Golden Pond Scum
I went to meet my girlfriend's 90-year-old father. They have a conflicted relationship. He doesn't "agree" with his daughter's homosexuality, generally looks down on women, and believes they should be helpful, nice, pretty, and married to men. When we got to his upscale senior living facility a few hours away, I jokingly asked my girlfriend whether I should change out of my jean shorts and into dress pants. She said yes, and I said, "I don't have those; are you serious?" She then pulled out a "nice outfit" she'd brought for me. I felt angry that she'd sneaked this up on me. I felt even angrier meeting her father, who barely acknowledged my existence and didn't notice this "nice outfit" I ended up putting on. Should I remind my girlfriend that she no longer chases her father's approval? Tell her I certainly will not?
--Steaming
Here's an ornery guy who's probably spent much of the past 90 years convinced that women belong in the kitchen wearing ruffled aprons, baking pies, and practicing saying, "Yes, dear." Yeah, he'll be changing -- the direction his finger's pointing when he looks at his daughter, gestures toward his closet, and says, "Could you go back in, change into a dress, and come out with a husband?"
Your girlfriend can tell herself she'll no longer be chasing her father's approval yet be running as fast as she can after it on the inside. It's deep-seated stuff, wanting your parents to approve of you, to appreciate who you are and love you for it, and it's tough stuff knowing they don't and probably never will. So as much as she might wish things were different and vow they're going to be, it shouldn't come as a surprise that her father still wears the pants in the family (even if he also wears the diapers).
It's probably tempting to go all one-woman gay pride march and picket the old goat's bed: "We're here! We're queer! Get used to it!" (Or, later in the day, "We're here! We're queer! We need a beer!") And if how your girlfriend handled the change of clothes -- going sneaky to get her way -- is a pattern, you two have a problem. But maybe she was just desperate to keep her time with him from being conflict-filled and awful and couldn't bear to do battle with you right before facing her father's disapproving looks because the man of her dreams is a woman.
Her father is grazing 100 and will be dead soon; doing what you can to relieve your girlfriend's stress when she sees him isn't exactly the equivalent of bringing a plate of cookies out to the Westboro Baptist Church marchers. Consider telling her that you know how hard visiting him is for her and, in the future, she should just tell you what she needs from you to make things easier. Hearing this will probably make her melt into a pool of love for you and inspire her to extend herself when it means a lot to you. Sure, it's unhealthy to always be in the habit of muzzling your beliefs, but there are times to stand up for them and there's sometimes a time to just crawl into the back seat and put on those "nice pants" your girlfriend brought for you.








The dude's 90, he's not going to change, just humor him as much as possible. He's going to die soon, problem solved.
NicoleK at November 13, 2013 3:44 AM
And make sure you show up for the funeral.
Cousin Dave at November 13, 2013 6:51 AM
Oh God yes, ALWAYS show for the funeral. People aren't rational about their relationships with their parents, and grief makes people crazy.
Cut the grieving as much slack as you can. Always.
Lamont Cranston at November 13, 2013 7:11 AM
If dad is 90, these two have got to be old enough to have learned to navigate these waters by now.
Her partner gave her the "nice outfit" when they reached the facility and she was effectively trapped. Oooh, I can see the shark fins poking out of the water.
Don't worry about the old fart. He's only one of your problems.
Pricklypear at November 13, 2013 7:48 AM
I actually know a lesbian in a similar situation.
She was the "star" of the family. First to go to college, very pretty, popular, star player, full scholarship etc.
Anyways it turned out this perfect angel is a lesbian. My reaction was meh, none of the other attributes particularly impressed me and neither would this one. But suddenly the star fell and the fact that she was gay had her whole family turn against her.
I told her to fake being straight until college was over and she had a stable job and the lesson learned is how fickle a family s admiration can be.
Ppen at November 13, 2013 10:33 AM
>>Here's an ornery guy who's probably spent much of the past 90 years convinced that women belong in the kitchen wearing ruffled aprons, baking pies, and practicing saying, "Yes, dear."
He is not ornery, just normal.
That ideal is definitely inspirational in today's "civilized" world.
BTW, LW, be ready: when the guy dies, his daughter's views on men, marriage, etc. might change radically.
Mere Mortal at November 13, 2013 2:10 PM
Amy Alkon
https://www.advicegoddess.com/ag-column-archives/2013/11/golden-pond-scu.html#comment-4050238">comment from Mere MortalBTW, LW, be ready: when the guy dies, his daughter's views on men, marriage, etc. might change radically.
Oh, come on. What an absolutely ridiculous thing to say and about someone you've never met.
And here's a woman who has always longed for her father's approval and who could have had much more of it had she been straight. Yeah, she's only to give herself a hard time.
I'm sexually open and I've sometimes thought about being with a woman, but there's a problem -- I'm not attracted to women. I don't long to have sex with them. I don't even want to have sex with them. Oh. That.
Amy Alkon
at November 13, 2013 3:49 PM
Seriously, LW? You're meeting the GF's 90 year old father for the first time, and you couldn't think to wear something nice - all by yourself?
To get respect, you've got to show respect.
You failed.
Pete the Streak at November 13, 2013 4:13 PM
Of course you dress nice. And refrain from necking in front of him. You don't really have to do the "we're queer, we're here" in front of a 90 year old man. I'm sure you can wait a few hours. It may offend you, but what's more important?
I took my ex to see her dying grandmother a few times several years ago. She has her problems with her family (basically, I had to be there or she couldn't go, we stayed in a hotel, etc). But we'd been, from her grandmother's point of view, living in sin for years, which would have horrified her. Grandmother never knew - I was just the friend helping her granddaughter. There was no reason for me to make an issue of it.
And yes, I escorted my ex to the funeral.
Ltw at November 13, 2013 10:42 PM
"Should I remind my girlfriend that she no longer chases her father's approval? Tell her I certainly will not?"
You could just shut up and let your girlfriend and her father have their catch-up without your issues intruding, of course. Who gives a shit if he ignored you? What you want is pretty irrelevant. She won't have long with him. Be supportive, don't let her beat herself up over it, but it doesn't sound like that. It sounds like you're pissed off she won't ditch him for you. Tough.
Ltw at November 13, 2013 10:48 PM
Suck it up butter-cup.
The dude's got less than ten years left. Your issues with this are so far from relevant they can't see the light from relevant.
And dress nice for the funeral.
wtf at November 14, 2013 5:25 AM
It's funny that she's offended that he didn't complement her outfit. She's probably have been offended if did.
pikachu at November 14, 2013 10:26 AM
My mother is 88 and one of her better friends, is a gay guy. They play duplicate bridge together at a club in town, and have served together on the boards of some charitable organizations. She goes to the Christmas party he and his parter give every year. This is a real effort for her, especially if the weather is bad.
So, while my mother frowns on gay relationships, she has no problem compartmentalizing her beliefs. She doesn't like cats either but is nice to mine, when he attempts to sit in her lap.
All it takes is manners. She is a nice person, and she was raised well.
Isab at November 14, 2013 4:07 PM
"All it takes is manners. She is a nice person, and she was raised well."
Beautiful. Really.
I know he's a fictional character, but Dumbledore was nice to the people who came to kill him. Class will out - for real.
Radwaste at November 14, 2013 4:44 PM
1. my first reaction was like many others': the dude isn't going to be with us much longer; suck it up.
2. jesus, Mere Mortal - way to make Patrick look almost rational. *almost*
Rachel Flax at November 15, 2013 8:38 PM
Pete nailed it.
Letter writer - One way to show care and respect is to meet people where they are. You could have covered this by asking your girlfriend in advance what would be appropriate attire. This would have shown consideration for girlfriend and framed the visit as something letter writer did as a supportive partner. When you tell her she shouldn't want her father's approval, and protest by declining to do the adult due diligence of showing up properly attired, you run the risk of looking like a saboteur and a graceless winner.
Don't grind an axe against a ninety year old man. Win or lose, you look bad. If you must, kill him with kindness - just dress to the nines and ask him for his daughter's hand in marriage.
Michelle at November 15, 2013 10:57 PM
Anyways it turned out this perfect angel is a lesbian. My reaction was meh, none of the other attributes particularly impressed me and neither would this one. But suddenly the star fell and the fact that she was gay had her whole family turn against her.
That stinks on ice. If I had a child and he came to me and told me he was gay, I would ask him, "What did you expect? Did you expect me to stop loving you? Stop supporting you? Stop admiring your accomplishments? That's not going to happen here."
And then the rest of the family could hate the both of us, I guess.
Whatever a parent's view on homosexuality is, he should never stop loving his children.
mpetrie98 at November 18, 2013 9:10 PM
Re: Rachel Flax
>>2. jesus, Mere Mortal - way to make Patrick look almost rational. *almost*
It is almost tragic to be so certain of one's own rationality.
Mere mortal at November 19, 2013 7:16 AM
Leave a comment