LW: it's still so new that we haven't even had our first big argument yet.

You just might get your wish over this issue.

Amy's right. It sounds like she's angling to push you into the daddy-role. And what better way than to make you a virtual prisoner for a nine hour roadtrip listening to the incessant, "Are we there yet? Are we there yet? Are we there yet?"

I feel badly for the LW. It sounds like she's being pushed into something he isn't ready for.

By the way, what's up with this "all of her" crap? Her daughter is a separate entity, not an extension of her. They will meet "all of her" when they meet her. And they'll meet her daughter when they meet her daughter.

He's taking the relationship to a more serious level by introducing her to his family, and I would think she's saying pretty clearly that she's not ready to get more serious unless he's serious about her daughter, too. I think *he* is the one who's rushing things by inviting her on a cross country trip to meet his family. I think she doesn't want to say yes to that, if he's not ready for her daughter.

This guy should have a web profile that says, "No dogs, No children, No music after 8:00 p.m." If my son brought his girlfriend to meet us (5 months is a while), I'd have no objection to meeting her 9 year-old. It would be better that way. She can fake it while she's alone, but that 9 year-old will bring out the truth in her. And, from the sound of it, the truth is probably good.
I'm more worried about this guy's squeamishness about taking the kid along.

I agree with Nanci and Canvasback...when I was a single parent, it was so clear the difference between men who had children and who never had. The latter accepted my kids as "other", whereas men who had children understood that a mother is never again single; she's joined physically and emotionally to her children first. She isn't really single; she's a family.
That's just how it is...

No mention is made here of bio-dad. What is the custody arrangement? What role, if any, does he have in the child's life and does he have any say over whether the child can travel cross-country?

Also, the school year just started. How long would this trip be and how long is the mom planning on keeping the daughter out of school? Sorry to be the practical one here but unless this letter was in the queue since the summer the school issue alone is a good reason to nix this idea.

Yeah, kids sure do complicate things, don’t they? Whether he knows it or not, the LW’s problems might go beyond who meets his parents when. While he says he really enjoys his girlfriend’s daughter, I wonder how close the LW and the little girl have grown. If they’re really close, then it doesn’t matter whether her mother is trying to maneuver her new boyfriend into a daddy role; he’s doing it voluntarily.

I’ve heard it said that if you date a woman with kids, you should wait a while before you even meet the little ones, especially if they’re very young. If you wind up marrying the woman, you get to “marry” the children as well. And if you break up with her, well, if you’ve already grown close to the kids, it’s heartbreaking, and they don't deserve the pain.

Hmmm I was a single mom with a young daughter. Her father and I share custody she doesn't "need" a daddy she has one but the LW doesnt seem like he is accepting that she has a daughter and that child is part of her, part of the whole equation. Things take a big leap in to serious if you are willing to introduce someone to your parents especially on a cross country trip to do so. I guess my question for the LW is why are you taking a woman you arent all that serious with to meet your parents? Why would you even meet her kid in the first place? I think there is more off about him than her pushing him to be daddy.

Back when I was dating, I eschewed single mothers for this reason - the package deal. As was pointed out in the movie Jerry Maguire, "Single mothers don't date." Basically, it's a job interview, and I had no desire to be interviewed for a job raising another man's kid(s). Yes, yes, this is "unfair" and men "ought" to find mothers as attractive as a childless woman, blahblahblah.

I ended up marrying a childless woman with no desire to reproduce, which has worked out extremely well. If I were in this guy's shoes, I'd keep looking, but maybe he doesn't have a lot of options. And he's living in a childish fantasyland if he really still believes in the concept of "the one."

What the hell is he doing dating a mom when he clearly isn't ready for kids?

If he were ready for kids, he wouldn't even have met the kid in the first place, knowing as parents do that you shouldn't meet the child until you're pretty damn sure you're in it for the long haul.

That said, I think five months is pretty damn early in the relationship at that age to be introducing someone to your parents.

Both are moving way too fast, and the person who is going to suffer most from the inevitable break up is the kid.

Poor thing.

Yeah, MikeinRealLife, I think it's a great thing that you found a woman with no desire to reproduce, too.

I'm curious on custody arrangements, and how often he has actually been around the kid.
If she has custody it's kind of assumed he's been around the kid a lot and should have assumed kid would be going too.
If she doesn't have custody, he might not have been around the kid much.
I've known single parents who don't let the bf meet the kid for months of dating anyway.
So this could be a surprise to him.

It would suggest that I'm taking on the role of a father

Deer LW,

Stop right there. You're not the child's father. She has one. You can be a mentor, a role model, a positive influence in her life.

None of these things make you her father, nor require you to fulfill that role. You need to make this statement to your girlfriend, so that she understands.

As far as your relationship with the child, let it evolve as these things are wont to do. If she comes to calling you "dad" accept that as a very high compliment. If she doesn't, well, you aren't her father.

That said, introduce them together to your family. This is a package deal, after all.

Show me a woman who will throw her own child under the bus for you, and I'll show you a woman who will throw you under the bus when something better comes along.

Side note: I was all set to go milk the telephone poles...

At best, seems to be a lot of unspoken assumptions between these two. Worse would be passive-aggressive manipulation. Either way I don't see much of a future for them, which would probably be the merciful thing.

"Is it a warning sign that there are already issues regarding her child?"

This sentence here tells me so much. Ignorant AND self-absorbed, that's a rough combination, sucks to be him.

Bit of a side issue here, but I'm not certain what the phrase "GF of 5 months" means these days. Some folks use it to mean, "she's my GF, and we met 5 months ago." But other guys mean, "We were casually dating/ going 'Boink'/whatever for about a year and a half, but then we started dating seriously five months ago."

If LW is in the "I've know her a total of five months" camp, then a cross-country trip to meet the 'rents seems early (except, maybe if LW lives in Luxembourg.)

"He's taking the relationship to a more serious level by introducing her to his family, and I would think she's saying pretty clearly that she's not ready to get more serious unless he's serious about her daughter, too. I think *he* is the one who's rushing things by inviting her on a cross country trip to meet his family. I think she doesn't want to say yes to that, if he's not ready for her daughter"

This, 1000 time this. Meeting the parents-ESP so far away-means "this is serious". If it's serious, kid needs to be part of the deal. He needs to see his family on his own until he's pretty darn sure she's the one plus.

I'm also concerned he's spent time with her daughter and yet doesn't feel that they're forming a family. Of course, he could have met the daughter very informally a couple of times. But if he's been been hanging out a lot with the little girl it's not good for her that he's this ambivalent.

"Show me a woman who will throw her own child under the bus for you, and I'll show you a woman who will throw you under the bus when something better comes along."

SCORE!!!

I told Miss Amy the story of the yacht America beating the entire Royal Yacht Squadron, in a race around the Isle of Wight.
Victoria and Albert were watching the finish when America came into sight. She was far ahead of anyone else, and Victoria asked Albert "Who is second?" He replied "Madam, there IS no second!"
When a woman says "My child(ren) will always come first", it means "You aren't second-- there IS no 'second'."

If you have kids, you understand. Nanci nailed it, and has been quoted already by wtf and others so I won't do it again.

My boyfriend has kids, and loves his kids, and I have a child and love my child. It does NOT mean I'm trying to be their mommy or he's trying to be mine's daddy. But loving him means the WHOLE him, including his love for his kids. I sometimes (often) take second place to them, and that's only right. When they are old enough to be on their own, I'll get more of his time, and we plan to live happily ever after (with both sets of eventual grandkids visiting often).

It's not a race with only one winner. If you see it that way, please find someone who doesn't have kids to compete with you.

I'm probably wrong, but I assumed that she couldn't get child care for that long, so the kid has to come with or she can't go. Without a mention of the bio-dad's role, that's where my mind went.

Is that snark in Laurie's comment to MikeInRalLife?? Or am I imagining it?
There is nothing wrong with not wanting or having kids.Or preferring not to date people who already have them.
I think he worded it a bit oddly about the job interview, but people with kids take dating pretty seriously(especially the women b/c more often than not, they are the custodial parent)
I didn't get married until my 40s. I had wanted kids but it didn't work out that way. I also found it much easier to date guys without kids. Also preferred them without ex-wives. As I got older both of these things got harder to find.
It seemed guys with kids either didn't want more or if they did, a huge age gap is difficult for new and existing kids. Plus, if they have kids, they are tied to their ex forever.
It's a huge package deal falling in love with someone with kids and exes etc. It can work but it's sure easier with less baggage.
I ended up marrying a man who had never been married and had no kids. It also ended up that I was too old to have kids....we have cats and life is good.

"I think he worded it a bit oddly about the job interview, but people with kids take dating pretty seriously(especially the women b/c more often than not, they are the custodial parent)"

Well, when I was of that age and was dating women of that age, some of there were pretty blatantly looking for support. One was kind enought to explicity tell me so: "We can't be together because you don't want to be what I'm looking for." She was right. And then we decided that until she found it, we could have some fun. And we did for a few months, and then it ended when it was time for it to end. I still have fond memories of her.

It would suggest that . . . she's important to me, that I'm ready to care for her, and that they should accept her as part of my life.

Doesn't taking the g/f to meet his parents suggest that about her? If he's not ready to say it about the kid, he's not ready for the mom either, because they ARE a package.

When I was between marriages, I dated mostly single mothers (didn't set out to do that, it just happened). If there was still mutual interest after a couple of dates, I would arrange an outing with the mom and the kid(s), such as a day at an amusement park. I figured if I was going to date a package, I might as well get to know all of them, and have all of them get to know me, before any serious commitments got made. It worked quite well; in one case, it was a major reason she wound up dumping the guy she was living with and going with me.

If the relationship had "forever" stamped all over it, this guy wouldn't even be writing to Amy.

Practical issue - if the kid doesn't go on the trip, who is going to take care of her while mom is out of town? The lw used the phrase "cross-country trip" which makes me think he lives, well, on the opposite side of the country from his parents, which makes me think this may be a long trip, not just a quick weekend visit. It's one thing to take a weekend trip w/bf and w/o your child, but a week-long trip would be quite a different story. Also, when is this trip to occur - next summer, when the child may be with her dad or in camp, or during the school year? During Xmas?

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