2014 5:47 AM
From Sarah Hoyt:
"Because the truth, Ms. Eveleth, is that women who have an interest in space exploration will not be put off by a scientist’s shirt showing pretty women in next to nothing, holding ray guns. THOSE women – I’m one of them – will think it’s cool. They will dive into the field with renewed interest because there are Odd men there, and only Odd men get Odd girls, the same girls your cliques tend to treat as pariahs because we don’t wear the right clothes and we don’t emit the required bleats at the right time.
I know you’ll never get this, but you can keep your “social justice” and your damned Marxist-derived feminism.
I want my ray guns and my spaceships."
http://accordingtohoyt.com/2014/11/15/no-space-for-sewing-circles/
I will also note that the SJWs are now accusing Instapundit of 'sending his flying monkeys to doxx and attack' Eveleth. As someone notes, publicly lying about the actions of a law professor may be suboptimal.
http://pjmedia.com/instapundit/198354/
Firehand at November 16, 2014 7:40 AM
"I'd wear it in a hot second, despite finding it horribly ugly."
In my experience, although "clothes make the man", it is the woman who makes the outfit. A T-shirt on you is likely to invoke shortness of breath, not outrage, no matter what is printed on it.
All us kids admire gifts, even those given to others…
Radwaste at November 16, 2014 7:45 AM
The guy apparently had a leadership role on the team and chose a sort of 'gonzo' style to express it. When they hit a milestone, the guy got a tattoo of the mission. So this shirt was sort of an ensemble piece with his shorts and mission tattoo on his leg which he was also showing off for the cameras.
This guy is not a conservative. He's a monofocused lunatic. But that's ok. Unlike the feminists, we can be tolerant about that.
TMLutas at November 16, 2014 7:52 AM
Glad it's finally been pointed out that shirt is a strong statement for female empowerment. It says to girls: "Get a STEM degree -- invent rayguns. Then wear any damn thimg you want. And disintergrate any creep who harrasses you about it."
Of course, the people calling themselves "feminists" hate that. They attack the guy wearinfg this female-empowering shirt. Attack ISIL? That would be un-PC.
Owen at November 16, 2014 8:07 AM
I see chicks with penis envy
just_some_lowbrow at November 16, 2014 9:12 AM
"Do the people accusing the guy of being "unprofessional" have any clue about the norms and customs of the professions of science and engineering? Have they spent any time at all among practicing scientists? I very much doubt it."
The thing is DH, when you try to spin this as "normal behavior" for engineering types *that* is when it leaves the realm of one guy's clothing choice into the realm of "this culture could be unpleasant and discouraging for women." That there is no one in that culture willing to say "hey, don't wear that shirt with all the half-naked girls on it to work, it could some of our coworkers uncomfortable" makes you wonder what else the "norms and customs" would let slide. Nobody is going to point to a shirt and say "that's why I can't be in a STEM field" but the culture that thinks half-naked lady shirts are ok attire for being on international TV is comprised of many such straws on the camel's back.
No, a tacky shirt does not undermine his ability to do jaw-droppingly amazing science. And I'm not saying he had to wear a suit or even a polo and khakis. How awesome was Mohawk Guy during the landing of the Curiosity? But this particular Hawaiian shirt of half-naked women on international tv is still unprofessional, tacky, and classless.
Elle at November 16, 2014 9:52 AM
A little bit of social awkwardness is almost expected of nerdy, geeky scientific types. Everyone knows this. What we are seeing here is a "look at me, look at me!" display from individuals who would, absent the cause they claim to represent, would be living in well-earned, well-deserved obscurity.
Ned C. at November 16, 2014 9:55 AM
A picture of Captain America would be no more sexual than what the rocket scientist had on his shirt.
This is leftist totalitarianism parading as manners.
ccoffer at November 16, 2014 10:36 AM
No wonder there are so few women in science and technology, they're afraid of shirts. And they're blind to amazing feats.
Guys, on the other hand, are busy marveling at the fact that a space probe launched 10 years ago hit a comet on the fly more than 3 million miles from earth.
Conan the Grammarian at November 16, 2014 10:43 AM
Sorry, Elle, you're not only barking up the wrong tree, you deliberately passed the right tree on the way.
The shirt was a gift to him from a *female* friend. Maybe he thought it would be nice to give some exposure to that fact.
Yes, it *was* slightly unprofessional, but the fact that there are so many deliberately outraged people, in need of the famous fainting couches, who completely ignore the awesomeness of the event and get vapors over a fucking shirt is telling.
The ones complaining about the shirt don't actually care how many women enter STEM fields.
They just want something they can be a victim about.
The women engineers I know (and have recently asked) *love* that shirt. They're not put off at all.
there are some who call me 'Tim?' at November 16, 2014 10:44 AM
Also, agree with Raddy.
Amy in a shirt like this would inspire a certain reaction, but certainly not rage.
there are some who call me 'Tim?' at November 16, 2014 10:50 AM
If there is anything keeping American women (and American men for that matter) from getting STEM jobs its H1Bs.
Obama, the dems and the GOP want more, wtf!
Lester at November 16, 2014 10:58 AM
The basic question to ask of any grievance monger is the following: Who has done more for humanity, you or your target?
This goes for almost any critic of individuals who have accomplished anything, and it's easy to find other examples, e.g.
Who has done more for humanity, the pharmaceutical industry or it's critics?
Who has done more for humanity, doctors or their critics?
Once the meta rule outlined above is applied more broadly, clarity on issues become a piece of cake.
Gleep Glop at November 16, 2014 11:25 AM
I'm a woman and a space geek. I got hooked on spaceflight back in the late 60s when I was a child.
To me this was an absolutely awe inspiring achievement.These scientists & engineers designed, built, launched & piloted a machine across space to land on a comet, in order to explore & expand our knowledge of the universe. It does not get any better than this, IMHO.
Yet some feminist bitch [excuse my language]got her panties all in a wad because the chief scientist was wearing a shirt with half dressed women [and armed women at that!]on it. Really.
And feminists wonder why so many women [including myself] refuse to identify themselves as feminists or with feminism.
Beemer at November 16, 2014 12:26 PM
"The basic question to ask of any grievance monger is the following: Who has done more for humanity, you or your target?"
To which 100% of SJWs will reply, "ME!"
dee nile at November 16, 2014 12:35 PM
The putative "feminists" whining about a shirt are mere attention whores and arrested development mean girl bullies and their bleating sheep followers. Symptoms of a culture destroying itself with childish self indulgence, secure in a world made by the very people they constantly attack. Why does anyone care what they think? Because we no longer believe in our culture.
Victor Erimita at November 16, 2014 2:48 PM
People may dress more like 'adults' in Western Europe, but the women also dress more like WOMEN. I found it "refreshing" to be in a society where women didn't have so many hangups about embracing and expressing and enjoying their own femininity. (And it doesn't hold them back from their careers.)
Posted by: Lobster at November 16, 2014 5:15 AM
__________________________________
Not sure what you mean. For one thing, high heels can make it difficult to walk well - or run when you're in a hurry. What's so "enjoyable" about that? I twist my ankles often enough even though I NEVER wear heels. Very painful. If a certain dress looks awful anyway, I doubt heels would help - but a great dress doesn't need heels to go with it.
Also, any career - such as nursing - where you have to run around, get dirty sometimes, or use elbow grease, very often is only hindered by wearing even a knee-length skirt. What you wear off the job is a completely different matter, of course.
Finally, as Ann Landers pointed out in 1982, many women prefer to wear pants simply because even young, reasonably thin women can have unattractive (e.g., bowed) legs - I've seen plenty of such women. (She also mentioned the extra expense of nylons when wearing skirts - and the freedom of movement when wearing pants, whether one is sitting, climbing, or bending over.)
Keep in mind that it wasn't considered properly "feminine" to go without a corset, once upon a time. Thankfully, we're now sane enough to believe in exercising instead, to stay in shape.
lenona at November 16, 2014 3:09 PM
I think everyone should be allowed to dress how they want as long as it isn't obviously harmful, and we should stand up against petty bullies who want to dictate otherwise.
_________________________________
There have to be limits, for more than one (non-partisan) reason.
"What you have when everyone wears the same play clothes for all occasions, is addressed by nickname, expected to participate in show and tell and bullied out of any desire for privacy is not democracy; it's kindergarten."
- Judith Martin (Miss Manners)
From the 1985 book: "Common courtesy: in which Miss Manners solves the problem that baffled Mr. Jefferson"
lenona at November 16, 2014 3:18 PM
I, personally, find the definition of "professional attire" for a scientist or engineer a ludicrous concept. It's a stupid social construct, in many ways designed to keep the people who can actually DO the work from displacing the suit-wearing manager who couldn't answer the question, "What's the derivative of sin x?"... but who has some really classy suits.
I will always revere the memory of Bill Hewlett and David Packard, who released generations of engineers (including me) from colored frog stranglers around their necks by demonstrating that they could hire shorts and t-shirt wearing nerds in flip-flops to produce world class products.
If the PR people had said to him, "You know, that shirt is probably not what you should be wearing on national TV", I'm pretty sure he would have said, "Sure, ok, what do you think I should wear?" He wasn't making a statement.
Bud at November 16, 2014 3:45 PM
"That there is no one in that culture willing to say "hey, don't wear that shirt with all the half-naked girls on it to work, it could some of our coworkers uncomfortable"
Elle, the problem is who gets to decide when who is made uncomfortable. Feminists seem to tell us that only THEY get to decide for BOTH genders.
Note:
http://nypost.com/2010/06/03/woman-says-she-was-fired-from-citibank-for-being-too-hot-2/
and
http://nymag.com/thecut/2012/05/woman-claims-she-was-fired-for-being-too-hot.html
And numerous other instances of the same. When male workers are "made to feel uncomfortable," then they are being sexist and women complain to the HR departments. Woman should be able to wear whatever they want, and men should just put up with it. The fact that men are uncomfortable, is just the patriarchy trying to oppress a woman's right to express herself.
Who decides when something makes someone else uncomfortable? If it's the person being made to feel uncomfortable...who has the control...then these women have no basis for their complaints. Instead, women want to control both ends of the conversation.
You have a double-standard situation where a woman could claim the right to wear one of the outfits on the shirt (no slut-shaming aloud), and men just need to put up with it...but the man having the picture of the very same woman in the very same outfit is demeaning of women?
F Irving at November 16, 2014 3:48 PM
Ok, yes its a loud shirt. But the deafening stupidity of the response is far worse. Is this what we have become? The man landed a machine on a comet. Let me reiterate that....he landed, a man made thing, on a moving ball of rock and ice, in space, while it was moving.....and were worrying over whats on his shirt?? The shirt that was made and given to him as a birthday gift from a female friend who is a tattoo artist (a male dominated field)??? Seriously??? So people who dont grasp what hes doing, cant fathom the ramifications let alone how hard this was, are butthurt over his shirt? He landed a spacecraft on a comet. He can wear whatever he wants. And Ben youre seriously still on about the shirt?? And Elle, you have a vag, we get it. Now shut up and go do something useful like make sammitches.
Murphy at November 16, 2014 6:17 PM
If a female scientist was criticized for what she was wearing, there's be "slut walks" in solidarity with her in every large city in the US.
A. C. at November 16, 2014 8:05 PM
Murphy,
I agree with you the defining stupidity is the response. The hypocrisy and totalitarianism of feminists was paraded all over the place. Though to some extent I am desensitized. Feminist lunacy is such an every day thing. I only yelled at Lars because he was doing the same thing as the feminists. You can criticize a shirt for being ugly or unprofessional without calling for the guy to lose his job or calling him history's greatest monster like the feminists are.
And for those saying the optics don't matter because it isn't part of his job, when he got in front of a camera and represented his team he became a public spokes person. And optics matter in that job. He wasn't just some guy in the background.
And yes, I do know what is 'professional dress' for scientists and engineers. Ugly shirts and weird shoes are how we get rid of the crap work of dealing with customers and upper management. The damn middle managers and sale people need to do their jobs and let us do ours. If you dress too professionally they offload all of their work onto you and before you know it you've become a salesman.
Ben at November 16, 2014 9:40 PM
Okay, I was slow finding a picture of the shirt in question; criminy, if you're hot about that thing, how mortified must you be at a stoplight, a radio host, or anybody/thing else that doesn't act like YOU think they should at the moment. Call the police! Arrest THAT man! He has fantasy figures on his SHIRT that don't look anything like me!
Radwaste at November 17, 2014 8:14 PM
Elle,
You are WAY off base on this issue and focusing on minutia instead of things of importance.
First of all, let me dissuade you from any presumption that loud gaudy shirts are somehow part of "engineering culture".
Let me even dissuade you from the idea that there is a such thing as "engineering culture".
Most people in the sciences are fiercely independent, they are people who buck the trend and actively defy easy categorization.
Many of them are the adult version of the kid who didn't quite fit in with everyone because they were interested and passionate about science from the time they were in elementary school.
These are people who do things their own way, see the world differently, and hence are able to do things that astound and amaze because they aren't stuck wearing the same blinders as everyone else.
Unfortunately this can sometimes lead to individual eccentricities. This particular guy happens to have lots of tattoos and apparently wears gaudy shirts.
To conclude from this that gaudy shirts are par for the course is silliness of the highest order... there were several other scientists on video with him at various times and not one of them was wearing anything like that, nor did they have any visible tattoos.
Apparently that is just his own individual expression... in other words, if anything the "culture" of science is that of individualism. So you can't nail it down in the simplistic terms that you are trying to do.
"But this particular Hawaiian shirt of half-naked women on international tv is still unprofessional, tacky, and classless."
Great... so far as you are concerned the guy has a terrible fashion sense and is a tacky dresser.
The wonderful news for you is that you don't have to worry about going to social gatherings with him or worry about dating him... the guy is married and apparently has friends willing to make that tacky shirt for him and provide it as a gift.
The problem is that he has been set up as a poster child for looming sexist attitudes within the field of science.
How someone gets from "unprofessional, tacky, and classless" to "sexist" is the problem here.
You should not have any concern if he appears unprofessional at work so long as the people he works directly with have no problems with his attire.
Surely you wouldn't want people outside of wherever you work dictating what you can and cannot wear while on the job. Frankly it isn't any of their business if you wore tacky and classless clothing to work if they do not work with you.
The charge of sexism here based upon a gaudy shirt is the problem and there is no rational basis to make such an assertion.
Gaudy shirts do not make someone a sexist... discriminatory attitudes make someone a sexist.
Artemis at November 17, 2014 10:04 PM
I am glad some people are finally coming to this poor guys defense, and taking on the SJW fanatics. This shirt did not have Hustler style porn, it was comic book art, the kind you will see all over the place at sci fi conventions, comic book conventions, gamer conventions, and pop art fairs all over the country. Yes, it is not suitable for a corporate boardroom, or a news anchor, but for a bunch of nerdy space scientists or silicon valley people (men and women both) it is pretty common. And any woman so delicate she is offended by that does not belong in the field. The real dismaying part of this is for awhile it looked like even most conservatives were too intimidated to fight back, as even on Fox news the anchors were clucking about the offensive shirt.
richard40 at November 18, 2014 7:53 AM
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