A Tantrum About Adult Reality And A Celebration Of Looting
There's some pretty obscene stuff below, and not of the penis and vagina (and other parts employed in sex acts) kind. It's ethically obscene, and it pretends to be exactly the opposite.
It's an NP interview by Natalie Escobar with an author, Vicky Osterweil, whose book, In Defense of Looting, came out on Tuesday. Again, it's some sick stuff.
During the uprisings of this past summer, rioting and looting have often gone hand in hand. Can you talk about the distinction you see between the two?"Rioting" generally refers to any moment of mass unrest or upheaval.Riots are a space in which a mass of people has produced a situation in which the general laws that govern society no longer function, and people can act in different ways in the street and in public. I'd say that rioting is a broader category, in which looting appears as a tactic.
Often, looting is more common among movements that are coming from below. It tends to be an attack on a business, a commercial space, maybe a government building--taking those things that would otherwise be commodified and controlled and sharing them for free.
Can you talk about rioting as a tactic? What are the reasons people deploy it as a strategy?
It does a number of important things. It gets people what they need for free immediately, which means that they are capable of living and reproducing their lives without having to rely on jobs or a wage--which, during COVID times, is widely unreliable or, particularly in these communities is often not available, or it comes at great risk. That's looting's most basic tactical power as a political mode of action.
It also attacks the very way in which food and things are distributed. It attacks the idea of property, and it attacks the idea that in order for someone to have a roof over their head or have a meal ticket, they have to work for a boss, in order to buy things that people just like them somewhere else in the world had to make under the same conditions. It points to the way in which that's unjust. And the reason that the world is organized that way, obviously, is for the profit of the people who own the stores and the factories. So you get to the heart of that property relation, and demonstrate that without police and without state oppression, we can have things for free.
Importantly, I think especially when it's in the context of a Black uprising like the one we're living through now, it also attacks the history of whiteness and white supremacy. The very basis of property in the U.S. is derived through whiteness and through Black oppression, through the history of slavery and settler domination of the country. Looting strikes at the heart of property, of whiteness and of the police. It gets to the very root of the way those three things are interconnected. And also it provides people with an imaginative sense of freedom and pleasure and helps them imagine a world that could be. And I think that's a part of it that doesn't really get talked about--that riots and looting are experienced as sort of joyous and liberatory.
"Riots and looting are experienced as sort of joyous and liberatory."
Wow.
Also, consider the downside of getting caught in such a "joyous and liberatory" act: being liberated from your freedom when sentenced to spend several years or more in a cage.
And note this idea: "It also attacks the very way in which food and things are distributed."
Distributed. How do you get food? By waiting for the food truck to come by and drop you off your free steak? Or do you work for a boss who's kind of an asshole in a job you really wish you could leave to get into another career.
Life as an adult is not all ice cream cones, blow jobs, and Nintendo. However, it's vastly more comfortable and filled with vastly less suffering than at any time in human history. You just have to work and make something of yourself rather than joining a mob and stealing stuff or screaming that you've been wronged because nobody will give you a home, a Bentley, and vacations in exchange for doing fuck all.
This is kinda poygnint.
Trump's an ass for not using any of our Presidential powers, including a serious rhetorical effort from the grandest Bully Pulpit the world has ever known, to put a stop to the lawlessness. He comes to us from the eighth grade: He can literally not conceive of any activity on the planet beyond watching out for his best interests. Make no mistake: If having your home or business set aflame would reflect well on him only by comparison, you'd be shit out of luck, too... No matter how responsible a citizen & taxpayer you had been, and no matter how many times you'd voted for Trump while wearing a goofy red cap.
But he comes to America in the one hour of her history when trashrodent liberals are just as eager to sacrifice the lives of the powerless to decorate their fantasies of righteousness.
Won't vote this year. Can't. Will not feign assent to any of these filth-mongers.
Crid at August 28, 2020 11:55 PM
We're basically reliving the late 60's / early 70's. They haven't even changed lingo. So if history is any guide, in a few years black people will find themselves further alienated from society and locked out of opportunities because people fear them. And the same upper middle class Progressives will blame 'society' for what they themselves had precipitated and abetted.
Norm at August 29, 2020 12:03 AM
George Floyd Tweets & Links—
Anyone who thinks these cases are an excuse to bring violent misery to the lives of strangers is going to have all the reason they need for quite some time, certainly for the rest of 2020. There are similar considerations for the Jacob Blake case.Crid at August 29, 2020 12:48 AM
"So you get to the heart of that property relation, and demonstrate that without police and without state oppression, we can have things for free."
But, but, pray tell, Radical Underpants Gnomes: Where do the "things" come from?
I remember thinking something similar--why can't the government just give everybody all the money they need so that everyone could buy everything? WHEN I WAS SIX YEARS OLD.
RigelDog at August 29, 2020 7:49 AM
I just do not understand rooting and looting.
Attacking the distribution of food?
Food is not just distributed. It takes time and nurturing. Then it is picked and shipped.
My grandparents couldn’t afford to buy food. They grew their own in their regular sized backyard. They splurged on meat at Thanksgiving, Easter, and Christmas. They also purchased ice milk and milk regularly. Everything else was grown. Stealing their food is stealing their work and their chances of survival.
Every product involves labor. I don’t understand just distributing it.
On the other hand, I’m all for giving people the tools for self-improvement.
I’d like to see free internet, free online education at all levels, free healthcare, and environmental protections. Community gardens are a benefit for those who don’t have any property. If you are healthy and educated, they can pull themselves up be their bootstraps. That’s my way of providing a level playing field and reparations of a sort. People would have to invest in themselves to get any kind of benefit, but at least it would be available for those who care to take advantage of it.
Jen at August 29, 2020 7:54 AM
I approve of looters being shot in the act.
Kent McManigal at August 29, 2020 8:19 AM
Yoo Guyth, things are Rilly Bad.
But they aren't that bad.
Crid at August 29, 2020 8:20 AM
"I’d like to see free internet, free online education at all levels, free healthcare, and environmental protections."
You'd like to see taxpayer-funded internet, education, healthcare, etc. Sorry, that's one of my pet peeves. If it requires resources of any kind, it's not free.
Which isn't to say it's not a good idea, but the effectiveness of taxpayer-funded anything isn't easy to assess. If you actually get what you pay for, you should count yourself fortunate.
Old RPM Daddy (OldRPMDaddy at GMail dot com) at August 29, 2020 8:26 AM
RigelDog I think you are correct. A few years ago I proposed we give everyone $1 million. Since everyone would be rich, the govt could impose a wealth tax. With the additional revenue from the tax and the elimination of most welfare programs the deficit is solved. Why waste time sending out $1200 checks. Lets get serious.
Bill O Rights at August 29, 2020 8:27 AM
(looting) "also attacks the history of whiteness"
Now I understand!
Ken McE at August 29, 2020 8:44 AM
This is what happens when you close the malls.
". . . without police and without state oppression, we can have things for free," is classic cargo-cult dogma.
Spiderfall at August 29, 2020 9:01 AM
"Free internet, free online education at all levels, free healthcare, and environmental protections."
We already pay for all of that, for them. Libraries have free internet as does almost every cafe, store, and waiting room in the country. We pay for their smart phones, their healthcare, their housing, their food. You can already take online courses free of charge from most universities. Anyone with any level of drive whatsoever can improve their life right now, no more cost to the taxpayers needed. The issue is what to do with those on the bottom of life's bell curve. Because they're never going away.
Momof4 at August 29, 2020 10:51 AM
The author used to be Willie Osterweil. I wonder if his HRT medications are stolen from drugstores?
Marina at August 29, 2020 10:58 AM
One time in college, I was very cruel to a young woman who had a crush on me. We'd messed around, had a falling out, and I told her off in a wicked, evil way.
It did feel good. I felt powerful, awesome, joyous, and liberated. I totally got a high from it.
She didn't, though.
The reality is being cruel, being wicked, being destructive and harmful can feel GOOD.
And this is why we have to fight against it within ourselves. Doing wrong is much more exciting than doing right.
NicoleK at August 29, 2020 12:13 PM
Civilization is a great achievement. It particularly protects the old, women, children, and minorities. Minorities do not fare well under dictatorships. Saying you can just have things for free can lead to no one having anything at any price. If you live in downtown Portland or Minneapolis, try to find a job that is close. ha. They are gone.
Most whites do not just get wealth handed to them. They work hard, finish school, save their money. They don't go clubbing every night. Whites who do go clubbing every night and drink too much stay poor. It is a simple result. Black activists want the wealth without all that restraint and hard work. Why if it is racism are black immigrants from Bahamas or Nigeria doing so well? I've known some and they don't have an attitude, they don't claim to be oppressed, they work hard.
cc at August 29, 2020 1:06 PM
> one of my pet peeves
Props to ORD. Good reflexes
Crid at August 29, 2020 2:52 PM
"I’d like to see free internet, free online education at all levels, free healthcare, and environmental protections."
Free Healthcare? Only if you think witchdoctors provide quality health care.
I am a health care provider. It is a difficult, stressful, demanding job, somewhat dangerous job (ie the risk of being attacked or robbed by the patients when I worked at inner city hospital, I finally realized there was no joy in that and took a job in the 'burbs, I got fed up with being a veterinarian, I wanted to work with Humans) that required a long education in order to acquire the needed sill set.
I do it and stay with it because I am well paid. However, will soon make move into administration, where there is less stress, less responsibility for one's actions, and the opportunity for lots of graft. I am tired of working my ass off while watching the admins make anywhere from 3 to infinite times more money than the people who actually work.
You get good health care by paying someone to do it well, no one is going to do it for free.
J Rudnick at August 29, 2020 3:40 PM
"It gets people what they need for free immediately . . ."
Using that justification, then I propose that I get what I *need* immediately and that is for looters/rioters to be shot because I need peace and security in my person and my property.
charles at August 29, 2020 8:22 PM
This glorification and exposure of really horrible disgusting ideas makes me hope NPR gets burned down to the cellar hole.
ruralcounsel at August 30, 2020 10:32 AM
Someone knows how to work those camera angles
https://twitter.com/mtracey/status/1299851490308370432
Marina at August 30, 2020 4:09 PM
The District Attorney of Contra Costa County in California, my old East Bay stomping ground when I lived out there, directed police to consider whether the looter "needs" the item stolen before charging him.
This assumes every thief or looter is Jean Valjean, stealing a loaf of bread only because he's in a desperate need and must steal to feed his children. It foolishly romanticizes the criminal, ennobles him.
The sentiments expressed by the author and the DA ignore that looting also steals bread from the mouths of workers. Every item stolen is an item that would have been sold to pay the wages of a worker, often a worker for whom the loss of a regular wage seriously imperils his ability to feed his family.
If the DA's directive is to be followed, are police also to determine degree of need - i.e., can the looter of a 52" flat panel television be charged if a 36" TV would have sufficed?
I wonder if this sets a bad precedent, effectively turning police officers into judges and juries - right when we're talking about the need to reform our police departments and limit the powers they have.
Conan the Grammarian at August 30, 2020 6:12 PM
Breaking into a store and stealing from it are so obviously wrong -- both illegal and immoral. It's really strange that I'm considered a racist for saying so.
Jane at August 31, 2020 3:45 PM
Breaking into a store and stealing from it are so obviously wrong -- both illegal and immoral. It's really strange that I'm considered a racist for saying so.
Jane at August 31, 2020 3:45 PM
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