how much research did you do? or is it pure opinion? paid by the CCP? some of it reads like Xinhua please quote your source before you place your allegations? is the dalai lama not human? the shugden controversy is a sensitive one and complicated and i highly doubt the reasons why the dalai lama did what he did, as it was dividing his people and i need evidence that he and the government in exile were directly involved in persecution. Please be responsible with your allegations and provide evidence...

thanks

Second time in two days: Someone calling themself only "Karma" shouldn't be so pissy about insufficiently candid sources...

And what more could have been said here? She linked to a piece in a respected newspaper, and offered little analysis of her own.

Hitchens was pretty harsh on the DL in his book last year: Always remember, the way into Dalai Lama racket is to be born into it. That shit don't wash so well here in the States

I've found Brendan O'Neill to be a reliable source, number one, and if there's stuff that you believe is wrong, contest it instead of whining about it.

"karma"? Oh, hurl.

Try "reason," nitwit.

karma makes my brain hurt. I blame Sharon Stone.

As far as Buddhists go, I prefer the Nichiren types, myself.

But some people need a guy in a robe. Twas ever thus.

"I have a different question: why should Brown, who for all his troubles is still the head of an elected political party, meet with an authoritarian, fame-chasing, Apple-loving monk?"

Because that fame makes him a powerful force in Tibetan issues, that's why. If you want to play, you have to talk to the players.

Hey Raddy: Be sure to smile at Sharpton next time you see him.

Your Karma ran over my dogma!

Yeah, the DL has pretty much gone the way of the buggy whip. Plus, I wanna take that really cool train up to Llasa someday.

first of all, karma is my real name and i, unlike most of these posters happen to be one of the people that follow the dalai lama. He is the religious as well as the political leader of the Tibetans. Sort of like the non violent Yasser Arafat and the pope in one package, so his is a complicated job. It is for this reason that he wishes to leave the politics to the younger generation once and if Tibet regains autonomy or independence from China. Please read this article from himal magazine and try to understand the dorje shugden controversy in more detail and make up your own mind before making sweeping judgements:
http://www.himalmag.com/96sep/dorje.htm
I am not a blind supporter of the dalai lama despite coming from the Tibetan Buddhist tradition. I am simply taken aback when people are criticising him for the wrong reasons. I am more sympathetic to the ones that criticise him for not doing enough for the suffering Tibetans within Tibet, not taking action, agains the Chinese government.

and if the whites want to believe in shangri-la, the noble savage indians, the dalai lama, that seems like its their problem, not the dalai lama's.
thank you,

"the non-violent Yasser Arafat"?

Does that mean he's stolen millions of dollars of money meant to go to his people?

Best to actually engage the old brain before posting.

> karma is my real name

Given at birth? Jody's head still hurts.

> Sort of like the non violent
> Yasser Arafat

Arafat had other problems besides violence.

> and the pope in one package,
> so his is a complicated job

He could simplify, and give up the inherited holiness.

>> and if the whites want to believe in shangri-la, the noble savage indians, the dalai lama, that seems like its their problem, not the dalai lama's.

>> Sort of like the non violent Yasser Arafat and the pope in one package...

Now my head hurts. You know when Crid and I agree on something...

on credibility of the writer for your article:

Brendan O'Neill is a journalist based in London. Currently, he is the editor of Spiked Online.

He began his career in journalism at Spiked's predecessor, the journal of the Revolutionary Communist Party, LM magazine, until it was forced to close following a libel action brought by ITN. [1]

I don't care who he worked for or whether I like his politics. Find something in his piece that's in error and point it out, if there is such a thing. Pissy, sideways, grasping attempts to impugn by association don't fly here.

The reason I made the buggy whip comment is because I can't foresee China ever leaving Tibet, especially if you believe as most do that China will be the next superpower.

I will just take the one topic i am most familiar with and that is the dorje shugden issue. Why would you quote the view of the Western Shugden Society as if it were true and not biased. If anyone were to read the link I posted earlierhttp://www.himalmag.com/96sep/dorje.htm, it is these new European Buddhists that are accusing the dalai lama of persecution.

How one sided is that? I would expect a more independent source than one of the groups involved in the controversy. It just proves that you already had your mind made up against the dalai lama and merely collected quotes to back your evidence regardless of the quality.

someone ought to sue Brendan for libel one more time for such baseless accusations. It won't be the first time and it won't be the first time he would lost it and perhaps the Guardian would learn its lesson as well....

(...)Sort of like the non violent Yasser Arafat(...)

With all due respect Karma, I hope that you were sarcastic on this subject. Putting the term "Non Violent" next to this pederast name make me want to laugh.

This being said, I think that Buddhism in general is quite destructive for human rights in Asia in general. If I get it right (And please inform me if I am wrong), buddhism is all about detaching oneself from materialistic values to reach inner peace. This means not be angry against a government who restrict human rights and private ownership.

The Dalai-Lama is the leader of a movement who sees this very like, the life we are living, as a simple training ground for the next. This makes human life cheap and redundant. If the Asian global community dared accept the idea that life is a ephemeral occurrence instead of a metaphysical and eternal state, how much abuse would perdure in those poor countries. Faith is the drug here and the Dalai-Lama is the kingpin.

"Hey Raddy: Be sure to smile at Sharpton next time you see him."

Don't have to smile; do have to see him when he shows up!

I don't see anyone arguing me on the Dorje Shugden issue. Why do you wanna throw pointless hypotheticals around? If you wanna pretend like you know about us, please have the courtesy to at least do your homework and pray tell me Why did the author, Mr O'Neil quote verbatim only the side of the argument that favors him, the "Western Shugden" view. Do you know how the Tibetan Buddhists in Tibet, Nepal, and India feel about it???? I am merely exposing the hypocrisy in the article and the biased and unprofessional job.

also, I am deeply sorry for the poster that believes that Buddhism is destructive. When religion and destruction are concerned, I would say radical islam and right wing christianity are far more dangerous than Buddhism.

Karma,

Since you directed your last comment to me, I will now re-explain my position. Of course, Buddhism is less destructive than Islam these days. It is hard to put in the same category a suicide bomber sponsored by Hamas and a Buddhist Monk immolating himself. One aim to kill others, the other seek his own death as a protest. One is very common, the other is very rare.

This being said, regardless of all the difference we can find, there's a single link; the disregard of one's own life due to a belief in a metaphysical system. This is the poison found, in varied doses, inside of every religion of the world. On this very point, even if we are comparing grams with tons, it is the same idea.

You can say that I am talking about extremes. On this, you would be right. Extremes are interesting because they show the real undercurrents of a situation. Let's go back to Tibet and Burma. Both those areas are occupied by a belligerent, militaristic government who got no scruples of using terror to control the masses. What do Buddhism has to offer to those people besides prayers and calls for a peaceful "resistance"? I can tell something from where I am; the peaceful Buddhist doctrine is a blessing for any military occupation.

If you look at the recent uprising in the Tibet, it was caused by the youth who had chosen to disobey the Dalai-Lama's call for pacifism. What was his reaction? He said that he would pout and go away. In the meantime, the Tibetans put once again their claim to independence in the forefront of international politics, a feat rarely reached by the Dalai-Lama. By bypassing their faith, they received a better support for their cause.

So this is why I believe that Buddhism is dangerous. I know you disagree and I hope you don't see this as an attempt to "Troll" this blog. I have, in my perspective, valid doubts towards the Buddhism faith and I just wanted to share them.

Regards,

Toubrouk.

Toubrouk,

You are in fact correct, however studies apparently have shown (I must warn you I'm getting this 3rd hand at best) that Buddhism suffers in areas of civil conflict. But as a Buddhist I must disagree your belief that it is harmful, true asceticism is frowned on. Although the opposite seems to be practiced in many of the areas that are traditionally Buddhist; at least according to the last lecture at temple I attended where the Monk waxed eloquent about how Western practice is in fact far closer to what the Buddha taught than what is practiced in the west.

> Don't have to smile; do have
> to see him when he shows up!

Well, he's a player... For no good reason, he's a player.

I saw him sitting in a window in a fancypants restaurant once, about a block from the Waldorf, or maybe it was the Waldorf. He had a napkin tucked under his chin like they did in old gangster movies.There were about ten people at the table, but he'd had himself placed there so that people like me would admire him and write blog comments about it later... I know that this will mean a lot to him.

Just going out and making noise is what made him a player. As Hitchens says, you can involve yourself with as much silliness and villainy as you like if you first convince someone to put the word "Reverend" in front of your name.

toubrook,

thanks for the reponse...

i was born into a famil of Tibetan Buddhists, but I went to school and got a degree in Business Computers here in the U.S. So i am familiar with both traditional Buddhism as well as secular lifestyle. I am not a devout Buddhist, but it is insulting to see an article in a supposedly respectable paper that reads like frontpage of the Xinhua (Chinese Communist Party)'s mouthpiece.

I will agree that The Dalai Lama and his government is not perfect and Tibet before the "Chinese Occupation" was not perfect. It was like most Asian countries then, backwards. However, what choice do the Tibetans have than support the Dalai Lama who has brought a lot of attention to their cause? I am sure they would be more than happy to know if there are other options for them.

I have often thought about what you have said about the weaknesses of a Buddhist culture and peaceful cultures in general. In face, I was reading a website for the Inner Mongolian People, where I read that the Buddhism had made them weak thus enabling the Chinese to take it over.

Ahh the Chinese who doesnt fear them?