Grate Expectations
I am dating a guy in his early 20s who is very nice, very fun, very cute -- and very much in the habit of mentioning that he went to Harvard. He finds a way to weave it into all sorts of conversations it really has no place in.
--Not Impressed
He probably mentions Harvard a lot because it seems more tasteful than the alternative -- having his diploma laminated and wearing it around his neck. Guys in their early 20s have it rough. Just as girls their age are coming into their prime hotitude, the guys are entering a work environment where they are the gum on the pavement that the 30-year-old successful guy runs over in his Mercedes. If your guy is feeling this way, it may explain why no subject is too far-flung or random to connect to a reminder of where he went to school. ("Pass the milk? I sometimes passed the milk at Harvard.")
Ask whether you can give him your opinion about something you've noticed. Assuming he says yes, say something like, "I have no doubt you're going places, but you seem to mention Harvard a lot. This might make you sound like you need to ride on the name, which you clearly don't." If he's got more than school smarts, he'll recognize that it says something about him that he went to Harvard, but not when he advertises it so often that it starts to sound like the DeVry of the Ivy League.








I'm hoping Amy did her usual extensive research into this column, but there is a difference between going to Harvard and graduating from Harvard.
In this letter, it's never mentioned that the boyfriend actually got a degree there. It reminds me of this guy in our college Theatre department who said he went to the High School of the Performing Arts in New York City, and this would have been about the time the original "Fame" movie came out. I don't know why he decided to come to our podunk little college when he probably could have gotten work anywhere at that time. He never said he graduated, just that he went there.
Fayd at August 26, 2014 4:20 PM
Amy Alkon
https://www.advicegoddess.com/ag-column-archives/2014/08/grate-expectati.html#comment-4981075">comment from FaydHe graduated from Harvard. He didn't just, as the joke goes, crawl under the fence.
Amy Alkon
at August 26, 2014 4:47 PM
Good. I was hoping this was not a case of "Those who talk about it the most do it the least."
Fayd at August 26, 2014 4:59 PM
Soooo, there are two types of Harvard alumni:
Type 1: "My name? My name is John Smith, and I went to Harvard. Yes, doesn't the grass look lovely? Just like Harvard Yard at Commencement. The weather? Oh yes, it's been terrible lately -- reminds me of Harvard."
Type 2: "School? Where did I go to school? Acme High School. Oh, you meant college? Up North. So, how 'bout them Dodgers!"
Not sure if a Type 1 can turn into a Type 2, but there's always hope. I really wish graduating seniors had to sit through a course on how to avoid focusing heavily on four years of their life when they move to the post-college world.
(As for the Type 2s, few people are ashamed of going to Harvard, but having that fact introduced in a conversation between two people who have just or recently met tends to be disruptive. There are few good ways to respond to, "Wow, you must be really smart!" and the like.)
marion at August 26, 2014 11:36 PM
I tend to be an ass. I've bee a cynical paranoid misanthrope since I was a child and half a dozen near death experiences have done noting to engender any sense of patience or tolerance for anyone's stupidity.
Doenst win me many friends, but I dont like people anyway.
I knew a guy like this once but it was Stanford, and Oxford
Everyone was sick of it. So one night, rather than wait for him to interject it I'd interupt him and at odd moments in what ever anecdote he was sharing and say "I understand you went to Stanford, and Oxford"
First time he preened, forgetting the fact that he'd already told me 20 times or so. By the end of the night he was trying to avoid me and everyone was sniggering behind their drinks when I said it.
But one night of me being an ass and he stopped dropping into every conversation
lujlp at August 27, 2014 1:27 AM
Wanna nip it in the bud?
Have one of your girlfriends on standby and the next time he mentions it have her say.
"Wait, you went to Harvard? I had no idea!! I must have missed the last 1800 times you mentioned it. Did they implant an advertising chip that compels you to compulsively mention it every 15 god damn seconds you pretentious shit bag?"
lujlp at August 27, 2014 1:33 AM
Are you sure he went to Harvard? Most Harvard alums I know (and I grew up in the Boston area, so they pretty much grew on trees) do the dodge...
"College? Oh, I went to school in Boston. Well, near Boston. No, not UMass..."
Because no one wants to be the asshole who brags about having gone to Harvard. Ironically, it ends up being even more pretentious.
NicoleK at August 27, 2014 5:40 AM
On a more serious note, though, he may have a not-lived-up-to-expectations complex. Many Harvard alums go on to do great things, so where they went to undergrad or even grad is a non-issue. If he hasn't "lived up to his potential" post-Harvard and he is dwelling on his time in school as his greatest achievement, then that's a whole can of worms.
NicoleK at August 27, 2014 5:43 AM
There is a woman at work who has many, many allergies, including food allergies. How do I know this? She drops a reference to her food allergies in literally every conversation. She answers the phone by telling the caller that she is eating her gluten free chips and dairy free dip. I think she is incredibly narcissistic and self absorbed. Just like this guy, we must be reminded of her personal idiosyncrasies. Why people insist on doing this, I don't know. But it drives me crazy.
cp_deb at August 27, 2014 8:59 AM
This is a gender thing, Amy?
Re. sentences 2 and 3, are the "girls" his age sitting around being hot vapid Barbie dolls while the guys go out and work?
Even in the far-off early 2000s, I could have said this:
"Women in their early 20s have it rough. They are entering a work environment where they are the gum on the pavement that the 30-year-old successful woman runs over in her Mercedes." Also, they're being hit on by that 30-year old!
This condition ain't endemic to one gender. It's an early 20s thing, period.
Lauren at August 27, 2014 9:41 AM
@"Because no one wants to be the asshole who brags about having gone to Harvard. Ironically, it ends up being even more pretentious"
"I'm a million times as humble as thou!" (Weird Al)
Lobster at August 27, 2014 11:51 AM
Depending how bad it really is, I'd say cut the guy a bit of slack, he's probably just proud of his recent achievement and the novelty will probably wear off after a while.
I think lujlp has the right idea though, but perhaps one notch less abrasive, start making some 'lighthearted' jokes about it .. "Oh, I had forgotten it was Harvard you went to as you told me only yesterday" ... "Wait, I've forgotten again, *which* University did you go to?" etc.
Lobster at August 27, 2014 11:54 AM
@"If he hasn't "lived up to his potential" post-Harvard "
I think early 20s is very early to be calling that on any graduate ... early 20s usually means 'just graduated'
Lobster at August 27, 2014 11:56 AM
This is pathetic behavior, even worse as one ages. Once I met 2 freelance media contacts at their flight - never seen either one before -, the young woman says to me (aside) "OK Let´s count how many times he mentions when he was at CBS the network, before dinner". This poor has-been alky ex-network reporter launched right into network name dropping. I felt icky and sad. Harvard kid would be wise to learn to shut off this tic.
zapf at August 27, 2014 12:09 PM
It's September. Even if he graduated in June, I bet most of his friends have jobs lined up. He may well feel he's not living up to expectations if he isn't doing something cool.
NicoleK at August 27, 2014 12:17 PM
I liked the below lines - sounds like something Dave Barry might write.
("Pass the milk? I sometimes passed the milk at Harvard.")
krisl at August 27, 2014 12:21 PM
Ah, Dave Barry, gosh. One of my favorite pieces of writing is his 'Lost in America'.
Lobster at August 27, 2014 12:52 PM
@"She answers the phone by telling the caller that she is eating her gluten free chips and dairy free dip. I think she is incredibly narcissistic and self absorbed ... Why people insist on doing this, I don't know."
I'd guess deep down she feels unloved, so she subconciously re-enacts the type of behaviors that in early childhood attained her that greatest feeling of unconditional love and attention from her parents. Occasionally someone will convey sympathy, and like a rat pulling a lever for intermittent rewards, or a slot machine dishing out some coins for a gambler (or a Facebook addict scrolling their feed endlessly for something interesting), it reinforces the behavior, partly by delivering a small release of dopamine in the brain and activating the reward system. I don't know if I'd say it's narcissistic as narcissists usually love themselves, while she may be responding to inner absence of self-love.
Lobster at August 27, 2014 1:50 PM
Alternatively, it may be the 'zeal of the newly converted'; if she genuinely struggled with allergies, and finally found something that really helps, she may feel like helping others.
Lobster at August 27, 2014 1:53 PM
I went to a prestigious college. I must admit that I was very proud of the accomplishment. Graduating from programs as rigorous as some of them are is something to be proud of. He's in his early 20's, so he only recently graduated. Give the guy a little bit of slack and see if it calms down. If it doesn't, have the gentle, affirming conversation that Amy suggests.
Geesh. Some of you are so cynical, you comment as though this guy is a 40 something still riding the Harvard train. Don't be such bullies.
Laurie at August 27, 2014 3:19 PM
Lauren, the letter is about a guy, so her quip uses that gender. That's all there is to it.
treadwell at August 27, 2014 3:21 PM
Hey, I DID go to DeVry-- AND I graduated, which most other guys couldn't say. That place was no picnic, believe me.
jefe at August 27, 2014 5:12 PM
To put the best possible face on it, the guy might be looking for a job, and hoping the Harvard name will open some doors. Of course, if he keeps mentioning it to the same people who've heard it before, with nobody new in the room, forget I said anything.
Rex Little at August 27, 2014 6:59 PM
In the Air Force, we used to say the same thing about fighter pilots or Academy grads. As in: "Yes, I know you went to the Academy (or Harvard). I can see your class ring every time you pick your nose!"
I remember one Academy grad telling me, "Oh yeah, we had to learn all the verses of the Air Force song when we were plebes." I said, "I wouldn't know about that. I went to college." He flipped me off.
Old RPM Daddy (OldRPMDaddy at GMail dot com) at August 28, 2014 4:34 AM
Laurie, I take your point, but Amy doesn't just use the male pronoun here, she makes a statement that implies that this problem is uniquely male because women that age are consoled by and consumed with being hot, whereas men are the ones who are career-oriented and conscious of getting beaten down in the workplace.
I would argue that everyone--male and female--feels beaten down and underappreciated in their 20s (and beyond). Being "hot" is no consolation to the women. For every one person who sees herself that way, 10 of her peers see themselves as normal or below-average. They're comparing themselves with their peers, not their 50-year old coworkers.
Lauren at August 28, 2014 5:38 AM
Lauren, Amy's point isn't that young women are consoled by being hot. It's that the young men who want to date these hot young women are getting steamrollered by older guys, and a big reason for that is that the older guys have attained more success in the workplace. (Money is part of that, but there are other factors as well.)
20-something women might have it just as tough as men in the workplace, or even tougher, but that doesn't interfere with their success in the dating world.
Rex Little at August 28, 2014 12:11 PM
It struck me the same way, Lauren.
Gail at August 28, 2014 12:12 PM
Story time! So, I went to (and graduated from) Harvard. My classmates and I frequently go to elaborate (and laughable) lengths to avoid mentioning it by name - especially when we cirst graduated. I'm suspicious of whether anyone who mentions it frequently actually went there. Very, very suspicious. Maybe those people existed and I just didn't know any of them... or maybe he went to Tufts.
Lucy at August 28, 2014 2:23 PM
See, Lucy agrees with me.
NicoleK at August 30, 2014 5:57 AM
@Lucy -- the trouble with those convoluted attempts to avoid mentioning your school is that they're rather condescending. Really, are your listeners going to perish from envy? I doubt it, and I think it's more respectful to assume that a grown-up acquaintance is above such silliness. Occasionally where you went to school is relevant to the conversation, and if so, there shouldn't be a problem in mentioning it, any more than there's a problem with mentioning that you once lived in Boston or you served in the Marine Corp or you have a black belt in karate or you have a degree in nursing or you finished the Lake Tahoe ironman.
Gail at August 30, 2014 11:29 AM
doesn't anyone else watch The Office? "I'm Andy Bernard; I went to Cornell." just take the Jim Halpert approach and lean into it - bring it up more than he does, start wearing alum-wear, etc. to mess with him. or take the patient approach and wait for someone else to do this or similar smart-ass suggestions above; it's a matter of time.
Rachel Flax at August 30, 2014 11:41 AM
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