Hot Serial
My boyfriend wants to marry me. I love him, but settling down with one person seriously concerns me. The only times I ever feel like getting married are fleeting moments when I feel insecure. I love serial monogamy. I'm 36, and have enjoyed these consistently fulfilling two-year relationships since high school. It is so exciting. If the person just puts their hand on my knee, I almost die of ecstasy! I relish every moment, everything they say and do, their every quirk and nuance. Developing these relationships into solid, communicative, balanced partnerships is rewarding, but after about two years, while I love the person and know them so well...well, I know them so well! The sparks have faded. Still, how long can I keep this up? Should I settle down? I don't want kids, so don't factor that in.
--Unsettled
There comes a time in a girl's life when she's looking for that special dozen.
If only you could see how miserable serial dating is making you. Just reread your words: "It is so exciting! ...I almost die of ecstasy." (Almost dying of ecstasy is so overrated.) Surely, you'd be happier if only you'd get the white dress and get with the program: "We're gathered here today to join two people, one of whom is scared out of her pantyhose that she'll end up an old cougar preying on recent college graduates in a bar."
You'll be a hard woman to propose to, considering you're only tempted to get fitted for the old ball and chain during "fleeting moments" when you feel insecure. What's the guy supposed to do, wait till he notices you gnawing your cuticles, and really quick, drop down on one knee? And what then? While many couples these days do write their own vows, "till dull do us part" probably isn't going to fly. Yet, this seems to be what works for you, not because you're a commitment-phobe, but because you're a commitment realist. That's why you walk the walk (right out the door when it gets boring), unlike those who only talk the talk: "If you love something, set it free..." but if you really love something, make sure it gets bogged down with a bunch of legal hassles if it ever tries to leave.
The path you're taking isn't without risks. As helpful marriage-minded types have surely informed you, you could die alone and be eaten by your cat. Of course, if you marry, you could still die alone and be eaten by your cat. Even worse, you could die alone while you're still very much alive and married. And yes, some women have an increasingly hard time finding dates as they get older. This doesn't mean all women will. Because men value youth and beauty, you need to stay in shape and take care of your skin. (Forget the $300 ampules of hydrogenated sheep urine; just be sure your sunblock protects, not only against UVB, but the UVA rays that make skin look like Sacagawea's moccasin.)
Your attitude, of course, is a strong selling point: A guy can keep the ring, his genetic material, and the granite countertops; you'll stick around as long as the fun outweighs the unfun. At some point, chasing newness may start getting old. That would be your cue to seek a more predictable form of novelty -- like marveling at how the same old man always manages to keep it fresh: every night, coming up with hours of new and irritating throat-clearing noises. "Honey, is that you?" you call from the kitchen, "Or has a wounded brontosaurus slipped into the living room?"
It's a bit of a no-brainer... if you don't want to marry him... don't!!!
NicoleK at May 27, 2009 2:57 AM
I'm with NicoleK. If you don't relish married life, then you shouldn't get married. Lots of people are perfectly happy remaining single.
However, one thing to keep in mind is that if you start dating someone who is marriage-minded, you should probably make it clear up front that you don't see marriage in your future. Doing so might spare some disappointments in misunderstandings in the long run.
old rpm daddy at May 27, 2009 4:53 AM
Old rpm daddy,
It doesn't matter if you tell them up front that marriage is not in the future. Many guys look at that as a challenge. It's been my experience that after a year, guys will start slipping in the marriage-hope talk. And ruin everything.
kg at May 27, 2009 5:57 AM
Some philosopher once said "know thy self."
She sounds like she knows herself, and commitment is not her thing.
Don't, repeat don't, do what a lot of women who envision themselves as old maids do.
Don't get married and potentially have children and ruin and/or negatively impact many peoples lives.
David M. at May 27, 2009 6:10 AM
Gotta go with David M on this one. Marrying someone who you don't want to marry is a big mistake. Hell, sometimes marrying someone you do want to marry is a big mistake! It's a crap shoot either way, but I believe if you stay true to who you are, you won't be disappointed. Disappointing to others, maybe, but that would be their problem, not yours. Of course, YMMV.
o.O
Flynne at May 27, 2009 6:39 AM
Sounds like the LW is trying to shore up her defenses against all those people who think she needs to get married to be complete.
LW, you may decide 20 years from now that you should have gotten married. But that's a really poor reason to do it now, no matter what people are telling you.
MonicaP at May 27, 2009 6:52 AM
"It doesn't matter if you tell them up front that marriage is not in the future. Many guys look at that as a challenge. It's been my experience that after a year, guys will start slipping in the marriage-hope talk. And ruin everything."
Would that not depend on the sitch? Warning up front is still something which needs to be done to save issues in the future. If they start trying to change the deal on you later, that's their responsibility. If they think that they have a decent shot without being forewarned, that's just cruel. There are some guys and gals who would bounce at the beginning or not even pursue in the first place if they knew.
Amax at May 27, 2009 7:54 AM
I dunno about that whole "take it as a challenge" thing. If a woman tells me that she wants marriage and children, well, that's our last date. I'm not interested in either of those things, so I don't see the point in wasting her time if that's what she wants.
If I were of a mind to seek marriage and family, I'd certainly not spend my time in relationships that never had a chance of getting me there.
I don't get people who think they can change other people. It doesn't make sense.
brian at May 27, 2009 8:07 AM
"If they think that they have a decent shot without being forewarned, that's just cruel."
Amax....I totally agree. I'm not saying I don't tell; I'm just saying that for some guys it doesn't matter that I do.
The other side of forewarning is that some guys assume, then, that sex is all a girl who doesn't want to be married wants. (So she's a ho...and he doesn't take the potential seriously.) That's frustrating as well. But, them's the breaks!
kg at May 27, 2009 9:00 AM
She knows what she wants and she's happy. She just wants to be reassured that she's not the only one who thinks the way she does.
I'm pretty sure she'll find plenty of guys who will think of her as a gift from heaven: no pressure, no pregnacy to worry about.
The only thing I would suggest is to try to keep the next relationship she gets into interesting and exciting, so she doesn't get bored by the 2 year mark. The best way to do that is by not living together, and not slipping into predicable patterns. She should always keep herself in fabulous shape, and have fun with their sex life, so it's play for both of them.
Chrissy at May 27, 2009 9:07 AM
LW, if that's the lifestyle that makes you happy, go for it. Just be careful that you aren't making promises that you can't keep. Oh, and do bear in mind that you have no right, ever to gripe about men being afraid of committment. ;)
Cousin Dave at May 27, 2009 9:11 AM
Where did everyone get the idea that she's telling these men that she prefers serial monogamy?
That's not indicated in her letter.
Frankly, by her writing, I suspect that she's prone to leading men on - she's someone who relishes the romantic whorl wind. And the best way to achieve that experience is to pretend that you're pursuing a real relationship.
I don't think that many men would want to endure the rigmarole of a relationship if they knew that the woman was already intending to jump ship once the initial rush had subsided.
It's one thing to sleep with women like this, but there's no reason to spend the time, money, and effort on them that you would with someone you were hoping to develop a longstanding relationship with.
The LW can do what she likes, but I suspect that her misgivings are motivated, at least in part, by her recognition that she's deceiving these men.
Jack at May 27, 2009 10:42 AM
Very good points Jack, but would there still not be a shortage of guys who aren't looking for anything long term? No commitment I mean.
Amax at May 27, 2009 12:59 PM
..but would there still not be a shortage of guys who aren't looking for anything long term
I don't disagree. But that's a different kind of relationship, and they don't typically go on for two years.
That's what makes me suspicious. I find it hard to believe that a man is gone to role-play a two year relationship for his own amusement.
And she's obviously looking for a commitment..
Developing these relationships into solid, communicative, balanced partnerships is rewarding ..
Also her use of hyperbole strikes me as odd - I almost die of ecstasy! - I relish every moment, everything they say and do!
I think that she's a relationship Vampire!
Jack at May 27, 2009 2:00 PM
I counted fifteen pronouns where the writer referred to herself (e.g., "I" or "me").
Her references to other people seem to be mainly explaining how they fit in with what she wants.
I'm thinking maybe I see the real issue at work here...
Spartee at May 27, 2009 2:14 PM
Sorry, but leading men on is not a virtue. It doesn't matter if she tells them up front - I guarantee you she is constantly sending mixed signals to keep these men fired up and interested, and she does it because she gets some kick out of it. I'm not convinced she "knows herself" as well as it seems - I reckon shes probably internally unfulfilled to need to keep seeking that thrilling ego boost of a new relationship over and over, like an addict ... addicted to meaningless thrills to the point that you can't hold down a relationship , that's nto healthy. She's just using these men to feed her ego, she doesn't "love" them in the true sense or care how many hearts she breaks. She claims she works on a "relationship" but when you form true partnership bonds in an actual relationship, you don't just wake up one day and say "hey I'm bored of you, go away".. WOrse, she even plans this in advance ... "hey, I'll 'love' you for a year or two until I'm bored, then you must make way for the next man'.
That feeling that she "should" consider settling down, I would guess that's a nagging feeling that deep down she isn't doing the right thing, and that something is amiss.
D. Advocate at May 27, 2009 4:22 PM
"I suspect that her misgivings are motivated, at least in part, by her recognition that she's deceiving these men."
Well put.
"Her references to other people seem to be mainly explaining how they fit in with what she wants."
Likewise.
D. Advocate at May 27, 2009 4:26 PM
The fixed timeline seems odd but what got me was her question "Still, how long can I keep this up?" Its like she's role playing or hiding behind the serial monogamy as some kind of mask. And I don't think she's even being honest with herself, if she really liked these guys as much as she says, then she wouldn't get "bored" or whatever. I think maybe she's afraid deep down of them rejecting her and so she rejects them first before they can get to know the real her. You can't really trust another person to love you enough to stay with you foreveruntil you can stand to live with yourself. I think she should be single for a while and stop chasing whatever it is she's chasing and just get to know herself. Figure out what she wants out of life. And maybe she doesn't ever want to get married. But it seems to me like she wants something more than she's getting, otherwise she wouldn't be writing to Amy. She would just turn her boyfriend down on the marriage proposal and move on like she has apparently done before.
Lily at May 27, 2009 6:03 PM
"The fixed timeline seems odd"
Yeah ... I mean, there's a lot of middle ground between 'I don't want to get married' and 'I practically use a calendar to schedule my relationships on two year cycles'. Sure you shouldn't marry if you don't want to, but that doesn't mean the only alternative is the opposite extreme.
I wonder if she's also one of those 'self-fulfilling end-of-relationship prophecy' types - if you believe relationships don't last, your behaviour (and depth of emotional risk-taking) will change in variuos subtle and not so subtle ways that will usually kill the relationship. Maybe she's just grown to expect that her relationships never last, and subconsciously plays out that "inevitable" script (maybe easier than being the one to get hurt?). I had a girlfriend once like this who was already mentally planning (and even speaking about) 'The Breakup' from almost day one even when everything was pretty much awesome.
D. Advocate at May 27, 2009 7:30 PM
Whether she is a total bitch who is leading the guys on, or whether she is a nice lady who is upfront with them and knows what she wants is a bit irrelevant... either way, she shouldn't marry this dude.
NicoleK at May 28, 2009 5:00 AM
I'm not getting the vibe that the LW is one of those women that gets her kicks from leading guys on and then dumping them. Still there is this that Lily wrote: "And I don't think she's even being honest with herself, if she really liked these guys as much as she says, then she wouldn't get 'bored' or whatever. I think maybe she's afraid deep down of them rejecting her and so she rejects them first before they can get to know the real her. " Hmm. And it's a good point that if the LW is happy with her life, why is she writing to Amy? It sounds like she's been doing this long enough that societal pressure to be married isn't a problem for her, other than just being an annoyance, but you don't write to an advice columnist over a mere annoyance. There's something else going on here, but I can't put my finger on what it is. Amy, can you offer any further insights?
Cousin Dave at May 28, 2009 7:39 AM
She may just be shallow. That's the simplest and most likely explanation. Lots of people are shallow. They go from one person to the next, breaking-up once the sparks die down. Nowadays we call this behavior 'serial monogamy'.
I think that the fact that she falls in love with everyone and then dumps them once she gets to know them is a pretty good confirmation of shallowness.
Mark at May 28, 2009 9:31 AM
Hey, come on, she said she loves the guy.
Clearly she's not in love with him, she just loves the emotional intensity of a guy who may think he's found "the one".
How much longer can she keep this going? As long as she can keep finding guys who confuse passion with love.
That's my two cents, although it might be worth less depending on current market conditions.
Gog_Magog_Carpet_Reclaimers at May 28, 2009 10:26 AM
I wouldn't read too much into the "fixed timeline." She said these relationships last "about" two years, so that's probably a rough average rather than a firm deadline.
And for those who think there's a self-fulfilling prophecy involved--that she's looking ahead to the breakup even when the relationship is great--it's not clear from her letter that she ever knew in advance that her then-current relationship would go sour in two years. It might have caught her by surprise each time, until she finally became aware of her pattern. (Perhaps that awareness is what prompted her to write.) I myself have a pattern that if I live with a woman for three years or so, the relationship starts to go bad. If we stay together instead of getting separate living arrangements right away, we're like strangers within two years. But I didn't spot the pattern, or understand how and why it happened, until I'd gone through it three times.
Rex Little at May 28, 2009 1:59 PM
what i got from the LW was that she is in love with being in love - once the adrenaline rush is over so is the "relationship"
even though she's a heartbreaker, at least she's not a serial divorcee; wreaking a lot more havoc than is necessary; especially where kids are involved. given the penchant of women to divorce for superficial reasons, in many cases "boredom", i have to give her kudos for that
i also think that she is feeling her biological clock ticking - not the baby clock but the attractiveness clock. unfortunately for women, the older a woman gets the fewer men are available to her. most guys are either taken or dead by the time many women are ready to settle down. also, men value youth and beauty moreso than women so she going to have to compete with more attractive women as she gets older. i think that is where the "how long can i keep this up?" is coming from
in middle age relationship power shifts more to men. women can't complain about this as they have their turn to crack the whip when they're young
theOtherJim at May 29, 2009 8:22 AM
She sounds very shallow and immature, though I do give her kudos too for not marrying before she's sorted this out.
Everything we do gets boring. Our work does too, but we can't just change professions every two years...or maybe we can, but it's still a little off. I wonder if she has problems with committment in other areas. I don't question her not wanting to marry, but only being able to tolerate a relationship through the early, "exciting" stages - only being able to go so far each time - indicates that something is wrong emotionally, and I think she knows that. She takes relationships just to the level where things start getting realistic, then she bolts.
lovelysoul at May 29, 2009 2:26 PM
Well at least she's not one of those amoral women who married some guy as her 'starter husband'.
Maurice at May 29, 2009 3:56 PM
Why does a relationship have to be 'work'? It sounds like going to the next level where things are 'realistic' means that it doesn't make you happy anymore. If you're not happy being with your bf/gf, then why are you with them? I guess that's why I see so many miserable couples wandering around, because they feel they have to stay together for some reason.
I get the feeling that people just want what they don't have. If a guy has a girlfriend that wants to get married, they don't like the pressure. If they have one that doesn't want to get married, she's somehow leading him on and wasting his time because he's investing money into the relationship. Both women and men really should take some time to get to know themselves and what they want before they drive themselves and everyone else crazy with the 'grass is always greener' mindset.
After my divorce, I was just happy to date, and my relationships would usually last about 3-4 years until I broke up. It was usually because the guy wanted to get married or live together, and I couldn't see us being compatible enough to do that (one guy had no sex drive, one had a substance abuse problem, and one was a workaholic).
I've told the guy I'm seeing now that we can stay together for as long as we're both happy, and not living together, which for me could be for years and years. I'm not going to be someone I'm not just to be in a relationship.
Chrissy at May 30, 2009 8:01 AM
She seems to think she's an oddity for not wanting marriage. I suspect her attitude would be more common if people were honest with themselves.
"Men are afraid of committment," goes the prevailing wisdom. No, men are afraid of extortion, like any sane person would be. Marriage generally profits the woman and the divorce generally profits her more. And that's the elephant in the living room. It's why women tend to be more interested in marriage (understandably) and men hate the idea.
Patrick at May 30, 2009 11:43 AM
Chrissy, being "realistic" to me just means realizing that you're not ALWAYS going to be happy. Along with the sweet, tender moments, and sexy, fun times, there will also be really tough, unpleasant moments...like when the toilet overflows and you have to literally mop up shit (this just happened to me and my boyfriend - ugh!)...or one of you becomes sick...or the economy makes you cut back on romantic dinners out.
These things make us momentarily unhappy, but when you're truly intimate with someone, you deal with them together, which is not the case when you're first dating. I probably wouldn't have had some new guy I was just dating deal with a clogged toilet, but once you're intimate, you share each other's real lives, good or bad.
Yet, being realistic is different than finding yourself consistently unfulfilled or bored. If you're really no longer having ANY fun or passion with this person, then it's time to move on.
But, unless I'm reading it wrong, that's not what the LW is saying. She seems to be purely discontent with the fact that the initial "newness" has worn off, which it will with anybody, no matter how great they are.
I think these types are usually adrenalyn junkies. She just uses romance to get her high, instead of other things. Maybe she should try skydiving. It might improve her relationships by not being the sole source of her excitement.
lovelysoul at May 31, 2009 8:57 AM
"maybe she should try skydiving."
lol
Lily at May 31, 2009 7:11 PM
This is actually a very common pattern in relationships, though it seems less prominent among people her age.
It's the LW's strange description of her affairs that raises flags for me. She seems to be trying too hard to rationalize her behavior, and to dramatize her relationships. But perhaps she's taken a certain artistic license here, and the style of her writing isn't actually so significant.
I know singles who live in NYC, SF, and LA who follow a very similar pattern though. They'll hop from one relationship to the next well into their thirties.
It seems like a game of hot-potato. They keep having 'relationships' until the pool of available partners dries-up, and then they marry the person they're with at the time.
To be honest, I've come to suspect that a few good relationships are vastly preferable to a lot of short intense ones. People who pursue the former seem to end-up with a lot of baggage.
It's like the Bee Gee's said..
Too many lovers in one lifetime ain't good for you
And not to be cruel, but unless she's drop dead gorgeous, she's probably not going to be able to continue doing this much longer. It's not that she won't meet men, but she may not be happy with the type of men that she attracts.
J.Stevens at May 31, 2009 8:05 PM
To be honest, I've come to suspect that a few good relationships are vastly preferable to a lot of short intense ones. People who pursue the former seem to end-up with a lot of baggage.
oops - I meant latter - I always to that!
J.Stevens at May 31, 2009 8:17 PM
The hot potatoe dating style sounds like Seinfeld. They'd use totally insane reasons for breaking up (my fav was 'man hands').
Drop dead gorgeous woman probably aren't happy with the kind of guys they attract anyways, so not much would change for them as they get older. If you're that hot, every guy you meet would want to have sex with you (married, single, old, young) but not all of them would want a relationship.
Chrissy at June 1, 2009 10:46 AM
to continue this behavior well into her 50´s if she is attractive, I suggest moving to Latin America -- here the married guys have lovers which can fit your lifestyle very very well - - wives worry about kids, lovers go on vacations and are romantic... have cake and eat it too situation
zapf at June 1, 2009 9:22 PM
In Latin America married men seek out 50 year old lovers?!?
That's odd. Because everywhere else on the planet, they're going after 20 somethings.
Jamolo molo at June 2, 2009 8:15 AM
Let him be. At 36 you are too set in your trampy ways to be worthwhile as a wife. You are so in love with yourself that you can only tolerate boyfriends when they are in the stage where you are still fairly new to them and they are spending their bank account and retaining farts to impress you.
I bet the fun ends when they get tired of being used, or when you start screwing around.
Smarty at June 30, 2009 3:49 PM
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