Does Appearing In Porn Erase Your Ability To Teach Frog Dissection?
A teacher did nothing illegal -- she apparently appeared in a porn film -- and yet the Oxnard school district has voted to fire her for it. From L.A. Now at latimes.com:
Stacie Halas, 31, a science teacher at Richard B. Haydock Intermediate School, had been placed on leave last month while the Oxnard Unified School District investigated the allegations.The school board met Wednesday to discuss the case and voted unanimously to fire Halas.
"If she were to return to the school district, it would be a disruption," Superintendent Jeff Chancer told KTLA-TV. Halas has 30 days to appeal her termination. She did not respond to requests for comment.
The investigation began when students approached administrators at the school and told them they had seen a female teacher in a pornographic video. Halas allegedly participated in the movie under the name Tiffany. Administrators tried to verify the students' claims but couldn't because filters on the school's computers prevent access to pornographic websites, Chancer said.
So administrators distributed a memo to school staff, acknowledging the students' claims but only as unverified rumor. Other teachers then came forward and showed administrators the video at the center of the rumor on a cellphone, allowing them to tentatively confirm that Halas appeared in the X-rated production.
Shouldn't the real worry be that underparented seventh and eighth graders not only have access to porn but enough access to ferret out teach's appearance. (It is, of course, possible, that some 18-year-old came upon it and spread the clip and the word.)
And I love that the administrators couldn't verify the students' claims because of their nanny filters.
via the delightfully cranky @MrsAbbotKinney
If the badly-married father of one of your students pops a chubby during a parent-teacher conference, the education of your students may be unnecessarily impeded.
Seriously, 8th-grade kids are all weird about sex... Who needs the an extra source of gossip?
Crid [CridComment at Gmail] at April 28, 2012 10:04 PM
I'd like to see that memo. What did it say -- "Ms' Halas was purportedly seen in a porn video. If you know anything about this video, please bring it forward."
Now why is it proper for other teachers to watch pornos, but not proper for a teacher to participate in the production of it?
Jim P. at April 28, 2012 10:59 PM
Administrators tried to verify the students' claims but couldn't because filters on the school's computers prevent access to pornographic websites, Chancer said.
Bull. Shit.
Those filters have passwords that will disable them for a search session, and there are ways to keep specific computers free of the filter restriction. Any IT department worth its Jolt could get those administrators unfettered access to anything they wanted to see.
Or, how about grab the laptop/iPad/SmartPhone and spend an hour at Starbucks?
They didn't find it because they didn't want to. And I'll bet every one of them did, once they got home to their unfiltered DSL connection.
Steve Daniels at April 28, 2012 11:23 PM
Heh, this was always my fear when I was teaching... the words "Hey guess what I saw on the internet this weekend" always filled me with fear.
Not that I did anything hardcore, but still...
One of the many reasons I prefer to teach adults.
NicoleK at April 29, 2012 2:02 AM
Heck, Steve. They probably already knew and were just all hiding that fact from each other.
Sosij at April 29, 2012 2:36 AM
Just because something is not illegal, does not make it a great idea, and that does not mean it is a thing to be emulated.
Teachers are, theoretically at least, supposed to not just be robots spewing factoids and math problems, a computer could do that.
They are also supposed to set examples by their conduct and behavior, and just because I like porn, that does not mean I want my daughter to get instruction from Jenna Jameson.
Want to do porn, do porn, but then don't expect to take on a job where you are expected to behave in public and in private in a professional, dignified, and reputable manner.
I know this must be surprising coming from ME of all people, that tends to hold extremely liberal views on how we should be able to behave and what we should be able to do with our own bodies and so on and so forth.
But if you consider the requirements for the character of a teacher, not just their educational knowledge, this is one of those times when you face mutually exclusive actions.
Teacher, and "porno" do NOT belong in the same damn sentence.
Robert at April 29, 2012 2:38 AM
> that does not mean I want my daughter to get
> instruction from Jenna Jameson.
Aren't you the guy who was squealing about the USSS terminations?
Dude, they're ALL somebody's daughter.
Crid [CridComment at Gmail] at April 29, 2012 3:31 AM
Doing a little further research -- apparently this was her prior career. Why should this be held against her.
And again, notice that it was students that brought her past career forward. High school students are generally under 18, therefore can not legally be watching porn anyway.
Jim P. at April 29, 2012 5:53 AM
I thought it was pretty much impossible to fire a teacher?
Snoopy at April 29, 2012 6:44 AM
...and isn't it just a little odd that school administrators would send out a memo to all staff with unverified rumors.
T
Tony K at April 29, 2012 7:05 AM
Say, Crid - if a porn star is having sex for money, like a prostitute, then of course this person could not have been a teacher.
You said yourself that such people do not participate in the community.
Or you could be wrong about that. Yeah. That's it.
Radwaste at April 29, 2012 7:36 AM
"The best predictor of future behaviour is past behaviour"-- Dr Oz said that, I think.
It's too bad schoolteachers can be fired this easily, but we can't get rid of the corrupt banksters who are destroying our country.
Why is this even in the news?
bluenorther at April 29, 2012 8:46 AM
> if a porn star is having sex for money, like
> a prostitute, then of course
A "reach," we call this. A desperate scramble for elusive meaning....
> Or you could be wrong about that.
Drift away, Raddy! Drift away into a fluffy, inane, juvenile fantasy world where prostitutes lead safe, fulfilling lives of achievement, with sturdy families and thoughtful participation in the community around them.
But before you go, take a moment to tell us which women in your life would have been better off by choosing a life of whoring.
Because it's a career, right? It was described as a "profession" in the earlier comments. So it's like any other economic activity in a free market... Wealth is created because both parties walk away happier. Right?
So Raddy, tell us... Who, in your life, foolishly left some wealth and happiness on the table by living in contemporary United States mores, with our famous dislike for prostitution? Your Mother/Grandma/Aunt? Someone in your own generation, perhaps? If not your sister, maybe even just an idiot second cousin, a dimmer soul who should have been doing titfucks on the side while attending cosmetology classes in her early twenties?
But instead, she had to do the typical American thing of marrying a successful plumber and raising his kids in an unremarkable suburb, all while pulling down $60 by renting a chair in a hair salon in the strip mall to do ladies from the nice side of town...
...What a shame.
Are you really so horny that you need to think this way?
Crid [CridComment at gmail] at April 29, 2012 9:08 AM
"I thought it was pretty much impossible to fire a teacher?"
Indeed. Remember Mr. Berndt?
"A teacher charged with 23 counts of lewd conduct in his classroom successfully thwarted attempts by the Los Angeles Unified School District to fire him. In the process, the teacher, who is accused of spoon-feeding his semen to blindfolded children, managed to retain lifetime health benefits provided by the nation's second-largest school system"
http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/lanow/2012/02/la-teacher-suspected-of-lewd-conduct-keeps-benefits.html
Adolescent boys who are going to masturbate like monkeys anyway would be better off spilling their seed over a hot science teacher with a secret former identity as a porn star.
Martin at April 29, 2012 9:36 AM
Yes, appearing in porn DOES lessen your ability teach frog dissection. Teachers can't teach without respect and now every student she has it going to look up that video, and they will never listen to her again. Employers have the right to decide who they want representing them, schools included. And I can't imagine a school that would want a porn star representing them. Probably not many companies would, period.
Make the choices you want in life-be in porn if you want. But those choices have consequences. Other people's perfectly valid reactions to your choices are a consequence. Deal with it.
momof4 at April 29, 2012 9:38 AM
"with a secret former identity as a porn star."
Dude-her STUDENTS outed her. There was nothing secret about this.
I mean-would YOU listen to someone you had just seen swallowing a cock while she was teaching you the periodic table? Or do you think you might be a little distracted?
momof4 at April 29, 2012 9:42 AM
If a teacher is even mildly attractive, the boys in her class will imagine her naked, and the boys with vivid imaginations will imagine her doing all sorts of wicked things while she's naked.
"Employers have the right to decide who they want representing them, schools included" Agreed. I just pointed out that there's a long, long list of criminally incompetent and abusive teachers in the firing line ahead of her who still have their jobs, or at least their benefits.
Martin at April 29, 2012 10:31 AM
What if she'd drifted into porn largely due to poor parenting and abusive relationships in her past? What if she regretted that past and, through great effort, had left porn, obtained schooling and a more "respectable" profession? Would those of you justifying her dismissal feel a little more compassion then? I'm genuinely asking.
I can't imagine a school that would want a porn star representing them. Probably not many companies would, period.
What the fuck is she supposed to do then? Yes, I realize that choices have consequences, but at what point do we force people's questionable past decisions to fuck them up for life? What she did not was not against the law, nor did it harm anyone except (arguably) herself. And she still needs to eat. Is she now damned to finding a meal ticket husband, or blue collar labor, or returning to the porn set? Seems awfully harsh to me.
YTS at April 29, 2012 11:16 AM
> Not that I did anything hardcore, but still...
That's the thing, there aren't really a lot of what Raddy calls "porn stars." How many people have become genuinely famous through porn? In a world where most new phones are smart phones, there's going to be an ocean of clips of people having fun out there, so ubiquity might make scandals like this go away.
Meanwhile, school boards are going to do what they need to do to keep the community from squealing too loud. I'm cool with that.
> Adolescent boys who are going to masturbate
> like monkeys anyway would be better off
> spilling their seed over a hot science teacher
> with a secret former identity as a porn star.
Better than what?
> Would those of you justifying her dismissal
> feel a little more compassion then?
Discussing these topics in recent weeks has given me renewed respect for America's uptight attitudes. And even when it hasn't, it's honed the goofiness of people (men, always) who argue for "compassion" for women who pander to horndogs in base and sometimes illegal ways.
Really? "Compassion"? Of all the comments you might offer here in defense of people who are misunderstood or tossed about on the rocky shoals of a world that doesn't care, a little bunny schoolteacher is the one for who you weep and light candles? Nothing for the retarded? Nothing for the diseased or sickly or unloved?
Crid [CridComment at gmail] at April 29, 2012 12:30 PM
"Drift away, Raddy! Drift away into a fluffy, inane, juvenile fantasy world where prostitutes lead safe, fulfilling lives of achievement, with sturdy families and thoughtful participation in the community around them."
You have such a tremendous blind spot about this that you can't even notice the stupendous amount of projection you have loaded onto each of my sentences. All of these are things you have made up.
I busted you, and properly, for your insistence that whores could not do things, among them lead public lives of meaning, though I encourage everyone to read back and see what Crid said a whore could not do.
"Drift" - what awesome irony! Here you're not even noticing your absence of consistency. I recommend a career in religion. You'd be perfect.
But chicks dig you. You said so yourself. That's why you're here, I bet. But that's another story.
Radwaste at April 29, 2012 1:54 PM
What the fuck is she supposed to do then?
Investment banker? Family Values Right Wing Congrescritter? Secret Service foreign relations trainer?
Steve Daniels at April 29, 2012 3:24 PM
"but at what point do we force people's questionable past decisions to fuck them up for life?"
At what point do you want to tell anyone they HAVE to hire people, background be damned? There are a lot of professions that don't involve teaching kids. She couldn't have found one? Do we want someone SO stupid that she didn't see this being an issue, teaching kids? Even in public schools? The lack of foresight and imagination is stunning.
momof4 at April 29, 2012 4:04 PM
> your insistence that whores could not do things
No... My insistence is that they don't. You keep offering these one-shot idiocies –a porn star in Italian government!– as if they proved that prostitution was just like a teenager's after-school job at McDonald's, or two summer weeks spent detasseling corn in Iowa. The distinction has been perfectly clear, both in these comments and in the lives of hookers, but you won't see it.
There's a reason that, when asked to consider your own loved ones in that 'line of work', the screen goes blank... You understand perfectly that it's not a "profession" that leads a woman you love to the kind of life you'd want for her.
Offtopic: Cinderella story, about to become the Master's Champion.
Crid [CridComment at gmail] at April 29, 2012 4:15 PM
Who said we wanted to force employment? They hired her already. Where does her past career break the moral turpitude clause? If she put down on her application that the prior employment was with Adam and Eve Film Company, where does lying come in?
If her past job had been a stripper would you have the same view. The only difference in this is that there is photographic evidence.
Jim P. at April 29, 2012 4:49 PM
Oh and where did she violate the California code?
Jim P. at April 29, 2012 5:06 PM
Just because they hired her doesn't mean they can't fire her if something from her past comes up that affects her ability to perform the job. That's true in any job.
Adam and Eve has LOT of employees-the majority in fact-that don't "perform" for the films. It's a business like any other. Seeing that on an application (do we even know she put it on there?) wouldn't mean they knew she was a porn star, although due diligence on the person hiring should have meant asking. I'm betting someone loses their job for hiring her, if it was on her app.
If she had been a stripper? Well, no one would probably have ever known if she kept her mouth shut. I wouldn't WANT a former stripper for a teacher (I wouldn't want one for most things, personally) but she would not have been performing a pole dance for her students. In a film-she IS having sex in front of her students, every time they watch. The fact that photos and film can and almost certainly will come back to bite you in the ass used to be widely known. I'm not sure when common sense died, about that.
momof4 at April 29, 2012 5:58 PM
Also—
> That's why you're here, I bet
I get more tail than Sinatra, Raddy. Nobody gets more poon from comments on this blog than me, with the exception of anyone who ever got any poon from comments on this blog.
Mostly I agree with M4 on this. She understands the difference between public and private voodoo. It's a personal stupidity thing. In 2012, nobody gives a rat's ass whether there's a video clip of you blowing somebody out there... We all got our own lives to lead.
And that's the same reason we don't care enough to defend you from the prissy ladies on the committee, or the wrath of the Chairman Emeritus of the Glenview Junior High Decency Association, when they accuse you of moral turpitude or whatever. If you're old enough to make a movie, you're old enough to think about what it will mean to the people who might see it.
Steve Daniels gets it too: People lose their jobs all the time, and for reasons that the rest of us would think silly. In America, you can go get another one. But there's a hideous recession, so you'll have to think very clearly about what other people want from you, and conduct yourself accordingly.
Friends, "compassion" is like the other resources in the public sphere: In recent years, it's been squandered. We need to be very thoughtful about asking for a slice.
Crid [CridComment at gmail] at April 29, 2012 7:37 PM
That you are getting poon does not impress me. Neither does your abstinence or being celibate.
Thank you for your standards. Now if she became a teacher ten years from now and it was found out that she was Tiffany Six?
Because as soon as you say "yes" it shows your hypocrisy.
I grew up pre-internet. I couldn't just google to find out that my teacher was in a porno. But even so, from my eighth grade on I made lists of which teacher I wanted to fuck and in what order.
There was a case several months ago where a teacher appeared on FB drinking a beer. Did you advocate for her dismissal?
There is no difference on moral equivalence. If there isn't then you need to be doing all in your power to stop pornography, drinking, and every other item of moral turpitude you can find. Aren't these the seven deadly sins?
And I have no desire to live anywhere near your worlds.
Jim P. at April 29, 2012 8:58 PM
> Because as soon as you say "yes" it shows your
> hypocrisy.
Oh, you silly person... Hypocrisy was addressed in the following blog post just an hour ago. Besides: "Yes" to what? And who's Tiffany Six?
> from my eighth grade on I made lists of which
> teacher I wanted to fuck and in what order.
It's very important that we know this about you!
> Did you advocate for her dismissal?
Would anyone care? It ain't my school. LAUSD is a nightmare, but as a rule, I'm ready to let local communities do what they want to do in terms of standards for teachers. (And that's kinda the problem with LAUSD, it's insufficiently local.)
AGAIN I'm impressed at the urgency with which this woman's employment is regarded by distant, singular men.
> And I have no desire to live anywhere near
> your worlds.
Bye now!
Crid [CridComment at gmail] at April 29, 2012 9:36 PM
Keep in mind for all the condemnation of sex workers, americans (especially cnservitive christians americans) spend more money on porn than anyone else
lujlp at April 29, 2012 9:43 PM
Why should it be held against her?
Welcome to Earth. It may not be fair, but past actions have an impact on present and future perceptions.
"What if she'd drifted into porn largely due to poor parenting and abusive relationships in her past? What if she regretted that past and, through great effort, had left porn, obtained schooling and a more "respectable" profession? Would those of you justifying her dismissal feel a little more compassion then? I'm genuinely asking"
A fair enough question.
Life can be tragic. But tragedy does not earase choice. It does not erase bad decisions. It does not create fairness. Victims of circumstance know this best of all.
And expecting others to know the inner workings and demons and inner triumphs of others is, well, ludicrous. We can set our standards based upon what we see. And what we see is a teacher crotch dancing on camera for money. The only question we are responsible for answer is, "Do we want this person as a teacher?" The answer is for most people probably a resounding NO.
Its not fair. But where is it written that life is fair. All choices are not equal. All people are not fortunate. Bad decisions have consequences just as good ones do, and sometimes we close off options to ourselves because of the choices we made before those options even appeared. Again...welcome to the world.
Robert at April 29, 2012 10:33 PM
You all are bringing a lot of hypotheticals to this porn performers life. She was performing and teaching at the same time. She was aware of the possibility of getting caught and losing her teaching job and didn't see to care. I don't and won't ever feel sorry for her. Definitely NSFW link follows that demonstrates completely these points. Starts with an interview the woman talking about her teaching kids then goes to full on hardcore. I don't ever want children, but even if i was stuck with some, i wouldnt want this lady teaching them. http://www.efukt.com/20976_Teacher_Of_The_Millennium?_.html
I think I mostly agree with Crid on this issue of public/private sexuality. There seems to be ingrained in at least American society an ambivalence about sex that functions such as to keep it private or be known as lewd and uncouth. Reputations matter.
Abersouth at April 30, 2012 8:51 AM
> There seems to be ingrained in at least American
> society an ambivalence about sex that functions
> such as to keep it private or be known as lewd
> and uncouth. Reputations matter.
It's fun to mock hillbillies as being sexually naive and fearfully condemnatory, but I think there's more going on here (the United States) than that.
First, we note that the people mocking the hillbillies never seem to have any evident erotic superiority... It's just assumed that we can trust them to be the judge of relevant weakness in the souls and motives of (distant) others.
Second, whether the ambivalence comes from genuine sexual ignorance or from quiet wisdom, the practical message most often seems to be Don't bother me, my family, or my international reputation with problems caused by your stupid boners.
Crid [CridComment at gmail] at April 30, 2012 11:37 AM
I think there is a middle ground between illegal and must be permitted. Her lack of judgement is a professional disqualification.
Our school district recently booted a self-professed shaman who let his shamanism interfere with the teaching he was being paid to do. They also booted an adulterous couple busted on a picnic table in a public park.
MarkD at April 30, 2012 11:59 AM
Does Appearing In Porn Erase Your Ability To Teach Frog Dissection?
Rephrase that to "does visiting hookers or watching porn erase your ability to run a company?" So many ceo's have been made to leave their jobs because of affairs outside the office or visiting hookers etc. And think about it, Tiger Woods lost a lot of his advertising contracts because of his trysts with women. It is the same standard here. You must apply judgement before you do anything. You cannot say that you will do what you want and there should be no consequences to it. Some jobs(or maybe a lot of them) require that you are a model example to the people around and if you are not, then you better not do that job. Plus, people who show better judgement in their earlier days deserve a better deal than those who did not. The simple fact is no one can erase their past.
Redrajesh at May 1, 2012 6:13 PM
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