Two Women With A Startup And Their Fake Male Cofounder (As Seen Through The Lens Of Evolved Sex Differences)
John Paul Titlow writes at Fast Company about two female entrepreneurs who said things went better for them after they created a fake male cofounder who responded to people by email. Here's the subhead of the piece:
Penelope Gazin and Kate Dwyer faced a lot of sexism and condescension when they launched their e-commerce marketplace for weird art-that is until they introduced an imaginary cofounder named Keith.
An excerpt from the piece:
After setting out to build Witchsy, it didn't take long for them to notice a pattern: In many cases, the outside developers and graphic designers they enlisted to help often took a condescending tone over email. These collaborators, who were almost always male, were often short, slow to respond, and vaguely disrespectful in correspondence. In response to one request, a developer started an email with the words "Okay, girls..."That's when Gazin and Dwyer introduced a third cofounder: Keith Mann, an aptly named fictional character who could communicate with outsiders over email.
"It was like night and day," says Dwyer. "It would take me days to get a response, but Keith could not only get a response and a status update, but also be asked if he wanted anything else or if there was anything else that Keith needed help with."
Dwyer and Gazin continued to deploy Keith regularly when interacting with outsiders and found that the change in tone wasn't just an anomaly. In exchange after exchange, the perceived involvement of a man seemed to have an effect on people's assumptions about Witchsy and colored how they interacted with the budding business. One developer in particular seemed to show more deference to Keith than he did to Dwyer or Gazin, right down to the basics of human interaction.
"Whenever he spoke to Keith, he always addressed Keith by name," says Gazin. "Whenever he spoke to us, he never used our names."
Rather than deterring them, these types of encounters just gave Gazin and Dwyer more motivation to push forward, and an opportunity to have some fun at the expense of tech bro masculinity everywhere.
"I think we could have gotten pretty bent out of shape about that," Dwyer says. "Wow, are people really going to talk to this imaginary man with more respect than us? But we were like, you know what, this is clearly just part of this world that we're in right now. We want this and want to make this happen."
I would explain it as part of our evolved psychology -- just one of those things; something to deal with not to whine about -- and good for them for thinking of a creative way around it. More on the specifics of the ev psych below.
In short, I think it's likely we take men more seriously in job situations because men, in general, have evolved to be more serious about careers and advancement because that's a primary way they attract mates.
But first, why I don't find their need to create a male cofounder whine-worthy: I see this like a friend's creative idea to be taken seriously as a composer of commercial music (like jingles) when he was about two minutes out of college. He used his bar mitzvah money to buy seriously pricey stationery and a logo to go on it. He looked professional, and he soon got jobs.
I wore fake glasses to recording sessions where clients were present when I was a producer at Ogilvy & Mather/New York right out of college. I looked about 14, and the glasses made me look older.
Do we go "waah, waah" because younger people are not taken as seriously? Or do we just come up with creative ways and think, "Heh, heh...fooled you, sucka!"
Also, the fact that other people might not take you seriously doesn't mean anything about you; it's just the way the world works. I'm not taken seriously as a writer of applied science -- research turned into practical advice. I suspect that's largely because I don't have a Ph.D. and because I write the advice with humor. However, I defy you to find many people who do it better than I do in my columns, in "Good Manners for Nice People Who Sometimes Say F*ck," and in my next book. (I'm reading the page proofs now, and it'll be out in January.)
Here's my reply to Adam Grant's tweet: ![]()
Here is some of the research on sex differences in mate preferences from my science-based syndicated column:
...Male sexual attraction is visually driven in a way female attraction is not -- which is why strip clubs catering to men are big business while those for women are largely a bachelorette party novelty. Sure, women like a nice view if they can get it, but if they have to make a trade-off, they're likely to go for the weak-chinned self-made gazillionaire.This is reflected in research by anthropologist John Marshall Townsend. He showed men and women photos of hotties and homelies of the opposite sex, dressed in either a Burger King uniform or biz exec-wear and a Rolex. When he asked which they'd go for, men were indifferent to how the woman was dressed -- picking the hottie no matter what she was wearing. Women, on the other hand, went for the homely business dude, and tended to nix even a hookup with the hot hamburger helper.
Another excerpt from my column:
Of course, we ladies will take a nice view if we can get it, but other things come first. Anthropologist Robert Trivers explains that what women evolved to prioritize in a partner comes out of the greater amount of "parental investment" required from us. Because a man could just walk away after sex (in the days before there was a state to come after him for child support) and because the features men find hot reflect fertility and health, male sexuality evolved to be primarily looks-driven. For a woman, however, a single romp in the bushes with some loinclothed Hunky McHunkerson could have left her with a kid to feed -- long before baby food was sold in stores in cute little jars.So, the women whose children survived to pass on their genes to us were those who vetted men for the ability and willingness to "provide." There was no "wealth" in ancestral times -- no National Bank of the Stone Age. However, evolutionary psychologists believe a modern man's high earnings act as a cue for what women evolved to go for in a man -- high status, meaning high social standing and the ability to bring home the wildebeest steaks for Mommy and the twins.
You, however, claim that a man's status does nothing for you. Now, studies reveal how most people are, not individual differences, so you may be right. However, cognitive neuroscientist Michael Gazzaniga explains that 98 percent of our brain's activity is unconscious -- including some of our decision-making -- but we invent reasons for our choices afterward (typically those that make us seem rational, consistent, and admirable). And research keeps reflecting that women subconsciously prioritize status. In a study by evolutionary psychologist Michael Dunn, women found the exact same man hotter when he was driving a Bentley than when he was driving a Ford Fiesta. Men? They found a woman equally attractive in either car, and frankly, a woman who's hot can probably get dates while "driving" a donkey with bumper stickers on the back.
Again, I think it's likely we take men more seriously in job situations because men, in general, have evolved to be more serious about careers and advancement. This makes evolutionary sense.
As I told the guy whose letter I answered at the above link:
You are right; "there's been something called 'evolution.'" Unfortunately, psychological change takes a little longer than you think -- which is to say you're only off by maybe a few million years. As evolutionary psychologists Leda Cosmides and John Tooby explain, we're living in modern times with a "stone age mind." By this, they mean that the genes right now driving our psychology and behavior were molded by (and are still largely adapted for) mating and survival problems in the hunter-gatherer environment millions of years ago.







I conjecture that the phenomenon that Gazin and Dwyer encountered had less to do with the presumed sex of the fictional character, and more to do with differences in communications styles that they used when communicating as "Keith". I presume that they made an effort to make Keith seem like a different person, and so they wrote in a different style than when communicating under their own names. (Otherwise, the ruse most likely would have been spotted quickly by people that they communicated with.) A comparison of Keith emails vs. Gazin and Dwyer signed emails could be interesting.
I will also say that the name "Witchsy" puts me off -- it sounds like the delusional women who think that they are reincarnations of ancient goddesses and that sort of thing. I would be unlikely to spend any time there, unless someone that I trusted recommended it. That may seem unfair to judge it by the name, but when you're sorting through pages and pages of search engine results, you have to discard most of them right off the bat if you're going to get anything done, and all you've got to go by is a site name and a sentence or two of text.
Cousin Dave at August 30, 2017 6:37 AM
Cousin Dave, I think that's a great point.
Amy Alkon at August 30, 2017 6:39 AM
I started growing a beard when I wanted a new job. Never really liked them so I usually cut them off after I was hired but looking older helped. Though the joke is on me since I used a bearded photo on my OkCupid profile and met a wife who likes red beards so now I can't cut it off anymore.
I have an uncle who does most of his work interactions over email. He actively avoids meeting people now after several people refused to work with him anymore after they met him in person. Apparently his emails lead people to imagine some sort of person and when they meet him in person the delusion gets shattered.
The Witchsy women's issue may be as Cousin Dave opines. Or they may be right. But as you point out Amy guys run into the exact same thing all the time.
Ben at August 30, 2017 7:19 AM
Did anyone see the junk they're selling? They needed to invent a gay man with taste, not just a male name.
The "hit me" tshirt isn't edgy. If a MAN was selling that item, he'd be hounded out of business.
https://www.witchsy.com/clothing/t-shirts/dirty-pop-britney-tee/
KateC at August 30, 2017 8:29 AM
They needed to invent a gay man with taste and flair, not just a boring name.
They sell a "hit me" tshirt that's not edgy but loathesome.
https://www.witchsy.com/clothing/t-shirts/dirty-pop-britney-tee/
KateC at August 30, 2017 8:31 AM
Chances are, since the made up "Keith Mann" was an anonymous alter-ego, they did communicate differently as him than they did as themselves; perhaps "Keith" was more assertive and business-like. Can't say for sure, but it's possible.
Conan the Grammarian at August 30, 2017 10:17 AM
I try to be polite with everyone when communicating via email regarding professional matters, but extra polite with women, because you never know when some humorless bitch with an axe to grind is going to make an example out of you on social media.
So it's Ms. Gazin and Dwyer until they lower the formality level and Keith, because Keith is probably not an asshole and just wants to get his job done.
Keith can be expected to have restarted windows at least once, where if I suggest to Ms. Gazin to restart windows, I'm a condescending sexist, and if I assume Ms. Gazin has restarted windows, I'm a gaslighting sexist trying to neg her so I can get in some heteronormative PIV.
Fuck, I don't know how Keith works for Ms. Gazin, I need to buy that guy a beer.
jerry at August 30, 2017 10:23 AM
Men are more serious in general. They don't put much importance on their looks and clothes, realizing quite young that status and $ are what matter to women. I saw a study that when a couple are expecting, women begin to focus more on the home and short-term, whereas their husbands suddenly start making much more long-term career plans. I know, big surprise. Many women depend on their husbands to protect them from the crazy world out there--which is fine. But this means the men have to pay attention to the stock market, rumors of war, if their house is in a flood zone, local crime stats, etc. in a way their wives don't.
cc at August 30, 2017 12:35 PM
Not everything is genetic. Women get a break in SBA loans. That's why there are so many women starting businesses. Some of them are figureheads. Maybe, right or wrong, the a few of the folks responding in this case have twigged.
Richard Aubrey at August 30, 2017 2:57 PM
Tits.
Crid at August 30, 2017 5:44 PM
Next step in marketing: an EO complaint against Keith, followed by doxing him widely on social media with numerous mentions of the firm's name. Even cheap crap benefits from brand name recognition.
Wfjag at August 31, 2017 3:42 AM
I guess naming the imaginary partner Remington Steele would have been too obvious.
Karl Lembke at September 3, 2017 9:46 PM
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